Dr Kwon

[Zitlow]

"Muscles can only pull and cannot push. Therefore muscles have to work in pairs to move a joint."

 

[1Ante]

Driver vs. Iron swing and Dr. Kwon, question.

 

I have of course not seen or read all material Dr. Kwon has put out (not even close) or all posts on this forum, so maybe the answer to this question is already here?

 

It seems to me that when a student of Dr. Kwon is swinging it is always the driver being used. And that when Dr. Kwon is demonstrating some move he is not using a club at all, only his hands or some tool of his.

 

So, the focus seems to me to be on the driver swing, meaning with the intention is to hit up on the ball. Does this mean that his theories and teachings are not straight off applicable to iron swings (with intention to “hit down” on the ball) and consideration is needed when iron is being used?

 

I have had great help, really, from Dr. Kwons theories in all my swings so I have no complaints whatsoever, but I am still a high cap and constantly tweaking my swing notes…

[glk]

5 hours ago, 1Ante said:

Driver vs. Iron swing and Dr. Kwon, question.

 

I have of course not seen or read all material Dr. Kwon has put out (not even close) or all posts on this forum, so maybe the answer to this question is already here?

 

It seems to me that when a student of Dr. Kwon is swinging it is always the driver being used. And that when Dr. Kwon is demonstrating some move he is not using a club at all, only his hands or some tool of his.

 

So, the focus seems to me to be on the driver swing, meaning with the intention is to hit up on the ball. Does this mean that his theories and teachings are not straight off applicable to iron swings (with intention to “hit down” on the ball) and consideration is needed when iron is being used?

 

I have had great help, really, from Dr. Kwons theories in all my swings so I have no complaints whatsoever, but I am still a high cap and constantly tweaking my swing notes…

He uses driver since he is indoors on a mat and has folks make lots of swings and don't hit many balls - he is training a motion change - for a full analysis he has folks swing driver, 5i, and pitching wedge.    His motion applies thru the bag nothing about it means one has to hit up.   His YouTube playlist on drills has some where he swings an iron - see his shurn video.    

Edited September 14, 2023 by glk

[1Ante]

Thanks, will watch that video again. 
 

To be perfectly honest it seems I have some issues with irons right now but driver is better than ever. Think I have put too much focus on the front leg push up in the down swing, making me stay behind at impact (duff)

[Nels55]

On 11/10/2022 at 1:31 PM, Zitlow said:

Dr. Kwon is better than the rest IMO because he's teaching one unified motion instead of a series of mechanical positions. 

That is true but Dr. Kwon gets really technical with his more advanced students are far as looking at positions of body parts during the swing.  Things like hand path and trail elbow movement and so on.  My understanding is that he uses his 3D system to define the changes to make the swing more efficient and then modifies the drills to achieve the positional effects that he is looking for.  Most good teachers do the same or similar though some or maybe most rely on their eyes and the ball flight as opposed to the high tech stuff.

[MrHateCoffee]

On 11/24/2022 at 1:49 AM, gentles said:

Nearly a year into this thread, I'd like to hear from people who had some success using step drills and rope swings to promote a more active backswing and better pressure shift.

 

What was the trigger that helped the drills transition into real golf swing? Did you just do a ton of step drills and let the change on course take care of itself? Were you feeling the pressure shift as a swing feel? did you try step swings on course? Exaggerations? 

 

Please share experiences and what you're still working on now. thanks!

 

 

 

Nearly a year later... I'm quoting this to see if anyone is gonna answer your question.  I actually like what Kwon teaches but I'm having a hard time finding people who have taken it to the course with great success.  If they exist then they are pretty dang quiet about it.

[Nels55]

3 hours ago, MrHateCoffee said:

 

Nearly a year later... I'm quoting this to see if anyone is gonna answer your question.  I actually like what Kwon teaches but I'm having a hard time finding people who have taken it to the course with great success.  If they exist then they are pretty dang quiet about it.

I still do the drills probably about once a week or so.  Dr. Kwon's teaching and drills did help me to improve my swing no doubt about it.

