MD/DC/VA Golfers - Twelve Monkeys Mental Divergence

[SullGolf]

RIP my "For Shiggles" visor, 2016-2019. Damage to it in the weather at the 7s was unrecoverable.

[baddomes]

> @SullGolf said:

> RIP my "For Shiggles" visor, 2016-2019. Damage to it in the weather at the 7s was unrecoverable.

 

On twitch they'd say "can I get a F in chat for the visor please"

[SullGolf]

I'm calling it. Based on the likes, my For Shiggles hat is more popular than the Rugby World Cup.

[aiyyer]

We cancelled the trip to Links At Perry Cabin at 4AM Friday morning.

It was either the Rugby World Cup or Larry King hyping a “ man pull” on TV until the Premier League kicker on at 7 AM.. ( your hat may be more popular than that sport also).

Finally found the Popeyes chicken sandwich courtesy of Cbass and played Avenel Friday.

 

[GooseHook]

Cautionary tale: even when you are in complete control of your game, sometimes the gods conspire against you. Also- brain farts usually happen when you think you're completely locked in and have a false sense of security.

 

Saturday morning, I'm on track to post possibly my best score in the last 3 years. Making putts and boosted by a really strong short game day, the payoff of some rare recent practice. Irons are keyed in and on the last tee box of the day, I've just made a 30 foot birdie putt and a tough up and down on the previous two holes. Smoke the drive on the perfect line and I've got 50 yards in to the pin to try and post a 74.

 

Two chili dips and a skulled chip later, the 74/5 becomes a better than average 77 and the beer didn't taste as good. No one even jinxed me, I just hit a couple of really bad shots at the worst possible time.

[TheCityGame]

Nice playing, goosehook.

 

We've all had those "pop up" crashes late in rounds. . .hitting everything on a rope all day, and then snap hook out of nowhere. Or a mental lapse, or whatever.

 

I assume Sparrows is in good shape these days. Everything else around here is.

[GooseHook]

> @TheCityGame said:

> Nice playing, goosehook.

>

> We've all had those "pop up" crashes late in rounds. . .hitting everything on a rope all day, and then snap hook out of nowhere. Or a mental lapse, or whatever.

>

> I assume Sparrows is in good shape these days. Everything else around here is.

 

It is, in fact, not in good shape. All the land re-organization stuff and pinched maintenance budgets have thrown a lot of the course into a bad place. The greens are still great but that's about it.

 

Starting in two weeks there won't be 27 holes anymore and we're going to a new 18 hole routing. Sad times.

[XHoop24]

 

> @GooseHook said:

> > @TheCityGame said:

> > Nice playing, goosehook.

> >

> > We've all had those "pop up" crashes late in rounds. . .hitting everything on a rope all day, and then snap hook out of nowhere. Or a mental lapse, or whatever.

> >

> > I assume Sparrows is in good shape these days. Everything else around here is.

>

> It is, in fact, not in good shape. All the land re-organization stuff and pinched maintenance budgets have thrown a lot of the course into a bad place. The greens are still great but that's about it.

>

> Starting in two weeks there won't be 27 holes anymore and we're going to a new 18 hole routing. Sad times.

 

Goosehook - Interesting - how are they keeping members in that scenario? Can they just see the light at the end of the tunnel and believe this will be worth it when everything is done?

[aiyyer]

Hardest course and hole you’ve played in this area?

I played really well at Avenel and could barely bogey most holes.

[TheCityGame]

> @aiyyer said:

> Hardest course and hole you’ve played in this area?

> I played really well at Avenel and could barely bogey most holes.

 

Greystone is absolutely my nemesis in this area. I didn't play it this year. I never score there. It plays long for its yardage, has very slopey greens, has a lot of trouble, and has some horribly penalizing design features.

[FAbb]

> @aiyyer said:

> Hardest course and hole you’ve played in this area?

> I played really well at Avenel and could barely bogey most holes.

 

I've only played Avenel twice (practice round for a tournament, and then the actual tournament), but I found it underwhelming. It was very straightforward in that every shot felt very obvious what you had to do. The fairways were wide, and the greens were large. BUT it also seemed like it would be brutally punishing if you miss. There were deep fairway bunkers, gnarly rough, and really tough green surrounds. It was the kind of course that seems like it would just eviscerate a bogey golfer.

 

Hardest course in terms of where I score worst has got to be Turf Valley Original lol. I can't pin down why, but I think my index would be about 12 if I could only count scores from that course.

 

Hardest hole, again in terms of where I score worst, is TV-O hole 2. My average score has got to be closer to double bogey than bogey on that hole.

 

Those are highly skewed by inexplicable personal scoring demons.

 

I think hole 3 at Worthington Manor would get a lot of votes for hardest hole.

 

Worthington would probably get a lot of votes for hardest course, too. Those greens can be a real doozy when they're firm and fast, but at least that would also mean conditions in general are firm, so the course plays pretty short.

