How many scratch players are TRUELY scratch players ????

[jcjr1972]

Can't believe this post has such legs to it. It's pretty simple people yes there are sandbaggers both high and low out there, the guys that keep it high to win and the "posers" out there that love seeing that low cap. There also "reality" people, the US handicap system couldn't be any more flawed. First off a cap is you future potential so just by that alone it's off base. Second it's only a average of you top 20 scores and high ones are thrown out so at any point in the golf season it is not an accurate assessment of you golf game as it stands that very day. Third and this is the reason we are even posting right now is the actual course you regularly play on and it's rating/slope.
I am a legitimate 3.2 don't cheat don't sandbag I played 154 times last years at my home course and posted every round good and bad. So here's the rub people, blue tees rating at my course is 70/120 from the blues. So we can all end this debate I will ask you this. I post all my scores accurate no cheating. My home course rating where I play the majority of my rounds is 72/120. AM I REALLY A 3.2?

[isaacbm]

[quote name='jcjr1972' timestamp='1391676971' post='8608245']
Can't believe this post has such legs to it. It's pretty simple people yes there are sandbaggers both high and low out there, the guys that keep it high to win and the "posers" out there that love seeing that low cap. There also "reality" people, the US handicap system couldn't be any more flawed. First off a cap is you future potential so just by that alone it's off base. Second it's only a average of you top 20 scores and high ones are thrown out so at any point in the golf season it is not an accurate assessment of you golf game as it stands that very day. Third and this is the reason we are even posting right now is the actual course you regularly play on and it's rating/slope.
I am a legitimate 3.2 don't cheat don't sandbag I played 154 times last years at my home course and posted every round good and bad. So here's the rub people, blue tees rating at my course is 70/120 from the blues. So we can all end this debate I will ask you this. I post all my scores accurate no cheating. My home course rating where I play the majority of my rounds is 72/120. AM I REALLY A 3.2?
[/quote]you haven't told us your scores. What point are you trying to make ?

[cwbrion]

[quote name='kekoa' timestamp='1369979993' post='7141224']
Thus the phrase vanity cap. I started a thread way back when with the same topic. Knew two guys who work at a local range claiming to be scratch players. One shot high 80's in a us open qualifer. The other also hardly broke 90. I understand pressure but i dont think a true scratch player would shoot such high #'s. maybe a bad round in the low 80's i could understand.
[/quote]

Hey I did this very same thing back when I was a scratch. Quite a few years in a row. Good players don't have always put up good scores. And as mentioned previously most scratches play the same course day in and day out.....i.e. their games do not travel well. I would have loved to play in the U.S. Open as I am sure those two guys would as well, but there is so much pressure put onto yourself that goal is impossible. I do not regret trying and I actually learned a lot about my golf game and myself having to post a card in the 80s each year at US Open qualifying.

[bogeywoods03]

Traveling scratch players are different than home course scratch guys....

[minimal45]

People have trouble accepting who they are in golf and in life.

[joeshmo]

Briny Baird shot 81 today at AT&T.

Good thing he wasn't playing some WRX'ers.............

[3_Jack_Par]

[quote name='MtlJeff' timestamp='1369965534' post='7139930']
i've never met anyone in the +1 to 3 range who couldn't play.

I shot 88 in our club championship last year as a 1.2

I wonder how many threads got started about me and my lying ways. "i played with this 1 in the club championship (yeah right) who shot an 88....why do guys lie to get into the A flight?"

I guess some guys genuinely lie about their scores. But 95% of the time it's the other way around. I've run into faaaaaaarrrrrr more sandbaggers
[/quote]
Definitely happens. I don't know what my exact index was at the time, but I fluctuate between 0 and 3, and I had a complete back nine meltdown in a tournament a few years ago, and shot 90. Sometimes, things just snowball, and a single round of golf isn't always enough time to pull yourself out of it.

