OEM integrity

[Twisty82]

Does a companies ethics and behaviours influence you at all?

I was just interested if anyone else out there pays much attention to company integrity etc when buying clubs? I know you might play JP wedges cos you have had good dealings with him and he is a good guy, but what about big companies? Do you play certain brands because you like the rep or you like the way they support certain causes etc or run their business with honesty and good values? I am not talking buying Titleiist cos you like Rors or not buying Nike cos you don't like Tiger.

Would love to lnow if anyone thinks about this side of the industry and if so I would love to know which companies people feel fit in to the good and bad categories and why.

[plus8]

I don't buy based on which person I like or not, but a company's presence and demeanor to play a role for me. That's one of the reasons why I play Ping. The other reasons are that they offer GREAT equipment, have top-notch customer service, are an American company, and work hard to maintain (and protect) their fitter network. No gimmicks with Ping (unlike some others). Just a great and well-run company of professionals.

[Twisty82]

[quote name='plus8' timestamp='1333275393' post='4623207']
I don't buy based on which person I like or not, but a company's presence and demeanor to play a role for me. That's one of the reasons why I play Ping. The other reasons are that they offer GREAT equipment, have top-notch customer service, are an American company, and work hard to maintain (and protect) their fitter network. No gimmicks with Ping (unlike some others). Just a great and well-run company of professionals.
[/quote]

I don't want to influence what anyone else has to say but I love your response. I put Ping at the top of my list in almost all categories, just my opinion and experience.

[pingman1]

[quote name='Twisty82' timestamp='1333275676' post='4623211']
[quote name='plus8' timestamp='1333275393' post='4623207']
I don't buy based on which person I like or not, but a company's presence and demeanor to play a role for me. That's one of the reasons why I play Ping. The other reasons are that they offer GREAT equipment, have top-notch customer service, are an American company, and work hard to maintain (and protect) their fitter network. No gimmicks with Ping (unlike some others). Just a great and well-run company of professionals.
[/quote]

I don't want to influence what anyone else has to say but I love your response. I put Ping at the top of my list in almost all categories, just my opinion and experience.
[/quote]
Exactly why I play PING and have since 1973.

[Nessism]

I also like Ping, and to answer the question, yes, the companies ethics and behavior influence me.

[phil75070]

I am another committed to play Ping for the reasons stated above.

[Wayside]

Yup, it's very important to me. I wouldn't put a brand in my bag if I didn't like them as a company.

When I worked in the golf trade, my experience was that Callaway, Titleist and Ping consistently offered the best customer (and retailer) service. I also liked what I read about Karsten Solheim and Ely Callaway.

Those are the brands that are in my bag at the moment, although after finally seeing the i20s yesterday it may become an all Ping bag.

[EricZ116]

I actually hate Tiger, but my irons, 5 wood, and old driver are all nikes...

I just play what I find to be the best clubs in my given budget.

[MtlJeff]

LOL....i know how you guys feel

[url="http://www.golfwrx.com/forums/topic/611979-all-is-right-with-the-world-again"]http://www.golfwrx.c...the-world-again[/url]

[mat562]

You're as likely to see me using a Callaway golf club as you are to see me drinking Argentinian wine.

[dplevin]

The integrity of an OEM does affect me, that's why I don't play Scotty Cameron.

[hattrick3518]

This is an interesting topic. However it's not something I really think about when buying a club. I buy clubs that work for my game, and help me get better. I don't do much research on the integrity of the big box companies, in fact I haven't really noted anything unethical from them (again, haven't done a ton of research). I mean sure, some people are only going to buy clubs from certain manufacturers, and not buy from others; all for different reasons. For me I just buy what works best, I don't do an ethics check on the manufacturer before their club makes it in my bag. As long as they aren't burning down orphanages and shooting children as they run out, I think I'll keep buying their clubs.

Edit: After reading the replies again, it feels like some are stating that good customer service = good ethics and integrity. I don't agree with that, its easy to have good customer service skills. When I saw this thread it got me to thinking about what could be unethical from golf manufacturers...The way they source their materials, is it sustainable? Is it exploiting anyone? How do these companies treat their employees and ambassadors? Customer service may be an indicator of integrity, but its also something necessary for businesses to succeed. Can companies not have good customer service, while at the same time doing some morally questionable things behind closed doors?

[mdgboxx]

I wrote a review: SRIXON, Z-Star adjustable driver ! It answers your question........In DETAILS !