[2moreTerps]

ClubCorp has acquired seven lifestyle golf clubs in residential communities located on the East Coast from Toll Golf, the golf and country club division of Toll Brothers, Inc.

 

The clubs, which offer a variety of lifestyle amenities such as upscale, resort-style golf, tennis, fitness, aquatics, sports and dining, include: Belmont Country Club in Ashburn, Va.; Dominion Valley Country Club in Haymarket, Va.; Regency at Dominion Valley Country Club in Haymarket, Va.; Brier Creek Country Club in Raleigh, N.C.; Hasentree in Wake Forest, N.C.; Jupiter Country Club in Jupiter, Fla.; and Oak Creek Golf Club in Upper Marlboro, Md.

[GooseHook]

> @XHoop24 said:

>

> > @GooseHook said:

> > > @TheCityGame said:

> > > Nice playing, goosehook.

> > >

> > > We've all had those "pop up" crashes late in rounds. . .hitting everything on a rope all day, and then snap hook out of nowhere. Or a mental lapse, or whatever.

> > >

> > > I assume Sparrows is in good shape these days. Everything else around here is.

> >

> > It is, in fact, not in good shape. All the land re-organization stuff and pinched maintenance budgets have thrown a lot of the course into a bad place. The greens are still great but that's about it.

> >

> > Starting in two weeks there won't be 27 holes anymore and we're going to a new 18 hole routing. Sad times.

>

> Goosehook - Interesting - how are they keeping members in that scenario? Can they just see the light at the end of the tunnel and believe this will be worth it when everything is done?

 

That question is above my paygrade. Some will stick it out, others may not have a high level of confidence that the development plan will realize its cash flow projections. Fortunately I've got options if I decide to leave.

[TheCityGame]

> @2moreTerps said:

> ClubCorp has acquired seven lifestyle golf clubs in residential communities located on the East Coast from Toll Golf, the golf and country club division of Toll Brothers, Inc.

>

> The clubs, which offer a variety of lifestyle amenities such as upscale, resort-style golf, tennis, fitness, aquatics, sports and dining, include: Belmont Country Club in Ashburn, Va.; Dominion Valley Country Club in Haymarket, Va.; Regency at Dominion Valley Country Club in Haymarket, Va.; Brier Creek Country Club in Raleigh, N.C.; Hasentree in Wake Forest, N.C.; Jupiter Country Club in Jupiter, Fla.; and Oak Creek Golf Club in Upper Marlboro, Md.

 

Interesting.

 

That's good news for people who like lifestyle amenities such as aquatics, fitness and sports.

[ALTSean]

> @TheCityGame said:

> > @2moreTerps said:

> > ClubCorp has acquired seven lifestyle golf clubs in residential communities located on the East Coast from Toll Golf, the golf and country club division of Toll Brothers, Inc.

> >

> > The clubs, which offer a variety of lifestyle amenities such as upscale, resort-style golf, tennis, fitness, aquatics, sports and dining, include: Belmont Country Club in Ashburn, Va.; Dominion Valley Country Club in Haymarket, Va.; Regency at Dominion Valley Country Club in Haymarket, Va.; Brier Creek Country Club in Raleigh, N.C.; Hasentree in Wake Forest, N.C.; Jupiter Country Club in Jupiter, Fla.; and Oak Creek Golf Club in Upper Marlboro, Md.

>

> Interesting.

>

> That's good news for people who like lifestyle amenities such as aquatics, fitness and sports.

 

How is their falconry program?

[Gmen1204]

 

[Gmen1204]

Oops ignore

[aiyyer]

> @FAbb said:

The fairways were wide, and the greens were large. BUT it also seemed like it would be brutally punishing if you miss.

Fabb, this is most of us..

 

 

 

[GooseHook]

In terms of difficult local holes, this one's a doozy.

 

 

[FAbb]

> @GooseHook said:

> > @TheCityGame said:

> > Nice playing, goosehook.

> >

> > We've all had those "pop up" crashes late in rounds. . .hitting everything on a rope all day, and then snap hook out of nowhere. Or a mental lapse, or whatever.

> >

> > I assume Sparrows is in good shape these days. Everything else around here is.

>

> It is, in fact, not in good shape. All the land re-organization stuff and pinched maintenance budgets have thrown a lot of the course into a bad place. The greens are still great but that's about it.

>

> Starting in two weeks there won't be 27 holes anymore and we're going to a new 18 hole routing. Sad times.

 

I remember ole Kent sharing the proposed routing at some point. I don't remember much about it at this point.

 

I think I've played the inside 9 there twice. It's definitely got some nice holes, so it'll be interesting to see those folded into the new 18.

 

Is the whole thing being done to sell land to raise capital?

[GooseHook]

> @FAbb said:

> > @GooseHook said:

> > > @TheCityGame said:

> > > Nice playing, goosehook.

