Is the "other site" done for good? (Merged)

slicktry · November 2, 2009

There were ALOT of good members that for whatever reason left. Rareguitar etc... just wondering if someone could list some of the more influential members that were originally on the site?

God Bless
Jer

danimal · November 2, 2009

as ye sow so shall ye reap?

Scotty_D · November 2, 2009

[quote name='parbeater' post='2040099' date='Nov 2 2009, 02:12 AM'][quote name='elrey23' post='2040090' date='Nov 2 2009, 02:48 AM'][quote name='parbeater' post='2040078' date='Nov 2 2009, 12:32 AM'][quote name='irvtrain' post='2039906' date='Nov 2 2009, 12:00 AM'][quote name='MBA-J' post='2038858' date='Nov 1 2009, 11:11 AM']You never WANT someone to be unemployed, but... well... I wouldn't need Nyquil tonight if I found out that Hossonmoss had to go back to NC.

I'm just saying.[/quote]

Is that because of the grooves vertical/horizontal thread? Hoss can be a arrogant ***** most of the time over there.

DTown was the biggest reason I really liked BSG to begin with but now that someone who is as helpful and knowledgable is gone it has taken away a lot of appeal from the site. There are still several members I whose opinions I respect and always try to make a point of reading them and why I do hope the site does get up and running again.

Kudos to GxGolfer for this thread and running the most popular site on the net! :good:
[/quote]

Some of the issues that have been brought up I can see for myself and understand to a degree. Others though, I don't qiute get. I'm not trying to take up for any of the guys at BSG, but I have met them on a few occasions and I get quite the opposite impression that so many of you have.

[b]Questions about their playing abilities is one thing that I don't understand unless any of you have played with them. I have and they are better players than 99% of the guys sitting around any message board.[/b]
[b]
Talks about the poor craftsmanship. Marcus has actually done some club work for me a couple of times and the work is nothing short of exceptional.[/b]
[b]
Questionable business practices are brought up, but I'm not really sure exactly what beef everyone has with BSG. They sell pretty expensive tour heads and high end shafts. Big deal. If people choose to buy that stuff from them, I don't see the issue. They seem to have a lot of very happy customers. The really funny thing is that I see a lot guys on this site playing tour issue equipment and Matrix shafts. So, is the issue that they run a business and make a profit? Seems like a lot guys are just bitter about the prices more than anything. I can't afford to buy $1,000 drivers every year, but I don't see a point in criticizing those who can or those who sell them.[/b]

And now it's come down to Hoss being an arrogant ***** or Todd is an a$, etc. What I am really wondering is how many of you have actually met these guys and found this to be true. Not judging someone by how they come across online, but actually meeting and getting to know them somewhat. I can say having met Todd once, Marcus and Austin on a couple of occasions that they are as personable as anyone that I have ever met. I certainly don't know them all that well, but I certainly didn't get the impression that most of you guys have though you probably have never dealt with them personally.

It just sounds like there are a few who are very sour over some petty stuff that happened on a website selling and discussing golf equipment. I have read some accurate comments about BSG in general that I would completely agree with, but most of this thread completely lacks any kind of perspective in my opinion.
[/quote]
No offense but you've been here awhile and you use your 3rd post to make this point? Maybe because you've been on BSG the whole time? If you want to defend them, that's fine and you almost had me but you indicated a little too much. You don't have to lay it on so thick. We get it, they're great guys who wouldn't hurt a fly. Meeting someone once doesn't really give a full picture of that person. Yes, they have a right to sell overpriced product but we as consumers also have a right to make others aware of that fact and then they can make up their own mind. Must be all that space age metal they use on Tour clubs. That's gotta be why they cost so much, right?
[/quote]

I have been on both sites for a while. I used to post some on BSG when I first joined a few years ago, but have pretty much just lurked both places as of late. Like I said, I have no reason to defend anyone. Someone asked if anyone had actually played with the guys at BSG and I have. Just figured that I would offer up some facts. I'm certainly not the best of friends with any of them, but I have met them on more than one occasion. I thought that I would offer up my experiences for those interested since it seems like no one else here has had any kind of real interactions and there is so much speculation going on. I could be completely wrong about everything that I said, but I would think that being around someone for hours in several instances would give me a more accurate insight than others likely have. You can just take that for what it's worth.
[/quote]

[quote name='rebels68' post='2040122' date='Nov 2 2009, 03:35 AM'][quote name='parbeater' post='2040099' date='Nov 2 2009, 02:12 AM']I have been on both sites for a while. I used to post some on BSG when I first joined a few years ago, but have pretty much just lurked both places as of late. Like I said, I have no reason to defend anyone. Someone asked if anyone had actually played with the guys at BSG and I have. Just figured that I would offer up some facts. I'm certainly not the best of friends with any of them, but I have met them on more than one occasion. I thought that I would offer up my experiences for those interested since it seems like no one else here has had any kind of real interactions and there is so much speculation going on. I could be completely wrong about everything that I said, but I would think that being around someone for hours in several instances would give me a more accurate insight than others likely have. You can just take that for what it's worth.[/quote]

I'm interested in what you have to say parbeater because you are speaking from actual time spent with the BSG staff.
It is obvious that Todd has written things that have really infuriated many people & he has alienated a significant number
of former BSG members. I certainly do not condone that kind of treatment of anyone.

[b]On the other hand, I have never heard one person complain or give a negative review after experiencing a fitting with the
guys at BSG. Most everyone who has had a fitting in Vegas has spoken in glowing terms how well it was conducted & how
much they benefited from the experience. And, I'm not talking about the BSG in-crowd either, just regular members who
decided to spend the money to go to Vegas and get fitted. There was a guy (can't recall his screen name) who made a big
stir in the open forum when he complained about hairline, spider cracking in the hosels of his BSG bought Cally irons. He
did this before contacting BSG to tell them about the problem and there was a very negative exchange before the problem
was resolved. That's the only really bad thing I can remember happening over there, everything else was always small &
very minor arguments where people took things personally and fed off their emotions. Never a good thing. [/b]

I can sympathize with those that have been wronged by Todd and BSG, and those that feel they will never get any kind
of satisfactory retribution and want to vent their frustrations. I can't blame them for that. One of the complaints I don't
understand is why would anyone slight Todd for trying to sell his goods in anyway he can. If I had 500 expensive shafts
leaning up against my wall, I certainly would aggressively promote the sale of them. If he is lying about the heads he is
selling and misrepresenting his products, then someone should set in motion legal proceedings. At least file a complaint
with the BBB.

It has always amazed me how people out in the real world are completely unaware of both BSG and WRX. I spend a lot
of time with many different people in the golf industry and as a teacher, I get to interact with many golfers from all around
the world down here in Florida. I have only met two people in four years that actually knew about BSG. I have not met a
golfer who has heard about WRX yet. When I turn off my computer and head out the door, these golf forums are not on
my mind any more. At one time I really promoted BSG and WRX and told people to log on and check them out. None did
that. Most people are unconcerned about forums such as these and all the trials and tribulations that go on here and at
BSG really have no baring out there in society. I think we are a very unique and small community and as time goes by
our relating should become more amiable. At least I hope so.