[MtlJeff]

[quote name='hattrick3518' timestamp='1333312247' post='4625263']
This is an interesting topic. However it's not something I really think about when buying a club. I buy clubs that work for my game, and help me get better. I don't do much research on the integrity of the big box companies, in fact I haven't really noted anything unethical from them (again, haven't done a ton of research). I mean sure, some people are only going to buy clubs from certain manufacturers, and not buy from others; all for different reasons. For me I just buy what works best, I don't do an ethics check on the manufacturer before their club makes it in my bag. As long as they aren't burning down orphanages and shooting children as they run out, I think I'll keep buying their clubs.
[/quote]

it is certainly an interesting topic, and i understand the people that don't care because at the end of the day one person doesn't make a lick of difference. As i've experienced more and more in my own job, witnessed so many consolidations and so many midsize/small companies get sucked up and taken apart, i've just tended to start resenting big companies more. Everything becomes lowest common denominator, everything is about only profits, and the bigger they get the more they bully distributors and try to buy up all their competitors to create a monopoly or oligopoly that can hurt consumers in the end.

I understand how the world works and nothing will ever change this. The big companies will always win in the end. But i like giving my money to smaller guys i guess.

Now if i could only find a small company that made lefty woods. I guess i need to go back to Ping

[mdgboxx]

[quote name='MtlJeff' timestamp='1333312780' post='4625309']
[quote name='hattrick3518' timestamp='1333312247' post='4625263']
This is an interesting topic. However it's not something I really think about when buying a club. I buy clubs that work for my game, and help me get better. I don't do much research on the integrity of the big box companies, in fact I haven't really noted anything unethical from them (again, haven't done a ton of research). I mean sure, some people are only going to buy clubs from certain manufacturers, and not buy from others; all for different reasons. For me I just buy what works best, I don't do an ethics check on the manufacturer before their club makes it in my bag. As long as they aren't burning down orphanages and shooting children as they run out, I think I'll keep buying their clubs.
[/quote]

it is certainly an interesting topic, and i understand the people that don't care because at the end of the day one person doesn't make a lick of difference. As i've experienced more and more in my own job, witnessed so many consolidations and so many midsize/small companies get sucked up and taken apart, i've just tended to start resenting big companies more. Everything becomes lowest common denominator, everything is about only profits, and the bigger they get the more they bully distributors and try to buy up all their competitors to create a monopoly or oligopoly that can hurt consumers in the end.

I understand how the world works and nothing will ever change this. The big companies will always win in the end. But i like giving my money to smaller guys i guess.

Now if i could only find a small company that made lefty woods. I guess i need to go back to Ping
[/quote]


The PING i20 couldn't kick my trusted SRIXON, Z-Rw outta the bag, no matter what shaft the rep put on it but, the G20 did just that, GO !

[MadGolfer76]

To me, the only no-BS lines out there are PING, Mizuno, and Bridgestone. Just my opinion, and nothing more.

[scottvw13]

Bottom line, I'll play whatever helps me to play better. I can care less how big a company is or how much money they are making.

If I am on the fence about one product or another, I'll certainly go with the OEM that will provide the best service.

As for Ping, I root for them because I really like the way they do business. That said, I don't have a single Ping club in my bag.

Makes me chuckle how these threads threads turn into Ping lovefests.

For those who hate big companies, keep in mind that Ping is one of the largest privately owned compaies in the world. Their golf biz is just a small part of their business

[MtlJeff]

[quote name='scottvw13' timestamp='1333315078' post='4625497']
Bottom line, I'll play whatever helps me to play better. I can care less how big a company is or how much money they are making.

If I am on the fence about one product or another, I'll certainly go with the OEM that will provide the best service.

As for Ping, I root for them because I really like the way they do business. That said, I don't have a single Ping club in my bag.

Makes me chuckle how these threads threads turn into Ping lovefests.

For those who hate big companies, keep in mind that Ping is one of the largest privately owned compaies in the world. Their golf biz is just a small part of their business
[/quote]

can you elaborate on the bottom sentence? I'm not being snarky or anything i'm actually curious. What does Ping do other then golf? I've never heard of anything else. One of the largest private companies in the world is a pretty big statement

[scottvw13]

[quote name='MtlJeff' timestamp='1333315760' post='4625561']
[quote name='scottvw13' timestamp='1333315078' post='4625497']

For those who hate big companies, keep in mind that Ping is one of the largest privately owned compaies in the world. Their golf biz is just a small part of their business
[/quote]

can you elaborate on the bottom sentence? I'm not being snarky or anything i'm actually curious. What does Ping do other then golf? I've never heard of anything else. One of the largest private companies in the world is a pretty big statement
[/quote]

Being privately owned, they are in no way required to report their earning, other than to the IRS. As a result, it is hard to know precisely how large a company they really are.

That said, the Karsten family owns an engineering company that performs work for NASA and various defense contractors, as well as various steel foundries, and also supplies Aeronautical parts to the defense industry. Very high end, precision, high dollar stuff.

