Iron ball striking is inconsistent

[j8979]

Had a lesson a few months ago, the pro determined I was coming in to the ball with an open club face causing shanks and heel shots.

 

He had me working on flexing the lead wrist at the takeaway, shutting down the face and getting a better strike at impact as a result.

 

Also, he had me move the shaft forward at address, before it was very straight on with the ball. To me the club face now looks open at address, but it actually isn’t.

 

Since that lesson I’ve give pretty far downhill with the irons. I’ve lost about 15-20 yards off each club and my iron play is destroying my game. 
 

here’s a video of my iron swing:

 

 

Edited November 29, 2022 by j8979

[bladehunter]

10 minutes ago, j8979 said:

Had a lesson a few months ago, the pro determined I was coming in to the ball with an open club face causing shanks and heel shots.

 

He had me working on flexing the lead wrist at the takeaway, shutting down the face and getting a better strike at impact as a result.

 

Since that lesson I’ve give pretty far downhill with the irons. I’ve lost about 15-20 yards off each club and my iron play is destroying my game. 
 

here’s a video of my iron swing:

 

 

Preface -  this is a regular dude asking. Not a teacher.  
 

have you checked on face alignment at address ?   As in I have an eye dominance issue that makes a wide open face look square to me and a square face looks hooded.  I’m conscious of it and adjust accordingly.  Along that line.  Have you tried just adjusting the grip in your hands at address to a more shut position ?  Not rolling the hands. Turning the grip shut then gripping the club .  Just to see what happens ?  How about your grip strength in general ?  As in positions of hands.  
 

the shallowing move he’s showing you is fine IF you can get comfortable with it.  Most who do it - do it on the downswing naturally.  Takes a long time to add it in.  But obviously can be done.  
 

post a swing the old way for comparison if you can.  

[nsxguy]

12 minutes ago, bladehunter said:

post a swing the old way for comparison if you can.  

 

LOL I was going to ask him if this video way the "new" way or the old one - but I think you're right as it looks like the face is a bit shut on the way back.

 

It's funny but just recently I tried this "shut face" method. With the wedges it seemed like I was getting a bit more solid strike but as the irons got longer the results got worse.

 

I watch this video and see how upright the swing seems to get with the "shut" face and that's kinda sorta what I felt was happening to me. I'll probably mess around with it a bit more.

 

 

[Sean124]

That “shallowing” move is getting your arms stuck so far behind you that your body stops rotating completely in an attempt to let them catch up. The 2nd pic almost looks like like address, but it’s actually impact. Everything has stopped while you flip at the ball = no power and no face control.
 

[j8979]

18 minutes ago, Sean124 said:

That “shallowing” move is getting your arms stuck so far behind you that your body stops rotating completely in an attempt to let them catch up. The 2nd pic almost looks like like address, but it’s actually impact. Everything has stopped while you flip at the ball = no power and no face control.
 

 

the shallowing move isn’t a conscious thing, happens without thinking about it. Makes me think something else is going wrong before that happens.

[cgasucks]

I can see that your purposely manufacturing flat downswing plane.  For me, I think the plane of the backswing should be the same as the downswing.  I can also see than your lower body is hasn't really opened enough at impact which really exaggerates the misshits on your purposefully flat downswing.  It is almost the same at address.  Not good.

[glk]

Arms move out of sequence with body in takeaway - arms start to get inside and then you turn body taking arms further inside and too deep at the top.   When you get to the top you stand up and lose inclination - watch your left shoulder raise and flatten     Gets arms even more behind you.

 

this can help with takeaway being sequenced.    The standing up part, not so much - arms work down not behind - justin rose drill may be of help.

https://www.instagram.com/p/CArLoP8llFa/

 

 

[Fuscinator]

Sorry for the wording, but that alleged "shallowing" move looks like a very mild case of Charles Barkleyitis. It's like something that got started and now you can't stop.

 

I once complained to the guy who works on my clubs that the grip on a putter I had bought made the clubface open. He looked at it and said it was square, but because of the way I tend to lean the shaft forward, it looks open. So, that might be at play when you get more shaft lean at setup.

[bladehunter]

24 minutes ago, Fuscinator said:

Sorry for the wording, but that alleged "shallowing" move looks like a very mild case of Charles Barkleyitis. It's like something that got started and now you can't stop.

 

I once complained to the guy who works on my clubs that the grip on a putter I had bought made the clubface open. He looked at it and said it was square, but because of the way I tend to lean the shaft forward, it looks open. So, that might be at play when you get more shaft lean at setup.

