Powerful chicken wing at impact

[Jbarretta]

I have been having more success and straighter shots by setting up with a strong grip and internally rotated lead arm and foreman, then keeping that inclination during the backswing and at impact.  At impact the back of the lead hand faces the ball target line(not facing the target) the lead elbow and ulnar bone of the lead wrist face the target. This swing removes forearm roll during the downswing.  Below is two pics of jaime sadowski and brooks koepka at or near impact.  This method is not talked about much online   I only see perfectswingreview.net discuss it but for me it is the most consistent way to have a square face at impact.  I would like to hear other thoughts on this impact position ( I do get a sore lead wrist after a round from the shock of impact)

[cardoustie]

I have that impact move, left elbow slightly bent, but hands ahead

 

Westwood is another example 

 

I’ve been playing with a “slap hinge” release lately 

[Jbarretta]

I also find this setup and impact method allow you to keep the trail shoulder externally rotated longer in the ds with elbow pitched since you dont need to go internal with trail shoulder to square the face 

[phizzy30]

Koepka and Spieth are the most notable players nowadays who have the left elbow bend on impact as seen in the pics you've posted OP.  Look at how successful their careers have been thus far.  It obviously works although I think that it should be naturally occurring. 

Edited November 19, 2022 by phizzy30

[MonteScheinblum]

Doing it on purpose is a good way to stink.

[Chunkitgood]

What the arms do in the swing is secondary, accidental as opposed to essential.

[getitdaily]

@mikpga

 

I blame you

[MonteScheinblum]

1 hour ago, Chunkitgood said:

What the arms do in the swing is secondary, accidental as opposed to essential.

Not true for a lot of golfers in early downswing.

[joostin]

Sadlowski's chicken wing was one of the reasons I got interested in the physics of the swing because initially I figured you want almost full extension at impact, yet this smallish guy was winning long drive with a chicken wing.  It didn't make sense at first look, but then I remembered physics....

 

Just looking at a lot of the long drivers that leave their feet, and even pics of tour players at impact, it's obvious that around impact they are basically pulling (up / away / back), almost like an Olympic hammer thrower (below) but to a lesser degree.  This is because to get the clubhead moving in an arc we need to create angular momentum and centripetal force.  If you look at slo mo vids, around impact the instantaneous center of rotation of the clubhead is pretty close to the grip end butt of the club (below).

 

I'm gonna calculate the centripetal force of a 200g driver clubhead with its CG 45" from the instantaneous center of rotation at impact, for Koepka's clubhead speed of 121 mph:

 

Centripetal Force = (mass*velocity²)÷radius

= (200g * (121mph)²)÷45"

= (.2kg * (54.09m/s)²)÷1.143m

= 511.94N

= 115.1lbf <-- 115 pounds of force, just the clubhead alone (more if you calculate the whole club), that Koepka or anyone else is pulling instantaneously at impact swinging at 121mph.

 

IMO the reason Sadlowski and Koepka are chicken winging is not because they're doing it consciously, but because that is part of their natural athletic recruitment of their muscles for this motion in creating and supporting this force.  It could possibly stem from a hockey background, or it could just be innate.  Others will recruit muscles differently.  Obviously many don't have a chicken wing and swing just as fast.

 

To create the 121mph swing above, there is significant centripetal force being generated, and that force points away from the clubhead, towards the center of rotation.  Centripetal force governs the physics of the rotating object in any point in the swing arc (just as the suns gravity pulls on the earth in orbit).  If you look at any point in someone's swing, you can almost tell which way the centripetal force vector pulls by where their weight is shifting or the direction their body momentum is going and anticipating.

 

 

Can even explain Tiger's squat - just part of his muscle recruitment motor pattern

 

Wherever the center of the club path arc is at any point in the swing is where the centripetal force is pointing, and is inline with where we are creating, supporting, and anticipating those forces with our body movement.

 

Got a little technical, but I think it's worth knowing centripetal force direction as it applies to the swing.  Sorry OP, this probably should've been a thread in its own... just wanted to point this out!

[glk]

Those arent chicken wings.

[Fuscinator]

4 hours ago, MonteScheinblum said:

Doing it on purpose is a good way to stink.

How many people do it on purpose? 

[Jbarretta]

I have spent to much time worrying about a bent lead arm.  Got my handicap down to a 15 and my driver swing speed is 108. My 8 iron is my best club 165 carry with consistency.  I cant supinate my lead forearm 90 degrees. (I need to externally rotate my shoulder to supinate) I am finally embracing "the wing"

[mikpga]

14 hours ago, getitdaily said:

@mikpga

 

I blame you

remember, I take no responsibility!

 

 

[Haroputt]

I think it’s okay as long as left arm doesn’t collapse. I been building strength over the muscles surrounding my left shoulder blade to keep the upper core intact