A Journey Back to Scratch Golf and Healthy Fitness

[The_Hipp]

@Nels55Those are some great point mate, all super simple and super effective.  You hit some real highlights that I think get over looked.  The big two being:

1. Keeping a log.  I think it's super important to keep a log, not only of food intake (calorie counting, macros, etc) but even logging workouts (inclusive on finish times, weights used, etc).  It's so helpful to look back and even to track progress, and like you said, accountability! Same goes for golf, track your rounds and stats.  Simple things like fairways hit, GIR, putts.

 

2. and I'm going to shoutout @Myherobobhopehere as well.  People get too caught up with diets.  Keto, low carb, low fat, paleo, etc.  Everyone's body is different.  Everyone's requirements in terms of carbs, fat, protein are different.  There is a crazy amount of science behind this.  A diet is a great kickstart, but really should not be the long term solution.  The goal there should be healthier eating habits in general that can translate to everyday life.  I think both short term (the sprint) and long term (the marathon) goals are key!

[The_Hipp]

28 minutes ago, gticlay said:

Hey Obee.  You must be the Obee we all know and love from POF, right?  Agree with what you say.  It kind of depends on how out of shape or fat one is. Do you have any workout advice for those wanting to improve their golf at the gym as well as practice at the course?  My main goal this year is to work on partial wedge shots.  Especially with the new wedge setup I'm going to try this year after maybe 15 years with just 47/54/60.

 

I'd be happy to help you with some golf specific workouts and programming.  

 

I see you mentioned partial wedge shots.  There are great exercises and stretches for that.  A lot to do with control and stability.  Is this something you are interested in?

[The_Hipp]

38 minutes ago, DasTanK said:

Hey @The_Hipp, I'm also from Long Island and Bethpage is my home course. I live about 5-10 minutes away. I know those 5 hour rounds all too well, but last year with the spaced out tee times was the fastest I've complete a round (~4 hours). I have a similar story to you, I had my first born at the end of the 2019 golf season after playing some of my best golf. After she was born and including quarantine I got to the heaviest I've ever been.

I'm also trying to lose weight  especially before the local am tour season starts but also for the quality of life. So I invested in a peloton and noticed how fast my leg strength has gone up but still trying to eat properly so haven't really lost anything yet. I'm trying to lose about 30-40 lbs by May which might be too ambitious but mostly want to lose by June for Monte's Jersey Clinic. If you're interested I would be down to play a round this year at Bethpage and also help out on the fitness journey. I definitely need to start lifting again 

 

You know, I was quite hesitant before starting this topic, but I knew I'd get some replies that said "similar story".

 

I hear great things about the Peloton, a lot of my family and friends have one.  I think if you clean up your eating, and your committed to riding that Peloton, the lbs should start melting off!

 

Just to be honest with you, 30-40 lbs by May / June is quite the lofty goal, but the fun thing is I have the same one.  I turn 34 on May 27th.  My son turns 2 on May 28th.  I'd like to be 30lbs lighter by then.  Is it impossible for us? No way.  Is it going to be difficult and require a lot of self discipline? Hell yes.  I think I've already seen a few replies to your post indicating that it's quite a lot of weight in a short period if time.  As long as you keep your overall health in mind and don't make an drastic and dramatic, you should seem some great results.

 

I can tell you exactly what will happen, at first you'll probably lose a decent amount in a short time, it'll be a good mix of water weight and fat.  So stepping on the scale will be quite rewarding.  You'll continue to see small weekly decreases if you stick to your plan, it'll feel great.  Then one week, you'll more than likely plateau.  You won't see any weight loss, or even more of a mental mind f*ck, you'll gain a pound or even a few.  Totally normal, you just have to push through.  Don't let is discourage you, trust me!  

[The_Hipp]

26 minutes ago, TLUBulldogGolf said:

Fellow D3 player checking in, those were some good times. Hard to believe I could travel to both coasts from a small school in central TX and play, even got to play Oak Hill East one year. Good luck on the journey. 

