UPDATED VIDEO & PICS: Nike Covert Drivers, Woods & Irons

[greenadam21]

[quote name='longbal30' timestamp='1359311839' post='6309033']
The foresight gc2 is phenomenal, but its only as good as the guy who Is setting the parameters. That didn't look like a foresight screenshot to me. I own one myself, and have used them at different stores like golfsmith and a local mom and pop. None had that screenshot. The only units I would trust are foresight gc2, trackman and flightscope.
[/quote]

Well if it makes a diff that was a gc2 at golfsmith. they have three of them. When you say as good as the guy setting the parameters what do you mean? They are set at see level and the club was set to driver...what else can you change? I tried all three yesterday the other two are older. One hits everything dead straight...the other spins every shot with slightest side spin off the planet. These numbers are off the newest one they got a couple months ago.

Ive been reading about this all morning. Andrew rice has a pretty in depth golf study forum. I trust his data. I'm pretty much maxing out my numbers and must be hitting up at the ball to produce the balls speed with that spin. http://www.andrewricegolf.com/tag/low-spin-high-launch/

[scottvw13]

I think the only question is the yardages. All the other stats look dead on.

They can set the internal parameters to juice the yardages without the user ever knowing. I don't even look at the yardages any more. I only look at the stats.

[longbal30]

You can adjust wind, fairway firmness, fairway speed, altitude and some units can also increase your numbers but a manually set percentage. So if you really hit drives 250, unit would spit out 275 set at 10%. Most big box stores have them set up to sell clubs. If you came into a store and test the latest and greatest only to see no real gain in performance, you would not buy new equipment. So they doctor the numbers a bit to make sales.

The trackman numbers you quoted for carry are much more realistic. 259-266 carry is very different from the 280 numbers you posted earlier.

[greenadam21]

[quote name='scottvw13' timestamp='1359312632' post='6309119']
I think the only question is the yardages. All the other stats look dead on.

They can set the internal parameters to juice the yardages without the user ever knowing. I don't even look at the yardages any more. I only look at the stats.
[/quote][quote name='longbal30' timestamp='1359312810' post='6309141']
You can adjust wind, fairway firmness, fairway speed, altitude and some units can also increase your numbers but a manually set percentage. So if you really hit drives 250, unit would spit out 275 set at 10%. Most big box stores have them set up to sell clubs. If you came into a store and test the latest and greatest only to see no real gain in performance, you would not buy new equipment. So they doctor the numbers a bit to make sales.

The trackman numbers you quoted for carry are much more realistic. 259-266 carry is very different from the 280 numbers you posted earlier.
[/quote]

Well i'm sure if they can do that they will. Which to your point earlier is why i test against my equipment. So at least its apples to apples. Super jealous that you have one of these foresight systems. If i wanted a divorce i'd buy one in a second.

[longbal30]

What else is one to do in the frozen winter months. I picked mine up used for a steal. Keep your eyes open and you may be able to find one on the cheap as well.

[greenadam21]

What else is one to do in the frozen winter months. I picked mine up used for a steal. Keep your eyes open and you may be able to find one on the cheap as well.


Lucky...I'll start scanning ebay and other places to see if i can come up with one ( and find a good lawyer for the divorce thing). I'd like to do some ball testing on one. The range balls at golf smith and edwin here have got to be 5 years old..horrible. Cant bring prov1 in to the store they'd just get mixed in with their balls. i'm sure i'm loosing something there...just would like to know what. Trackman had me at 110 +- 2mph swing speed. and my contact isn't that bad. notice how the covers of the balls have turned to powder that leaves a nice imprint on the face this might explain some of the distances i see on course vs on monitor.

[attachment=1508595:2013-01-27 13.35.49.jpg]


ok sorry everyone back to nike's covert..great club...just not better than my old one..

[TheDominator273]

Spent some time with the Covert last night and its definitely on the short list for drivers for me this year. Carry was 4-7 yards over my 910 D2 based on better ball speed and I was also getting more roll out due to less spin. No hard numbers yet because I was hitting on the About Golf sim at one of my workplaces and I don't trust the hard numbers there but I'll update when I jump on the GC2 at my other job

[kben1993]

I was at golfsmith yesterday and compared the length of the Covert to the 913. The covert is suppose to be 45.75 standard, but when I sat the 913 next to it they were both pretty much the same length. The 913 is suppose to be 45 standard. I wonder if nike measures their clubs differently. Anyway just food for thought

[greenadam21]

[quote name='kben1993' timestamp='1359382897' post='6313799']
I was at golfsmith yesterday and compared the length of the Covert to the 913. The covert is suppose to be 45.75 standard, but when I sat the 913 next to it they were both pretty much the same length. The 913 is suppose to be 45 standard. I wonder if nike measures their clubs differently. Anyway just food for thought
[/quote]

Hmm thats interesting. I thought the nike seemed long. but i didnt measure up...

