Moving from Players Distance to Cavity Back Players irons?

[ad_l1b]

Currently gaming P790s from 2021 (played Titleist T300s before that) and like them a lot however my handicap has dropped from 20 all the way down to a 10 over that last year or so. On a whim I went to go try out the new Ping 10k driver just to see if the hype was real (was not better than my LST) and while I was there my fitter had me try the Titleist T150s and the new Mizuno 243s. LOVED the feel from these irons and honestly really like how much feedback they gave me over the p790s. I could tell exactly where I struck the ball on the face vs with my P790s its a lot more numb unless its an extreme miss. My miss is mostly a pull to the left that ends up getting me in trouble long, what I found with the cavity back irons is that miss ended up being much less of an issue as they didn't fly nearly as far. I also was expecting a huge drop off in carry distance but in fact it was very similar and the ball flight was much better to my eye and the stopping power into the green with descent angle and spin was REALLY nice. I would not go so far as to say that my iron striking is the best part of my game, but as I hit those irons it occurred to me that the increased feeling/feedback would probably help me continue to improve more quickly than the forgiveness at this point. Maybe I am delusional but I didn't see a HUGE gap in forgiveness between the cavity back and the players distance. I am really considering picking up a set of the Mizuno 243s or something similar, but before i light fire to a bucket full of cash wanted to see if anyone had some helpful thoughts maybe from their journey. 

 

thanks in advance

[SEP1006]

To me, it all comes down to face contact. If you're hitting the center of the face pretty consistently then you aren't going to notice much difference if any at all.

 

Now if you're not, which it sounds like you aren't. Well then I would make the swap.

 

Make the game as easy as possible !!!!!!

 

 

 

[golfinbrad]

I think forgiveness is an often over used term.  Great for marketing, but no club is going to fix bad strikes.  That said, what shaft is in your current set and which were you fit for?  Have to wonder if the better dispersion is coming from that.  As for the change, go with what looks and feels the best to you.  If one of this are off then you likely won't be happy with the decision.

[Pepperturbo]

49 minutes ago, ad_l1b said:

I would not go so far as to say that my iron striking is the best part of my game, but as I hit those irons it occurred to me that the increased feeling/feedback would probably help me continue to improve more quickly than the forgiveness at this point.

Having played blades since learning, plus a few modern Tour iron designs like my T100; impact vibrations are imperative for me.  Though the head material and design contribute, it's the shaft that allows the talking to reach my hands and my head to read the message. 

 

As you consider clubs with Player attributes, let me remind you, they are not the best at letting the user off the hook with sloppy ball striking.  When a person goes brain-dead, bad scoring with certain clubs and shafts sends a message.  

 

I've said it often, solid ball striking comes from constant attention to details, there's NO let up like with more forgiving irons; reason I still hit the ball well and card respectable scores.  Good luck!

Edited January 17 by Pepperturbo

[ad_l1b]

9 minutes ago, golfinbrad said:

I think forgiveness is an often over used term.  Great for marketing, but no club is going to fix bad strikes.  That said, what shaft is in your current set and which were you fit for?  Have to wonder if the better dispersion is coming from that.  As for the change, go with what looks and feels the best to you.  If one of this are off then you likely won't be happy with the decision.

My current irons are fitted with OBAN CT 125 stiff, and I have been really happy with those. I was able to hit the T150s and the 243s with the same shaft setup as my gamers only obvious difference is the loft sleeve weight on the fitting shaft. Like I said the thing i noticed was the ball flight looked better (visually and on trackman) and the feel/feedback was night and day different. 

[golfinbrad]

8 minutes ago, ad_l1b said:

My current irons are fitted with OBAN CT 125 stiff, and I have been really happy with those. I was able to hit the T150s and the 243s with the same shaft setup as my gamers only obvious difference is the loft sleeve weight on the fitting shaft. Like I said the thing i noticed was the ball flight looked better (visually and on trackman) and the feel/feedback was night and day different. 

Sounds like you already convinced yourself.  Go for it and have fun!!! 

[realmfg]

48 minutes ago, golfinbrad said:

I think forgiveness is an often over used term.  Great for marketing, but no club is going to fix bad strikes. 

Best post of the year.

Edited January 17 by realmfg

[SUPERG]

I have several set of CB and other "Tour Cavity" but prefer to play my club matches and important ones with players distance for lower flight. That said, severe misses with a P790 or say a ZX7 or Pro 223 are likely the same, if all lofts match you may get more speed out of a P790. So you may just have to get used to a new set of distances. I have to agree with you though, it is a better feel experience. 