 

Awesome mate!  I have to get a thread going on this topic.  Too many good stories for us all not to share.

 

What an amazing experience right? Those 4 years still doesn't feel real.

[gticlay]

19 minutes ago, The_Hipp said:

 

I'd be happy to help you with some golf specific workouts and programming.  

 

I see you mentioned partial wedge shots.  There are great exercises and stretches for that.  A lot to do with control and stability.  Is this something you are interested in?

Yes, especially the stretches.  I'm strong enough for sure.  I'm pretty flexible but I think could be more so.

[phizzy30]

2 hours ago, TLUBulldogGolf said:

Fellow D3 player checking in, those were some good times. Hard to believe I could travel to both coasts from a small school in central TX and play, even got to play Oak Hill East one year. Good luck on the journey. 

Yeah same here.  I played on my golf team at Cal State Northridge eons ago for one year.  We were D2 at the time.  Not sure now. 

[DShepley]

If you want to get fit, use this thread as a log to tell us each morning what your plan is.  Cardio / workout / nutrition, then report back at the end of each day to let us know how you did.  I lost a bunch of weight once, (since regressed due to Covid, working from home, etc.), and I started a Facebook group with some friends to track progress.  I found that I was much more likely to get to the gym, go for a run, or make healthy choices if I first spelled it out in the morning and shared it with the group.  Basically, if you tell someone you are going to do something, you are more likely to do it.  

 

Good luck!  Also, make health a priority before the golf....you may find that your mindset improves and helps the golf improvement come along quicker.  We tend to do silly things and make poor decisions when we are tired and carry stress!

[Obee]

6 hours ago, gticlay said:

Hey Obee.  You must be the Obee we all know and love from POF, right?  Agree with what you say.  It kind of depends on how out of shape or fat one is. Do you have any workout advice for those wanting to improve their golf at the gym as well as practice at the course?  My main goal this year is to work on partial wedge shots.  Especially with the new wedge setup I'm going to try this year after maybe 15 years with just 47/54/60.

 

Wait ... you remember me from POF and you're asking me to help with fitness advice??? 

 

I am a svelte 6' 303lbs right now.

 

Now partial wedge shots? I can definitely help you there. 🙂

 

Would need to see some video, though... Both FO and DTL. 🙂

[Divot License]

7 hours ago, Obee said:

 

Wait ... you remember me from POF and you're asking me to help with fitness advice??? 

 

 

@Obee you're more famous and memorable than you realise bro. 

[gticlay]

9 hours ago, Obee said:

 

Wait ... you remember me from POF and you're asking me to help with fitness advice??? 

 

I am a svelte 6' 303lbs right now.

 

Now partial wedge shots? I can definitely help you there. 🙂

 

Would need to see some video, though... Both FO and DTL. 🙂

Ha ha. Well I don’t really think of fellow internet axe murderer golf friends as thin or fat... but I do remember you having a lot handicap. Was that you who plays a lot of hybrids?

[The_Hipp]

18 hours ago, DShepley said:

If you want to get fit, use this thread as a log to tell us each morning what your plan is.  Cardio / workout / nutrition, then report back at the end of each day to let us know how you did.  I lost a bunch of weight once, (since regressed due to Covid, working from home, etc.), and I started a Facebook group with some friends to track progress.  I found that I was much more likely to get to the gym, go for a run, or make healthy choices if I first spelled it out in the morning and shared it with the group.  Basically, if you tell someone you are going to do something, you are more likely to do it.  

 

Good luck!  Also, make health a priority before the golf....you may find that your mindset improves and helps the golf improvement come along quicker.  We tend to do silly things and make poor decisions when we are tired and carry stress!

 

A lot of these posts have a common theme - ACCOUNTABILITY.

