Do Thicker Grips Really Make You Less Handsy Through Impact

[Barfolomew]

Use Jumbomax ultralite XSmall

 

Think out the science.  Take a pencil vs a car tire.... if you turn the pencil a few millimeters it might go 90 or 180 degrees of a turn but the tire will only move a few degrees.

 

So if the golf grip is twice the size of another golf grip the head will rotate way less degrees when the hands move.... science class over 🐓

[tippethor]

On a follow up question regarding bigger grips.

 

Yesterday i put on a ultralite medium grip on my 5 wood. I just could not get my swingspeed up to «normal». I was about 5-7 mph slower, but i have never hit the ball straigther and my smash (on trackman) was 1.49-1.5 and even 1.51 and 1.52 on one occation. 

 

i was pleased with the results, but i am not sure what it tells me. Is my rotation/flipping creating more swing speed, i have always belived that was a negativ thing regarding speed?
 

[Stuart_G]

12 hours ago, Barfolomew said:

Use Jumbomax ultralite XSmall

 

Think out the science.  Take a pencil vs a car tire.... if you turn the pencil a few millimeters it might go 90 or 180 degrees of a turn but the tire will only move a few degrees.

 

So if the golf grip is twice the size of another golf grip the head will rotate way less degrees when the hands move.... science class over 🐓

 

Sorry no.  That's only true if the input is linear.   Then yes, the bigger the moment arm, the less angular change results from a given linear input.

 

But with golf, the input isn't linear - it's angular.   The same exact physical motion and effort of the wrist that gives 1* of rotation of the wrist and forearm will always give 1* rotation of the club - no matter how big the grip size.

Edited December 1, 2021 by Stuart_G

[Alan Pllu]

4 hours ago, Stuart_G said:

 

Sorry no.  That's only true if the input is linear.   Then yes, the bigger the moment arm, the less angular change results from a given linear input.

 

But with golf, the input isn't linear - it's angular.   The same exact physical motion and effort of the wrist that gives 1* of rotation of the wrist and forearm will always give 1* rotation of the club - no matter how big the grip size.

I wanted to say this but couldn't explain it, as well as you just have. 

 

It is a direct 1:1 input from the hands to output at the head. The bigger grip doesn't work like a reduction gear reducing the output from the input. 

 

The hand turning 10 degrees from one position in space to another will always result in a 10 degree change in the position of the head. 

 

Only difference is how it affects the input made by the person swinging the club which will be different from person to person. 

[Nels55]

1 hour ago, Alan Pllu said:

I wanted to say this but couldn't explain it, as well as you just have. 

 

It is a direct 1:1 input from the hands to output at the head. The bigger grip doesn't work like a reduction gear reducing the output from the input. 

 

The hand turning 10 degrees from one position in space to another will always result in a 10 degree change in the position of the head. 

 

Only difference is how it affects the input made by the person swinging the club which will be different from person to person. 

Yes, I believe that it can actually be harder to turn over the smaller grip if it is too small for the hand size making it difficult just to hold on to the club.  I am thinking of trying to play golf with a pencil thin grip LOL.

[Barfolomew]

7 hours ago, Stuart_G said:

 

Sorry no.  That's only true if the input is linear.   Then yes, the bigger the moment arm, the less angular change results from a given linear input.

 

But with golf, the input isn't linear - it's angular.   The same exact physical motion and effort of the wrist that gives 1* of rotation of the wrist and forearm will always give 1* rotation of the club - no matter how big the grip size.

 

I dont know the difference of linear and angular with the golf swing lol.... Cant really discuss it using scientific terms but I did a practical experiment that you can too

 

I have taken one of my Jumbomax clubs and a standard grip clubs that feels half the size.... hold them down and turned my hand the same small amount and the club heads don't turn the same amount, the larger grips turn the head less.... try it.  The distance to go 90 degrees is further on the large grip then small grip, much further.  I know you can probably talk me under the table with facts but just try that simple experiment.... or please explain why that experiment is false.... Thanks! 🦆

[Stuart_G]

3 minutes ago, Barfolomew said:

 

I dont know the difference of linear and angular with the golf swing lol.... Cant really discuss it using scientific terms but I did a practical experiment that you can too

 

I have taken one of my Jumbomax clubs and a standard grip clubs that feels half the size.... hold them down and turned my hand the same small amount and the club heads don't turn the same amount, the larger grips turn the head less.... try it.  The distance to go 90 degrees is further on the large grip then small grip, much further.  I know you can probably talk me under the table with facts but just try that simple experiment.... or please explain why that experiment is false.... Thanks! 🦆

 

Take a video and post it.  I can do the same test and get the exact same amount of rotation no matter how much I build up the grip size.  So without seeing exactly what you're doing I can't tell you where the process breaks down.

 

But the difference between a linear force and a rotational one is equivalent to the difference between using a wrench and using a screw driver.   In a wrench, the length of the wrench (radius of the turning force) matters.   Using a screw driver, the size of the grip might matter for how secure a grip you can get, but it wont change how  much the screw actually rotates when you rotate your hand to turn the screw.

