X-stiff or stiff

mizunotpzmizunotpz Members Posts: 171 ✭✭
Hi!



Looking at a great deal on a Taylor Made M2 2016 driver. My swing speed is about 100-102, the shaft is a Diamana S60+ blue x-stiff. I like my shaft

on a driver to feel a little boardy, but would an x-stiff for my swing speed, and moderate tempo, be too much to handle. I tried a x-stiff shaft like 10 years ago, a V2 and remember that felt quite stiff.



Thanks!!
«1

Comments

  • rgk5rgk5 rgk5(OLB) Members Posts: 3,575 ✭✭
    Not enough speed for that shaft.
    Cobra F8+, 10.5*, VA Composites Raijin 44 F2
    Cobra F8 3-4 wood 15.5*, VA Composites Raijin 44 F3

    Cobra F8 5-6 wood, Tensei Blue A
    Callaway V Sole 7-wood, Bassara R
    Callaway Rogue Pro 5-AW, Recoil 95 F3
    Ping Glide 1.0 55*, CFS Wedge flex

    Ping Glide 2.0 Stealth 58*, Alta 70 R

    Ping Zing 2 TR 34", Flatso 1.0 grip
  • mizunotpzmizunotpz Members Posts: 171 ✭✭
    rgk5 wrote:


    Not enough speed for that shaft.


    What speed would be more appropriate you think?
  • SubaruWRXSubaruWRX Members Posts: 3,282 ✭✭
    Consider head weight and playing length as well
    “I think getting advice from guys who are sitting at the computer in their underwear while taking a break from **** is a very solid way to choose clubs.” - bluedot
  • mizunotpzmizunotpz Members Posts: 171 ✭✭
    SubaruWRX wrote:


    Consider head weight and playing length as well


    What would be standard head weight? The length of that is like 45.5, its standard length. How would that affect you mean?
  • Krt22Krt22 Members Posts: 6,504 ✭✭
    mizunotpz wrote:

    SubaruWRX wrote:


    Consider head weight and playing length as well


    What would be standard head weight? The length of that is like 45.5, its standard length. How would that affect you mean?




    If you played it shorter and added weight to bring up swing weight, the shaft will play softer.



    With that being said, the diamana blue 60 isnt an very stout profile, so may not be a big deal.
  • mizunotpzmizunotpz Members Posts: 171 ✭✭
    Homepage says x starts around 106. If I dont like the shaft I can always trade it. But I havent measuered my swing speed in like 6-7 years and improved my swing a lot since then.
  • mizunotpzmizunotpz Members Posts: 171 ✭✭
    Krt22 wrote:

    mizunotpz wrote:

    SubaruWRX wrote:


    Consider head weight and playing length as well


    What would be standard head weight? The length of that is like 45.5, its standard length. How would that affect you mean?




    If you played it shorter and added weight to bring up swing weight, the shaft will play softer.



    With that being said, the diamana blue 60 isnt an very stout profile, so may not be a big deal.


    No, and I mostly react to shafts thats very tip stiff, and this shaft isnt, more like butt stiff. But thanks for the info. Cause I will most likely shorten the shaft in the butt end and add some weight to the head.
  • ian-500ian-500 Members Posts: 704 ✭✭
    You'll be fine with that shaft. I've hovered between 100 - 110 for years now and have always played x-flex shafts, in nearly all clubs.....just more confidence to go after it image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />
    Cobra F9 7.5* + Fuji Speeder Pro XLR8 63tx.
    Taylormade R15 12.8* + Diamana R80x.
    Adams XTD 19* + Matrix White Tie x.
    Adams Pro 23 Tour Issue + Tour AD UT95x
    Adams DHY Pro 27 + Irod 105x.
    Adams XTD Forged Tour Issue 6i - GW + Recoil Prototype 125F5.
    Adams XTD Forged SW/LW + KBS Hi-Rev x.
    SeeMore SB1, Accra FX300, Garsen.
  • mizunotpzmizunotpz Members Posts: 171 ✭✭
    ian-500 wrote:


    You'll be fine with that shaft. I've hovered between 100 - 110 for years now and have always played x-flex shafts, in nearly all clubs.....just more confidence to go after it image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />


    haha, thats what Im thinking. Trying to find more fairways this season. Thanks for your input. If you never try youll never find out.
  • mizunotpzmizunotpz Members Posts: 171 ✭✭
    And I can hit my driver like 260 up to 290 in warm conditions so it might work.
  • bradskibradski Members Posts: 2,328 ✭✭
    it honestly comes down to preference and #'s. But the standard for xstiff is usually 110ish and up.
  • Krt22Krt22 Members Posts: 6,504 ✭✭
    For me the trade off of going to weak is far worse than going too stiff. Ill gladly give up a hand full of yards for more control and less left misses. Worse case you can find the same exact shaft in stiff for not a bunch of money.
  • Krt22Krt22 Members Posts: 6,504 ✭✭
    bradski wrote:


    it honestly comes down to preference and #'s. But the standard for xstiff is usually 110ish and up.




    There is no real standard, those are just guidelines. Really depends on the player and how they load the shaft. Profile matters as well.
  • LodestoneLodestone Members Posts: 3,269 ✭✭
    Would you mind sharing what a "great deal" on a '16 M2 is? I've been doing some window shopping myself.



    thanks
    FORE RIGHT!!!!
  • mizunotpzmizunotpz Members Posts: 171 ✭✭
    Krt22 wrote:

    bradski wrote:


    it honestly comes down to preference and #'s. But the standard for xstiff is usually 110ish and up.




    There is no real standard, those are just guidelines. Really depends on the player and how they load the shaft. Profile matters as well.


    Yes thats what Im thinking also, like a Bassara 40 gram shaft might play softer in x stiff than a Tensei white in stiff. And as you say I could easily find a similar shaft in stiff and maybe even exchange it with someone who wants to go stiffer. But Im like you, I prefer to go straight and slightly shorter and not that duck hook. Hate it.
  • mizunotpzmizunotpz Members Posts: 171 ✭✭
    Lodestone wrote:


    Would you mind sharing what a "great deal" on a '16 M2 is? I've been doing some window shopping myself.



    thanks


    Its over here in Sweden. Its a demo, but looks new to me. about 130 dollars.
  • OokluhOokluh Members Posts: 64 ✭✭
    edited Mar 13, 2019 7:08pm #18
    Swing speed only part of the story, but that speed usually would be more likely to be a stiff fit. Violent or fast transitions can push people into next flex up if sort of borderline, not sure if that is borderline though. That being said, if you use a 70 stiff then maybe a 60 xstiff wouldn't necessarily be tremendously different. Just my 2c, far from an expert.
  • kiw1982kiw1982 Members Posts: 1,203 ✭✭
    You can try stiff shaft tipped.
    Mizuno        ST-180 Driver w/KuroKage HBP 50 S+
    Taylormade  M6 3 Wood w/NV 2KXV Blue 75 S+
    Mizuno        CLK  3 Hybrid w/Tensei Blue HB 80  S+
    Taylormade  P790 4-G Irons w/KBS Tour 130 S+
    Mizuno        T7 56/10 Wedge w/KBS Tour 130 S+
    Mizuno        S18 60/06 Wedge w/KBS Tour 130 S+
    Odyssey      O-Works 1WS Putter
  • cardoustiecardoustie haha, we don't play for 5's Members Posts: 11,859 ✭✭
    If you're over 100 no probs with that shaft
    Ping G400 LST 11* Oban Revenge 65x
    Ping G400 5w 16.5* Oban Kiyoshi White 65s
    Ping G25 7w 20* Fubuki Tour 73x
    Ping G25 4h 23* Diamana White 92s
    Callaway Apex 5h 26* Mitsu KK 80s
    Ping s55 6-PW Fujikura mci 100s
    Vokey sm2 50* 54* 59* 64* DG s400 Onyx
    Piretti Matera Elite (torched)
  • DaRizDaRiz SoCalMembers Posts: 1,517 ✭✭
    I was in this situation. Self-fit for the past few years, 105-112 mph swing speed, always had more success with X shafts, they always seemed to go straighter for me. BUT I always felt like I had to really gear up to hit it. On cold days, and in early/late in the year, I was more inconsistent but attributed that to not being in "mid season form". Fact of the matter is I probably couldn't swing fast enough in the cold to load the shaft properly. This year I decided to get fit as my driver was only going about 250-260 even though I was crushing it. Old guys were out driving me with visibly slower speeds.



