All Things Michigan Golf....the Mulligan (MOD EDIT: NO POLITICS, NO COVID-19, NO ECONOMICS)

[timbo08]

> @"Timbo Slice" said:

> > @timbo08 said:

> > > @njspence said:

> > > > @timbo08 said:

> > > > So here's a question for the group. We are doing a overnight trip in September to play Arcadia and the Bear. We are playing the Bear Saturday Afternoon and Twilight at Arcadia at 4pm on Sunday.

> > > >

> > > > We are staying in TC at the Holiday Inn. Playing the South course is out of some folks budget. So if you had to fit a round in Sunday morning, between TC and Arcadia where would you go? Right now I am seeing a place called PineCroft that I have never heard of on the way, also Interlochen, which I haven't really heard much about. Outside of that, I am pretty clueless to that area as far as courses go. Any suggestions?

> > >

> > > Me personally, I cancel the bear sat afternoon and play the south course. I have never played a round in under 5:40 at the bear. If I remember it was always around $140 or so, so what’s the difference to play the south course instead

> >

> > Thanks for the advice but we got the Bear @ 3pm on a Twilight rate for $55 for 18 which I thought was solid. Otherwise, I would 100% agree with you and be playing the South course.

>

> You can actually play Spruce Run @ GTR and play the Bear for $45 on replay rate to get it even cheaper. Spruce Run is pretty good, it just suffers being compared with a much better Wolverine and Bear on property.

 

Good to know, thanks!!

[Openwater22]

> @timbo08 said:

> > @Openwater22 said:

> > Pick one between PineCroft and Champion Hill. Both pretty good and budget friendly.

>

> They both looked pretty solid online and a decent price. We aren't looking for anything too crazy price wise or super nice and those both seemed to fit the bill but sometimes pics make the courses look better than they are. Would you do those over Spruce Run @ Grand Traverse for $70?

Flip a coin, but if it was my decision...Champion Hill.

 

 

[Go_Blue!]

> @"3 Jack Par" said:

> > @swizbeatz said:

> > Will be interesting if they build a third course, I’d never play the loop on a trip there.

> >

> Same. I played it one direction before an outing I went on back in May, and had it scheduled to play it the other direction on the way home, but we cancelled the second round (partly due to predicted bad weather, but we cancelled that day and were going to find somewhere else to play on Sunday instead if it wasn't for that). It's just not worth the $135 or whatever it is to me. I find the green complexes to be really over the top, and on at least 3 of the last 5 holes, where they had the holes cut was basically impossible to get it anywhere near the hole coming from the direction we were. There was one in particular that was in bit of a bowl that runs off the back of the green (from our direction) where it was simply not possible to stop the ball on the green (coming the other direction, it would be uphill and you'd have a backstop, so it would be a pretty easy location). There was another where I was 50 yards from the flag and in the fairway after my tee shot, and it took 4 shots to get on the green from there, plus a putt to get it in the hole, and I can't point to a single shot I hit that I'd consider bad.

> Maybe it would make more sense if I played it a bunch of times, and got to know the contours and where to hit it and where not to miss on every hole, but in a resort type of setting, most people will never do that, and it just doesn't seem like requiring that much local knowledge is right for that kind of setting.

>

>

 

My exact feeling. Unique, but not worth the coin. Too many greens where I felt the same; quality of shot didnt always matter.

[jefftomahawk]

Can't wait til the weekend & next week, outing Saturday (devils ridge) & Sunday (heather hills), then to the cottage Monday for relax for a week in Harrison,

we'll play The Tamaracks, The Quest & Forest dunes :p

 

 

[ernordst]

All The Loop hates sounds like golfers who have been overly conditioned to boring, everything-is-right-in-front-of-you american style golf. The best part of The Loop is that it is interesting, thought-provoking golf! If you want to score, you have to think! As golf moved away from the links land this has been lost but make no mistake, this is how the game is SUPPOSED to be played!

[Go_Blue!]