 

You are 100% right.  The majority of people need that accountability as a motivator and a driving force.  Whether it's joining a Facebook group like you mentioned or even a simple thread like this, when folks know there are others holding their feet to the fire, they seem to have an easier time staying focused.  Self motivators are a rare breed and incredibly disciplined.  Their mindset is on another level.  

 

I don't want to bore everyone here with daily details, I am keeping a personal log, but I will post weekly progress.  For now, it'll be more focused on healthier eating habits, weight loss, workouts.  Not too much work I can do on the golf game here on Long Island until the weather gets nicer.  Maybe some putting and keeping the swing loose at an indoor facility.  

 

I encourage all of you to share any updates!

[Obee]

6 hours ago, gticlay said:

Ha ha. Well I don’t really think of fellow internet axe murderer golf friends as thin or fat... but I do remember you having a lot handicap. Was that you who plays a lot of hybrids?

Yup, that's me. Still below scratch when I'm healthy. Back has been awful since November, though. Swinging 50%, but still playing. Need to get out of the house to get some fresh air and sun. Otherwise I would go crazy I'm working from home 100% of the time now. I can shoot in the 70s, low 80's but I can't play "real" golf at all. I have a back surgery consult on Wednesday.

 

Regarding hybrids, I'm not sure I play "a lot" of hybrids as that is a relative term. I will let you decide:

 

 

[jonsnow]

On 2/25/2021 at 11:36 PM, Obee said:

Hell thereo! Good luck on your journey. 

 

One observation: You will almost certainly not "fitness" your way to good golf. You will improve your golf by improving your golf and improve your fitness by improving your fitness. Fitness is a way to eek out small improvements in your game.

 

I've known many 4-cappers who swore to me that the reason they weren't +2's is that they were "out of shape."

 

As if going from 5'10" 225 and flabby to 5'10" 185 and super fit was going to somehow magically improve their skill with a golf club. It doesn't.

 

It can help you hit the ball a bit farther. Be a bit less tired. Be a bit more flexible. (Maybe) have a few less injuries. It can help turn a 0 into a +2 ... maybe.

 

If and when you get back down to scratch(ish) (which I hope you do!), your fitness will play a very small part in that compared to getting better at the game itself.

 

Best of luck to you. 5 strokes in a year is totally doable if you play a bunch of golf. Practicing alone ain't gonna do it. Gotta get on the course and play (and lessons and practice, of course/maybe).

 

 

 

Thanks, Obee. I think this is some of the best common sense advice I've read here about the relationship between fitness & golf & how you really improve your game.

[The_Hipp]

7 minutes ago, Obee said:

Yup, that's me. Still below scratch when I'm healthy. Back has been awful since November, though. Swinging 50%, but still playing. Need to get out of the house to get some fresh air and sun. Otherwise I would go crazy I'm working from home 100% of the time now. I can shoot in the 70s, low 80's but I can't play "real" golf at all. I have a back surgery consult on Wednesday.

 

Regarding hybrids, I'm not sure I play "a lot" of hybrids as that is a relative term. I will let you decide:

 

 

 

Just a couple hybrids in there! 🤣

[gticlay]

1 hour ago, Obee said:

Yup, that's me. Still below scratch when I'm healthy. Back has been awful since November, though. Swinging 50%, but still playing. Need to get out of the house to get some fresh air and sun. Otherwise I would go crazy I'm working from home 100% of the time now. I can shoot in the 70s, low 80's but I can't play "real" golf at all. I have a back surgery consult on Wednesday.

 

Regarding hybrids, I'm not sure I play "a lot" of hybrids as that is a relative term. I will let you decide:

 

 

Yeah - that's not sooooo many.  But maybe a few years ago it seemed like a lot.  Hopefully you hang out here and share knowledge.  I'd value that "bigly"

[Obee]

9 hours ago, gticlay said:

Yeah - that's not sooooo many.  But maybe a few years ago it seemed like a lot.  Hopefully you hang out here and share knowledge.  I'd value that "bigly"

My longest iron is an 8-iron. I probably have more hybrids in my bag than any scratch/+ in the world. 