Thanks for your initial post parbeater, it gives the thread some sincere honesty and a better balance of pro and con.
[/quote]

[quote name='rebels68' post='2041459' date='Nov 2 2009, 06:01 PM'][quote name='kal32473' post='2041031' date='Nov 2 2009, 02:29 PM']Of course you didn't. If someone were to dare question anything going on within that "company", they would be banned, have threads deleted etc. I mean, do you honestly think that Todd has "A Ray Lewis Type Body" like he bragged about? The dude's a complete joke.[/quote]

Your focus is completely on Todd.[b] I was talking about the BSG fitting service. I got many emails from every day
BSG members that went through the fitting process and they all had nothing but good words to say about it. Todd
can't regulate my email and ban anyone sending me an email either. I tried to find someone, anyone that actually
did a fitting with BSG that had a bad experience and/or thought it was a waste of money. I would say I talked with
a significant number of people who did and not one of them had a negative word to say about any of the BSG staff
and that includes Todd too.
[/b]
Whatever bad things Todd has done or said to people, you cannot include what he did with the fittings. Unless you
can come up with a person who had a bad BSG fitting experience. This point is not an effort to exonerate Todd in
any way for his questionable practices and poor treatment of members, it's just a point of truth. It doesn't appear
that he scammed anyone or was fraudulent with his fittings.

Trying to say anything positive about BSG and Todd on WRX is going to go over like a lead balloon. I do feel what
parbeater said has merit because it's honest and real, first hand experience. I had many positive experiences on
BSG and was never taken advantage of by the BSG staff or misled in any way, mainly because I already know a
lot about golf equipment. BSG's prices and hype never really made an impression on me. $2000 for a driver????
You've got to be kidding!!! If you can't perceive the absurdity in that, maybe there's more than just one person
who is at fault. I thought the debate about Tour vs. Retail was silly. The differences are obvious to me and being
able to realize that the differences are not worth thousands of dollars is obvious too. Isn't it??

If Todd was selling any equipment that was somehow not what he said it was, then he should be prosecuted for
deceptive or fraudulent business practices. There are laws against these kinds of enterprises. Maybe you guys
should get together and collectively pursue a legal action. Of course, you will need more than just anger, you're
going to need proof. You know, hard evidence. I guess it's easier said than done. Have any of you people that
harbor ill feelings considered what could be or should be done about Todd??
[/quote]

If you want to hear about bad fitting experiences PM a member on here, he has a terrible fitting experience and he and his playing abilities are credible as can be. His scores are online from Q School and many other tournaments and I would name him but I haven't asked him permission to do so. Anyway his experience was terrible and they have a trackman so its tough to get numbers wrong. He was a big posting member on BSG too.

As for their playing abilities ask any of the Vegas members you will find a ton on GD who were once tight with them and were banned and ridiculed after the first big dog shootout when heads went flying down the fairway due to botched epoxy jobs. Have you ever seen Todd's swing? He is no + 3. JimBoneCrusher was banded for challenging all the staff of BSG to $1000 a hole straight up. Also ask JLV about their playing abilities and why they are no longer allowed out at Dragon Ridge. Ask CaddyJoe about shoddy club work, he has pictures and when he lives in Vegas they wont let him drop it off at their shop "Todd's basement or garage" he has to ship it to their PostNet located, pure BS. As for that member is was EDOE and Frank Viola and Scratch fixed him up and he is now happier then ever. Ask them about their Charlie Hoffman is a good buddy claims, Charlie is a friend of JLV and he brought Charlie out, the guys from BSG try to tell him what to do and he tells them to beat it. 3 years later they are talking about they were the ones that brought Charlie out and he's a good buddy.

Their prices and limited quantities are pure BS. The B heads could be purchased elsewhere for much cheaper and they get them from TM just the same. To say trust your source and no one else gets them other then stealing them from Tour Vans is done purely to discredit the much more credible club makers out there.

Also ask Todd why you cannot type Ari or Joe Kwok on BSG? One time friends asked to do shady work and when they declined and told people about Todd and his practices their names became mud. I laughed when Todd went on to call out Ari and Scratch for copying Jose's grinds, meanwhile Jose comes out basically hushing Todd as the golf business is all about borrowing ideas and coming oh so close to patents.

Im glad I lost my rose coloured glasses

petter7 · November 2, 2009

[quote name='Dizzub' post='2041814' date='Nov 2 2009, 08:34 PM'][quote name='rebels68' post='2041779' date='Nov 2 2009, 09:17 PM'][quote name='j0npeterson' post='2041647' date='Nov 2 2009, 07:27 PM'][quote name='rebels68' post='2041459' date='Nov 2 2009, 03:01 PM'][quote name='kal32473' post='2041031' date='Nov 2 2009, 02:29 PM']Of course you didn't. If someone were to dare question anything going on within that "company", they would be banned, have threads deleted etc. I mean, do you honestly think that Todd has "A Ray Lewis Type Body" like he bragged about? The dude's a complete joke.[/quote]

Your focus is completely on Todd. I was talking about the BSG fitting service...

redacted for brevity

...Have any of you people that harbor ill feelings considered what could be or should be done about Todd??
[/quote]

It's amazing the lengths you're going to to try to convince a seemingly endless population of people that Toad is a decent person. People don't care if he's Mother Teresa in person... he has a history of being a jerk online (where he established much of his identity).

[b]I hope you get your kneepads signed by the man himself though..[/b]. it's the least he could do for all the hard work you've put in on his behalf.
[/quote]

This is just ridiculous. I am not trying to convince anyone that Todd is anything one way or the other. :rolleyes:

If there are so many people who have been deceived by fraudulent business practices, why isn't
there anyone doing something about it?? Seems like a whole lot of bitching going on and no action.
Would like to read about someone who actually got some justice for all his lying, cheating, and fraud!!
All the puerile comments are getting a bit boring.
[/quote]

[b]I think you are missing the point here Petter but then again I don't think you've ever really listened to anyone else's side because you are always right. [/b] Has anyone said his business practices are bad? Its not his fault that people are honestly willing to spend $200 extra for a color with no performance difference. Its not his fault that he claimed certain shafts were no longer high performing shafts until they came out in matte blue. Again its not his fault people pay $2,000 for drivers, $2,500 for iron sets, etc. People don't like Todd because he spouts off at the mouth about things he shouldn't...such as the whole Wishon thing. Not to mention the things that happened with the member outings which were already talked about on here. He owns a business and if he can get people to pay the $$$ he asks for them then there isn't a problem. I am a sub 100 member over there with over 2K+ posts although most of them were early on and I was never banned because I didn't make posts that I knew would make them mad because frankly I don't care enough to bash all their claims of playing certain equipment. The point is, Todd has stepped on a lot of peoples toes and instead of taking it he deletes posts and bans people with an opinion. I, for one can't wait for that site to get back up so I don't have to see the same two people weighing in on every topic on this site.
[/quote]

Always right? OK, I had over 12K posts over there and tried hard to make sure what I posted was right.
The majority of my posts over there were efforts to give information that members were looking for and
pics people wanted to see. No one posted more pics than me. What is wrong with being accurate. When it
came to golf, I made sure I was as accurate as possible. I spent a lot of time exchanging PM's giving swing
advice too. Always thought it was weird how some guys would jump on people making an effort to help out.
The level of disrespect is awful and I'm not speaking about myself. There are others on BSG that were very
knowledgeable that had to endure unwarranted malicious comments.