 

For me, it was tough to swallow some guys hitting 7 while you hit a 6 but once you get past that there are no issues and in theory if you get better feedback you would be lowering your feedback with practice etc.... 

[ad_l1b]

26 minutes ago, SUPERG said:

I have several set of CB and other "Tour Cavity" but prefer to play my club matches and important ones with players distance for lower flight. That said, severe misses with a P790 or say a ZX7 or Pro 223 are likely the same, if all lofts match you may get more speed out of a P790. So you may just have to get used to a new set of distances. I have to agree with you though, it is a better feel experience. 

 

For me, it was tough to swallow some guys hitting 7 while you hit a 6 but once you get past that there are no issues and in theory if you get better feedback you would be lowering your feedback with practice etc.... 

I dont mind clubbing up if i can drop it and stop it :)

[ad_l1b]

1 hour ago, golfinbrad said:

Sounds like you already convinced yourself.  Go for it and have fun!!! 

again though I may be delusional here 😛  

[SoCalTitleist]

get some older AP2s , much cheaper.

[btyh]

I would add that the better you understand your swing the more you can work the ball left to right. The 150s and 243s will make it easier. Feel and workability will be your advantages making the switch. 

[shoeshine]

Would you consider a blended set? Say like Mizzy 243’s in short to mid irons and then 245’s in the longer irons? I haven’t hit the 243’s yet but I remember hitting the 223’s in my last fitting and they were great all around. They almost made it in the bag but I ultimately went with the ZX7’s 5-P. However I recently swallowed my pride and acknowledged that I could use a little more forgiveness in my 5&6 irons so I swapped in the ZX5 mkii 5&6. They gave me the additional forgiveness I was looking for, feel great and provide feedback to know where I’m hitting on the face, just not as buttery as my ZX7s. I imagine that the drop off in feels between the Mizzy 243 and 245 would be minimal, if any though

[Jeff58]

A significant issue with a typical fitting is that you’re being fit for a 7 iron. I decent ball striker can hit any 7 iron in the controlled fitting environment. You then purchase the player/blade set, become despondent in real play, and under the “Goldilocks” rule, trade them for Cleveland Halo XL’s.

 

An alternative might be to purchase TM P7MC’s. Then just integrate whichever P790’s with the P7MC’s that you’re comfortable with.

[MiloMalt]

I currently have T200's that were fit for me last year when I was a 22HC. I'm now a 9 HC and am looking to do the same thing. I have a Cobra fitting soon to try the Cobra King CB which I would combo with the King Tours in the 4 and 5 iron if I like the clubs.

[Chunkitgood]

If you want to improve get some clubs with high center of gravity so you have to strike them properly to get spin to get distance.

 

Just an idea.

[POKeefe]

T-150's are fantastic. They would be a good middle of the road option to go from a P790 to a players iron.

[T_Golf_23]

This is golf WRX….. buy 20 sets. Change them very few weeks. Or every 9 holes. 
 

Rinse and repeat. 
 

I hate fittings. They generally suck. 
 

id rather go to PGA superstore. Grab a bunch of the preowned clubs for sale and hit them in a simulator. They let you do that with the preowned sets. Try the shafts and different heads. Or go find a second swing. Go in a weekday when no one is there. Or use global golf UTry program.
 

Or buy tons of stuff on here and take them out on a course and mess around with them. 
 

these places have so much available this time of year because everyone is trading in. Most try to a of sh*t….

 

here is the kicker, learn what it is about the dynamics of the shafts and heads that work for you. 
 

for example, I need heads with high CG and longer blade length. But little offset. My shafts need to be between 110 and 125G with almost no kick in the middle. I can handle but flex or tip flex in Tour V or Modus 130. Once you start wrapping your head around that you can start to realize it’s not about players cavity vs GI Vs blades, it’s a type of club and shaft dynamic that works for your swing. 
 

Then in typical WRX fashion still buy stuff here that doesn’t fit that profile because somehow you still want to try it…. Which I am probably about to do right now….. off to BST … to buy super low CG irons with some kind of slot back and a mid flex shaft that is light weight…. Because well, you know…..

[skaarsgard]

Reading the original post, the OP mentions after improving and growing into the clubs, his misses now are often left.   while i haven't looked at those version of p790's, this was a thing for many manufacturers that the more game improvement on into player's distance clubs had more offset helping players eliminate the most common right misses.  

 

moving into CB's and blades/ MB's, usually they have limited to no offset.   the elimination of offset was the reason i went from a 12 HC to mid single digit.