[kben1993]

[quote name='greenadam21' timestamp='1359384299' post='6313929']
[quote name='kben1993' timestamp='1359382897' post='6313799']
I was at golfsmith yesterday and compared the length of the Covert to the 913. The covert is suppose to be 45.75 standard, but when I sat the 913 next to it they were both pretty much the same length. The 913 is suppose to be 45 standard. I wonder if nike measures their clubs differently. Anyway just food for thought
[/quote]

Hmm thats interesting. I thought the nike seemed long. but i didnt measure up...
[/quote]May have to do with the head size and color. I measured the tour model just for reference. When I took the titleist away, the covert did seem long. Must be a visual thing I guess

[greenadam21]

[quote name='greenadam21' timestamp='1359147767' post='6298113']
[quote name='minteq' timestamp='1359146935' post='6298007']
[quote name='greenadam21' timestamp='1359145604' post='6297837']
[quote name='minteq' timestamp='1359144514' post='6297695']
[quote name='greenadam21' timestamp='1359142597' post='6297427']
[quote name='minteq' timestamp='1359138167' post='6296949']
[quote name='greenadam21' timestamp='1359135530' post='6296601']
If anyone is heading to demo right now i'd love to hear your results compared to the I20 px 6.0
[/quote]

I had the I20 with the 6.0, I thought the Nike was better feeling, and a much more piercing trajectory. I used the KK silver in the performance head, much better than the KK black. I was getting 12-13 launch with around 2200 spin. When I had the i20, my spin was around 2800-3000, and I was prone to lose shots right. With the Nike, I was getting a nice little draw, and I had it set at 8.5 and open.
[/quote]
hmmm..
thats very interesting. The I20 sits open supposedly dont know how much...i draw everything with mine. But to each his own swing

I hit everything with pretty low spin...well compared to those i've been on the monitors with...105-112 swing speed. I can keep the I20 in the 2200-2600 range wiht a 12-14 degree launch..(9.5) I really like the shapes i get and the feel.

I took a couple swings,no monitor available, with the kuro kage stiff at 9.5 setting. As a lover of muted meaty feel at impact i was impressed. I just need to see what ball does.


Did you notice much difference in ball speed?
[/quote]

A little bit more with the Covert, maybe 3-5mph, but the flight was more boring, with more roll. Felt better as well.
[/quote]

Man...i don't want to want a new stick...and you are not helping at all.

thanks for the response.

I'll try it tonight and maybe post some results
[/quote]

Use the KK silver not the black, the black was way too much spin, the silver was perfect for me. I tried the Tour head, but I like the performance head with the silver better, much more forgiving. I was surprised by the Covert, I went there to try the G25, could not believe how much I liked the Covert.
[/quote]

I'll keep that in mind...thanks!
[/quote]

I did get up there and try it . I posted this in another thread but i seemed to have more trouble finding the center of the face on the nike at first. And the only pics i didn't get completely blurry are of the first 8-10 swings. I will say that the ones i caught well went a mile for me...but not much further than the ones i caught with the I-20. The nike's feel was amazing but I feel less forgiving. The spin was lower with the I20 as well. Coudl be that im just used to swinging the i20. I will also note that my spin numbers on the i20 seem to be less today than what i have been seeing. But this may be due to a recent swing change with more passive hands. Regardless i made great effort to swing them both the same.

nike covert tour in blue font Black tie matrix in stiff

[attachment=1509947:2013-01-26 14.58.45.jpg]


Ping i20

[attachment=1509949:2013-01-26 15.11.58.jpg]

[Ajlepisto]

I wouldn't trust the units at Golfsmith. They do use the GC2, but the local one at my store shows weird numbers as well.

It severely reduces the clubhead speeds at the local place around me. I've read, like above, that this can be due to the estimated smash. That unit doesn't actually measure the clubhead. The golfsmith units are the standard LM with a case around them. For example, it shows that with a 72mph clubhead speed with a 6i I am carrying 180. The Mizuno swing DNA unit places my 6i CHS in the low 90s, and a few of the other LMs around like the PureLaunch verify the numbers. Only the CG2s at Golfsmith seem to be off. Substantially.