[tinytim]

the problem about handicap is, that most people beleave in bragging with it.
people judge others by handicaps. its ridicioulus. there are guys who play 10 years , having an (uk index) HC of 10 which is really nothing good. they worked hard for it, and its maximum they can get. they will stuck at this point, maybe 9 is good, thats it.
then there comes a guy, playing 3 months, having HC of 30 which says nothng, because he just plays 2 tournaments and thats 2 months ago. the 10 guy talk to the 30guy like he is the captain. he calls himself "captain flight" because hes so much better at golf.
end of the day: the HC30 guy was 3 shots behind the HC10 who plays a 87. lol :-)

[Jc0]

[quote name='cwbrion' timestamp='1391709702' post='8610183']
[quote name='kekoa' timestamp='1369979993' post='7141224']
Thus the phrase vanity cap. I started a thread way back when with the same topic. Knew two guys who work at a local range claiming to be scratch players. One shot high 80's in a us open qualifer. The other also hardly broke 90. I understand pressure but i dont think a true scratch player would shoot such high #'s. maybe a bad round in the low 80's i could understand.
[/quote]

Hey I did this very same thing back when I was a scratch. Quite a few years in a row. Good players don't have always put up good scores. And as mentioned previously most scratches play the same course day in and day out.....i.e. their games do not travel well. I would have loved to play in the U.S. Open as I am sure those two guys would as well, but there is so much pressure put onto yourself that goal is impossible. I do not regret trying and I actually learned a lot about my golf game and myself having to post a card in the 80s each year at US Open qualifying.
[/quote]

I did the same thing in one. Chose to play probably when I shouldn't have (played only 3 rounds in the two months leading up to it) and ended up shooting 87. What you need to realize is that since it is a one round event people are way more aggressive than normal. Factor that with a hard golf course plus a hard setup and scores can snowball if you aren't playing well.

Also remember a USGA handicap is the average of your 10 best of 20 scores, so you may have someone who is scratch but also have 2 or 3 scores in the 80's that don't effect their handicap. In reality you should only should better than your handicap 25% of the time if it is correct.

[lumberman2462]

I think we all probably know guys that can shoot "anything".

One guy at my club shot 67 and followed it up a few days later with an 84.

When he gets rolling he can flat out play. When his driver isn't cooperating he can hardly finish a round.

[Mcgeeno]

^Great post^

I played with a guy in a practice round in my local open from out of town...Shot a legit 67 (-4) on a decent track and it was one of those rounds where he wasnt 100% serious and it could have been a few strokes lower. I took note of his name and made sure to check the leaderboard to see by how many strokes he was going to win by, LOL.

He posted 83-74 over the two days.

Golf is a crazy game.

[Toph84]

I think there are way more people who sandbag than vice versa.

Bad rounds do happen though, even to low handicappers. When I played in the US Am qualifier last year I was a 1.6 and am now playing to a 2.1, and hopefully rising to accurately reflect how I am playing this season. During the US Am qualifier last year, it was myself and a few others in the 25-40 year old range, and the rest were D1 college golfers and a few D2 and D3 guys. I was middle of the pack on day 1 with an embarrassing 80. I did not by any means have the lowest handicap there, some of the golfers were plus handi's and shot mid 80's that day.

Anyone can have a bad round as others have stated. I deal with some temper issues that can easily turn a 70 into a 76-80 especially under pressure in tournament settings. Expectations for tournaments are your biggest enemy and if you are not familiar with those settings on a fairly regular basis its easy to post a high number.

[scottishpedro]

Sergio Garcia at the 1999 british open at Carnoustie (a few months before his super performance in the Ryder cup) shot 89 83. Everyone has bad days. As mentioned many times in this thread, the handicap system allows players to play to their handicap around 25% of the time. As long as someone is honest with their scores, a scratch handicapper is a scratch player irrespective of whether he shoots 68, 78 or 88 that day.

[msegroves]

Yea, handicap can be misleading. I got down to a 8.2 over the summer but I was only playing the same course over and over again. I was consistently scoring in the low 80s and occasionally scoring in the 70s. Recently I have been trying some other courses I am unfamiliar with and my scores are going up. Right now I am sitting at 13.4, which is probably closer to my real handicap level.

[Obee]

Another way to look and indexes is to look at players' "T" (Tournament) scores. The requirements for Tournament rounds are usually more stringent. Usually, a player's regular rounds and T rounds are similar, but sometimes there's a marked difference. Beware the guys with really low "T" scores and higher "everyday' scores. LOL!