> @ernordst said:

> All The Loop hates sounds like golfers who have been overly conditioned to boring, everything-is-right-in-front-of-you american style golf. The best part of The Loop is that it is interesting, thought-provoking golf! If you want to score, you have to think! As golf moved away from the links land this has been lost but make no mistake, this is how the game is SUPPOSED to be played!

 

Lol...ok.

[Openwater22]

> @ernordst said:

> All The Loop hates sounds like golfers who have been overly conditioned to boring, everything-is-right-in-front-of-you american style golf. The best part of The Loop is that it is interesting, thought-provoking golf! If you want to score, you have to think! As golf moved away from the links land this has been lost but make no mistake, this is how the game is SUPPOSED to be played!

 

Sorry, wrong. I was a member at Kingsley Club for like 8 years and love that place. It's everything the Loop should be. And I love links golf, Royal County Down is #1 on my personal list and Turnberry is #3. And I love some of Doaks other designs, Ballyneal and Dismal River especially. So no, I'm not overly conditioned, just think the loop is an average gimmick. Glad you like it, hope you get to play it lots.

 

[JeffreySpicoli]

> @Openwater22 said:

> > @JeffreySpicoli said:

> > We have a family trip to Petoskey coming up. I’d like to play two or three rounds. I’ll play alone unless I get paired up.

> >

> > I’m thinking Bay Harbor and Belvedere.

> >

> > Other thoughts? Suggestions?

> Belvedere is really good, but doesn't play anywhere close to the same as the Loop. Belvedere is a 1920 something parkland style course, Loop is a modern faux links style course. Others in the area:

> Links/Quarry at Boyne, True North, Birchwood, Hidden River, Heather at Boyne, Walloon Lake CC, Little Traverse Bay.

>

 

Out of the privates, which one would you choose? (I’m leaning toward True North.)

[reperna]

I am in the middle of the best run of good golf ever in my life. In 10 days i will have played Old course at indianwood, eagle eye, timbers ridge, red run, cherry creek, then the orchards. cant ask for much more than that!

[odshot68]

> @"Timbo Slice" said:

> Bay Harbor with Quarry or Links as one of the nines is amazing but super pricey. The Links is

 

> @"Timbo Slice" said:

> Bay Harbor with Quarry or Links as one of the nines is amazing but super pricey. The Links is best followed by Quarry then Preserve. I played Quarry and Preserve and it is currently my #1 golf experience in Michigan.

> I Never played Belvedere but have heard and read nothing but positive reviews. In my eyes it probably plays a lot like the Loop, which some people find boring. In Petoskey any Boyne course or a close by Black Lake would be my first choices. I even stayed at Boyne Mountain last year with family for the water park and drove to Shanty Creek to play Cedar River one of the days which was very good. If it were me I would rank top 5 Petoskey courses....

> 1. Bay Harbor

> 2. Black Lake

> 3. Any Boyne course (Heather or A Hills)

> 4. Belvedere

> 5. Dunmaglas (not worth $100, but easy to get on cheaper)

>

 

I personally didn’t care for Belvedere at all. I really like black lake and bay harbor is great on links and quarry. The other boyne courses are just okay. I absolutely love true north.

[odshot68]

> @"Timbo Slice" said:

> Bay Harbor with Quarry or Links as one of the nines is amazing but super pricey. The Links is best followed by Quarry then Preserve. I played Quarry and Preserve and it is currently my #1 golf experience in Michigan.

> I Never played Belvedere but have heard and read nothing but positive reviews. In my eyes it probably plays a lot like the Loop, which some people find boring. In Petoskey any Boyne course or a close by Black Lake would be my first choices. I even stayed at Boyne Mountain last year with family for the water park and drove to Shanty Creek to play Cedar River one of the days which was very good. If it were me I would rank top 5 Petoskey courses....

> 1. Bay Harbor

> 2. Black Lake

> 3. Any Boyne course (Heather or A Hills)

> 4. Belvedere

> 5. Dunmaglas (not worth $100, but easy to get on cheaper)

>

 

> @"Timbo Slice" said:

> Bay Harbor with Quarry or Links as one of the nines is amazing but super pricey. The Links is best followed by Quarry then Preserve. I played Quarry and Preserve and it is currently my #1 golf experience in Michigan.