[Obee]

Just now, Obee said:

My longest iron is an 8-iron. I probably have more hybrids in my bag than any scratch/+ in the world. 

And I hang out here a lot. Usually post several times a week. Love this place. 🙂

Edited February 28, 2021 by Obee

[nitram]

Getting in better shape will also help your mental game in two ways. One, you won't be focused on how miserable you are and can concentrate more on the situation and shot at-hand. Secondly, you can use the same discipline on the course as you do in your workout routine and food selection. Plus you'll feel better physically and more importantly, feel better about yourself.

[ninjamac]

Slightly off topic, but how long did it take post surgery on your Achilles until you were golfing again?

[Yuck]

To the OP, I wish you well.  To the point others made, fitness and great golf are separate goals, each for their own reasons.  I was a plus capper when I was about 245 lbs.  I hit it the furthest when I was about 285 lbs.  At my army weight of about 210, I never was better than about a 3 or 4 capper.  At the end of the day, I am not the only one who’s best playing weight is not aligned with their best fitness weight. 

[gticlay]

I’ve hit maybe 3 buckets of balls over the last 5 years for practice, outside of fitting sessions.   Time has been precious with two toddlers and I tend to prioritize a walk with hitting balls over a range session. 
 

Most of our snow has melted for now and that means we are allowed to go on the range and “pick” a bucket of balls. I went Friday afternoon after a tough gym workout, then again today. What I call my “golf muscles” are really sore right now. I hit a lot of irons and just a few drives and fairways.

 

By the end of today, I was really tired and ended up hitting really smooth, pured shots. It was a good reminder of how important good technique is and that I don’t have to muscle each shot.

 

 I’m gonna have to take a few days to let my muscles heal up, but I’m already looking forward to hitting balls again! 

[Barfolomew]

Good luck hippy, once you get to scratch it's so much easier getting back there.... same in fitness as you know cause those muscles remember. 

 

I'm a par golfer that constantly gets injured and have to rebuild my swing too many times a year,  latest one is I snapped my achilles skateboarding in October. 

 

I want to play par golf in tourney's but got to do it in practice first lol

[Brocktoon]

I just started working on getting back in shape.  Have a week long golf trip coming up in exactly 2 months and I want to commit to improving my game over that period.  

My 4 goals are to:

1. Swing a club everyday ( I can get to a driving range 2 times a week usually but have 10 ft ceilings so swinging is no issue at home.)

2. Exercise everyday (Gym twice a week and home, outdoor workouts.  At minimum I have a 10 minute core workout that I can fit in.)

3. Stretch everyday 

4. Learn & work on mental game everyday

 

Only played 3 times in the last year. Currently a 22 HCP.  My problem is that I've always dabbled in working on my swing and became satisfied with small gains.  Then by the time I play again the gains are mostly gone.   Hopefully if I commit to it for 2 or 3 months I can permanently improve my game.

[The_Hipp]

On 2/28/2021 at 9:15 PM, ninjamac said:

Slightly off topic, but how long did it take post surgery on your Achilles until you were golfing again?

 

I had complete tear and rupture of my achilles in early November, had the surgery a week later.  My rehab was with a sports specific physical therapist, it was pretty rigorous, not the typical recovery process.  I was in a pool relatively early on, as a form of low impact exercise.  Then moved to cycling / spin class, and lastly running.  I was fully recovered by the start of the following years golf season. So about 4-5 months until I was 100%.

[The_Hipp]

1 hour ago, Barfolomew said:

Good luck hippy, once you get to scratch it's so much easier getting back there.... same in fitness as you know cause those muscles remember. 

 

I'm a par golfer that constantly gets injured and have to rebuild my swing too many times a year,  latest one is I snapped my achilles skateboarding in October. 

 

I want to play par golf in tourney's but got to do it in practice first lol

 

You just tore your achilles in October, of 2020?!