[Nels55]

I found this guys swing improvement interesting to watch.  I

 

[umamimami]

For my fellow tall golfers Verplank is 6"3'. Verplank is top 10 (6th) in Long Drive points - here's a video I dug up. Eyeballing his record, based on the video date, Verplank has made more points since the date of the lesson with Dr. Kwon.
 

EDIT: He's a model student too. Anyone can learn from him how to best acquire new skills from a coach.

 

Contrasted with other students you can see how absorbed he is in absorbing whatever Dr. Kwon presents him. I've witnessed so many of Dr. Kwon's other students half-watch Dr. Kwon, do a SINGLE REP of the movement, and most then immediately jump into their default motor pattern with a FEW SLIGHT CHANGES (ie flair). THIS IS A HUGE MISTAKE IMO. The successful students absorb first ... .... (dots to emphasize how much later, if at all the second step happens) THEN they blend. Unsuccessful students jump headfirst into showing off their own moves. This isn't a swap-meet! It's a lesson! It's a one way street. Or at least you should treat it as such, IF ONLY FOR THE DURATION OF THE LESSON. If you're at the point of asking for help, you would be best served to wholly trust and respect the knowledge you receive - again, IF ONLY FOR THE DURATION OF THE LESSON.

 

It's like if a friend offered to teach you how to do a 3-point turn when you've only known how to do a 5-point turn. Imagine he's got one of those fake steering wheels all setup on the passenger side. Imagine y'all get ready to go. Your friend starts talking about how they do a 3-pointer and starts to mime turning the wheel and looking over his shoulder ... and right then you look away and IMMEDIATELY shift and turn the wheel and back up like you'd normally do - THEN you look to your friend and ask them what to do next...

 

Learning is like the golf swing - it happens really fast and if you get in the way of it, your results are of lower quality than intended. If you're trying to learn a new way of doing things, would you rather have that new way be a DISTINCT AND VIBRANT memory? Or would you want it to be an indistinct part, jumbled up with your (self-admittedly wrong) current way of doing things.

Verplank starts with mimicry, masters that, then moves on. Watch him test out the hip movement at the start of the lesson, before Dr. Kwon has even begun the demonstration. He's already zeroing in on the thing he's going to be learning about -AND CHANGING HIS RELATED BEHAVIOR.
 

I see a lot of people appear to get embarrassed when learning and to me that's a sign that they are too in their head, and thus not enough into their bodies. Sensing your body is natural, everyone does it. There's no inherent shame in using and feeling your body. If you're feeling shame its a sure sign that you're using your mental resources on something that ISN'T the learning/swing infront of you. Once you recognize that you're putting your resources towards something that isn't your physical body awareness, consider that you could resolve to dedicate more resources to sensing your body. You get a twofold reward, higher quality sensory information/memories, and a gradual fading whatever the recently overactive parts of your brain were cooking up.

 

 

Edited October 19, 2023 by umamimami

[glk]

hand path is at the root of lots of swings issues   This is a pretty typical example.
 

 

[Nels55]

9 hours ago, glk said:

hand path is at the root of lots of swings issues   This is a pretty typical example.
 

 

Interesting video, thanks!  If I understand correctly Dr. Kwon is saying that the hands should reach their low point at the ball.  Most experts I have seen say that the hands are moving up through the ball in good swings.  Has Dr. Kwon found differently with his analysis of pro swings?

[ezpz]

On 9/27/2023 at 5:01 PM, MrHateCoffee said:

 

Nearly a year later... I'm quoting this to see if anyone is gonna answer your question.  I actually like what Kwon teaches but I'm having a hard time finding people who have taken it to the course with great success.  If they exist then they are pretty dang quiet about it.

I've been taking lessons from a pro who also focuses on this types of teaching, step drills, focusing on force before motion, pressure plates etc. started in winter 2021/22 and had been stuck at an 8 for quite some time with not much noticible improvement in my ballstriking for quite a while, no matter the lessons I took before or how much I tried to practice them I couldnt get over my structural issues. in 2 years since I went from my 8 to a 3 and am just a much better golfer. 