> I Never played Belvedere but have heard and read nothing but positive reviews. In my eyes it probably plays a lot like the Loop, which some people find boring. In Petoskey any Boyne course or a close by Black Lake would be my first choices. I even stayed at Boyne Mountain last year with family for the water park and drove to Shanty Creek to play Cedar River one of the days which was very good. If it were me I would rank top 5 Petoskey courses....

> 1. Bay Harbor

> 2. Black Lake

> 3. Any Boyne course (Heather or A Hills)

> 4. Belvedere

> 5. Dunmaglas (not worth $100, but easy to get on cheaper)

>

 

> @"Timbo Slice" said:

> Bay Harbor with Quarry or Links as one of the nines is amazing but super pricey. The Links is best followed by Quarry then Preserve. I played Quarry and Preserve and it is currently my #1 golf experience in Michigan.

> I Never played Belvedere but have heard and read nothing but positive reviews. In my eyes it probably plays a lot like the Loop, which some people find boring. In Petoskey any Boyne course or a close by Black Lake would be my first choices. I even stayed at Boyne Mountain last year with family for the water park and drove to Shanty Creek to play Cedar River one of the days which was very good. If it were me I would rank top 5 Petoskey courses....

> 1. Bay Harbor

> 2. Black Lake

> 3. Any Boyne course (Heather or A Hills)

> 4. Belvedere

> 5. Dunmaglas (not worth $100, but easy to get on cheaper)

>

 

> @"Timbo Slice" said:

> Bay Harbor with Quarry or Links as one of the nines is amazing but super pricey. The Links is best followed by Quarry then Preserve. I played Quarry and Preserve and it is currently my #1 golf experience in Michigan.

> I Never played Belvedere but have heard and read nothing but positive reviews. In my eyes it probably plays a lot like the Loop, which some people find boring. In Petoskey any Boyne course or a close by Black Lake would be my first choices. I even stayed at Boyne Mountain last year with family for the water park and drove to Shanty Creek to play Cedar River one of the days which was very good. If it were me I would rank top 5 Petoskey courses....

> 1. Bay Harbor

> 2. Black Lake

> 3. Any Boyne course (Heather or A Hills)

> 4. Belvedere

> 5. Dunmaglas (not worth $100, but easy to get on cheaper)

>

 

> @"Timbo Slice" said:

> Bay Harbor with Quarry or Links as one of the nines is amazing but super pricey. The Links is best followed by Quarry then Preserve. I played Quarry and Preserve and it is currently my #1 golf experience in Michigan.

> I Never played Belvedere but have heard and read nothing but positive reviews. In my eyes it probably plays a lot like the Loop, which some people find boring. In Petoskey any Boyne course or a close by Black Lake would be my first choices. I even stayed at Boyne Mountain last year with family for the water park and drove to Shanty Creek to play Cedar River one of the days which was very good. If it were me I would rank top 5 Petoskey courses....

> 1. Bay Harbor

> 2. Black Lake

> 3. Any Boyne course (Heather or A Hills)

> 4. Belvedere

> 5. Dunmaglas (not worth $100, but easy to get on cheaper)

>

 

> @"Timbo Slice" said:

> Bay Harbor with Quarry or Links as one of the nines is amazing but super pricey. The Links is best followed by Quarry then Preserve. I played Quarry and Preserve and it is currently my #1 golf experience in Michigan.

> I Never played Belvedere but have heard and read nothing but positive reviews. In my eyes it probably plays a lot like the Loop, which some people find boring. In Petoskey any Boyne course or a close by Black Lake would be my first choices. I even stayed at Boyne Mountain last year with family for the water park and drove to Shanty Creek to play Cedar River one of the days which was very good. If it were me I would rank top 5 Petoskey courses....

> 1. Bay Harbor

> 2. Black Lake

> 3. Any Boyne course (Heather or A Hills)

> 4. Belvedere

> 5. Dunmaglas (not worth $100, but easy to get on cheaper)

>

 

> @"Timbo Slice" said:

> Bay Harbor with Quarry or Links as one of the nines is amazing but super pricey. The Links is best followed by Quarry then Preserve. I played Quarry and Preserve and it is currently my #1 golf experience in Michigan.