[Obee]

On 2/25/2021 at 7:16 AM, The_Hipp said:

<snip>

A strict workout routine paired with the freedom to play golf at will (no wife, no kids, no responsibility outside my full-time job) got me into the best shape of my life and down to scratch golf.  I started playing some local tournaments and leagues to feed my competitive nature.  It was really an amazing time.

<snip>

I'm trending towards a 10+ handicap again, which for anyone who has ever been a scratch golfer knows its incredibly frustrating and sometimes just down right not fun, especially when your topping tee shots.

 

First off, don't take this as an insult, please. It's not meant that way at all, I'm truly trying to understand something I've been having trouble wrapping my mind around since you posted this. 🙂

 

I'm quite curious how anyone could go from being a true "scratch golfer" and then somehow become a 10 -- especially at your age and without any major, ongoing, debilitating injuries.

 

That entire concept is alien to me. Why wouldn't it be that just by getting out and playing twice a week you wouldn't quickly drop down to, at the very worst, a 2 or 3?

 

I can honestly say that I don't know a single scratch/+ index golfer who has taken a long time off who has taken more than a a month/couple months -- at most -- to get back close to their previous form.

 

So a couple questions:

• What changed in the way you play golf from when you were a "scratch golfer" to now? How do you manage to shoot 10 strokes worse, on average? That's ... a lot of strokes
• How much of that is mental and not physical?
• How much does your knee(?) injury impact you current golf swing?

Asking because I once took over 2 straight years off without once touching a club due to three successive surgeries on different parts of my body for different things. I was back to below scratch very quickly, but I was, for sure, much more inconsistent for the first 3 to 6 months. Could shoot 68 one day and 81 the next. But I was back to scratch/below very quickly.

 

This probably gets to the larger question of how people become scratch/below to begin with: There are the technical, process-oriented "grinders," and there are more "natural" players of the game who can roll out of bed and hit a golf shot -- and everything in between, of course. I'm guessing you are more of the former? Maybe that plays into this?

 

[The_Hipp]

1 hour ago, Brocktoon said:

I just started working on getting back in shape.  Have a week long golf trip coming up in exactly 2 months and I want to commit to improving my game over that period.  

My 4 goals are to:

1. Swing a club everyday ( I can get to a driving range 2 times a week usually but have 10 ft ceilings so swinging is no issue at home.)

2. Exercise everyday (Gym twice a week and home, outdoor workouts.  At minimum I have a 10 minute core workout that I can fit in.)

3. Stretch everyday 

4. Learn & work on mental game everyday

 

Only played 3 times in the last year. Currently a 22 HCP.  My problem is that I've always dabbled in working on my swing and became satisfied with small gains.  Then by the time I play again the gains are mostly gone.   Hopefully if I commit to it for 2 or 3 months I can permanently improve my game.

 

This is an awesome plan, very committed and all four points are so beneficial, each in their own way.  I think stretching is totally underrated, so adding it to your daily routine is fantastic.

 

As far as learning and working on your mental game, there are so many great books and podcasts.  I read "Zen Golf: Mastering the Mental Game". You can grab it on Amazon.

[Barfolomew]

1 hour ago, The_Hipp said:

 

You just tore your achilles in October, of 2020?!

 

Ya... it popped mid Oct 2020 started PT in Dec.  Doing good can hit balls now with bad balance on left foot (right handed). 

the calf lost all its strength.

[The_Hipp]

21 hours ago, Obee said:

 

First off, don't take this as an insult, please. It's not meant that way at all, I'm truly trying to understand something I've been having trouble wrapping my mind around since you posted this. 🙂

 

I'm quite curious how anyone could go from being a true "scratch golfer" and then somehow become a 10 -- especially at your age and without any major, ongoing, debilitating injuries.

 

That entire concept is alien to me. Why wouldn't it be that just by getting out and playing twice a week you wouldn't quickly drop down to, at the very worst, a 2 or 3?

 

I can honestly say that I don't know a single scratch/+ index golfer who has taken a long time off who has taken more than a a month/couple months -- at most -- to get back close to their previous form.