 

I'm not a very athethic person in general so these types of lessons have been eye opening for me. I hit the ball maybe 20y further but that hasn't been the focus at all, I always struggled with lowpoint and that has been completely resolved. The biggest impact it has made was improving my short irons and pitching. I'm still not good, but a hell of a lot better than i was and I went from not knowing if there was any hope for improvement in my game to looking forward to much better I can get. 

 

I will say that without lessons my progress would've been extremely unlikely, the feels were so foreign to what I was feeling athleticaly in my body before that I could never have managed it from the video's on Kwons channel.

[glk]

11 hours ago, Nels55 said:

Interesting video, thanks!  If I understand correctly Dr. Kwon is saying that the hands should reach their low point at the ball.  Most experts I have seen say that the hands are moving up through the ball in good swings.  Has Dr. Kwon found differently with his analysis of pro swings?

he is not sayings hands low point is at ball.  Hands will be on the lead side at impact not the center on planar swings - low point is still before impact   This guy has low point way before impact - too far back - thin and fat due to very in to out path..

[Nels55]

On 10/29/2023 at 6:38 AM, glk said:

he is not sayings hands low point is at ball.  Hands will be on the lead side at impact not the center on planar swings - low point is still before impact   This guy has low point way before impact - too far back - thin and fat due to very in to out path..

Viewing the video again I see that the Dr. Kwon says the low point should be at the center which is actually behind the ball.  The first time that I watched the video I mistook the center for the ball position.

[glk]

Just finished my third trip thru Dr. Kwon's certification classes ( 5th time if you count me rewatching previous classes) - If you are interested in better understanding of the mechanics and biomechanics of the golf swing motion, i'm not aware of a better source (don't believe any other golf researcher offers classes based on their work.  He offers them via zoom every spring and fall - early bird sign up discounts - they are international affairs - 30 hours in class - close to 500 slides(it is a lot to digest), plenty of chances to ask questions (in class and outside) - once taken can do endless retakes (he does continue to add material).   only requirement is an open and curious mind.  A good starting point would be to view his videos under his youtube golf biomechancis playlist - i started by taking his mini talk series - 10 hours and cheaper plus it got me discounts, lol.

 

So new stuff.   Dr. Kwon is working to have all of his golf research have free access - right now most of it is behind pay walls - believe he said it is costing him around $1500 but he wants folks to be able to have it.

 

He shared his soon to be published research on the two step swing drills (tssd).    10 jr's 15-18 9 boys, 1 girl.   One 45 minute  session after a full swing analysis.   No mechanical improvements other than the step drills done.  results are promising - overall 3% chs gain - significant increases in angular velocities in backswing and downswings and in others areas such as grf, kinematic sequence, etc.      He mentioned his literature studies of speed training (which run  weeks) have only shown gains in the 1%  range.    Next step is a longer study - maybe 7 weeks - and to include other swing mechanic improvements - hopes to start this coming spring.   he is starting to assess the effectiveness of the drills he prescribes.

 

Otherwise, he has no plans to attempt developing a swing model - he thought maybe sometime in the future AI could take a shot.   He is more interested in swing principles supported by evidence - his K-GRANIOSE principles.   Next research is on the the thorax and then on the mid hands forces on the club.

 

Though he has lots of data that he has run through regression analysis , he doesn't focus mainly on numbers (people often ask him for numbers like what forward bend should be and he always politely defers) - more on patterns.  In level II he shares mean, std,ranges, correalation to chs - and alway shares extremes on each end - including pulling up the swing data for the person.  He has not included all the data he has since he took a macro view - so ask him about internal/external hip rotation and he'll tell you he has not looked at that level yet even though he has the data     Elite swings are far from homogenous - he dismissed the idea that 95% tour swings are the same with small deviations.   His focus is not on how one moves today but rather how one can move more efficiently - we are not trapped in our current motion patterns -  a bit of talk about having healthy motion variability -not ROM but rather how we use our overly redundant joints to do difference motions to accomplish similar motions - the more options one has the more easily one can adapt and control our body's motion  -he is a fan of doing many athletic things as a youth ( or at any age). 