> I Never played Belvedere but have heard and read nothing but positive reviews. In my eyes it probably plays a lot like the Loop, which some people find boring. In Petoskey any Boyne course or a close by Black Lake would be my first choices. I even stayed at Boyne Mountain last year with family for the water park and drove to Shanty Creek to play Cedar River one of the days which was very good. If it were me I would rank top 5 Petoskey courses....

> 1. Bay Harbor

> 2. Black Lake

> 3. Any Boyne course (Heather or A Hills)

> 4. Belvedere

> 5. Dunmaglas (not worth $100, but easy to get on cheaper)

>

 

I personally didn’t care for Belvedere at all. I really like black lake and bay harbor is great on links and quarry. I loved true north as well.

[odshot68]

> @"Timbo Slice" said:

> Bay Harbor with Quarry or Links as one of the nines is amazing but super pricey. The Links is best followed by Quarry then Preserve. I played Quarry and Preserve and it is currently my #1 golf experience in Michigan.

> I Never played Belvedere but have heard and read nothing but positive reviews. In my eyes it probably plays a lot like the Loop, which some people find boring. In Petoskey any Boyne course or a close by Black Lake would be my first choices. I even stayed at Boyne Mountain last year with family for the water park and drove to Shanty Creek to play Cedar River one of the days which was very good. If it were me I would rank top 5 Petoskey courses....

> 1. Bay Harbor

> 2. Black Lake

> 3. Any Boyne course (Heather or A Hills)

> 4. Belvedere

> 5. Dunmaglas (not worth $100, but easy to get on cheaper)

>

 

> @"Timbo Slice" said:

> Bay Harbor with Quarry or Links as one of the nines is amazing but super pricey. The Links is best followed by Quarry then Preserve. I played Quarry and Preserve and it is currently my #1 golf experience in Michigan.

> I Never played Belvedere but have heard and read nothing but positive reviews. In my eyes it probably plays a lot like the Loop, which some people find boring. In Petoskey any Boyne course or a close by Black Lake would be my first choices. I even stayed at Boyne Mountain last year with family for the water park and drove to Shanty Creek to play Cedar River one of the days which was very good. If it were me I would rank top 5 Petoskey courses....

> 1. Bay Harbor

> 2. Black Lake

> 3. Any Boyne course (Heather or A Hills)

> 4. Belvedere

> 5. Dunmaglas (not worth $100, but easy to get on cheaper)

>

 

> @"Timbo Slice" said:

> Bay Harbor with Quarry or Links as one of the nines is amazing but super pricey. The Links is best followed by Quarry then Preserve. I played Quarry and Preserve and it is currently my #1 golf experience in Michigan.

> I Never played Belvedere but have heard and read nothing but positive reviews. In my eyes it probably plays a lot like the Loop, which some people find boring. In Petoskey any Boyne course or a close by Black Lake would be my first choices. I even stayed at Boyne Mountain last year with family for the water park and drove to Shanty Creek to play Cedar River one of the days which was very good. If it were me I would rank top 5 Petoskey courses....

> 1. Bay Harbor

> 2. Black Lake

> 3. Any Boyne course (Heather or A Hills)

> 4. Belvedere

> 5. Dunmaglas (not worth $100, but easy to get on cheaper)

>

 

> @"Timbo Slice" said:

> Bay Harbor with Quarry or Links as one of the nines is amazing but super pricey. The Links is best followed by Quarry then Preserve. I played Quarry and Preserve and it is currently my #1 golf experience in Michigan.

> I Never played Belvedere but have heard and read nothing but positive reviews. In my eyes it probably plays a lot like the Loop, which some people find boring. In Petoskey any Boyne course or a close by Black Lake would be my first choices. I even stayed at Boyne Mountain last year with family for the water park and drove to Shanty Creek to play Cedar River one of the days which was very good. If it were me I would rank top 5 Petoskey courses....