 

So a couple questions:

• What changed in the way you play golf from when you were a "scratch golfer" to now? How do you manage to shoot 10 strokes worse, on average? That's ... a lot of strokes
• How much of that is mental and not physical?
• How much does your knee(?) injury impact you current golf swing?

Asking because I once took over 2 straight years off without once touching a club due to three successive surgeries on different parts of my body for different things. I was back to below scratch very quickly, but I was, for sure, much more inconsistent for the first 3 to 6 months. Could shoot 68 one day and 81 the next. But I was back to scratch/below very quickly.

 

This probably gets to the larger question of how people become scratch/below to begin with: There are the technical, process-oriented "grinders," and there are more "natural" players of the game who can roll out of bed and hit a golf shot -- and everything in between, of course. I'm guessing you are more of the former? Maybe that plays into this?

 

 

Haha, it's quite the mind f*ck right?! I am in no way offended by your comments and questions, and I'm happy to further explain!

 

Also, just want to preface my comments by saying, in no way am I advocating that being in peak physical shape a requirement to being a scratch golfer.  I just so happened to be in the best shape of my life, and playing my best level of golf at the same time.  I will however be a big advocate on the many ways fitness can help ones golf game, beyond swing speed and increased distance conversation.

 

Just to put a couple things in perspective, so you can see the big picture: the time in my life I'm referencing, I was 185 (I'm 5-11).  Today, still 5-11 lol but 235 (well 230 now since I've started this journey and topic).  I'll save everyone the math, but that's in increase of 50 lbs.  The increase in weight has been detrimental to my game in everyday.  I've lost an incredible about of flexibility, the drastic changes in my physical stature has caused some changes to my swing and swing path, and lastly but not least importantly, fatigue has become a big factor.

 

To directly answer your bulleted questions:

1. To be quite frank, gaining 50 lbs has severely impacted by swing, both turn and path) as well as fatigue.  Trust me, I know all to well it's A LOT of strokes, and the frustration level was at an all time high.  I can tell you I didn't lose my golf "skill". 

2. Not trying to pat myself on the back here, but my mental game is pretty strong.  I've played competitive sports at a high level, through HS and College (I also played college lacrosse on scholarship, not just D3 golf lol), so I'm pretty confident in my mental game, I've worked quite hard on it for many years.

3. I honestly do not think either the achilles injury, nor the knee surgery have had an impact on my game.  The do not hurt, they do not limit my abilities, they were just contributing factors in physical decline lol

 

To some of your last points, I couldn't agree more.  There are absolutely some guys that can play twice a year, shot even par and call it a day.  I envy them haha.  I definitely lean towards that grinder category.  I'm not saying if I don't play for a month I'll forget how to swing a club lol but for me personally, to maintain that "scratch" level of play, I'll need to play / practice / swing a little more often.

 

This may sound silly to some, but I've lived most if not all (besides this past year or so) of my life at a relatively fit level.  My body is not handling this well, at all.  Fatigue is a big factor here.  I've said this in some previous posts.  I'm out of breath walking up hills to the green.  I'm swinging and putting with an elevated heart rate.  There are times in the round that I am just flat out tired lol. I'm 33. I shouldn't be sucking wind walking a golf course.  It's the reality that I lived the past season, and it's something I do not want to face this season.

 

I think the path to handicap 5 and below is much faster than the path back to <200 lbs.  I know what it entails.  I'm prepared to face the music haha.  Hope this provided a touch more clarification.

[The_Hipp]

20 hours ago, Barfolomew said:

 

Ya... it popped mid Oct 2020 started PT in Dec.  Doing good can hit balls now with bad balance on left foot (right handed). 

the calf lost all its strength.

 

Wow sorry to hear that, I fell your pain! All joking aside, my left calf is STILL slightly smaller than my right.  The muscle atrophy was insane.  I do have many calf and balance building exercises if interested.