[MtlJeff]

cool, i didn't know that. I actually work for a large private company myself. Definitely a different experience then working at public ones

[scottvw13]

[quote name='MtlJeff' timestamp='1333317578' post='4625707']
cool, i didn't know that. I actually work for a large private company myself. Definitely a different experience then working at public ones
[/quote]


I see a lot of different types of companies (accountant) and in my opinion a large private is the best of all worlds

[square]

I thought it was in very poor taste when Cleveland Golf CEO Greg Hopkins started doing commercials pushing non-conforming groove wedges.

[quote name='Twisty82' timestamp='1333274469' post='4623203']
I was just interested if anyone else out there pays much attention to company integrity etc when buying clubs? I know you might play JP wedges cos you have had good dealings with him and he is a good guy, but what about big companies? Do you play certain brands because you like the rep or you like the way they support certain causes etc or run their business with honesty and good values? I am not talking buying Titleiist cos you like Rors or not buying Nike cos you don't like Tiger.

Would love to lnow if anyone thinks about this side of the industry and if so I would love to know which companies people feel fit in to the good and bad categories and why.
[/quote]

[scottvw13]

[quote name='square' timestamp='1333319927' post='4625929']
I thought it was in very poor taste when Cleveland Golf CEO Greg Hopkins started doing commercials pushing non-conforming groove wedges.

[/quote]

I agree.

However, do you remember when The King was endorsing Callaways line of non conforming drivers?

Thankfully, the public seems to want to play by the rules...

[wrmiller]

This reasoning is exactly why i won't even touch a TM or Cally club.

[putts4bogey]

I'm another in the Ping camp and the company behind the product plays a role in shaping my brand awareness and loyalties. All of the major golf companies seem to perform well at releasing and selling new clubs every year, but Ping's CS performs well long after previous models are forgotten by other golf companies.

[Myherobobhope]

As long as I'm not morally opposed to what they are doing, I don't really care.

I don't love Taylor Mades marketing campaigns, but if they have the best stuff... I will play it.

[Trevorn]

[quote name='mat562' timestamp='1333309780' post='4625107']
You're as likely to see me using a Callaway golf club as you are to see me drinking Argentinian wine.
[/quote]

Whatever you do, don't mention the war!!

[mat562]

Ping have long been a company I've liked and respected.

Their UK factory's only just down the road, their illustrious founder had some Norwegian blood in his veins, like me, and they were nice enough to give me some kit when I was younger, so, yes, I'm perhaps a bit biased; but they're a company who really give me the impression that they 1) care about me as a customer; 2) care about [i]keeping[/i] me as a [i]happy[/i] customer; and 3) stand by their products and offer an ongoing aftersales service which is arguably the best in the industry. If I take a 20 or 25 year-old club in to Ping UK to have some work done on it, they're both happy to do the work (often free of charge or for a nominal sum) and happy to still see me using the club in question - which is in marked contrast to some other OEMs who, if they had their way, would have sold me twenty replacements for the thing, each supposedly better than the last, in the time since I bought it, and who would be pushing me to chuck it in the bin and put the latest wonder club in the bag instead. [i]Until summer, of course, when it'll be obsolete.[/i]

As for OEMs for whom I don't much care, Callaway rubbed me the wrong way with their ball patents-related petty mardiness (albeit I was never much of a fan of their kit anyway), and Scotty Cameron, in my opinion, is simply trying to rip me off; either with his average quality recent retail putters with nonetheless hefty price tags or with the whole pretentious 'FOR TOUR USE ONLY/LOOK AT WHAT I'VE GOT!' nonsense and the endless stream of eye-wateringly-expensive branded tat he delights in knocking out. I've got several of his older putters, all of which are excellent, and I couldn't give a monkey's toss about the sniping that goes on between boutique putter companies and their afficionados or being 'seen' with a particular brand of putter in my mitts or with a limited edition headcover, but like a restaurant that charges me silly money for an ostentatiously-presented but distinctly average meal because it thinks its flashy reputation justifies it - usually via a snooty waiter who looks down his nose at me when he hands me the bill - I don't like to feel that I'm having the mickey taken out of me or that I'm being exploited when I hand over my money to someone. Rightly or wrongly, that's exactly the impression I now get from Scotty Cameron.

.

[Tgunn137]

I am another Ping devotee, I played eye 2's after they were introduced. Got away from them to play some component clubs from Wishon for a while then picked up a set of isi's a couple of years back and loved them even for a older set. Now play S58's. Ping quality and customer service are the best.

[Androooo]

I use what works for me...

R11 Driver
TEE 3 wood
Mizuno irons and wedges
Scotty RedX Putter