What does being a sub 100 member mean anyway. Who cares about that?? What year did you give your
first lesson or win your first professional golf tournament, or opened you first golf store?? How long have
you been in the business of golf and what have you done to contribute to the game and your community,
like in the form of junior programs and charity events? If you have done that for decades then I'll be quite
impressed. Being member #100 or less on some internet golf forum isn't much of an accomplishment.

Believe me, I'm not missing the point here. There have been quite a few guys complaining about Todd's
business practices, not just his exorbitant pricing. Claims about substandard heads and inferior shafts with
custom paint jobs, lying, cheating are words that have been used. I have received a number of PM's about
how Todd misrepresented his products. This kind of behavior is against the law and I find it curious that not
one single individual has made any effort at all to prosecute him.

As the CEO of one of the top three OEM's put it, BSG and Todd are basically harmless and we have made
tour issue equipment available for him to sell. Doesn't sound like they are too worried about him. If there
are those that feel that Todd is a bad man and conducts business in a fraudulent manner, then step up &
do something about it.

Scotty_D · November 2, 2009

Rareguitar, Stage1350, Rusty, BennyPayless, JLV, I can't remember his handle but he posted smells from my basement, Hungsolo (ask about Pinemeadow) I am sure there are more before I joined

Dizz · November 2, 2009

I was talking about being an early member because I have been there since the beginning...so I have seen everything change over the years. I was a member at GO when Todd got banned and then started BSG. My accomplishments mean nothing to anyone on the internet...anyone can say they have qualifications on here. Being a sub 100 member means absolutely nothing except having known Todd before he even stated his own site. You joined a few years after BSG started and have no idea what it was like in the beginning and must have missed all the BS(G) that Todd did over the years.

bcheeks · November 2, 2009

[quote name='Scotty_D' post='2041949' date='Nov 2 2009, 09:29 PM']Rareguitar, Stage1350, Rusty, BennyPayless, JLV, I can't remember his handle but he posted smells from my basement, Hungsolo (ask about Pinemeadow) I am sure there are more before I joined[/quote]

Here's a link to the pinemeadow scotty.

[url="http://www.golfdiscussions.com/yabbse/index.php/topic,16744.0.html"]http://www.golfdiscussions.com/yabbse/inde...ic,16744.0.html[/url]

OpusX20 · November 2, 2009

[quote name='rebels68' post='2041942' date='Nov 2 2009, 08:27 PM']Always right? OK, I had over 12K posts over there and tried hard to make sure what I posted was right.
The majority of my posts over there were efforts to give information that members were looking for and
pics people wanted to see. No one posted more pics than me. What is wrong with being accurate. When it
came to golf, I made sure I was as accurate as possible. I spent a lot of time exchanging PM's giving swing
advice too. Always thought it was weird how some guys would jump on people making an effort to help out.
The level of disrespect is awful and I'm not speaking about myself. There are others on BSG that were very
knowledgeable that had to endure unwarranted malicious comments.

[b]What does being a sub 100 member mean anyway. Who cares about that?? What year did you give your first lesson or win your first professional golf tournament, or opened you first golf store?? How long have you been in the business of golf and what have you done to contribute to the game and your community, like in the form of junior programs and charity events? If you have done that for decades then I'll be quite impressed. Being member #100 or less on some internet golf forum isn't much of an accomplishment.[/b]

Believe me, I'm not missing the point here. There have been quite a few guys complaining about Todd's
business practices, not just his exorbitant pricing. Claims about substandard heads and inferior shafts with
custom paint jobs, lying, cheating are words that have been used. I have received a number of PM's about
how Todd misrepresented his products. This kind of behavior is against the law and I find it curious that not
one single individual has made any effort at all to prosecute him.

As the CEO of one of the top three OEM's put it, BSG and Todd are basically harmless and we have made
tour issue equipment available for him to sell. Doesn't sound like they are too worried about him. If there
are those that feel that Todd is a bad man and conducts business in a fraudulent manner, then step up &
do something about it.[/quote]

I've done much of what you require to allow someone to comment, but frankly none of that stuff is relevant. I have never met Todd or had any dealings with him so I can't comment. But, lots of folks (apparently) have and they have voiced their opinion. Your arbitrary "reqirments" list is pretty silly. I'm sure you are very accomplished in the golf biz, much more than myself (especially since I'm no longer in it). But, it doesn't have anything to do with the subject at hand. Do you really think you need to have won a professional tournament to post an opinion on this?

petter7 · November 2, 2009

[quote name='Dizzub' post='2041995' date='Nov 2 2009, 09:47 PM']I was talking about being an early member because I have been there since the beginning...so I have seen everything change over the years. I was a member at GO when Todd got banned and then started BSG. My accomplishments mean nothing to anyone on the internet...anyone can say they have qualifications on here. Being a sub 100 member means absolutely nothing except having known Todd before he even stated his own site. You joined a few years after BSG started and have no idea what it was like in the beginning and must have missed all the BS(G) that Todd did over the years.[/quote]

Fair enough. The part about no idea about what happened in the beginning was once true, but after
communicating with so many of those sub 100 members through PM's and emails, I've heard most
of the bad things about Todd. Like I said, I didn't deal with him much. Never really thought of him
as anyone of great importance in the golf industry, just a guy that stumbled into the golf world by
way of a website business and tried to make a bunch of money through gouging customers. I paid
very little for the stuff I purchased from them in comparison. My wedges were the only items I can
say I probably overpaid for ($300 ea), but Derek did a helluva job on them with the grinds and the
stampings. Just did it to see what they would come up with. I'm still using the 58* sandwedge. The
grind on it is very good.

As for anyone making up qualifications, I'm not one of those people. I don't lie. There are a couple
of guys on BSG who know me personally and have made some nice comments about me. But, to be
honest, I never really seek praise, on the contrary, I'm very laid back and keep a low profile. I'm
known on BSG because I posted a lot there. The good news for all you petter7 haters and now, I
guess rebels68 haters, I'm just a couple of weeks away from being able to play golf full time and
when that happens, I'm gone. In the meantime, I have no ill feelings towards anyone on here, so
you're all great guys and if our paths ever cross, I'll buy ya a beer or two. :drinks:

elrey23 · November 2, 2009

[quote name='bcheeks' post='2042046' date='Nov 2 2009, 09:07 PM'][quote name='Scotty_D' post='2041949' date='Nov 2 2009, 09:29 PM']Rareguitar, Stage1350, Rusty, BennyPayless, JLV, I can't remember his handle but he posted smells from my basement, Hungsolo (ask about Pinemeadow) I am sure there are more before I joined[/quote]

Here's a link to the pinemeadow scotty.