The total distance seems to be pretty accurate, or at least carry, in my instances, but the numbers to get that aren't always very trustworthy. I also read somewhere that the GC2 needs to be at the same level as the ground you're hitting the ball from. The local GS here has it on the ground and you're hitting off of a mat, 2 inches higher. Apparently it can ruin the readings if you don't set it up right. Someone with one of these would probably be able to say if that is true or not.

Best thing to do is bring your gamer and test it right next to it. That way you can see the numbers change, so even if they aren't right, you get an idea.

But literally, I went there right after they installed the GC2 and my clubhead speed dropped 15mph versus the vectors that they used to use. I realize there is going to be some variation, but when the numbers don't add up they just don't add up.

[greenadam21]

ya if especially if you dont set them up right....if you get on the machine and dont change the club . it will give you a 1.45 smash on every six iron...that means a 124 ball speed is a 85 mph six iron ss....not likely

best ignore swing speed on there just watch ballspeed, spin and launch angle. and like we have all been saying just use apples to apples comparison against your club.


As far as vectors go....even the guys at golfsmith say those things were horribly innacurate I can't comment personally as i have never used them

[Eddie]

I say this not as a "flame" but in the nicest way I can, but if you are going to take these numbers as credible in determining what driver is better, I will offer a suggestion that having drives that are 60-70 yards dispersed from each other is something I would be concerned with more. Again not meant as a judgement but maybe getting a slightly higher spinning setup or with more loft might behoove you. You are hitting both of those clubs all over the grid. I've seen a ton of guys max out on those foresight gc2 machines (the high launch super low spin), and take those clubs out to the course and can't find a fairway.

When I test drivers with friends on gc2s, we tend to take 2 sets of balls for each club and compare dispersion first, then distance. (first 5 are normal focused keep the ball in play drives to simulate more normal swinging, second 5 set are to see how much max distance can be)


Back on topic, I spent time with both heads and the various shaft setups, there definitely was a difference in launch and spin in the two heads, and based on "numbers" there were multiple setups that seemed good.

The one that worked best for me was vr covert tour 10.5 right with the fujikura fuel shaft. The kuro kage silver was very nice as well but ive gotten used to the fujikura "feel". My past setup for reference was a 913d2 8.5 d1 with fujikura tour spec 6.2.

With my old 913 setup, I had it setup as a consistent push fade machine and it was incredibly consistent. Even at the right setting the covert tour seems willing to square up/close through impact, as a result seeing consistent results by hitting hard out to the right with this setup comfortably allowing the ball to turn over.

The rfe was also very nice..



For

[greenadam21]

First of all i want to thank you for the confidence booster. ..................Just kidding...

I notice now that i didn't fully explain here, as i did in the other thread. I was really having trouble find the center of the face especially on the nike. I sometimes struggle on monitors and swinging indoors sometimes im drilling them down the middle. other days like this session i felt uncomfortable. I went in on this occasion after play 36 holes and hitting a large bucket of balls. It could be that I was too tired....excuses are plentiful when it comes to launch monitor numbers on any forum. And most are reluctant it seems to post them. I posted what i hit ..and deleted no outliers because i think the misses are as important, if not more so than the good hits. In the last month i have "learned" and i use the term loosely, to hit a draw. you will see me loose one to the right as I still have a tendency to revert, in part, to my old swing. These shots very often are followed by an over correction as you see in the numbers ..One severe right followed by a severe left then back to on track ( i'm referring to the second screen shot here the I20 shots). For those of you reading this that have made a transition from a lifelong cut to slice miss this is not an easy change to make. My over correction is a teaching thing and i adjust less on the course and just play the game.

I will as i always do go back in several times to get a better feel on a good day that isn't after so much play. I for one was shocked at the knuckle balls i was hitting with both. I normally keep the spin down on any club but i've never seen such low numbers from the i20 therefore i should probably scratch the days numbers.