 

 

He is adapting his kwon3d software he developed to have acost effective golf only version - couple $100 - he plans to have a level III where he trains people on golf swing analysis using his software.    He is really a golf junkie - gets excited talking all things golf - yet 14 years ago he knew little to nothing but he has been involved in other sports since the early 90s - all this an he says he still has lots to learn about golf.

 

Run my virtual mouth enough.    

 

 

Edited November 3, 2023 by glk

[MPStrat]

On 11/3/2023 at 4:46 PM, glk said:

 Elite swings are far from homogenous - he dismissed the idea that 95% tour swings are the same with small deviations.   

Interesting 😂 

 

[Laaandry]

Late to the party but made it through this whole thread and just want to thank everyone for all the detail and especially @glk for sharing so many intricate details about the programming.

 

It's now winter where I am and figured I might as well spend it working on speed and mechanics (in the winter I only have access to a launch monitor every couple of weeks) and I started working through some Kwon drills this past week. I've worked with an instructor in the past who mostly focused on me holding off the club release and that's been my focus for a couple of seasons but it never really clicked until I worked on Monte's NTC work.

 

I was able to hit on a simulator yesterday, focusing almost entirely on pressure shifts and flow as per Kwon's drill. Below are some numbers compared to two weeks ago where I was trying to hit the ball as hard as possible and there are some massive increases. Do note these are number from hitting actually balls not step drill swings. I woke up this morning sore in my calves, hips, and upper back that I've never felt before but more importantly, no pain in my lower back/lumbar which I have almost every time I play golf.

 

It was harder getting the movement to work with irons--and granted I was hitting off a mat not turf--but when it clicked it clicked, I carried a 5 iron probably 15 yards further than I ever have before.

 

• Driver ball speed before Kwon drills: 
• Driver clubhead speed before Kwon Drills:
• Driver ball speed after Kwon Drills: 
• Driver clubhead speeds after Kwon drills: 

[Simpsonia]

Curious as to @glk take on the below video. I get the theory of keeping center of mass closer to increase rate of rotation (like a figure skater pulling in limbs to spin fast), though it seems like he's saying the traditional wisdom of maintaining width is essentially a compensation to help with timing the release to reduce inconsistency that leads to inaccuracy. In reality is this just kind of a matchup thing of finding your personal width that produces speed but doesn't lead to loss of accuracy? 

 

I get that the particular player in question also had some other compensations (that they discuss near the end), that the width in particular helped. More just curious as to how this applies in a more practical sense as it relates to the width in one's particular swing. Or is this one of those things that you can really only truly understand in conjunction with all of his other concepts? 

 

 

[glk]

58 minutes ago, Simpsonia said:

Curious as to @glk take on the below video. I get the theory of keeping center of mass closer to increase rate of rotation (like a figure skater pulling in limbs to spin fast), though it seems like he's saying the traditional wisdom of maintaining width is essentially a compensation to help with timing the release to reduce inconsistency that leads to inaccuracy. In reality is this just kind of a matchup thing of finding your personal width that produces speed but doesn't lead to loss of accuracy? 

 

I get that the particular player in question also had some other compensations (that they discuss near the end), that the width in particular helped. More just curious as to how this applies in a more practical sense as it relates to the width in one's particular swing. Or is this one of those things that you can really only truly understand in conjunction with all of his other concepts? 

 

 

 

Width, or arc width, is a measure of the mid hands from the sternum.   I'm not aware of it being a measure of the distance of the clubhead though I can see how one can conclude that.  

 

That said, one of the primary purposes of the pivot is to create as much torque as possible - since the swing is dominated by angular motion with a small but important amount of lateral motion.     So then it becomes how does one take that torque and create max angular acceleration very early in the downswing - the ice skater you mentioned applies to the swing and Dr Kwon mentions numerous time the importance of keeping the club close to body early in the downswing.

 

Here are examples of a swing keeping it close and another with an early cast.