 

so, yes, i 100% agree with T Golf 23 on trying clubs and shafts and finding those sweet spots - this is most important - but don't sleep on trying to remove offset.

 

and in ten years or after your mid-forties you'll be back asking for more forgiveness again.  

[FmaxTurboSi]

9 hours ago, ad_l1b said:

Currently gaming P790s from 2021 (played Titleist T300s before that) and like them a lot however my handicap has dropped from 20 all the way down to a 10 over that last year or so. On a whim I went to go try out the new Ping 10k driver just to see if the hype was real (was not better than my LST) and while I was there my fitter had me try the Titleist T150s and the new Mizuno 243s. LOVED the feel from these irons and honestly really like how much feedback they gave me over the p790s. I could tell exactly where I struck the ball on the face vs with my P790s its a lot more numb unless its an extreme miss. My miss is mostly a pull to the left that ends up getting me in trouble long, what I found with the cavity back irons is that miss ended up being much less of an issue as they didn't fly nearly as far. I also was expecting a huge drop off in carry distance but in fact it was very similar and the ball flight was much better to my eye and the stopping power into the green with descent angle and spin was REALLY nice. I would not go so far as to say that my iron striking is the best part of my game, but as I hit those irons it occurred to me that the increased feeling/feedback would probably help me continue to improve more quickly than the forgiveness at this point. Maybe I am delusional but I didn't see a HUGE gap in forgiveness between the cavity back and the players distance. I am really considering picking up a set of the Mizuno 243s or something similar, but before i light fire to a bucket full of cash wanted to see if anyone had some helpful thoughts maybe from their journey. 

 

thanks in advance

 

I see you have a 3 and 4 hybrid in the bag, and start your irons at 5 iron. The p790 5 iron is 23.5 degrees of loft.  If you really wanted to see if the t150 or mizuno 243 irons are a good fit, go find 4 and 5 irons in the t150 and 243 and see if you can hit them well enough to gap with your current hybrids.  I can tell you personally, hitting a p790 5 iron is completely different from hitting a players cavity, especially off un-even lies, bunkers, mud and the rough.  If you can hit them well, then honestly go for it and enjoy the new clubs.  I've had p790, p770, t100s, hmb20, mb20, and 225's, so just giving you some advice from personal experience. 

 

[ad_l1b]

2 hours ago, FmaxTurboSi said:

 

I see you have a 3 and 4 hybrid in the bag, and start your irons at 5 iron. The p790 5 iron is 23.5 degrees of loft.  If you really wanted to see if the t150 or mizuno 243 irons are a good fit, go find 4 and 5 irons in the t150 and 243 and see if you can hit them well enough to gap with your current hybrids.  I can tell you personally, hitting a p790 5 iron is completely different from hitting a players cavity, especially off un-even lies, bunkers, mud and the rough.  If you can hit them well, then honestly go for it and enjoy the new clubs.  I've had p790, p770, t100s, hmb20, mb20, and 225's, so just giving you some advice from personal experience. 

 

I hit the 6 iron in the fitting bay because Club Champion…that’s all they have. But yeah I would be open to going into the 245 or t200 in the 5 iron.

[ad_l1b]

3 hours ago, skaarsgard said:

and in ten years or after your mid-forties you'll be back asking for more forgiveness again.  

Turning 50 this year 🙂

[Itsjustagame]

I know when I hit a shot that's not near the middle of the club face with every club in my bag from driver to putter. Between my hands, my ears and my eyes I can identify where on the clubface I hit the ball. Knowing what to do with that information is far more difficult than getting the "feedback".

[skaarsgard]

5 hours ago, ad_l1b said:

Turning 50 this year 🙂

similar age here and still play CB's too but the winters and body reminds me that there's a reason all my senior friends play more forgiving irons.  i'm a ho too so i switch clubs each round thinking the next set will eliminate my problems.

[wigib2]

20 hours ago, T_Golf_23 said:

This is golf WRX….. buy 20 sets. Change them very few weeks. Or every 9 holes. 
 

Rinse and repeat. 
 

I hate fittings. They generally suck. 
 

id rather go to PGA superstore. Grab a bunch of the preowned clubs for sale and hit them in a simulator. They let you do that with the preowned sets. Try the shafts and different heads. Or go find a second swing. Go in a weekday when no one is there. Or use global golf UTry program.
 

Or buy tons of stuff on here and take them out on a course and mess around with them. 
 

these places have so much available this time of year because everyone is trading in. Most try to a of sh*t….