    I went from:



    Ping G 9* Speeder 757 X-stiff (77g low launch) D1

    to

    TS3 8.5* Kiyoshi Purple 75 stiff (79g high launch) D4



    Down in flex, up in launch, up slightly shaft weight and swing weight, and down in loft. You would think that going down in flex and up in launch that I would be hitting the ball super high (I was already a high ball hitter even with the 757 in X), but it was the opposite. By having the correct weight and flex, I was able to load the shaft properly which lowered my trajectory. I was swinging my 757 X at 105mph and the Kiyoshi Purple at 112mph. The softer shaft alone got me tons of ball speed and yardage. Having a well-fit shaft also enabled me to use a low spin head, instead of a head with max forgiveness, which got me even more yards. My strategy had been to use a super forgiving head with a super stiff shaft to kill the spin, but that was not ideal for me and actually backfired and produced way too much spin, even though I was very accurate with it.



    Stats were something like:



    Gamer:

    105 swing speed, 150 ball speed, 120 ft height, 260 carry 270 total (on my absolutely best, not sharing my avgs) playing a FADE

    New Driver:

    112 swing speed, 160 ball speed, 75 ft height, 270 carry 300 total (on my averages!) playing a DRAW



    note: I did nothing to go from a fade to a draw other than the shaft change. I typically play a draw in all my clubs except driver, which happens to be my only club that was X flex, you do the math..



    Bottom line: stiffer shafts do not always mean lower launch and less spin, and swing speed does not always dictate shaft flex. Check your ego, going down in flex gave me more swing speed and ball speed. Find a softer shaft you can control and you might be pleasantly surprised.
    TS3 8.5* Kiyoshi Purple 75
    TS2 16.5* Kiyoshi Purple 75
    913H 19* ADHY85
    4-6 MP-H4 s300 7-PW MP-4 s300
    SM5 50.12F 54.14F SM7 60.12D
    #7 MXM
  • cgasuckscgasucks Members Posts: 2,190 ✭✭
    edited Mar 13, 2019 9:50pm #22
    For your 100MPH Swing Speed, Stiff is just perfect for you. Your swing speed has to be at least 110 to handle xstiff. But that is ultimately up to you, if that xstiff feels fine to you, then go with it.
    10.5 deg Titleist 905R with stock UST Proforce V2 Shaft
    Titleist DCI 990 Irons (3-PW) with stock Dynamic Gold shafts in S300
    Taylormade ATV 54 deg & 58 deg wedges with stock KBS shafts
    Taylormade V-Steel 5W & 3W with Grafalloy Prolaunch Red shafts
    Ping Anser 2 Stainless Steel Putter
  • Stuart_GStuart_G New HampshireMembers Posts: 23,121 ✭✭
    Sorry, don't listen to anyone that tells you you should or should not get that shaft just based on the swing speed. Swing speed only gives a possible starting point in the fitting process, nothing more.



    I know it's winter but if it's a demo, any way you can actually demo it to test how it feels and performs for you? Even indoors on a LM would get you the answers you need. That's the only way to tell



    But also keep in mind that if it really is that good of a price, it might be worth it to get the club even if you have to change shafts to get the most out of it. It's really not that hard or expensive to convert an older shaft you've used and still have (and know works) to use it in the new head.
  • rgk5rgk5 rgk5(OLB) Members Posts: 3,575 ✭✭
    mizunotpz wrote:

    ian-500 wrote:


    You'll be fine with that shaft. I've hovered between 100 - 110 for years now and have always played x-flex shafts, in nearly all clubs.....just more confidence to go after it image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />


    haha, thats what Im thinking. Trying to find more fairways this season. Thanks for your input. If you never try youll never find out.




    There is a huge difference between 100 and 110 mph. At 102 you are pushing yourself with the Diamana +. A consistent and smooth 105+ would be better or a lighter shaft like the VA Composites Raijin 44 in X flex. Callaway's extensive robot and low handicap swing tests determined that shaft weight is much more important than flex.
    Cobra F8+, 10.5*, VA Composites Raijin 44 F2
    Cobra F8 3-4 wood 15.5*, VA Composites Raijin 44 F3

    Cobra F8 5-6 wood, Tensei Blue A
    Callaway V Sole 7-wood, Bassara R
    Callaway Rogue Pro 5-AW, Recoil 95 F3
    Ping Glide 1.0 55*, CFS Wedge flex

    Ping Glide 2.0 Stealth 58*, Alta 70 R

    Ping Zing 2 TR 34", Flatso 1.0 grip
  • Stuart_GStuart_G New HampshireMembers Posts: 23,121 ✭✭
    edited Mar 14, 2019 7:01am #25
    rgk5 wrote:

    mizunotpz wrote:

    ian-500 wrote:


    You'll be fine with that shaft. I've hovered between 100 - 110 for years now and have always played x-flex shafts, in nearly all clubs.....just more confidence to go after it image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />


    haha, thats what Im thinking. Trying to find more fairways this season. Thanks for your input. If you never try youll never find out.