Good point. Not it’s not “ looks “ it’s reality. The more you lean it forward , the more open it is unless you turn the grip.  Think of the hosel as acting on a arc. Lean it back it shuts the face line. Lean it forward it opens it. 
 

part of my setup question was on that.  Someone who lines up with shaft at their belt buckle might want or need a little pre shut face.  But usually not. Someone who lines up with shaft in line or his left arm definitely needs to shut the face at address or some other compensating move . Because the lean is opening the face. Grip a club with the butt of the grip pointed at your belt buckle. Now only push your hands forward and watch the toe of the iron. It opens. Putter will do same. 
 

the total picture is that it all has to line up or match.  

Edited November 29, 2022 by bladehunter

[mgoblue83]

This is not a setup issue or club face issue.

 

As said above:

Poor/stalled rotation combined with "fake" shallowing, early extension and stuck arms == inconsistent and no power. 

[Krt22]

Big time sequencing, take away, and back swing issues. 

 

The big one is the disconnect between your lower body and upper body, your hip turn finishes too early, then its all arms/rerouting from there

 

Then perhaps in your effort to turn the face down in the take away, you are sucking the club way inside and shut. When your lead wrist is flexed so much so early, it's hard to properly hinge the club, so in an effort to make power your arm swing gets very long.  A lot of folks would come over the top from this position, but instead your arms drop even more to get them even more stuck behind your body.

 

Now your arms are way stuck behind you and your lower body is completely static, so it's a big effort from there just to get the club back to the ball

 

The pivot sequencing needs to be addressed, but simply getting the club hinging more vertically early might fix a lot of things.

 

 

[bladehunter]

2 hours ago, mgoblue83 said:

This is not a setup issue or club face issue.

 

As said above:

Poor/stalled rotation combined with "fake" shallowing, early extension and stuck arms == inconsistent and no power. 

Agree. But I also assumed the disconnected swing was a product of trying to incorporate the motorcycle move.  That seems to be the kind  of hitch and go it throws into a lot of people action’s because it has to be so consciously focused on to do.  
 

Id bet he’s much more connected minus that thought.  But maybe not. 

Edited November 29, 2022 by bladehunter

[j8979]

2 hours ago, Krt22 said:

Big time sequencing, take away, and back swing issues. 

 

The big one is the disconnect between your lower body and upper body, your hip turn finishes too early, then its all arms/rerouting from there

 

Then perhaps in your effort to turn the face down in the take away, you are sucking the club way inside and shut. When your lead wrist is flexed so much so early, it's hard to properly hinge the club, so in an effort to make power your arm swing gets very long.  A lot of folks would come over the top from this position, but instead your arms drop even more to get them even more stuck behind your body.

 

Now your arms are way stuck behind you and your lower body is completely static, so it's a big effort from there just to get the club back to the ball

 

The pivot sequencing needs to be addressed, but simply getting the club hinging more vertically early might fix a lot of things.

 

 

good drill for vertical early wrist hinge?

[Krt22]

52 minutes ago, j8979 said:

good drill for vertical early wrist hinge?

At P2, feel like you are hinging the club straight up in the air. It may help you to feel that there is almost no lower body movement from P1 to P2 as well.

[aggiegolfer21]

On 11/29/2022 at 8:14 AM, j8979 said:

Had a lesson a few months ago, the pro determined I was coming in to the ball with an open club face causing shanks and heel shots.

 

He had me working on flexing the lead wrist at the takeaway, shutting down the face and getting a better strike at impact as a result.

 

Also, he had me move the shaft forward at address, before it was very straight on with the ball. To me the club face now looks open at address, but it actually isn’t.

 

Since that lesson I’ve give pretty far downhill with the irons. I’ve lost about 15-20 yards off each club and my iron play is destroying my game. 
 

here’s a video of my iron swing:

 

 

 

What is your typical ball flight on a good shot and what is your typical ball flight on a miss?

[betarhoalphadelta]

Ok... I'm not qualified to do much with regards to a golf swing, but you're standing up at the top relative to your address position.

 

I've tried to draw a line as best I can from the base of your tailbone to the top of your spine. 

 

 

Whatever you're doing, it's causing you at the top of the backswing to try to reroute the club behind you and that takes your entire upper body with it. 

 

Also note that you've lost right hip depth when you should have gained it (look at the golf balls behind your right cheek in the first and second pictures) and thrown your left hip out at the ball, which makes it nigh impossible to regain that depth in the downswing, which means EE... 

 

You need someone more qualified than me to fix this... And based on your description, either your current instructor isn't more qualified than me (unlikely but possible) or you've misinterpreted what he wanted to get from you...