[url="http://www.golfdiscussions.com/yabbse/index.php/topic,16744.0.html"]http://www.golfdiscussions.com/yabbse/inde...ic,16744.0.html[/url]
[/quote]

That's one of the funniest threads I've ever seen.

stage1350 · November 2, 2009

[quote name='slicktry' post='2041888' date='Nov 2 2009, 08:08 PM']There were ALOT of good members that for whatever reason left. Rareguitar etc... just wondering if someone could list some of the more influential members that were originally on the site?

God Bless
Jer[/quote]

[quote name='Scotty_D' post='2041949' date='Nov 2 2009, 08:29 PM']Rareguitar, Stage1350, Rusty, BennyPayless, JLV, I can't remember his handle but he posted smells from my basement, Hungsolo (ask about Pinemeadow) I am sure there are more before I joined[/quote]

I think credit is not being given where credit is due. The first mass exodus was the group that formed WRX. I was disappointed when Chris, Richard, and Johnny left. Thankfully, I got word through the grapevine and migrated over here. I learned a lot when Johnny(TN87) and DemolitionMan posted. They were and still are a wealth of information. And what Richard and Ryan have accomplished over here is something that we all can be thankful for: an alternative to the infomercial.

The "Exiles" got booted because Todd threw out a few entertaining guys, most notorious of which was AdamMull. This was the end of the Inside Locker Room being a neat place and the beginning of the "This is a business!" regime. As the focus became all Adams/Ozik all the time, Todd's quest for the almighty dollar started alienating a lot of long time members. We kept in touch with a lot of banned members and Todd wanted to tell us who were allowed to associate with and what we could say on websites other than his own. F**K THAT! You may not like what I have to say, but you aren't going to tell me what I can say on a site that you don't own. And for anyone that thinks Todd is a professional, I have emails to prove otherwise. Derek's aren't much better than Todd's, but at least he learned to spell at MSU.

Todd booted one of his own Mods for having a golfing relationship with some banned members. Aren't we supposed to have golf as a common theme? You and I can disagree about everything else, but I'll still play golf with you. Not Todd.

[quote name='rebels68' post='2041459' date='Nov 2 2009, 06:01 PM'][b]If Todd was selling any equipment that was somehow not what he said it was, then he should be prosecuted for deceptive or fraudulent business practices. There are laws against these kinds of enterprises. Maybe you guys should get together and collectively pursue a legal action.[/b] Of course, you will need more than just anger, you're going to need proof. You know, hard evidence. I guess it's easier said than done. Have any of you people that harbor ill feelings considered what could be or should be done about Todd??[/quote]

As for builds, I've taken apart clubs that have been built by Dana Upshaw, Joe Kwok, and BSG. I learned a lot of neat tricks and techniques studying the builds of the first two. The third looked like something that I would have assembled back in the early 90s when I was still learning how to reshaft clubs. Derek and Hoss builds may be better, but Todd's wood assembly is a joke. To this day, he still can't turn a ferrule.

Regarding legal action, prosecuting a company established in Delaware, with a admin address in IL, a shipping address in NV, and a PayPal account does not make for easy legal matters. I do know of at least two members that have filed complaints with the BBB in Nevada. Some funds have been refunded, like EDOE. But a lot of people got shorted, myself included. I think a lot of Insiders are going to find their $100 is now worthless. Try getting it back from PayPal. They aren't going to help you. All anyone can do is spread the word and try to keep others from making the same mistake of giving that guy any money.

Don't kid yourself. Efforts have been made to get money back. But for a simple litmus test, ask youself why you see so many BSG "perfectly fitted" clubs for sale and so few from Joe Kwok or Dana? It's not because of volume and it's not because of coincidence. It has to do with being fitted correctly and having a quality build.

ksavy17 · November 2, 2009

[quote name='toddnt' post='2041673' date='Nov 2 2009, 06:35 PM']Any reason why he parted ways??[quote name='GoinLo' post='2037601' date='Oct 31 2009, 06:21 PM'][quote name='Socrates' 2 iron' post='2037574' date='Oct 31 2009, 06:06 PM'][quote name='Tg007' post='2037512' date='Oct 31 2009, 05:24 PM']I find it interesting that i bought a three wood from Derek last week, he sent a paypal notice that it would be shipped on the 26th, and guess what .... no club, no response from e-mails, nothing. i guess whatever the problem is it must be big enough that they want to @#$% people.[/quote]

Derek hasn't been part of BSG for a long time now.
[/quote]

Correct...Derek left BSG well over a year ago.
[/quote]
[/quote]

i think he works for a sports fitness or somekind of nutrition company. Probable a good reason why has not really posted much since he left. Anyone notice his WITB??

Tim Delgado · November 2, 2009

All the old BSG crew here :clapping: debating the business practices and clubfitting skills of the BSG gang. Classic :lol:

The site went quickly from several knowledgeable guys discussing equipment, to everyone leaving or getting banned until the only posts in the Tour section were of jock-sniffers telling Todd how great the Matrix shaft that Todd sold them was working. :rolleyes:

Tim

petter7 · November 2, 2009

[quote name='OpusX20' post='2042049' date='Nov 2 2009, 10:08 PM'][quote name='rebels68' post='2041942' date='Nov 2 2009, 08:27 PM']Always right? OK, I had over 12K posts over there and tried hard to make sure what I posted was right.
The majority of my posts over there were efforts to give information that members were looking for and
pics people wanted to see. No one posted more pics than me. What is wrong with being accurate. When it
came to golf, I made sure I was as accurate as possible. I spent a lot of time exchanging PM's giving swing
advice too. Always thought it was weird how some guys would jump on people making an effort to help out.
The level of disrespect is awful and I'm not speaking about myself. There are others on BSG that were very
knowledgeable that had to endure unwarranted malicious comments.

[b]What does being a sub 100 member mean anyway. Who cares about that?? What year did you give your first lesson or win your first professional golf tournament, or opened you first golf store?? How long have you been in the business of golf and what have you done to contribute to the game and your community, like in the form of junior programs and charity events? If you have done that for decades then I'll be quite impressed. Being member #100 or less on some internet golf forum isn't much of an accomplishment.[/b]

Believe me, I'm not missing the point here. There have been quite a few guys complaining about Todd's
business practices, not just his exorbitant pricing. Claims about substandard heads and inferior shafts with
custom paint jobs, lying, cheating are words that have been used. I have received a number of PM's about
how Todd misrepresented his products. This kind of behavior is against the law and I find it curious that not
one single individual has made any effort at all to prosecute him.