> > >

> > > We've all had those "pop up" crashes late in rounds. . .hitting everything on a rope all day, and then snap hook out of nowhere. Or a mental lapse, or whatever.

> > >

> > > I assume Sparrows is in good shape these days. Everything else around here is.

> >

> > It is, in fact, not in good shape. All the land re-organization stuff and pinched maintenance budgets have thrown a lot of the course into a bad place. The greens are still great but that's about it.

> >

> > Starting in two weeks there won't be 27 holes anymore and we're going to a new 18 hole routing. Sad times.

>

> I remember ole Kent sharing the proposed routing at some point. I don't remember much about it at this point.

>

> I think I've played the inside 9 there twice. It's definitely got some nice holes, so it'll be interesting to see those folded into the new 18.

>

> Is the whole thing being done to sell land to raise capital?

 

Yeah, it's part of a land sale that will allow some new homes to be built and bring some capital into the club.

 

The modified layout is 1-4 on the inner and 5-18 on the course proper. Unfortunately that means we will lose the really interesting holes on the inner 9 despite the upside of tearing up the most annoying holes on the championship course.

 

Even the holes that will stay still need an overhaul. The whole region is going to have to switch to hot weather grasses like bermuda or zoysia eventually and the irrigation system burns more money in leak repair than actual operation. The pipeliner in me cringes when I think about how much work it's going to take.

[FAbb]

1-4 on the inner are kinda meh, right? 4 is a par 3?

 

Are they planning to do any renovation work on the new 18 as part of the whole thing?

[TheCityGame]

> @GooseHook said:

> In terms of difficult local holes, this one's a doozy.

>

>

>

 

This is a good hole. Wonder how many people here know it. If you've played it, you (should) know it.

[dcmidnight]

> @GooseHook said:

> The whole region is going to have to switch to hot weather grasses like bermuda or zoysia eventually.

 

Its hard for me to say enough good things about Lat36 on the fairways.

 

[aiyyer]

On a totally separate design issue but related to golf, the Accessibility standards also apply to new golf courses and course renovations. I haven’t been to a ‘ “new“ or extensively renovated course yet ( Maybe Pinehurst #4?) but curious if you guys have noticed anything related to this issue. This obviously will influence layout and design of new courses and also renovations

Obviously private courses are exempt!!

https://www.gcsaa.org/UploadedFiles/Education/Conference-Sessions/2011-Sessions-Presentations/2010-Accessibility-Standards-for-Golf-Courses.pdf

 

 

[GooseHook]

> @FAbb said:

> 1-4 on the inner are kinda meh, right? 4 is a par 3?

>

> Are they planning to do any renovation work on the new 18 as part of the whole thing?

 

Yes and yes. Holes 15-18 on the main course will get some tweaking and bring water more into play. The holes left on the inner will be reworked as well.

[gregh729]

That's pretty cool. I have a buddy who is a double amputee and we try to find a flat area to drive him up to the fringe on every hole. We had another friend who just passed away from ALS. Before he got to the stage where he was wheelchair bound, we would drive him next to the green and help him so he could putt with everyone. We'd bring him out for a few scrambles a year and he'd just putt.

 

Also, that design aspect should lend itself to more receptive green complexes. We were playing PB Dye last week and talking about how his courses don't allow for many shot that can run up. That is tough on most golfers (Not us, of course).

[aiyyer]

Yes the requirements would make courses more inclusive but will also significantly change the way courses are designed. Obviously there are creative ways of addressing accessibility of golf courses but as in most cases where liability and legal concerns become issues, designers will take the path of resistance and the design of golf courses will eventually be watered down. Cart path slopes Will be regulated and will probably never see a course like Little Bennett designed again.

The issue with Dye courses, father or son, is how “Manufactured”their courses are. Reading about how the Straits Course at whistling Straits was created and the landscape altered is pretty astounding. Don’t think the current younger generation of course designers would espouse this theory.

 

[Gmen1204]

Happy Birthday Kent.

[dcmidnight]

> @aiyyer said:

> Cart path slopes Will be regulated and will probably never see a course like Little Bennett designed again.

 

Good.

 

> The issue with Dye courses, father or son, is how “Manufactured”their courses are. Reading about how the Straits Course at whistling Straits was created and the landscape altered is pretty astounding. Don’t think the current younger generation of course designers would espouse this theory.

 

Even better. Its so exhausting to be beaten over the head - especially on this site - about the wokeness of the "new generation" of course designers and how much greater they are at everything in life. GTFO. If you watch any of the work thats been done at Sweetens Cove they have moved a crapton of land - I think they said 500,000 yards of dirt...and I dont even really know how much that is but it sounds like a lot. But I bet we still read an exhaustive amount about how amazing it is and it will be on everyones Top 2 list of HIDDEN GEMS YOU HAVE TO PLAY.

 

Although its been 14 minutes since I've read anything about The Buck Club so maybe that list will have to be longer.