    There is a huge difference between 100 and 110 mph. At 102 you are pushing yourself with the Diamana +. A consistent and smooth 105+ would be better or a lighter shaft like the VA Composites Raijin 44 in X flex. Callaway's extensive robot and low handicap swing tests determined that shaft weight is much more important than flex.




    Yes, there are exceptions but generally weight is much more important than flex. But there is no way to know or even guess at what point the OP will be 'pushing' it or not.



    A corollary to flex not being generally as important is that there is no ideal or right or wrong amount of loading in a shaft. There is nothing wrong with not getting a certain amount or very much loading in a shaft if it happens to be "too stiff" compared to what most people expect - as long as the feel doesn't cause problems with the swing. And that's where the exceptions come to play. And there certainly are people who have to get a certain feel out of the shaft in order to get good results. For those people too stiff and too soft are very important things that need to be avoided.



    But just because some people have that problem and might push themselves too much when they get a shaft that feels too stiff doesn't mean everyone will. Lots of folks can still continue to put a good consistent swing on the shaft even if it might be considered too stiff by some others. And even for those that do, the point at which it becomes too stiff is going to be different for everyone.



    In fact, I think it was Sneed who couldn't stand to feel ANY give or loading in the shaft and made them as stiff as he possibly could.
  • mwink822mwink822 Members Posts: 2,577 ✭✭
    edited Mar 14, 2019 9:24am #26
    I find profile, weight, and balance to make more of a difference for me. In driver I like something that's more of the one-piece stout feel, fairways I like a smoother feel. We had a Titleist demo day at my club not too long ago and I found I reacted to different shaft profiles more differently than I did when changing flex within the same shaft. Likewise, I reacted more to a change in weight than I did to a change in flex.



    At about 100 MPH with a Blue Board 60, shouldn't be too much of an issue.
    Titleist 917D3 9.5* Aldila Rogue Silver 80 Tour X 125 MSI
    Titleist 915 Fd 13.5* Diamana S+ 80X (rotates in and out based on course played)
    Titleist 917F2 18* (turned down to 17.25*) Aldila Rogue Black 80X 95 MSI
    3-P Mizuno JPX 900 Tour Nippon Modus 3 105X
    White Satin Mizuno MP T7 51-08 Modus 3 105X
    Blue Ion Mizuno MP T7 55-09 Modus 3 105X Soft Stepped
    Blue Ion Mizuno MP T7 59-09 Modus 3 105X Soft Stepped
    Scotty Cameron Studio Select Fastback 1
  • driveandputtmachinedriveandputtmachine 4 wedges or 2 iron? That is the question! Members Posts: 1,171 ✭✭
    edited Mar 14, 2019 9:42am #27
    SS has some to do with it, but in general transition plays a bigger role in what stiffness to play in what I have seen or heard of in most fittings. I am not a fitter, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn so take this with a grain of salt.



    For instance, I have a rather rough transition, I also do swing around 115 and I play an X flex in the driver and throughout my entire set. One of my best buds SS is roughly 113 and plays R and S flex shafts throughout his set. His transition is much smoother and between that and the fact that his body feels better swinging a softer shaft it is what fits him best.