As the CEO of one of the top three OEM's put it, BSG and Todd are basically harmless and we have made
tour issue equipment available for him to sell. Doesn't sound like they are too worried about him. If there
are those that feel that Todd is a bad man and conducts business in a fraudulent manner, then step up &
do something about it.[/quote]

I've done much of what you require to allow someone to comment, but frankly none of that stuff is relevant. I have never met Todd or had any dealings with him so I can't comment. But, lots of folks (apparently) have and they have voiced their opinion. Your arbitrary "reqirments" list is pretty silly. I'm sure you are very accomplished in the golf biz, much more than myself (especially since I'm no longer in it). But, it doesn't have anything to do with the subject at hand. [b]Do you really think you need to have won a professional tournament to post an opinion on this?[/b]
[/quote]

You're kidding right??

No, there are no requirements on these forums for anyone to be able to post. I never said there were!!

This is a perfect example of how posts are misinterpreted and given an altered meaning. It gets very
tiresome to constantly have to answer those who continually take comments in a post and put a different
spin on it. YOU"RE saying [i]"I've done much of what you require to allow someone to comment."[/i] I'M not
saying that. I'm saying I'm more impressed by what someone has accomplished in golf more so than what
member number they have on golf website. Not only have you missed my point, you go on to say that this
is MY list of arbitrary "requirements" for posting and that they are silly. Good gracious, it's a bit much!

I guess you were assuming what I meant, eh!

MiGolf · November 2, 2009

i think he works for a sports fitness or somekind of nutrition company. Probable a good reason why has not really posted much since he left. Anyone notice his WITB??

Yep. Mostly retail last I saw.

kgk · November 2, 2009

[quote name='Dizzub' post='2041814' date='Nov 2 2009, 07:34 PM']I think you are missing the point here Petter but then again I don't think you've ever really listened to anyone else's side because you are always right. Has anyone said his business practices are bad? Its not his fault that people are honestly willing to spend $200 extra for a color with no performance difference. Its not his fault that he claimed certain shafts were no longer high performing shafts until they came out in matte blue. Again its not his fault people pay $2,000 for drivers, $2,500 for iron sets, etc. People don't like Todd because he spouts off at the mouth about things he shouldn't...such as the whole Wishon thing. Not to mention the things that happened with the member outings which were already talked about on here. He owns a business and if he can get people to pay the $$$ he asks for them then there isn't a problem. I am a sub 100 member over there with over 2K+ posts although most of them were early on and I was never banned because I didn't make posts that I knew would make them mad because frankly I don't care enough to bash all their claims of playing certain equipment. The point is, Todd has stepped on a lot of peoples toes and instead of taking it he deletes posts and bans people with an opinion. I, for one can't wait for that site to get back up so I don't have to see the same two people weighing in on every topic on this site.[/quote]

Ah, memories. The Houston BSG group got Outtttings without prior approval verboten at BSG. Todd went nuts about someone getting us free stuff from an Edwin Watts for the raffle... was that Kiran? Maybe it was Glynn. Anyway, we were all blacklisted after that. I was finally banned in Black September of 2006, along with the rest of the "insider clique". We were all Internet Cowboys who were Too Big To Fit Into Mirrors.

For those keeping track, there are entire websites devoted to hating on Todd. The man has his own anti-fan club. It's pretty astonishing when you think about it.

OpusX20 · November 2, 2009

[quote name='rebels68' post='2042132' date='Nov 2 2009, 09:41 PM'][quote name='OpusX20' post='2042049' date='Nov 2 2009, 10:08 PM'][quote name='rebels68' post='2041942' date='Nov 2 2009, 08:27 PM']Always right? OK, I had over 12K posts over there and tried hard to make sure what I posted was right.
The majority of my posts over there were efforts to give information that members were looking for and
pics people wanted to see. No one posted more pics than me. What is wrong with being accurate. When it
came to golf, I made sure I was as accurate as possible. I spent a lot of time exchanging PM's giving swing
advice too. Always thought it was weird how some guys would jump on people making an effort to help out.
The level of disrespect is awful and I'm not speaking about myself. There are others on BSG that were very
knowledgeable that had to endure unwarranted malicious comments.

[b]What does being a sub 100 member mean anyway. Who cares about that?? What year did you give your first lesson or win your first professional golf tournament, or opened you first golf store?? How long have you been in the business of golf and what have you done to contribute to the game and your community, like in the form of junior programs and charity events? If you have done that for decades then I'll be quite impressed. Being member #100 or less on some internet golf forum isn't much of an accomplishment.[/b]

Believe me, I'm not missing the point here. There have been quite a few guys complaining about Todd's
business practices, not just his exorbitant pricing. Claims about substandard heads and inferior shafts with
custom paint jobs, lying, cheating are words that have been used. I have received a number of PM's about
how Todd misrepresented his products. This kind of behavior is against the law and I find it curious that not
one single individual has made any effort at all to prosecute him.

As the CEO of one of the top three OEM's put it, BSG and Todd are basically harmless and we have made
tour issue equipment available for him to sell. Doesn't sound like they are too worried about him. If there
are those that feel that Todd is a bad man and conducts business in a fraudulent manner, then step up &
do something about it.[/quote]

I've done much of what you require to allow someone to comment, but frankly none of that stuff is relevant. I have never met Todd or had any dealings with him so I can't comment. But, lots of folks (apparently) have and they have voiced their opinion. Your arbitrary "reqirments" list is pretty silly. I'm sure you are very accomplished in the golf biz, much more than myself (especially since I'm no longer in it). But, it doesn't have anything to do with the subject at hand. [b]Do you really think you need to have won a professional tournament to post an opinion on this?[/b]
[/quote]

You're kidding right??

No, there are no requirements on these forums for anyone to be able to post. I never said there were!!

This is a perfect example of how posts are misinterpreted and given an altered meaning. It gets very
tiresome to constantly have to answer those who continually take comments in a post and put a different
spin on it. YOU"RE saying [i]"I've done much of what you require to allow someone to comment."[/i] I'M not
saying that. I'm saying I'm more impressed by what someone has accomplished in golf more so than what
member number they have on golf website. Not only have you missed my point, you go on to say that this
is MY list of arbitrary "requirements" for posting and that they are silly. Good gracious, it's a bit much!

I guess you were assuming what I meant, eh!

[/quote]

You're the one that brought up the subject of accomplishments in golf. Not sure what other meaning there is, given the context, but I will take you at your word and leave it at that.

petter7 · November 2, 2009

[quote name='stage1350' post='2042100' date='Nov 2 2009, 10:29 PM']Regarding legal action, prosecuting a company established in Delaware, with a admin address in IL, a shipping address in NV, and a PayPal account does not make for easy legal matters. I do know of at least two members that have filed complaints with the BBB in Nevada. Some funds have been refunded, like EDOE. But a lot of people got shorted, myself included. I think a lot of Insiders are going to find their $100 is now worthless. Try getting it back from PayPal. They aren't going to help you. All anyone can do is spread the word and try to keep others from making the same mistake of giving that guy any money.

Don't kid yourself. Efforts have been made to get money back. But for a simple litmus test, ask youself why you see so many BSG "perfectly fitted" clubs for sale and so few from Joe Kwok or Dana? It's not because of volume and it's not because of coincidence. It has to do with being fitted correctly and having a quality build.[/quote]

Yeah, sounds like a tricky path to justice.