 

Caster is B -So B will have more club velocity early in the ds but sacrifices generating more body acceleration - then as momentum is transferred his body has less to apply to the arms/club late in the ds

 

So A has more body moementum to xfr

 

So is this a common issue in elite swings - more than one would expect.    Not the big universe - but still 40% of the swings in one of his studies showed an cast pattern - due to early wrist release - EDA is p5 - the player in the video could have more wrist c0ck but his issue was more o an arm cast.   I didn't look at this swing videos but from the discussion it sounded like he relied more on upper body

 

 

 

Don't think you need to take his classes to understand this just some basic mechanics.  I am glad to see Dr Kwon start to put up some of the swing analysis discussion and it appears he might be including some amateurs typically he only does reprogramming with ams.

[iacas]

3 hours ago, Simpsonia said:

Curious as to @glk take on the below video. I get the theory of keeping center of mass closer to increase rate of rotation (like a figure skater pulling in limbs to spin fast), though it seems like he's saying the traditional wisdom of maintaining width is essentially a compensation to help with timing the release to reduce inconsistency that leads to inaccuracy. In reality is this just kind of a matchup thing of finding your personal width that produces speed but doesn't lead to loss of accuracy?

 

I have thoughts, but you hint at them… and though the center of mass of the clubhead is pretty far from the center of rotation (which itself is not in a fixed location, either in 3D or in the body, except over short-ish periods of time), it's also relatively light, too, and the gains to be made in speed as noted in the video (more wrist hinge, pull down a bit more to keep the CoM of the club closer to the body) can screw up some other parts of the player's performance/ability to hit good shots.

[glk]

4 hours ago, Simpsonia said:

Curious as to @glk take on the below video. I get the theory of keeping center of mass closer to increase rate of rotation (like a figure skater pulling in limbs to spin fast), though it seems like he's saying the traditional wisdom of maintaining width is essentially a compensation to help with timing the release to reduce inconsistency that leads to inaccuracy. In reality is this just kind of a matchup thing of finding your personal width that produces speed but doesn't lead to loss of accuracy? 

 

I get that the particular player in question also had some other compensations (that they discuss near the end), that the width in particular helped. More just curious as to how this applies in a more practical sense as it relates to the width in one's particular swing. Or is this one of those things that you can really only truly understand in conjunction with all of his other concepts? 

 

 

Took the time to watch the first session with this player - part 1 rope - makes what was being discussed about the arms etc clear.   in short he was using his pivot to "drag" the club around himself and then throwing late.   worth a look.

[Nels55]

On 11/3/2023 at 1:46 PM, glk said:

Just finished my third trip thru Dr. Kwon's certification classes ( 5th time if you count me rewatching previous classes) - If you are interested in better understanding of the mechanics and biomechanics of the golf swing motion, i'm not aware of a better source (don't believe any other golf researcher offers classes based on their work.  He offers them via zoom every spring and fall - early bird sign up discounts - they are international affairs - 30 hours in class - close to 500 slides(it is a lot to digest), plenty of chances to ask questions (in class and outside) - once taken can do endless retakes (he does continue to add material).   only requirement is an open and curious mind.  A good starting point would be to view his videos under his youtube golf biomechancis playlist - i started by taking his mini talk series - 10 hours and cheaper plus it got me discounts, lol.

 

So new stuff.   Dr. Kwon is working to have all of his golf research have free access - right now most of it is behind pay walls - believe he said it is costing him around $1500 but he wants folks to be able to have it.

 

He shared his soon to be published research on the two step swing drills (tssd).    10 jr's 15-18 9 boys, 1 girl.   One 45 minute  session after a full swing analysis.   No mechanical improvements other than the step drills done.  results are promising - overall 3% chs gain - significant increases in angular velocities in backswing and downswings and in others areas such as grf, kinematic sequence, etc.      He mentioned his literature studies of speed training (which run  weeks) have only shown gains in the 1%  range.    Next step is a longer study - maybe 7 weeks - and to include other swing mechanic improvements - hopes to start this coming spring.   he is starting to assess the effectiveness of the drills he prescribes.