    One other big factor, one companies S is another companies X is another companies R. I will say I have seen better tolerances in manufacturers standards within flex for each model, but there are still variances there as well.
    Driver - Ping 400 MAX on Tour 65 
    Fairway - Cobra F9 on UST Axivcore Black
    Others - Srixon 785 5 Wood on UST Axivcore Black or TM UDI 2 iron on Nippon 130 or Ping G400 17* 
    Irons - (4-A) Taylormade 790's on KBS Tour
    Wedges - Cleveland Rotex 3.0 55*, Rotex 4.0 60* on KBS tour
    Putter - Mannkrafted MA/66 or Taylormade Spider
    Ball - TM TP5x or Srixon Z Star XV
  • Bkonja02Bkonja02 Members Posts: 17 ✭✭
    Hey guys, good thread going on here and I am in a similar dilemma. My SS is generally between 105-109 and Ive been playing stiff shafts that were on the lighter end (around 55g) for a long time. I'm a smaller guy around 5'5 but have always been able to move the ball out there a good way(295 average). Being smaller, ive always felt much more comfortable in the lighter shafts bc once I get into the 65-75g range the club kinda starts swinging me so to speak. Ive always been a Ping man... And there stock stiff 55g shafts are always pretty decent but have a tendency (for me) to be fairly "whippy". Natural ball flight is a mid to mid-high draw...and with the stock stiff I tend to hook the ball far too often. Ive messed with some aftermarket shafts such as the Fujikura Vista pro stiff 55g and found the same issue. Ive been looking into the lighter x-stiff shafts... And even hit a bucket with a friends Taylormade M3 with a Tensei CK50 x-stiff and loved how the shaft felt but it wasnt in my Ping G400 LST. Anyone have thoughts on a good lighter x-stiff shaft? Ive read on here about the Graphite Design AD IZ 5x, Kuro Kage tini, Atmos Red etc... But see if anyone had some feedback before I pulled the trigger on anything.
  • Krt22Krt22 Members Posts: 6,504 ✭✭
    edited Mar 14, 2019 2:41pm #29
    DaRiz wrote:


    I was in this situation. Self-fit for the past few years, 105-112 mph swing speed, always had more success with X shafts, they always seemed to go straighter for me. BUT I always felt like I had to really gear up to hit it. On cold days, and in early/late in the year, I was more inconsistent but attributed that to not being in "mid season form". Fact of the matter is I probably couldn't swing fast enough in the cold to load the shaft properly. This year I decided to get fit as my driver was only going about 250-260 even though I was crushing it. Old guys were out driving me with visibly slower speeds.



    I went from:



    Ping G 9* Speeder 757 X-stiff (77g low launch) D1

    to

    TS3 8.5* Kiyoshi Purple 75 stiff (79g high launch) D4



    Down in flex, up in launch, up slightly shaft weight and swing weight, and down in loft. You would think that going down in flex and up in launch that I would be hitting the ball super high (I was already a high ball hitter even with the 757 in X), but it was the opposite. By having the correct weight and flex, I was able to load the shaft properly which lowered my trajectory. I was swinging my 757 X at 105mph and the Kiyoshi Purple at 112mph. The softer shaft alone got me tons of ball speed and yardage. Having a well-fit shaft also enabled me to use a low spin head, instead of a head with max forgiveness, which got me even more yards. My strategy had been to use a super forgiving head with a super stiff shaft to kill the spin, but that was not ideal for me and actually backfired and produced way too much spin, even though I was very accurate with it.



    Stats were something like:



    Gamer:

    105 swing speed, 150 ball speed, 120 ft height, 260 carry 270 total (on my absolutely best, not sharing my avgs) playing a FADE

    New Driver:

    112 swing speed, 160 ball speed, 75 ft height, 270 carry 300 total (on my averages!) playing a DRAW



    note: I did nothing to go from a fade to a draw other than the shaft change. I typically play a draw in all my clubs except driver, which happens to be my only club that was X flex, you do the math..



    Bottom line: stiffer shafts do not always mean lower launch and less spin, and swing speed does not always dictate shaft flex. Check your ego, going down in flex gave me more swing speed and ball speed. Find a softer shaft you can control and you might be pleasantly surprised.




    And I am the exact opposite. I always knew I was sort of border line, so played slightly softer shafts, (foolishly) listening to the "play the softest shaft you can control". I played an ADDI 6X (known to play soft) and soft stepped modus 120X (also known to be soft). My miss is an over draw with irons and sometimes a hook/block with driver.



    With how I load the shaft early, both of those shafts simply don't work with my swing. I sense the shaft loading early and head lagging behind and then try to save it with my hands. This not only introduced excess curve but also ultimately slowed me down since if I went after it harder, I would miss more left and thus try to steer it the next time. I never really got up there too much swing speed wise, so never thought I was simply over-powering the shaft.