The way you are portraying Todd, I would definitely try to harass someone like that with legal actions.

Thanks stage1350 for the info. It's the first time I've heard anyone talk about any efforts to prosecute
him through the legal system. I guess I've been fortunate by avoiding being ripped off.

petter7 · November 2, 2009

[quote name='OpusX20' post='2042180' date='Nov 2 2009, 11:01 PM'][quote name='rebels68' post='2042132' date='Nov 2 2009, 09:41 PM'][quote name='OpusX20' post='2042049' date='Nov 2 2009, 10:08 PM'][quote name='rebels68' post='2041942' date='Nov 2 2009, 08:27 PM']Always right? OK, I had over 12K posts over there and tried hard to make sure what I posted was right.
The majority of my posts over there were efforts to give information that members were looking for and
pics people wanted to see. No one posted more pics than me. What is wrong with being accurate. When it
came to golf, I made sure I was as accurate as possible. I spent a lot of time exchanging PM's giving swing
advice too. Always thought it was weird how some guys would jump on people making an effort to help out.
The level of disrespect is awful and I'm not speaking about myself. There are others on BSG that were very
knowledgeable that had to endure unwarranted malicious comments.

[b]What does being a sub 100 member mean anyway. Who cares about that?? What year did you give your first lesson or win your first professional golf tournament, or opened you first golf store?? How long have you been in the business of golf and what have you done to contribute to the game and your community, like in the form of junior programs and charity events? If you have done that for decades then I'll be quite impressed. Being member #100 or less on some internet golf forum isn't much of an accomplishment.[/b]

Believe me, I'm not missing the point here. There have been quite a few guys complaining about Todd's
business practices, not just his exorbitant pricing. Claims about substandard heads and inferior shafts with
custom paint jobs, lying, cheating are words that have been used. I have received a number of PM's about
how Todd misrepresented his products. This kind of behavior is against the law and I find it curious that not
one single individual has made any effort at all to prosecute him.

As the CEO of one of the top three OEM's put it, BSG and Todd are basically harmless and we have made
tour issue equipment available for him to sell. Doesn't sound like they are too worried about him. If there
are those that feel that Todd is a bad man and conducts business in a fraudulent manner, then step up &
do something about it.[/quote]

I've done much of what you require to allow someone to comment, but frankly none of that stuff is relevant. I have never met Todd or had any dealings with him so I can't comment. But, lots of folks (apparently) have and they have voiced their opinion. Your arbitrary "reqirments" list is pretty silly. I'm sure you are very accomplished in the golf biz, much more than myself (especially since I'm no longer in it). But, it doesn't have anything to do with the subject at hand. [b]Do you really think you need to have won a professional tournament to post an opinion on this?[/b]
[/quote]

You're kidding right??

No, there are no requirements on these forums for anyone to be able to post. I never said there were!!

This is a perfect example of how posts are misinterpreted and given an altered meaning. It gets very
tiresome to constantly have to answer those who continually take comments in a post and put a different
spin on it. YOU"RE saying [i]"I've done much of what you require to allow someone to comment."[/i] I'M not
saying that. I'm saying I'm more impressed by what someone has accomplished in golf more so than what
member number they have on golf website. Not only have you missed my point, you go on to say that this
is MY list of arbitrary "requirements" for posting and that they are silly. Good gracious, it's a bit much!

I guess you were assuming what I meant, eh!

[/quote]

You're the one that brought up the subject of accomplishments in golf. Not sure what other meaning there is, given the context, but I will take you at your word and leave it at that.
[/quote]

Yes, but you brought up the subject of requirements for allowing someone to comment. I told you what the other
meaning is, didn't you read it??

Thanks for taking my word for it though, since I'm the one that wrote them. :lol:

Scotty_D · November 2, 2009

[quote name='stage1350' post='2042100' date='Nov 2 2009, 10:29 PM'][quote name='slicktry' post='2041888' date='Nov 2 2009, 08:08 PM']There were ALOT of good members that for whatever reason left. Rareguitar etc... just wondering if someone could list some of the more influential members that were originally on the site?

God Bless
Jer[/quote]

[quote name='Scotty_D' post='2041949' date='Nov 2 2009, 08:29 PM']Rareguitar, Stage1350, Rusty, BennyPayless, JLV, I can't remember his handle but he posted smells from my basement, Hungsolo (ask about Pinemeadow) I am sure there are more before I joined[/quote]

I think credit is not being given where credit is due. The first mass exodus was the group that formed WRX. I was disappointed when Chris, Richard, and Johnny left. Thankfully, I got word through the grapevine and migrated over here. I learned a lot when Johnny(TN87) and DemolitionMan posted. They were and still are a wealth of information. And what Richard and Ryan have accomplished over here is something that we all can be thankful for: an alternative to the infomercial.

The "Exiles" got booted because Todd threw out a few entertaining guys, most notorious of which was AdamMull. This was the end of the Inside Locker Room being a neat place and the beginning of the "This is a business!" regime. As the focus became all Adams/Ozik all the time, Todd's quest for the almighty dollar started alienating a lot of long time members. We kept in touch with a lot of banned members and Todd wanted to tell us who were allowed to associate with and what we could say on websites other than his own. F**K THAT! You may not like what I have to say, but you aren't going to tell me what I can say on a site that you don't own. And for anyone that thinks Todd is a professional, I have emails to prove otherwise. Derek's aren't much better than Todd's, but at least he learned to spell at MSU.

Todd booted one of his own Mods for having a golfing relationship with some banned members. Aren't we supposed to have golf as a common theme? You and I can disagree about everything else, but I'll still play golf with you. Not Todd.

[/quote]

I joined after WRX was established so I missed the beginnings, however I am just going from the "Exiles" and what I have read, researched, and got from face to face meetings with some great guys, all of which have had nothing good to say about BSG and more importantly Todd.

All in all this shut down has been poorly handled by a supposed high end company and led to this topic and a ton of hatred and opinions. Will it be able to recover? I highly doubt it...

elrey23 · November 2, 2009

Website still down as of this post. If it ever does come back I can't wait to see the s*** storm that ensues

OpusX20 · November 2, 2009

[quote name='rebels68' post='2042195' date='Nov 2 2009, 10:11 PM'][quote name='OpusX20' post='2042180' date='Nov 2 2009, 11:01 PM'][quote name='rebels68' post='2042132' date='Nov 2 2009, 09:41 PM'][quote name='OpusX20' post='2042049' date='Nov 2 2009, 10:08 PM'][quote name='rebels68' post='2041942' date='Nov 2 2009, 08:27 PM']Always right? OK, I had over 12K posts over there and tried hard to make sure what I posted was right.
The majority of my posts over there were efforts to give information that members were looking for and
pics people wanted to see. No one posted more pics than me. What is wrong with being accurate. When it
came to golf, I made sure I was as accurate as possible. I spent a lot of time exchanging PM's giving swing
advice too. Always thought it was weird how some guys would jump on people making an effort to help out.
The level of disrespect is awful and I'm not speaking about myself. There are others on BSG that were very
knowledgeable that had to endure unwarranted malicious comments.