> 1. Bay Harbor

> 2. Black Lake

> 3. Any Boyne course (Heather or A Hills)

> 4. Belvedere

> 5. Dunmaglas (not worth $100, but easy to get on cheaper)

>

 

> @"Timbo Slice" said:

> Bay Harbor with Quarry or Links as one of the nines is amazing but super pricey. The Links is best followed by Quarry then Preserve. I played Quarry and Preserve and it is currently my #1 golf experience in Michigan.

> I Never played Belvedere but have heard and read nothing but positive reviews. In my eyes it probably plays a lot like the Loop, which some people find boring. In Petoskey any Boyne course or a close by Black Lake would be my first choices. I even stayed at Boyne Mountain last year with family for the water park and drove to Shanty Creek to play Cedar River one of the days which was very good. If it were me I would rank top 5 Petoskey courses....

> 1. Bay Harbor

> 2. Black Lake

> 3. Any Boyne course (Heather or A Hills)

> 4. Belvedere

> 5. Dunmaglas (not worth $100, but easy to get on cheaper)

>

 

> @"Timbo Slice" said:

> Bay Harbor with Quarry or Links as one of the nines is amazing but super pricey. The Links is best followed by Quarry then Preserve. I played Quarry and Preserve and it is currently my #1 golf experience in Michigan.

> I Never played Belvedere but have heard and read nothing but positive reviews. In my eyes it probably plays a lot like the Loop, which some people find boring. In Petoskey any Boyne course or a close by Black Lake would be my first choices. I even stayed at Boyne Mountain last year with family for the water park and drove to Shanty Creek to play Cedar River one of the days which was very good. If it were me I would rank top 5 Petoskey courses....

> 1. Bay Harbor

> 2. Black Lake

> 3. Any Boyne course (Heather or A Hills)

> 4. Belvedere

> 5. Dunmaglas (not worth $100, but easy to get on cheaper)

>

 

> @"Timbo Slice" said:

> Bay Harbor with Quarry or Links as one of the nines is amazing but super pricey. The Links is best followed by Quarry then Preserve. I played Quarry and Preserve and it is currently my #1 golf experience in Michigan.

> I Never played Belvedere but have heard and read nothing but positive reviews. In my eyes it probably plays a lot like the Loop, which some people find boring. In Petoskey any Boyne course or a close by Black Lake would be my first choices. I even stayed at Boyne Mountain last year with family for the water park and drove to Shanty Creek to play Cedar River one of the days which was very good. If it were me I would rank top 5 Petoskey courses....

> 1. Bay Harbor

> 2. Black Lake

> 3. Any Boyne course (Heather or A Hills)

> 4. Belvedere

> 5. Dunmaglas (not worth $100, but easy to get on cheaper)

>

 

I personally didn’t care for Belvedere at all. I really like black lake and bay harbor is great on links and quarry. I loved true north as well.

[swizbeatz]

Cocktails on a Tuesday OD!? That’s ok, me too

[knickerbocker]

> @ernordst said:

> All The Loop hates sounds like golfers who have been overly conditioned to boring, everything-is-right-in-front-of-you american style golf. The best part of The Loop is that it is interesting, thought-provoking golf! If you want to score, you have to think! As golf moved away from the links land this has been lost but make no mistake, this is how the game is SUPPOSED to be played!

 

I don't hate the Loop. I just don't love it.

I love Links golf. I will say it plays more like true Links golf compared to any course I have played in Michigan. But at the same time, it is an average Links course that would cost 50 pounds to play in the UK. There are few memorable holes and a number that are sub-par. I would play it more if it was $60 - $75, but have no interest at $150.

 

 

[swizbeatz]

I’m sure I’m sour on it from playing it the first full year it was open. If the greens soften up a bit it wouldn’t be nearly as bad. The conditions when I played it weren’t real golf.

[3_Jack_Par]

> @ernordst said:

> All The Loop hates sounds like golfers who have been overly conditioned to boring, everything-is-right-in-front-of-you american style golf. The best part of The Loop is that it is interesting, thought-provoking golf! If you want to score, you have to think! As golf moved away from the links land this has been lost but make no mistake, this is how the game is SUPPOSED to be played!