I agree with your post if all i saw was the LM numbers above for a player i would make the same recommendation My intention in this test really was to compare ballspeed as i had heard so much about the covert and its LM results. My second page of shots with the nike was spread less over the field and the ball numbers on good strikes was higher but very close to the 120. I'll go in several more times and see if i can get more reliable data. If you wanted to take anything away from these numbers. take the following

Trust me that i'm being honest saying,[list]
[*]on trackman where SS is measured (foresight estimates bases on ballspeed) my swings are almost always the same SS within +- 2mph. on a driver.... so ballspeed variance is mostly contact so if i had to judge and not go in again i would guess that the nike might add 1-2mph ballspeed on a similar strike...when i can do it
[*]i knew when i hit it well it had a great feel, good looks, and a long ball flight. I would say thinking back on it today , and this is all opinion and i'm huuuge on feel , that on the later strikes not shown that the center hits of this club were the best feeling and sounding of any club i have ever hit...the i20 is great mind you...but nike i would have to give you this one.
[*]if there was something that threw me it was the length of the club. To me it felt crazy long. I was having trouble setting up and was so uncomfortable with that part of it at first that i didnt' think i would even be able to hit the ball. There is a threshold for all of us on length and this might just be over the limit for me.
[*]The other thing that is obvious but i dint' put it together until the second page of shots where i put contact tape on the nike and saw i was hitting it way high on the face is that the nikes head is so small that it needed to tee the ball way down. once I figured this out things got much better.
[*]i "probably" wont be making a switch....probably...maybe...ok i dont know more tests will show...
[/list]

Long story short ...no offense taken and i'm totally kidding on the confidence boost my ego is ridiculously obtuse. Thanks for the feedback as always.

[greenadam21]

love to see some more comparisons from others

[longbal30]

Does anyone know the swingweight of the covert tour?

[wldchld22]

For what it is worth...

Did a half hour session at PGA TSS and was averaging a 115SS with the covert. This was in their hitting bays in the back. I know one of their bays is weird because the associates have told me which one to stay away from.

The first time I tried the covert one of the bays was giving me negative spin numbers!

After I'm done I stop into golfsmith and in their bays I couldn't get my SS above 110. This is why bays are nice, but getting fit outside cannot be beat. This indoor stuff is great for the process of elimination when you want to narrow it down to a few options.

[Boogs2]

Well, every time I think I have everything set and ready to go, something always pops up.

So I was ready to order a Covert Performance with the Kuro Kage Silver 70g shaft in stiff, but when I called globalgolf.com, they said they cannot change or make any adjustments in length cause it would mess with swingweight. I ask them if they can call Nike just to verify cause I've been hearing different stories and people on this topic have posted Nike saying that they can adjust swingweight depending on the amount cut from the original length. So I get a call back saying that Nike has said that they will not make any type of adjustments in length, not even a half inch or anything cause of the swingweight issues. I really wanted to return the club I was going to return and use those credits towards a Covert Performance since I need a driver more than a 3 wood, but this has definitely made me re-evaluate about going with the Covert.

I like everything about it, but I may have to go to another brand if the whole swingweight/length issue keeps coming up.

[BirdieBob]

[quote name='Boogaloo_Jones' timestamp='1359568192' post='6330617']
Well, every time I think I have everything set and ready to go, something always pops up.

So I was ready to order a Covert Performance with the Kuro Kage Silver 70g shaft in stiff, but when I called globalgolf.com, they said they cannot change or make any adjustments in length cause it would mess with swingweight. I ask them if they can call Nike just to verify cause I've been hearing different stories and people on this topic have posted Nike saying that they can adjust swingweight depending on the amount cut from the original length. So I get a call back saying that Nike has said that they will not make any type of adjustments in length, not even a half inch or anything cause of the swingweight issues. I really wanted to return the club I was going to return and use those credits towards a Covert Performance since I need a driver more than a 3 wood, but this has definitely made me re-evaluate about going with the Covert.

I like everything about it, but I may have to go to another brand if the whole swingweight/length issue keeps coming up.
[/quote]


Yes, Nike will make any length you want and adjust the swingweight to what you want as well.
You just need to use a pro shop like discountdansgolf

[Boogs2]

[quote name='BirdieBob' timestamp='1359568801' post='6330675']
[quote name='Boogaloo_Jones' timestamp='1359568192' post='6330617']
Well, every time I think I have everything set and ready to go, something always pops up.

So I was ready to order a Covert Performance with the Kuro Kage Silver 70g shaft in stiff, but when I called globalgolf.com, they said they cannot change or make any adjustments in length cause it would mess with swingweight. I ask them if they can call Nike just to verify cause I've been hearing different stories and people on this topic have posted Nike saying that they can adjust swingweight depending on the amount cut from the original length. So I get a call back saying that Nike has said that they will not make any type of adjustments in length, not even a half inch or anything cause of the swingweight issues. I really wanted to return the club I was going to return and use those credits towards a Covert Performance since I need a driver more than a 3 wood, but this has definitely made me re-evaluate about going with the Covert.