[b]What does being a sub 100 member mean anyway. Who cares about that?? What year did you give your first lesson or win your first professional golf tournament, or opened you first golf store?? How long have you been in the business of golf and what have you done to contribute to the game and your community, like in the form of junior programs and charity events? If you have done that for decades then I'll be quite impressed. Being member #100 or less on some internet golf forum isn't much of an accomplishment.[/b]

Believe me, I'm not missing the point here. There have been quite a few guys complaining about Todd's
business practices, not just his exorbitant pricing. Claims about substandard heads and inferior shafts with
custom paint jobs, lying, cheating are words that have been used. I have received a number of PM's about
how Todd misrepresented his products. This kind of behavior is against the law and I find it curious that not
one single individual has made any effort at all to prosecute him.

As the CEO of one of the top three OEM's put it, BSG and Todd are basically harmless and we have made
tour issue equipment available for him to sell. Doesn't sound like they are too worried about him. If there
are those that feel that Todd is a bad man and conducts business in a fraudulent manner, then step up &
do something about it.[/quote]

I've done much of what you require to allow someone to comment, but frankly none of that stuff is relevant. I have never met Todd or had any dealings with him so I can't comment. But, lots of folks (apparently) have and they have voiced their opinion. Your arbitrary "reqirments" list is pretty silly. I'm sure you are very accomplished in the golf biz, much more than myself (especially since I'm no longer in it). But, it doesn't have anything to do with the subject at hand. [b]Do you really think you need to have won a professional tournament to post an opinion on this?[/b]
[/quote]

You're kidding right??

No, there are no requirements on these forums for anyone to be able to post. I never said there were!!

This is a perfect example of how posts are misinterpreted and given an altered meaning. It gets very
tiresome to constantly have to answer those who continually take comments in a post and put a different
spin on it. YOU"RE saying [i]"I've done much of what you require to allow someone to comment."[/i] I'M not
saying that. I'm saying I'm more impressed by what someone has accomplished in golf more so than what
member number they have on golf website. Not only have you missed my point, you go on to say that this
is MY list of arbitrary "requirements" for posting and that they are silly. Good gracious, it's a bit much!

I guess you were assuming what I meant, eh!

[/quote]

You're the one that brought up the subject of accomplishments in golf. Not sure what other meaning there is, given the context, but I will take you at your word and leave it at that.
[/quote]

Yes, but you brought up the subject of requirements for allowing someone to comment. I told you what the other
meaning is, didn't you read it??

Thanks for taking my word for it though, since I'm the one that wrote them. :lol:

[/quote]

Yes, I read it. It just doesn't make any sense given the context of the discussion that was going on. The discussion is about the history of BSG. Diz mentions his member number to illustrate a long standing history, which to me seems relevant. You then ask when he gave his first lesson, et al. I'm not sure what could be less relevant to his thoughts on BSG.

Dizz · November 2, 2009

[quote name='rebels68' post='2042075' date='Nov 2 2009, 11:20 PM'][quote name='Dizzub' post='2041995' date='Nov 2 2009, 09:47 PM']I was talking about being an early member because I have been there since the beginning...so I have seen everything change over the years. I was a member at GO when Todd got banned and then started BSG. My accomplishments mean nothing to anyone on the internet...anyone can say they have qualifications on here. Being a sub 100 member means absolutely nothing except having known Todd before he even stated his own site. You joined a few years after BSG started and have no idea what it was like in the beginning and must have missed all the BS(G) that Todd did over the years.[/quote]

Fair enough. The part about no idea about what happened in the beginning was once true, but after
communicating with so many of those sub 100 members through PM's and emails, I've heard most
of the bad things about Todd. Like I said, I didn't deal with him much. Never really thought of him
as anyone of great importance in the golf industry, just a guy that stumbled into the golf world by
way of a website business and tried to make a bunch of money through gouging customers. I paid
very little for the stuff I purchased from them in comparison. My wedges were the only items I can
say I probably overpaid for ($300 ea), but Derek did a helluva job on them with the grinds and the
stampings. Just did it to see what they would come up with. I'm still using the 58* sandwedge. The
grind on it is very good.

As for anyone making up qualifications, I'm not one of those people. I don't lie. There are a couple
of guys on BSG who know me personally and have made some nice comments about me. But, to be
honest, I never really seek praise, on the contrary, I'm very laid back and keep a low profile. I'm
known on BSG because I posted a lot there. The good news for all you petter7 haters and now, I
guess rebels68 haters, I'm just a couple of weeks away from being able to play golf full time and
when that happens, I'm gone. In the meantime, I have no ill feelings towards anyone on here, so
you're all great guys and if our paths ever cross, I'll buy ya a beer or two. :drinks:
[/quote]

First of all, I never said you made up qualifications...my point was that anyone can make them up so you take comments on the internet at face value. I've read tons of your posts at BSG and its very obvious that you know the golf swing very well and you have worked in the business for awhile...apparently you can play too. Obviously I don't know you personally and I'm not a petter7 hater...just that if you've been on golf forums pre-BSG you understand why so many people hate Todd. All I meant was, it seems difficult to get an opinion in if you don't agree with it...doesn't mean I'm a hater.

TheVelvetCat · November 3, 2009

[quote name='elrey23' post='2042222' date='Nov 2 2009, 10:27 PM']Website still down as of this post. If it ever does come back I can't wait to see the s*** storm that ensues[/quote]

:lol: You got me. I instantly envisioned both the scenes in [i]Airplane[/i] when the "sh^t hits the fan" and the movie [i]Kingpin[/i], "run for the hills everybody, there's a giant sh^t cloud headed this way."

And for the prior posts regarding additional popular golf forum names from Christmas past, how about....

PhilMickFan
leftyglfr
IndyHack
seasuks
fsmith84
MrAnderson

petter7 · November 3, 2009

[quote name='Dizzub' post='2042259' date='Nov 2 2009, 11:44 PM'][quote name='rebels68' post='2042075' date='Nov 2 2009, 11:20 PM'][quote name='Dizzub' post='2041995' date='Nov 2 2009, 09:47 PM']I was talking about being an early member because I have been there since the beginning...so I have seen everything change over the years. I was a member at GO when Todd got banned and then started BSG. My accomplishments mean nothing to anyone on the internet...anyone can say they have qualifications on here. Being a sub 100 member means absolutely nothing except having known Todd before he even stated his own site. You joined a few years after BSG started and have no idea what it was like in the beginning and must have missed all the BS(G) that Todd did over the years.[/quote]

Fair enough. The part about no idea about what happened in the beginning was once true, but after
communicating with so many of those sub 100 members through PM's and emails, I've heard most
of the bad things about Todd. Like I said, I didn't deal with him much. Never really thought of him
as anyone of great importance in the golf industry, just a guy that stumbled into the golf world by
way of a website business and tried to make a bunch of money through gouging customers. I paid
very little for the stuff I purchased from them in comparison. My wedges were the only items I can
say I probably overpaid for ($300 ea), but Derek did a helluva job on them with the grinds and the
stampings. Just did it to see what they would come up with. I'm still using the 58* sandwedge. The
grind on it is very good.