 

Otherwise, he has no plans to attempt developing a swing model - he thought maybe sometime in the future AI could take a shot.   He is more interested in swing principles supported by evidence - his K-GRANIOSE principles.   Next research is on the the thorax and then on the mid hands forces on the club.

 

Though he has lots of data that he has run through regression analysis , he doesn't focus mainly on numbers (people often ask him for numbers like what forward bend should be and he always politely defers) - more on patterns.  In level II he shares mean, std,ranges, correalation to chs - and alway shares extremes on each end - including pulling up the swing data for the person.  He has not included all the data he has since he took a macro view - so ask him about internal/external hip rotation and he'll tell you he has not looked at that level yet even though he has the data     Elite swings are far from homogenous - he dismissed the idea that 95% tour swings are the same with small deviations.   His focus is not on how one moves today but rather how one can move more efficiently - we are not trapped in our current motion patterns -  a bit of talk about having healthy motion variability -not ROM but rather how we use our overly redundant joints to do difference motions to accomplish similar motions - the more options one has the more easily one can adapt and control our body's motion  -he is a fan of doing many athletic things as a youth ( or at any age). 

 

 

He is adapting his kwon3d software he developed to have acost effective golf only version - couple $100 - he plans to have a level III where he trains people on golf swing analysis using his software.    He is really a golf junkie - gets excited talking all things golf - yet 14 years ago he knew little to nothing but he has been involved in other sports since the early 90s - all this an he says he still has lots to learn about golf.

 

Run my virtual mouth enough.    

 

 

Great post!

 

I really like that Dr. Kwon is trying to study how well his methods work.  I have always wished that there was some form of objective measure of how a teacher's students do.  Seems like Dr. Kwon is making a step in that direction with his study of young golfers.

[Simpsonia]

20 minutes ago, glk said:

Took the time to watch the first session with this player - part 1 rope - makes what was being discussed about the arms etc clear.   in short he was using his pivot to "drag" the club around himself and then throwing late.   worth a look.

 

Yeah I'm only about halfway through his full session video. I guess I was more curious about what Dr. Kwon was referring to around @3:25 when he tells him to keep the club close to his body (and makes a movement pulling in his right arm like he's decreasing the width). Given that movement, I wasn't really quite to sure if he was referring to the hands or just the center of mass of the club (ie traditional look of lag) and not letting go of the hinge in the wrists early. I guess I also kind of struggle with understanding his whole release concept (let it go, I know) but how it relates to maintaining not just path (his functional swing plane) but also the wrist conditions necessary to maintain stable face to path seem to be very different than when you're using a rope. 

Edited November 5, 2023 by Simpsonia

[glk]

48 minutes ago, Simpsonia said:

 

Yeah I'm only about halfway through his full session video. I guess I was more curious about what Dr. Kwon was referring to around @3:25 when he tells him to keep the club close to his body (and makes a movement pulling in his right arm like he's decreasing the width). Given that movement, I wasn't really quite to sure if he was referring to the hands or just the center of mass of the club (ie traditional look of lag) and not letting go of the hinge in the wrists early. I guess I also kind of struggle with understanding his whole release concept (let it go, I know) but how it relates to maintaining not just path (his functional swing plane) but also the wrist conditions necessary to maintain stable face to path seem to be very different than when you're using a rope. 

Posted this numerous time in the past    Prime example of keeping club close   Doesn't mean you pull the arms into the body - this leads to stick elbow.   Use the upper body to throw the arms continue with the video and you see where he doesn't want home to pull the arm - arms go along for the ride early 

 

Included grant Waite avatar swing where he keeps club close.

 

 

Edited November 5, 2023 by glk

[MK7Golf21]

1 hour ago, glk said:

Posted this numerous time in the past    Prime example of keeping club close   Doesn't mean you pull the arms into the body - this leads to stick elbow.   Use the upper body to throw the arms continue with the video and you see where he doesn't want home to pull the arm - arms go along for the ride early 

 

Included grant Waite avatar swing where he keeps club close.