 

Yeah, no. Good links golf is awesome, and my favorite courses that I've played are mostly links or links adjacent. Royal Dornoch is my favorite course in the world, and the Bandon courses were a phenomenal experience. Closer to home, Kingsley is my favorite course in the state. Those are all wonderfully designed fair tests of golf. The Loop is a bit of a gimmick, and Doak went a little nuts around the greens. There are some fun elements, but to me, it doesn't hold my interest like some of the others I mentioned.

[Openwater22]

Who's playing in the Mid-Am?

[3_Jack_Par]

> @Openwater22 said:

> Who's playing in the Mid-Am?

I am, as usual. Spending the weekend beforehand in TC. No golf planned up there in the early part of the trip -- just lots of awesome food and drinks. Are you playing again this year?

 

[ernordst]

> @Openwater22 said:

> > @ernordst said:

> > All The Loop hates sounds like golfers who have been overly conditioned to boring, everything-is-right-in-front-of-you american style golf. The best part of The Loop is that it is interesting, thought-provoking golf! If you want to score, you have to think! As golf moved away from the links land this has been lost but make no mistake, this is how the game is SUPPOSED to be played!

>

> Sorry, wrong. I was a member at Kingsley Club for like 8 years and love that place. It's everything the Loop should be. And I love links golf, Royal County Down is #1 on my personal list and Turnberry is #3. And I love some of Doaks other designs, Ballyneal and Dismal River especially. So no, I'm not overly conditioned, just think the loop is an average gimmick. Glad you like it, hope you get to play it lots.

>

 

> @"3 Jack Par" said:

> > @ernordst said:

> > All The Loop hates sounds like golfers who have been overly conditioned to boring, everything-is-right-in-front-of-you american style golf. The best part of The Loop is that it is interesting, thought-provoking golf! If you want to score, you have to think! As golf moved away from the links land this has been lost but make no mistake, this is how the game is SUPPOSED to be played!

>

> Yeah, no. Good links golf is awesome, and my favorite courses that I've played are mostly links or links adjacent. Royal Dornoch is my favorite course in the world, and the Bandon courses were a phenomenal experience. Closer to home, Kingsley is my favorite course in the state. Those are all wonderfully designed fair tests of golf. The Loop is a bit of a gimmick, and Doak went a little nuts around the greens. There are some fun elements, but to me, it doesn't hold my interest like some of the others I mentioned.

 

I really don’t understand how you can love those courses and not be a fan of The Loop? Kingsley actually brings up a good comparison, I think there are more “unfair” elements out there! One green is probably the most severe green I’ve ever played, especially in firm and fast conditions, if you are above the hole good luck keeping it on the surface! There are several pins on 8 where unless you use the slopes you can’t get anywhere close! And if you are talking unfair holes, 9 would be the textbook example, you have to hit a great shot to even keep your ball on the green and if you miss the green you’re dead! And I love Kingsley, played there a ton and wouldn’t change any of it! And to me The Loop is in the same class as Kingsley, which is the second best course in Michigan behind only Crystal Downs which itself is occasionally referred to as unfair, which again really just means you have to think you’re way around!

 

[Openwater22]

> @"3 Jack Par" said:

> > @Openwater22 said:

> > Who's playing in the Mid-Am?

> I am, as usual. Spending the weekend beforehand in TC. No golf planned up there in the early part of the trip -- just lots of awesome food and drinks. Are you playing again this year?

>

Yes, Super Senior division.

 

[knickerbocker]

I am skipping mid-am again. Too much kids stuff going on to get away. Maybe next year!

[swizbeatz]

Not signed up but I’d like to play, will figure it out next week.

[3_Jack_Par]

> @ernordst said:

>

> I really don’t understand how you can love those courses and not be a fan of The Loop? Kingsley actually brings up a good comparison, I think there are more “unfair” elements out there! One green is probably the most severe green I’ve ever played, especially in firm and fast conditions, if you are above the hole good luck keeping it on the surface! There are several pins on 8 where unless you use the slopes you can’t get anywhere close! And if you are talking unfair holes, 9 would be the textbook example, you have to hit a great shot to even keep your ball on the green and if you miss the green you’re dead! And I love Kingsley, played there a ton and wouldn’t change any of it! And to me The Loop is in the same class as Kingsley, which is the second best course in Michigan behind only Crystal Downs which itself is occasionally referred to as unfair, which again really just means you have to think you’re way around!

>

Pretty easy -- those courses are good and the Loop isn't in the same league as them, especially for the price. All the holes and shots you describe on those other courses require good to great shots and/or proper placement of tee shots to have a chance to get close, and if you miss in the wrong place, you're penalized. The specific examples I've given of problems with the design of the Loop are areas where when you are playing from the fairway, you have no chance to get close, and you're punished for being in the proper position for your approach. That is simply poor design and/or a failure to move hole locations from day to day to fit the direction that the course is playing (it was before Memorial Day, and it's possible they didn't move the pins from the previous day, but the holes I am thinking of were late in the round, so it's not like they didn't have time to move them)

 

[Go_Blue!]

> @"3 Jack Par" said:

> > @ernordst said:

> >

> > I really don’t understand how you can love those courses and not be a fan of The Loop? Kingsley actually brings up a good comparison, I think there are more “unfair” elements out there! One green is probably the most severe green I’ve ever played, especially in firm and fast conditions, if you are above the hole good luck keeping it on the surface! There are several pins on 8 where unless you use the slopes you can’t get anywhere close! And if you are talking unfair holes, 9 would be the textbook example, you have to hit a great shot to even keep your ball on the green and if you miss the green you’re dead! And I love Kingsley, played there a ton and wouldn’t change any of it! And to me The Loop is in the same class as Kingsley, which is the second best course in Michigan behind only Crystal Downs which itself is occasionally referred to as unfair, which again really just means you have to think you’re way around!

> >

> Pretty easy -- those courses are good and the Loop isn't in the same league as them, especially for the price. All the holes and shots you describe on those other courses require good to great shots and/or proper placement of tee shots to have a chance to get close, and if you miss in the wrong place, you're penalized. The specific examples I've given of problems with the design of the Loop are areas where when you are playing from the fairway, you have no chance to get close, and you're punished for being in the proper position for your approach. That is simply poor design and/or a failure to move hole locations from day to day to fit the direction that the course is playing (it was before Memorial Day, and it's possible they didn't move the pins from the previous day, but the holes I am thinking of were late in the round, so it's not like they didn't have time to move them)

>

 

Exactly this. Too many times I was in the fairway only to hit what I thought was a good shot and all of sudden I'm off the green needing a solid chip to save par when I'm thinking I have a decent look at birdie. And then there is the price...

 

Played Stoatin Brae this year in May during my annual Gull Lake trip. Would play that course 10 times out of 10 over the Loop. Better layout and was only $55.

[3_Jack_Par]

> @swizbeatz said:

> Not signed up but I’d like to play, will figure it out next week.

 

Do it -- bring the stripe show north...

[Timbo Slice]

https://amp.detroitnews.com/amp/1899001001

[joekloo]

Played Sasakatoon in GR today. They are adding another 9 to the current 36. Interesting with so many other courses struggling around town.

[Timbo Slice]

> @joekloo said:

> Played Sasakatoon in GR today. They are adding another 9 to the current 36. Interesting with so many other courses struggling around town.

 

Wow that's awesome news. I consider Saskatoon and Maple Hill my home courses. I play there for practice every Sunday unless I'm traveling around state to courses that I haven't played. Gold is most fun. Blue and White are most challenging. Red is fun but really easy.

[odshot68]

> @joekloo said:

> Played Sasakatoon in GR today. They are adding another 9 to the current 36. Interesting with so many other courses struggling around town.

 

Is it going to be another executive nine like the other 4?

[Timbo Slice]

> @odshot68 said:

> > @joekloo said:

> > Played Sasakatoon in GR today. They are adding another 9 to the current 36. Interesting with so many other courses struggling around town.

>

> Is it going to be another executive nine like the other 4?

Saskatoon doesn't have executive 9 courses