As for anyone making up qualifications, I'm not one of those people. I don't lie. There are a couple
of guys on BSG who know me personally and have made some nice comments about me. But, to be
honest, I never really seek praise, on the contrary, I'm very laid back and keep a low profile. I'm
known on BSG because I posted a lot there. The good news for all you petter7 haters and now, I
guess rebels68 haters, I'm just a couple of weeks away from being able to play golf full time and
when that happens, I'm gone. In the meantime, I have no ill feelings towards anyone on here, so
you're all great guys and if our paths ever cross, I'll buy ya a beer or two. :drinks:
[/quote]

First of all, I never said you made up qualifications...my point was that anyone can make them up so you take comments on the internet at face value. I've read tons of your posts at BSG and its very obvious that you know the golf swing very well and you have worked in the business for awhile...apparently you can play too. Obviously I don't know you personally and I'm not a petter7 hater...just that if you've been on golf forums pre-BSG you understand why so many people hate Todd. All I meant was, [b]it seems difficult to get an opinion in if you don't agree with it.[/b]..doesn't mean I'm a hater.
[/quote]

Sorry you feel that way, because I make a point to consider everyone's opinion. I do find it a bit odd
that others can disagree with my opinions, yet if I do that back, I'm being difficult. I hear what you are
saying Dizzub & I do know why there are so many Todd dissenters. I've been able to read a lot of what
has been written about him on other sites. Eye opening to say the least. I'm inclined to be as objective
as possible and I'm very interested in being truthful, so when it comes to BSG & Todd, that isn't exactly
crystal clear all the time. This subject matter is getting pretty depressing. Way too much hatred for my
psyche. Thanks for making your thoughts perfectly clear and not hating petter7 or rebels68.

As for OpusX20, I understand what you are saying. My comment was strictly about accomplishments
meaning more to me than a persons membership number. Now that I know Dizzub was only referring
to his knowledge pre-BSG and how that gives him a better knowledge of why people hate Todd, you
can disregard my comments. OK? :pardon:

forrre · November 3, 2009

[quote name='TheVelvetCat' post='2042296' date='Nov 2 2009, 11:06 PM'][quote name='elrey23' post='2042222' date='Nov 2 2009, 10:27 PM']Website still down as of this post. If it ever does come back I can't wait to see the s*** storm that ensues[/quote]

:lol: You got me. I instantly envisioned both the scenes in [i]Airplane[/i] when the "sh^t hits the fan" and the movie [i]Kingpin[/i], "run for the hills everybody, there's a giant sh^t cloud headed this way."

And for the prior posts regarding additional popular golf forum names from Christmas past, how about....

PhilMickFan
leftyglfr
IndyHack
seasuks
fsmith84
MrAnderson
[/quote]

Those names bring back some memories...WOW!!!!!!!

I have not posted on this topic since the first page and have spent the last 45 min reading to catch up. It is very sad to see the name that Todd has made for himself. From what I have gathered, not just from this topic but from my personal experience as well, he is truly a biz. savoy man and knows how to turn $1 into $200. It may not always have been the "right" way though. Todd is not the only one to blame in the falling of the big blue. I can tell you that I saw topics go from simple questions to lynchings in a matter of minutes. I don't know about the rest of you but I give respect until I find a reason not to. For the most part, we are all adults here and share the same passion but to completely ignore humanity and to flat disrespect someone due to them not sharing the same opinion as yourself is beyond me. The turning point for me was when I read a post in which a young golfer was asking for an opinion on a shaft and the first response was to the effect of "I won't try it until the Toddfather gives it his approval!" At what point in life does a human become a god? I left the site that day and have only been back a couple of times to see if they were still alive.

duck_hunter · November 3, 2009

if someone runs a website like bsg and with how much it supposedly makes. backing up the database(s) that support their operation should be a moot point. saying that their live production environment as well as their backups are corrupt is a joke. If they are tech-savy enough to host their own infrastructure than use an ISP, you would think they would be able to handle disaster recovery with ease. If they did use a hosted solution, the ISP would have a high chance of being able to restore their backend from some sort of backup..

just my 2 cents

faith+1 · November 3, 2009

Well if the economy has not killed BSG, then this thread sure has.

stage1350 · November 3, 2009

[quote name='echoi1975' post='2042392' date='Nov 3 2009, 12:49 AM']if someone runs a website like bsg and with how much it supposedly makes. backing up the database(s) that support their operation should be a moot point. saying that their live production environment as well as their backups are corrupt is a joke. If they are tech-savy enough to host their own infrastructure than use an ISP, you would think they would be able to handle disaster recovery with ease. If they did use a hosted solution, the ISP would have a high chance of being able to restore their backend from some sort of backup..

just my 2 cents[/quote]

I'm sure Hoss has been kicked down a flight of stairs for knocking the Igloo over at least once already. As for restoring their backends, I think the thumbrings have done enough damage already... :rolleyes: [/panache and debauchery]

parbeater · November 3, 2009

[quote name='Socrates' 2 iron' post='2041116' date='Nov 2 2009, 04:10 PM']Okay so after receiving an email today from < high-end shaft company > I can safely say that should BSG relaunch I will not be reregistering.

I was a longtime member there, and some time ago now I purchased a club through BSG dealing directly with Todd. I won't go into the specifics of it, so as not to shame the manufacturers whose goods are involved, but put simply... I did not get what I paid for.

It has come to my attention only recently that the serial numbers on the head do NOT match some of the specific designations for what was advertised. Is it a tour-head? Yes. Is it the same tour-head that was advertised, the one I had intended to buy? No.

Likewise, the high-end retail shaft I had ordered had been substituted for an earlier prototype model, supposedly the same shaft, despite having been very clear about which shaft I had wanted. I asked Todd about this; questioning him about the two profiles and he insisted that the two profiles were exactly the same, stating that this was only done such that I would not have to wait. Information I obtained from other sources suggested this was not true, and as such I emailed the manufacture. Today I received a reply from < high-end shaft company >, in which one of their technical people explained that the prototype shaft I received and the retail shaft I had ordered, are NOT the same profile - they are essentially different shafts, this particular prototype profile having never even made it to retail. Is the shaft I received a high-end shaft from < high-end shaft company >? Yes. Is it the shaft I ordered? No.

Caveat emptor.

This is about as much as I'm willing to say about this right now. If you're interested and would like to know more, then shoot me a PM.[/quote]

Why are the details of this such a secret? I can't see how naming the OEM's would hurty anything. If Todd was deceptive about something, it won't shame the manufacturer. If there is some truth to this, then it should be know. I'm sure that there are plenty of others who may have bought the same head or shaft that you did.