    Ended up with a speeder 757X in driver and oban CT115X in the irons. Both are much stiffer in the handle section so I don't sense the load as much and thus keep the face more square. More active tip to promote launch since I'm no longer trying to save it with my hands. I can now go after it and not fear the big left miss, so I'm actually swinging the club faster. I was 106-109 with the ADDI, currently can get the 757X up to 113 with nothing really slower than 110. 6I is similar, was swinging my gamers 90-92, now can peak at 95-96. Carrying a little fall off fade 275+ instead of a low over-draw/hook 250ish.



    Going purely by flex at some arbitrary speed doesn't really work for me, much more important to find the right profile for your swing/tempo.
  • mizunotpzmizunotpz Members Posts: 171 ✭✭
    Stuart G. wrote:


    Sorry, don't listen to anyone that tells you you should or should not get that shaft just based on the swing speed. Swing speed only gives a possible starting point in the fitting process, nothing more.



    I know it's winter but if it's a demo, any way you can actually demo it to test how it feels and performs for you? Even indoors on a LM would get you the answers you need. That's the only way to tell



    But also keep in mind that if it really is that good of a price, it might be worth it to get the club even if you have to change shafts to get the most out of it. It's really not that hard or expensive to convert an older shaft you've used and still have (and know works) to use it in the new head.


    Thank you Stuart G, you always give great answers. I see this as a good deal combined with an interesting experiment and try different things. There is no good fitter in my area, I know since I been to both of them and wasnt happy. They only wanted to sell me a new club, not to help into a good club for me. So if this shaft doesnt work it wont be that hard to find another shaft and sell this one or trade with someone.



    Do you remember the old V2 shaft? Only x-stiff I tried, but if I remember correctly that was a shaft with a stiffer profile than this Diamana blue Im looking at. I also heard that the modern version of Diamana blues has a softer profile than the original Diamana blueboard. But dont know if thats correct?
  • rgk5rgk5 rgk5(OLB) Members Posts: 3,575 ✭✭
    Stuart G. wrote:

    rgk5 wrote:

    mizunotpz wrote:

    ian-500 wrote:


    You'll be fine with that shaft. I've hovered between 100 - 110 for years now and have always played x-flex shafts, in nearly all clubs.....just more confidence to go after it image/smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />


    haha, thats what Im thinking. Trying to find more fairways this season. Thanks for your input. If you never try youll never find out.




    There is a huge difference between 100 and 110 mph. At 102 you are pushing yourself with the Diamana +. A consistent and smooth 105+ would be better or a lighter shaft like the VA Composites Raijin 44 in X flex. Callaway's extensive robot and low handicap swing tests determined that shaft weight is much more important than flex.




    Yes, there are exceptions but generally weight is much more important than flex. But there is no way to know or even guess at what point the OP will be 'pushing' it or not.



    A corollary to flex not being generally as important is that there is no ideal or right or wrong amount of loading in a shaft. There is nothing wrong with not getting a certain amount or very much loading in a shaft if it happens to be "too stiff" compared to what most people expect - as long as the feel doesn't cause problems with the swing. And that's where the exceptions come to play. And there certainly are people who have to get a certain feel out of the shaft in order to get good results. For those people too stiff and too soft are very important things that need to be avoided.



    But just because some people have that problem and might push themselves too much when they get a shaft that feels too stiff doesn't mean everyone will. Lots of folks can still continue to put a good consistent swing on the shaft even if it might be considered too stiff by some others. And even for those that do, the point at which it becomes too stiff is going to be different for everyone.



    In fact, I think it was Sneed who couldn't stand to feel ANY give or loading in the shaft and made them as stiff as he possibly could.




    That is exactly why asking to be "fit" on golf forum is a fool's errand. I based my opinion based on seeing hundreds of golfers trying drivers each year for the last 16 years and generally my observation is in the ball park but not 100%. He really should see a good fitting salon because as mentioned, shaft loading is critical as is weight.
    Cobra F8+, 10.5*, VA Composites Raijin 44 F2
    Cobra F8 3-4 wood 15.5*, VA Composites Raijin 44 F3

    Cobra F8 5-6 wood, Tensei Blue A
    Callaway V Sole 7-wood, Bassara R
    Callaway Rogue Pro 5-AW, Recoil 95 F3
    Ping Glide 1.0 55*, CFS Wedge flex

    Ping Glide 2.0 Stealth 58*, Alta 70 R

    Ping Zing 2 TR 34", Flatso 1.0 grip
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