Career Advice

[radiman]

So, long story short, I left my job of ten years to take a management position at a different company. Similar industry but different field (hardware support and internal IT to a managed service provider). After 2 days in, I realized that I was brought in to fix a mess. I think this place grew from a very small outfit into a decent sized one without changing any of their processes. As management I decided to meet with everyone individually. It was a rude awakening. Everyone Hates it there. They all had nothing but bad things to say about the place. Also, having not been in management or worked as a MSP, I'm feeling very out of place. I have now been there 3 weeks and it hasn't improved. I'm not sleeping, I'm stressed out when I get home, and feel like all of my free time is spent worrying about going into work the next day.

 

It so turns out that my old employer wants me back. I feel like I had it made before. Thing is I'll be moving back about 25% in pay (the new place paid a lot to win me over). I just don't know if my happiness is worth that much to me. We were doing fine before. Not really making a ton, but making enough to live comfortably. My knowledge base will not expand a while lot in my old job, but I'd be comfortable.

 

Had anyone else went down in pay to have a more stress free life?

 

 

 

[Uncle Chunk]

Yes I Did! And it was one of the best things Ive ever done...I'm a better person, dad, son, husband and friend for it...I hated that job and I was making very good money for my area.

[radiman]

Yes I Did! And it was one of the best things Ive ever done...I'm a better person, dad, son, husband and friend for it...I hated that job and I was making very good money for my area.

 

What kind of money are we talking about? Don't need to throw out numbers. I'm just curious how big of a financial impact it was.

[Uncle Chunk]

A little more than you're lookin at...

[Lance S]

I recently took a job with less pay but better benefits and i'm much happier. I didn't know how unhappy I was until I took my new job

[Wriggles]

GO BACK! You'll be much unhappier in the new job as time goes on. If the old place wants you back, lucky you.

[goondawg]

Stress and constant worry can wreck a lot more than not having a few extra dollars.

[golfandfishing]

I just made a change as well, lateral move salary wise with actually a smaller opportunity for quarterly bonuses. The quality of life change is indescribable. At full bonus EOY I'm probably leaving a potential $10k on the table. It matters not - immediate I began sleeping better, staying up later at night with my wife (I just wanted to go to bed weeknights to get the day over with), sleeping later on weekends, I'm much more receptive to after work activities like dinner out, a happy hour and even occasionally hitting some golf balls. If you can do it, go back, quality of life is immeasurable. If we're talking a life changing amount like $50k a year you have a real debate in your hands. If it's a grand or so a month that just isn't that much compared with hating your life.

[radiman]

I just made a change as well, lateral move salary wise with actually a smaller opportunity for quarterly bonuses. The quality of life change is indescribable. At full bonus EOY I'm probably leaving a potential $10k on the table. It matters not - immediate I began sleeping better, staying up later at night with my wife (I just wanted to go to bed weeknights to get the day over with), sleeping later on weekends, I'm much more receptive to after work activities like dinner out, a happy hour and even occasionally hitting some golf balls. If you can do it, go back, quality of life is immeasurable. If we're talking a life changing amount like $50k a year you have a real debate in your hands. If it's a grand or so a month that just isn't that much compared with hating your life.

 

Its borderline. It equates to about $1500 extra net each month. It would be pretty nice. But, we were doing alright before though.

[Argonne69]

Do you think you can fix the mess? 'Probably hard to tell after a few days. People hate too much process, but they also don't like working in a place that has little process, as it generally is chaos. You've talked to the people, and probably have some idea what irks them the most. Tackle that first. Lather. Rinse. Repeat. Once you, and your coworkers begin to see improvement, they'll likely get on board.

 

It's easy to run from a challenge, but if you do manage to improve the place, it'll be satisfying.

 

Of course, if the place is in a death spiral, run like h*ll. You're the pilot. Do you try to land the crippled jet, or do you eject?

[golfandfishing]

Yeah, that's a tough number to push aside. If you can fix the issues then it is worth staying. You need management/ownership to buy into and commit to a plan for change if you stay. It's a long term process, wholesale change of culture like that is a year and more in most cases. You MUST have support and commitment otherwise you will get chopped and have no fallback.

[Argonne69]

Yeah, that's a tough number to push aside. If you can fix the issues then it is worth staying. You need management/ownership to buy into and commit to a plan for change if you stay. It's a long term process, wholesale change of culture like that is a year and more in most cases. You MUST have support and commitment otherwise you will get chopped and have no fallback.

 

Agreed. OP should probably start with a small, achievable improvement. You'll quickly learn if management/ownership is fully committed to change, or only paying it lip service.

 

A series of small victories is better than trying to make major changes, as the long-term changes tend to get pushed aside for short-term needs.

[radiman]

Yeah, that's a tough number to push aside. If you can fix the issues then it is worth staying. You need management/ownership to buy into and commit to a plan for change if you stay. It's a long term process, wholesale change of culture like that is a year and more in most cases. You MUST have support and commitment otherwise you will get chopped and have no fallback.

 

Some of my ideas have already been shot down to some extent. I'm just not ready for this challenge. If I had been brought in as a tech and not management, it would be different, I could potentially grow into it. I was job hunting and decided that I was in a good spot and decided to stay put. They called me after I turned down a previous offer and offered me a bunch more money to get me. I just don't think I'm personally the right candidate for what they need. My confidence has been absolutely shaken. I just don't think I can be an effective leader at this point. I would feel guilty staying on for the paycheck.

[Argonne69]

Yeah, that's a tough number to push aside. If you can fix the issues then it is worth staying. You need management/ownership to buy into and commit to a plan for change if you stay. It's a long term process, wholesale change of culture like that is a year and more in most cases. You MUST have support and commitment otherwise you will get chopped and have no fallback.

 

Some of my ideas have already been shot down to some extent. I'm just not ready for this challenge. If I had been brought in as a tech and not management, it would be different, I could potentially grow into it. I was job hunting and decided that I was in a good spot and decided to stay put. They called me after I turned down a previous offer and offered me a bunch more money to get me. I just don't think I'm personally the right candidate for what they need. My confidence has been absolutely shaken. I just don't think I can be an effective leader at this point. I would feel guilty staying on for the paycheck.

 

So why do you think they called you back with an increased offer? They obviously see something in you that can affect change.

[Tcann32]

What industry are you in OP? I understand you said IT and management, just curious what industry as that can be a big part of the environment you've been put in.

 

My last job was similar to what you've described. Major growing pains and even though the people were actually great, it was like there was no actual path to take for any given situation and the way they had been doing things forever wasn't working, but they were not really all that open to change, which is necessary when you've doubled your business.

[highergr0und]

Go back to your old company. Staying is not an option from the way you're talking.

[radiman]

I told them today that it wasn't working out. I am going back and feel pretty bad about quitting right away. But, in the end, I feel like I want the right person for that job and it would have been pretty bad of me to string them along just to collect a larger paycheck.

 

Felt lost while working there and now feeling lousy for quitting. I've never been so stressed out as I am now.

[radiman]

What industry are you in OP? I understand you said IT and management, just curious what industry as that can be a big part of the environment you've been put in.

 

My last job was similar to what you've described. Major growing pains and even though the people were actually great, it was like there was no actual path to take for any given situation and the way they had been doing things forever wasn't working, but they were not really all that open to change, which is necessary when you've doubled your business.

 

Managed Services. They setup and maintained networks for small businesses.

[golfandfishing]

I told them today that it wasn't working out. I am going back and feel pretty bad about quitting right away. But, in the end, I feel like I want the right person for that job and it would have been pretty bad of me to string them along just to collect a larger paycheck.

 

Felt lost while working there and now feeling lousy for quitting. I've never been so stressed out as I am now.

 

Nothing to stress about now my friend, that job is in the past. That's business, you win some you lose some. You can go back to an environment that wants you there, welcome it. Stress not about quitting, it was obviously the right move.

[radiman]

I told them today that it wasn't working out. I am going back and feel pretty bad about quitting right away. But, in the end, I feel like I want the right person for that job and it would have been pretty bad of me to string them along just to collect a larger paycheck.

 

Felt lost while working there and now feeling lousy for quitting. I've never been so stressed out as I am now.

 

Nothing to stress about now my friend, that job is in the past. That's business, you win some you lose some. You can go back to an environment that wants you there, welcome it. Stress not about quitting, it was obviously the right move.

 

Thanks. I sure hope so. I guess I'm always kind of worried about everyone else and how it effects them. My stress was replaced with guilt. Nothing I can do but move forward I guess.

[Uncle Chunk]

Life is short, tomorrow is never guaranteed....why go through it unhappy. As much as we have to work hours wise, why put in the time if you're unhappy. My whole family and friends can tell a difference in me since I left my old place, it was making me a not so nice person and I didn't like who I was.

[teeitlow]

Good call, now you can get on with being a happier person, and by proxy your family and friends as well.

 

Don't feel guilty...it's a useless emotion.

 

-D

[radiman]

Good call, now you can get on with being a happier person, and by proxy your family and friends as well.

 

Don't feel guilty...it's a useless emotion.

 

-D

 

Thanks. I am actually feeling pretty good right now. Each hour that passes lifts a little more weight off my shoulders.

 

I asked my 8 year old what she thought about it. She smiled and told me that I should go back. She said I was a lot happier then. If my 8 year old was picking up on it, it must have been bad. I immediately felt better. Almost brought me to tears that she was so in tune to the situation. No child should have something so trivial as a worry point.

[braincramp52]

Life is way too short to work a miserable job no matter the money. You did the right thing.

[Bob Cat]

You have two employers who obviously think highly of you. I hope you negotiated some of that 25% back with the old employer before you returned as it sounds like you were in the drivers seat if they wanted you back.

Also, it sounds like you may have bitten off a little more than you could chew but don't be afraid to try it again in the future as that's how we grow and advance.

 

Good luck!

[highergr0und]

Man, it's not often that someone gets to learn a really valuable lesson like that without being left jobless or scrambling. Consider yourself lucky!!

 

Just don't let this stop you from looking to advance yourself. It's easy to become too used to a job and keep it for too long. I know because I've done it and am trying to get out of it now!! Identify skills you think you're lacking after that brief experience and work on them to prepare you for next time. And now you know the importance of interviewing a company just as much as they interview you.

[tocino]

I was the IT guy in my office before I left for a detail in another part of my agency. When I was due back my boss asked me if I wanted to do a stint as a unit supervisor. I didn't have any real management experience before and I remember a lot of my work-friends and peers saying geting that experience would benefit me a great deal in any future position i would go for. That was 4 years ago. After numerous union issues, playing counselor by hearing complaints about personal life issues I did not want to hear in the first place, AND basically baby-sitting adults who should know better... I should've politely told my boss "No sir, I just want to get back to fixing computers and making sure our equipment is running smoothly"

 

I was a lot happier doing IT (albeit a bit bored). OP, if your new job just wants you to come in and fix the situation, ok. That's actually a challenge I would not mind doing. Now if they want you to get in there, fix it THEN manage the place, hell no! Money doesn't equal happiness.

 

One word of advice if you do plan on staying, keep a record of ALL the performance or conduct conversations you have with your employees (bad or good). It will help you justify raises/bonuses/promotions or it can help you get rid of a bad employee. I wish someone would've told me that when I first started. I could've gotten rid of a lot of bad apples sooner.

[MtlJeff]

I have said in many threads in the tour section (talking about pro sports of course) that money isn't everything and that people make decisions like this every day. Of course we expect pro athletes to move from Phoenix to Minnesota for a 1% increase in pay when they are already millionaires, but people in real life make decisions every day that prove money isnt the most important thing.

 

Anyway, rant over. Congrats on your decision. I think it is the right one. Your happiness is the most important thing in the world as you spend the majority of your time at your job. So that money won't make you happy 8-9 hours a day while you are actually working, and then things don't get better when you get home miserable. Even if you have slightly nicer things in your house (which will happen, because pay increases usually lead to synchronized spending increases). Psychology studies have shown time and time again that if basic needs are provided for, money has pretty much a negligible effect on happiness

 

I make a pretty good living at my company, which knock on wood is pretty stable and i am well liked there, My office area is surrounded by 2 guys who are basketball fans so i have always have people to talk about the things i enjoy, and im not too stressed at my job as i've gotten pretty good at it, and it's 5 minutes from where i live. I've turned down 20-30% pay increases to leave. Working at a company that likes you, with coworkers you like, close-by...It would be really hard to leave. Long story short there's more important things then money

[radiman]

I have said in many threads in the tour section (talking about pro sports of course) that money isn't everything and that people make decisions like this every day. Of course we expect pro athletes to move from Phoenix to Minnesota for a 1% increase in pay when they are already millionaires, but people in real life make decisions every day that prove money isnt the most important thing.

 

Anyway, rant over. Congrats on your decision. I think it is the right one. Your happiness is the most important thing in the world as you spend the majority of your time at your job. So that money won't make you happy 8-9 hours a day while you are actually working, and then things don't get better when you get home miserable. Even if you have slightly nicer things in your house (which will happen, because pay increases usually lead to synchronized spending increases). Psychology studies have shown time and time again that if basic needs are provided for, money has pretty much a negligible effect on happiness

 

I make a pretty good living at my company, which knock on wood is pretty stable and i am well liked there, My office area is surrounded by 2 guys who are basketball fans so i have always have people to talk about the things i enjoy, and im not too stressed at my job as i've gotten pretty good at it, and it's 5 minutes from where i live. I've turned down 20-30% pay increases to leave. Working at a company that likes you, with coworkers you like, close-by...It would be really hard to leave. Long story short there's more important things then money

 

Yeah, that makes sense. I got a large pay increase a few years ago. It was weird having so much extra money at the time. Didnt take long to adjust to that and end up at square one again :)

 

Not going to lie. I was feeling like a complete jerk yesterday. But, had a great day with my kids today and feel so much better. However, I still think about the moment I quit a lot. can't shake the guys shocked/dissapointed look on his face. Feels like I insulted him and his company. But it's getting easier already.