 

here is the kicker, learn what it is about the dynamics of the shafts and heads that work for you. 
 

for example, I need heads with high CG and longer blade length. But little offset. My shafts need to be between 110 and 125G with almost no kick in the middle. I can handle but flex or tip flex in Tour V or Modus 130. Once you start wrapping your head around that you can start to realize it’s not about players cavity vs GI Vs blades, it’s a type of club and shaft dynamic that works for your swing. 
 

Then in typical WRX fashion still buy stuff here that doesn’t fit that profile because somehow you still want to try it…. Which I am probably about to do right now….. off to BST … to buy super low CG irons with some kind of slot back and a mid flex shaft that is light weight…. Because well, you know…..

"I need heads with high CG and longer blade length. But little offset."

 

So having narrowed down the style of irons you prefer...what types have you found that fit the bill? Curious as that's starting to sound similar to what I play best with as well. Thanks!

Edited January 19 by wigib2
typo

[PARETO]

Like the OP, I’m 50 and I’ll never forget what my first golf coach said waaaaay back in ‘88 when I started to love this game. Back then you had 3 choices in irons in my clubs pro shop…. Bladey blades, Eye2’s or 845’s. He said “play the most forgiving irons you can stand to look at”. It’s always stuck with me. CB, players distance, GI, SGI, players etc…… I ignore that lingo and just go back to what Pro told me all those years ago. 

[bogeypro]

On 1/17/2024 at 1:23 PM, ad_l1b said:

Currently gaming P790s from 2021 (played Titleist T300s before that) and like them a lot however my handicap has dropped from 20 all the way down to a 10 over that last year or so. On a whim I went to go try out the new Ping 10k driver just to see if the hype was real (was not better than my LST) and while I was there my fitter had me try the Titleist T150s and the new Mizuno 243s. LOVED the feel from these irons and honestly really like how much feedback they gave me over the p790s. I could tell exactly where I struck the ball on the face vs with my P790s its a lot more numb unless its an extreme miss. My miss is mostly a pull to the left that ends up getting me in trouble long, what I found with the cavity back irons is that miss ended up being much less of an issue as they didn't fly nearly as far. I also was expecting a huge drop off in carry distance but in fact it was very similar and the ball flight was much better to my eye and the stopping power into the green with descent angle and spin was REALLY nice. I would not go so far as to say that my iron striking is the best part of my game, but as I hit those irons it occurred to me that the increased feeling/feedback would probably help me continue to improve more quickly than the forgiveness at this point. Maybe I am delusional but I didn't see a HUGE gap in forgiveness between the cavity back and the players distance. I am really considering picking up a set of the Mizuno 243s or something similar, but before i light fire to a bucket full of cash wanted to see if anyone had some helpful thoughts maybe from their journey. 

 

thanks in advance

I'm a +1 and I play p790.  I get it..10 is good, but you got there by using equipment that works for you.  Why make the game harder? 

[st1800e]

On 1/17/2024 at 12:54 PM, Pepperturbo said:

Though the head material and design contribute, it's the shaft that allows the talking to reach my hands and my head to read the message. 

✅.  So much talk about club heads….Good club head , bad shaft.  No Bueno.  
 

And the anecdotal comments, the xxx are the best irons ever; I went to a CB and they're way better!  I always hit blades!   I tried those and they’re no good!  
 

Rarely see apples to apples comparison. Different club head with the same shaft to compare. 
 

And too much marketing blather in golf equipment.  

[TNwanabe]

Im 60 and reading you 50 year olds posts reminds me how I was in the same boat. I wanted to play the players irons but I wasnt getting the ball in the air like I used to. When I went to cavity backs the game got a lot more fun. It was easier. 

I suggest the Mizuno JPX line if you can. Amazing irons imo. 

[TNwanabe]

44 minutes ago, PARETO said:

Like the OP, I’m 50 and I’ll never forget what my first golf coach said waaaaay back in ‘88 when I started to love this game. Back then you had 3 choices in irons in my clubs pro shop…. Bladey blades, Eye2’s or 845’s. He said “play the most forgiving irons you can stand to look at”. It’s always stuck with me. CB, players distance, GI, SGI, players etc…… I ignore that lingo and just go back to what Pro told me all those years ago. 

Excellent advice i wish I had 4 decades ago!!!!!! Would have saved me a lot of aggravation.

However, there was a time when I would have been embarrassed if my friends saw me with cavity back irons. It was blades all day 2-pw. Vanity, ego, stupid; not as good as I could have been. Now I don't care. I will play whatever works the most effectively. My bag has a lot of head covers lol.