 

 

 

I’ve seen you discuss this before in regard to Kwon not liking a casting the clubhead from the top for the reasons discussed above. Do you think it’s interesting that Monte has the feeling of casting the clubhead away from his body to 8 o clock from the top but still has it close to the body?

[MPStrat]

12 minutes ago, MK7Golf21 said:

I’ve seen you discuss this before in regard to Kwon not liking a casting the clubhead from the top for the reasons discussed above. Do you think it’s interesting that Monte has the feeling of casting the clubhead away from his body to 8 o clock from the top but still has it close to the body?

I think if a golfer grows up being taught to overdo this, they might have to spend the rest of their life trying to do the opposite. I think this is super common in golfers who learned in the 80s and 90s. 
 

But yet another good example of 3D data and then application can vary. 
 

I would guess Kwon knows there is some point of diminishing return with this. But I also think if a player throws the daylights out of it immediately, many aren’t going to cast less by trying to cast more. 
 

Casting can often be a result of other things. Obviously not many argue there isn’t ulnar deviation in the downswing, some need more. But It brings up an interesting question. Can casting  be a fault in and of itself? Is it necessary to address the cast on its own to fix what the body does? I say absolutely yes it can be. Kwon is saying the same. Tyler Ferrell too. Foley, David Woods. Many more… 

[MK7Golf21]

1 hour ago, MPStrat said:

I think if a golfer grows up being taught to overdo this, they might have to spend the rest of their life trying to do the opposite. I think this is super common in golfers who learned in the 80s and 90s. 
 

But yet another good example of 3D data and then application can vary. 
 

I would guess Kwon knows there is some point of diminishing return with this. But I also think if a player throws the daylights out of it immediately, many aren’t going to cast less by trying to cast more. 
 

Casting can often be a result of other things. Obviously not many argue there isn’t ulnar deviation in the downswing, some need more. But It brings up an interesting question. Can casting  be a fault in and of itself? Is it necessary to address the cast on its own to fix what the body does? I say absolutely yes it can be. Kwon is saying the same. Tyler Ferrell too. Foley, David Woods. Many more… 

good post, I agree. It’s kind of like Hunter Mahan from back in the day, His miss was leaving club face too open and flaring them out to the right. In golf magazines he explained that he had the feeling of keeping his body closed and bringing his arms down during the downswing. Yet when you looked at him on the downswing he rotated so open with a bent right arm. He was just trying to sequence it better because he naturally rotated open so much that left the face open occasionally. 
 

Edited November 6, 2023 by MK7Golf21

[glk]

14 hours ago, MK7Golf21 said:

I’ve seen you discuss this before in regard to Kwon not liking a casting the clubhead from the top for the reasons discussed above. Do you think it’s interesting that Monte has the feeling of casting the clubhead away from his body to 8 o clock from the top but still has it close to the body?

Feel vs real.   In the part 2 video with this student, dr kwon uses the feel like you are drawing a sword from the sheath image ( arrow from quiver) to counter the move of pulling down which throws the club up and out away from body.

[RichieHunt]

23 hours ago, Simpsonia said:

Curious as to @glk take on the below video. I get the theory of keeping center of mass closer to increase rate of rotation (like a figure skater pulling in limbs to spin fast), though it seems like he's saying the traditional wisdom of maintaining width is essentially a compensation to help with timing the release to reduce inconsistency that leads to inaccuracy. In reality is this just kind of a matchup thing of finding your personal width that produces speed but doesn't lead to loss of accuracy? 

 

I get that the particular player in question also had some other compensations (that they discuss near the end), that the width in particular helped. More just curious as to how this applies in a more practical sense as it relates to the width in one's particular swing. Or is this one of those things that you can really only truly understand in conjunction with all of his other concepts? 

 

 

 

I really enjoyed this video from Dr. Kwon.  Explains quite a bit of some of my issues and why you tend to want to get the shaft more vertical in the backswing.




RH

[Nels55]

Dr. Kwon has some interesting training aid ideas: