MD/DC/VA Golfers - Twelve Monkeys Mental Divergence

[Sterling_247]

My interest will soon be gone. I just need them to show me Pinehurst first and then I'm out

[ceejay81]

I do wish they were showing their rounds on PH 2, 3, 4, and Tobacco Road before our trip.

I keep obsessively checking the weather even though I know it doesn't matter today what they think the weather will be in 2+ weeks.

[Sterling_247]

They're not going to show any of them before the trip? That's the sole reason I've been waiting on the videos

[dsc123]

Wunderground's forecast currently goes through Feb 26. So we should get our day 1 forecast tomorrow. I can't wait.

[ceejay81]

They're not going to show any of them before the trip? That's the sole reason I've been waiting on the videos

I think we get Caledonia, True Blue, and Wilmington Muni before the PH courses. There's only two Tuesdays left until we leave, so we get two more videos.Full course list:

Secession GC

Kiawah (Ocean)

Myrtle Beach Putt Putt Scene

Caledonia

True Blue

Wilmington Muni

Pinehurst Nos. 2, 3 and 4

Southern Pines

Mid Pines

Pine Needles

Tobacco Road

Wunderground's forecast currently goes through Feb 26. So we should get our day 1 forecast tomorrow. I can't wait.

Accuweather has forecasts a month out.

 

[FAbb]

DSC: I can't wait to see the 14-day extended forecast!

City:

https://media.giphy.com/media/88iYsvbegSUn9bSTF8/giphy.gif

 

CJ: I'm already looking at the 1-month extended forecast!

City:

https://media.giphy.com/media/1PgPvWLfXGkCY/giphy.gif

[TheCityGame]

10 day forecasts are no better than just using long term averages. Maybe up to 14 days in certain conditions, but "10" is the generally accepted number for just going with long term averages. Anyone who is providing forecasts longer than that are trying to sell you something.

Accuweather is the worst about this. Their long term predictions are no better than random chance. I don't use apps that use their data.

Also, I'll try not to veer into politics, but accuweather basically just uses re-packaged National Weather Service data for their forecasts, which is public information. Where they get sketchy is they've gotten bills introduced that have tried to limit the public's access to NWS data while they're still able to use it. Accuweather guys are huge d-holes.

There's more to the story, but it involves using names that get posts deleted.

Check out "The Fifth Risk" by Michael Lewis, or just google around.

[top.h]

note to self: asking city "how's the weather?" may get you in a lot deeper than you expected.

[Sterling_247]

Haha I think that goes for more than just the weather

[TheCityGame]

Quoting long range forecasts around is like saying, "Drive for show. Putt for dough."

[2moreTerpz]

i expected to hate the episode but figured i'd fire it up anyway. i watched every minute. it was really well done and entertaining. for a while i had REM's "Man on the moon" ringing in my head. like are they sitting back giggling about how they got these lemmings to watch a putt putt episode? by the end i didn't think they were doing that.

 

this winter i've neglected the chips and pitches I have to hit with a LW. I spent some time on them last week and yesterday as well. Today i did some of that 20/30/40 putting drill for speed and hit a bunch of short putts. It's just so different putting on a real green than in the basement. I hope to be more ready in the past to start the year actually shooting reasonable scores.

[ceejay81]

I keep obsessively checking the weather even though I know it doesn't matter today what they think the weather will be in 2+ weeks.

 

Quoting myself for emphasis on this discussion.

 

[dsc123]

Full knowledge that the forecast is fake news does not diminish my excitement about checking the forecasts.

[therealsneek]

I thought we were going to get to see their Pinehurst 3 video the Tuesday before the trip. I was pumped to get to see the course before the trip as I have been reading good things about #3 after the work done on it. Then I remembered the Wilmington Muni video came first. I was significantly less pumped. Still excited to play #3 though.

[FAbb]

I hope to be more ready in the past to start the year actually shooting reasonable scores.

 

I find that in general, it doesn't matter too much what I do during the winter. I'm gonna start the year a little rusty. Emphasis on a little. It's not like I completely lose my motor patterns. And it doens't take much to get back into the swing of things. I've even had some really good rounds first time playing after long breaks. Cut yourself a little slack on the expectations.

[Sterling_247]

“TIGER WOODS: Well, I’ve always said that the game of golf, it’s fluid, it’s moving. The golf ball is certainly going a lot further than the balata days. We’ve changed it from using a tree to using high-tech metal. We’ve come a long way in this game. What’s been crazy, I’ve been a part of all that. My career when I first started, I beat Davis Love in a playoff and he was using a persimmon driver. To see the technology advance as fast as it has, the average distance was, from when I first came out on here, if you carry it 270, it took a lot of trouble out of play. Now guys are hitting their hybrids and 5-woods 270 in the air. So the game has evolved and it’s changed. We’re running out of property to try and design golf courses that are from the back 7,800 to 8,000 yards, it’s difficult.But on top of that, we want to keep the game so enjoyable and we’ve trying to get more participation, and having the larger heads, more forgiving clubs, it adds to the enjoyment of the game. So there’s a very delicate balancing act where we’re trying to keep the game at, but also as we’ve all recognized, the players have changed over the years, too. When I first came out it was just Vijay and myself in the gyms and now seems like everyone has their own trainer and physios and guys got bigger, stronger, faster, more athletic like all sports.”

Interesting perspective on our distance debate from someone that would know

[ceejay81]

For those who haven't seen. The BMW Championship is at Caves Valley next year.

BMW Championship landing at Owings Mills’ Caves Valley Golf Club, sources say

[dcmidnight]

I think I get the same amount of rusty in the offseason that I always have - I just care a lot less about it now than I used to.

If I get to play golf in mid February, I'm just enjoying the company and happy to be out there, I'm not grinding over swing changes they way I might have a few years ago.

[tungstenplug]

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Edited February 26, 2023 by tungstenplug

[vtnerf]

I bet the Premier Golf League isn't thinking about rolling the ball back.

[dcmidnight]

Unfortunately its closer to two hours for me. I never went to a senior event there but what are the logistics going to be like getting in and out of there? I guess you just park everyone in the fields around there.

My caddie at Caves stole my RTJ ball marker. He was also a certified imbecile.

[HighBoomingDraws]

Yea we parked in some random field by the course. A well attended event up there might get ugly.

[mizuno player]

That's pretty cool.

[Sterling_247]

Found my favorite NLU video this morning. Tourist Sauce (Ireland) Episode 8, Carne. The property was incredible.

[TheCityGame]

He actually said a lot of things there without saying anything.

I'm working through the report and the summary. I'm trying not to comment too much before getting through -- at least -- the 16 page summary. It seems that a lot of people think they've said things that they haven't really said.

One interesting thing that no one has really talked about is that they mentioned the shortest tees at courses are still too long for people who play them. You know what the average driving distance of amateur women is? 145-160 (this is in the report).

The par 4's from the reds at one of my courses are : 304, 362, 326, 325, 313, 338, 325, 340, 311, 355.

You know what that means. . . for a woman golfer who hits it 150 off the tee. . .they couldn't get to a SINGLE par 4 if they hit driver, teed it up again, and hit driver again. And I see that out there.

People always think women golfers are slow? How fast would YOU be if you had driver 3w into every par 4 and still couldn't reach? The 7th hole at my club is listed at 313. It's guarded in front by a hazard. They women (in general) LAY UP on that hole. I've seen them hit driver and then 3w/hybrid (tough to say from another hole) to lay up. On a 313 yard par 4.

Our opening hole for women is 474, and has a creek cutting across the fairway, and an uphill approach to a tough green. Welcome to the golf course. . .here's a kick in the teeth for ya.

How much golf have you played with women in the last couple years? I know DC and baddomes do a little and that their SO's take a pretty good whack at it, so they would have perspective. I've played with the women from work, and I've played some holes with the (former) club champ from my club. I've played with my mom and sister.

That club champ (who shoots 80 ish) MIGHT hit it 175 off the tee. She keeps everything in play and gets it up and down. . .pars and bogeys. Maybe she gets and approach to roll up and has a look at birdie from time to time. But dang.

My mom hits her driver 120. When I played with the women from work, they just kept picking up balls, driving up and throwing them down wherever they wanted.

As lame as it seems, for (many) amateur women to play golf like 'we' do, they would need to make the par 4's like 230.

Anyway, I thought that was a pretty interesting tidbit in the report that hasn't been talked about much.

Side note : there are "silver tees" at my course. They're not listed on the card, and you can't post a score from them at MSGA, so they're probably not rated. They're also set up IN the fairway and are clearly just an afterthought and not attractive to anyone.

[dcmidnight]

I dont have a real good perspective maybe because Mrs DC hits it out there 200 or so and I honestly dont know many women who only hit it 150 off the tee. And we play with a lot of different couples throughout the year either in our Friday night league or in weekend events. So someone who truly hits it 145-150 off the tee? My mom maybe, but shes in her mid 70s and plays a lot. Thats almost hard to believe to be honest - mostly because if thats the average that means a lot of women are only hitting it 100-120 yards off the tee?

(sidebar)

Is there any discussion in the entire report about course conditioning on tour? Honestly I do not care enough to read the whole thing but its striking that its has not come up more. The average carry distance on tour has not increased all that much in the last 12 years (14 yard increase in 12 years) so it seems to me there is "something else" they need to be talking about as well in addition to equipment changes. But they seem hyperobsessed over the total distance numbers. Carry distance meanwhile has only increased about a yard per year on average.

I also somewhat marvel when donks on the Golf Channel are talking about average driver distances going back to the 60s. How accurate was our ability to really measure drives to the tenth of a yard 60 years ago?

 

[dcmidnight]

Eh, now that I'm thinking of a target at the range thats 150 out - maybe its not that unusual. I guess I'm stuck on the fact that if thats the average there are a reasonable number hitting driver 100 yards.

[FAbb]

The distance gap between professionals and "average" golfers is staggering.

I don't think of myself as a long hitter. I've never played with a tour player, so I use PQ as the measuring stick for how I'd compare myself to one distance-wise. The gap, good for good, is like 40'ish yards by my rough estimation. It's not close. Then he's about 2 clubs longer than me with irons, so there's potential he's hitting 4 clubs less than me into holes. Then I think about when I go play with my FIL in his member-guest. I've played with a bunch of people of different ages, and ability levels over the years. For a ton of them, they're lagging behind me just as far as I lag behind PQ. I'm out there hitting wedges or short irons into holes that they're hitting hybrids or woods. For a lot of them, they'd probably have a lot more fun playing from the forward tees.

If you truly want to roll back, I just don't see how you can afford to do that across the board. Bifurcation seems like the only option.

Also, Mrs. DC CRUSHES the ball. She'd be a clutch add to a scramble team. You'd be playing her drives a ton.

[TheCityGame]

"Is there any discussion in the entire report about course conditioning on tour?"

Yes.

And, in regards to that. . .I'd say that another thing that is kind of getting "glossed over" is that the USGA is not the PGA. I know you know this. But if the PGA doesn't want to narrow fairways, and lengthen rough, and soften fairways, then there's nothing the USGA can do about it. How is that ever going to be enforceable, or standardized?

The PGA (or equipment manufacturers) just doesn't (seem to) think that this is an issue like the USGA does. This could be a problem in the long run.

[TheCityGame]

If you truly want to roll back, I just don't see how you can afford to do that across the board.

this is the type of thing that's getting tossed around, and isn't really in the report.

They've mentioned using a local rule for distance mitigation, (e.g. "you need to use THIS ball at the Masters.")

But, they specifically state, "It is not currently intended to consider revising the overall specifications in a way that would produce substantial reductions in hitting distances at all levels of the game." But they do mention that they're in communication with equipment manufacturers about certain things.