[Barfolomew]

7 minutes ago, Stuart_G said:

 

Take a video and post it.  I can do the same test and get the exact same amount of rotation no matter how much I build up the grip size.  So without seeing exactly what you're doing I can't tell you where the process breaks down.

 

But the difference between a linear force and a rotational one is equivalent to the difference between using a wrench and using a screw driver.   In a wrench, the length of the wrench (radius of the turning force) matters.   Using a screw driver, the size of the grip might matter for how secure a grip you can get, but it wont change how  much the screw actually rotates when you rotate your hand to turn the screw.

 

What if the screw driver handle is the size of a car tire?..... (exaggerating obviously in order to show the effect) That's a lot of turn to just get to the screw to turn 90 degrees

[Alan Pllu]

33 minutes ago, Barfolomew said:

 

I dont know the difference of linear and angular with the golf swing lol.... Cant really discuss it using scientific terms but I did a practical experiment that you can too

 

I have taken one of my Jumbomax clubs and a standard grip clubs that feels half the size.... hold them down and turned my hand the same small amount and the club heads don't turn the same amount, the larger grips turn the head less.... try it.  The distance to go 90 degrees is further on the large grip then small grip, much further.  I know you can probably talk me under the table with facts but just try that simple experiment.... or please explain why that experiment is false.... Thanks! 🦆

The test you are doing is showing the difference in the rolling circumference of the larger diameter grip. Which will show the results you are talking about being the larger circumference has to roll further to achieve the same angular rotation. 

 

The reason this doesn't equate into the same thing in the golf swing is because the club isn't rolling on a surface it is being held in a hand which can open and close the required amount to hold the club. Once the hand is holding the club it doesn't matter if the grip is the size of a pencil or a pringles tube the hand and club become one unit so the club head will always rotate the same number of degrees as the hand does. 

[Alan Pllu]

2 hours ago, Nels55 said:

Yes, I believe that it can actually be harder to turn over the smaller grip if it is too small for the hand size making it difficult just to hold on to the club.  I am thinking of trying to play golf with a pencil thin grip LOL.

I'm looking into going the other way into thicker grips purely because I am getting pains in my left hand from thin grips. I used to play thin grips but have been getting progressively thicker over the last few years because of the hand. 

[Nels55]

20 minutes ago, Alan Pllu said:

I'm looking into going the other way into thicker grips purely because I am getting pains in my left hand from thin grips. I used to play thin grips but have been getting progressively thicker over the last few years because of the hand. 

LOL, I did not mean to say that I would actually play with a pencil thin grip I just meant that I was thinking of how hard it would be to use one!  Sometimes what comes off the keyboard is not what I was actually thinking...  I am very happy with my jumbomax ultralight extra small grips and I recommend them over any of the other oversize grips that I have ever used.

[Alan Pllu]

5 minutes ago, Nels55 said:

LOL, I did not mean to say that I would actually play with a pencil thin grip I just meant that I was thinking of how hard it would be to use one!  Sometimes what comes off the keyboard is not what I was actually thinking...  I am very happy with my jumbomax ultralight extra small grips and I recommend them over any of the other oversize grips that I have ever used.

Oops my bad! How did you find the jumbomax grips with the feel of the club?

 

I have have been looking and there isn't anything that's within 8g either side of the weight of my current grips in the sizes I am looking at in jumbomax either ultralight or tours. I'm wondering if I should go lighter or heavier with swingweight change. 

Edited December 1, 2021 by Alan Pllu

[Nels55]

1 minute ago, Alan Pllu said:

Oops my bad! How did you find the jumbomax grips with the feel of the club?

 

I have have been looking and there isn't anything that's within 8g either side of the weight of my current grips in the sizes I am looking at in jumbomax either ultralight or tours. I'm wondering if I should go lighter or heavier with swingweight change. 

For me the lighter grip feels better then heavier oversize grips that I have used in the past.  Swing weight went from D1 to D8 on my six iron with the ultra light grips but as has been pointed out many times swing weight is not all the important and is mostly useful as a reference not a goal.  Anyway it seems that I can feel the weight of the club head a little better with the ultra light grips which is something that I like.  The feel at impact is certainly not what I got from the leather wrap grips that I used years ago but it is good.  Good for me anyway and lot less harsh on badly struck shots...  LOL I do tend to change things quite often but I think that I may stick with the these grips for some time.  

[Stuart_G]

1 hour ago, Barfolomew said:

 

What if the screw driver handle is the size of a car tire?..... (exaggerating obviously in order to show the effect)

 

No it really doesn't show the effect - at least not in a meaningful way.  Because if it was that big you couldn't grip it with one hand and use forearm rotation to turn it any more.   When you go to those types of extremes it forces you to change the biomechanics of the motion and that completely invalidates anything you might be trying to show or prove that's applicable to the original motion.

 

 

Edited December 1, 2021 by Stuart_G

[Billfitz]

Going down the rabbit hole we are. Grip size is like shaft length, shaft weight, swing weight, static weight, shaft stiffness and ball choice. There's no formula that applies to everyone, so you find what works for you and don't worry about why it does.