I like everything about it, but I may have to go to another brand if the whole swingweight/length issue keeps coming up.
[/quote]


Yes, Nike will make any length you want and adjust the swingweight to what you want as well.
You just need to use a pro shop like discountdansgolf
[/quote]

Thanks BirdieBob...much appreciated. Any reasons why Nike wont accomodate retail stores/online retailers but will accomodate pro shops only?

Looks like I'll calling DiscountDans in a little.

[hmx3]

My resume about the Convert.

The CB is´nt either hotter or more forgiving.

The stocklength is unplayable and shorten the Convert is pretty difficult.

Pretty disappointed after this big marketing hype.

[Boogs2]

[quote name='hmx3' timestamp='1359571705' post='6330943']
My resume about the Convert.

The CB is´nt either hotter or more forgiving.

The stocklength is unplayable and shorten the Convert is pretty difficult.

Pretty disappointed after this big marketing hype.
[/quote]

The swingweight issue and playing length issue has been a problem for me, but I have been looking forward to this driver for a while. Not because its not more forgiving, or the cavity back doesnt give it more "pop". The technology that I'm looking for is the adapter...being able to adjust from 8.5-12.5 independent of face angle is huge for me. Plus I like how it looks so DiscountDans it is!

[Stetson]

There has been a ton of talk on here about the driver... I am sticking with my 913 and not trying the Covert at all. Why? Because I am afraid I will like it, if I do not hit it then I shall not be tempted to buy it. That being said... Has anybody hit the fairways? Especially the tour model of the fairways? If so what are you opinions?

I love my VR Pro LE. I think the versatility of this club is priceless. On any given day you can take a 3 wood and turn it into a 4 wood, drop the longest iron/hybrid and add a wedge. Or when playing longer courses you can turn it into a strong three and add another long club to the bag. It also will allow me to create perfect yardage gaps between driver and 2 iron, or 3 wood and 3 iron (If i use the 5 wood version). Case in point for me it seems perfect to adjust fairways. Any thoughts on how it performed relative to the LE and what you thought of the Kuro Kage Silver shaft? Thank you

[shakey]

[quote name='hmx3' timestamp='1359571705' post='6330943']
My resume about the Convert.

The CB is´nt either hotter or more forgiving.

The stocklength is unplayable and shorten the Convert is pretty difficult.

Pretty disappointed after this big marketing hype.
[/quote]
Don't think I want to try the Convert either.
The Covert on the other hand....

[wldchld22]

I am ordering the tour fairway and glued hybrids. The fairways are solid. I hit the adjustable a lot better. Hybrids were among the best I've hit in a long time.

[Boogs2]

Put in the order for a Performance head with the 70g KK Silver...cut to play at 44.25". I was told that I was cutting it way shorter than usual, that my request of swing weight would be almost impossible to get (I wanted D2/D3)...so we'll see how this plays.

Now I cant wait!

[TheMoneyShot]

[quote name='wldchld22' timestamp='1359577243' post='6331543']
I am ordering the tour fairway and glued hybrids. The fairways are solid. I hit the adjustable a lot better. Hybrids were among the best I've hit in a long time.
[/quote]

What is your new fwys/ hybrids replacing?

[tbowles411]

[quote name='Boogaloo_Jones' timestamp='1359577713' post='6331587']
Put in the order for a Performance head with the 70g KK Silver...cut to play at 44.25". I was told that I was cutting it way shorter than usual, that my request of swing weight would be almost impossible to get (I wanted D2/D3)...so we'll see how this plays.

Now I cant wait!
[/quote]
Put the crack pipe down! LOL

[TheMoneyShot]

[quote name='tbowles411' timestamp='1359579216' post='6331745']
[quote name='Boogaloo_Jones' timestamp='1359577713' post='6331587']
Put in the order for a Performance head with the 70g KK Silver...cut to play at 44.25". I was told that I was cutting it way shorter than usual, that my request of swing weight would be almost impossible to get (I wanted D2/D3)...so we'll see how this plays.

Now I cant wait!
[/quote]
Put the crack pipe down! LOL
[/quote][quote name='tbowles411' timestamp='1359579216' post='6331745']
[quote name='Boogaloo_Jones' timestamp='1359577713' post='6331587']
Put in the order for a Performance head with the 70g KK Silver...cut to play at 44.25". I was told that I was cutting it way shorter than usual, that my request of swing weight would be almost impossible to get (I wanted D2/D3)...so we'll see how this plays.

Now I cant wait!
[/quote]
Put the crack pipe down! LOL
[/quote]

Hey now! Only deer antler spray allowed on this site!