Fake driver shafts.

[lefthack]

So Haywood sent me a couple driver adapters and I got the opportunity to get 2 fake shafts to try. I've seen a few threads on here but nobody seems to have tried them. 

 

I have a free hour at a new sim bar in town, so I figured this was the perfect opportunity to try them out. I got a Atuoflex SF505, and a Ventus TN Black 6S. That get here next week, so I will do a bunch of test. 

 

My theory is they are some generic shaft with a paint job and sticker. 

 

[third-times-a-charm]

Well, yes. Will you be snapping them in half after your test?

[lefthack]

25 minutes ago, third-times-a-charm said:

Well, yes. Will you be snapping them in half after your test?

 

I guess it depends on how they test. 🤣

[dbdors]

Why waste time testing fakes?  What is the hope?

[lefthack]

11 minutes ago, dbdors said:

Why waste time testing fakes?  What is the hope?

 

I'm a QA engineer by trade and testing stuff is what I do. These were free, the hour sim is free, it's not like it's putting me out anything by trying them 

 

Maybe they break within the first 5 swings. Maybe they are like a wet noodle. My inquisitive mind wants to know. 

 

I am buying a real Ventus Black 6S to try as well. I plan to cut these open and compare the fake to real from the inside. I'm curious if all they did was take a shaft and put a sticker on it, or are they actually trying to emulate the real thing from a construction standpoint. 

 

Again, my theory is it's a generic/overstock/defective shaft with whatever paint and sticker you want. I'll be surprised if the two I got are different weights. They SHOULD be, but still. 🤣

 

<edit> or maybe it's like "replica" sneakers that are actually made in the same factory after hours and sold out the back door. Don't know until you try, right? 

Edited June 17, 2023 by lefthack

[Eeecc]

20 hours ago, lefthack said:

 

I'm a QA engineer by trade and testing stuff is what I do. These were free, the hour sim is free, it's not like it's putting me out anything by trying them 

 

Maybe they break within the first 5 swings. Maybe they are like a wet noodle. My inquisitive mind wants to know. 

 

I am buying a real Ventus Black 6S to try as well. I plan to cut these open and compare the fake to real from the inside. I'm curious if all they did was take a shaft and put a sticker on it, or are they actually trying to emulate the real thing from a construction standpoint. 

 

Again, my theory is it's a generic/overstock/defective shaft with whatever paint and sticker you want. I'll be surprised if the two I got are different weights. They SHOULD be, but still. 🤣

 

<edit> or maybe it's like "replica" sneakers that are actually made in the same factory after hours and sold out the back door. Don't know until you try, right? 

Awesome project! 
 

Now I know why you do all these experiments. It is pretty cool 

[I'_rather_be_golfing]

When can we see the results?

[lefthack]

The shafts should be here by Friday, I think. As soon as I trim and glue the adapters on, I will be good to go. So next week it should be game on. 

 

Depending on sim results, I might play one or both on course before I cut them open. All depends on how bad/good they do. 

[lefthack]

3 hours ago, Eeecc said:

Awesome project! 
 

Now I know why you do all these experiments. It is pretty cool 

 

Enquiring mind want to know. 🤣 

 

I do enjoy taking a couple clubs out for side by side. Every time I get new irons (this Monday) I will pair them up and do shot for shot from the same spot on a round. 

 

Since my new irons get here in time, I might get to do side by side on the sim with those, too. Driver will be the focus, but if I have time, I will hit irons, too.

[Eeecc]

6 hours ago, lefthack said:

 

Enquiring mind want to know. 🤣 

 

I do enjoy taking a couple clubs out for side by side. Every time I get new irons (this Monday) I will pair them up and do shot for shot from the same spot on a round. 

 

Since my new irons get here in time, I might get to do side by side on the sim with those, too. Driver will be the focus, but if I have time, I will hit irons, too.

Take lots of pictures…I am very interested to see what is inside the shaft difference.

 

I know the fake driver heads for example there has been examples where the “carbon fiber” is actually sticker on a metal body etc and inside has nothing of the tech or structure of the real. The few fake golf balls the inside are not the same or two piece inside of multiple pieces…

 

I have a fake proV1 392 I found that I put to the side as display…it is hard as a two piece and the surface layer is hard so definitely not urethane and doesn’t look refinished 

[tgolf90]

Do you have a youtube channel? Would be curious to watch the test and tear down of shafts. 

[lefthack]

1 hour ago, tgolf90 said:

Do you have a youtube channel? Would be curious to watch the test and tear down of shafts. 

 

No, I couldn't stand to video myself. But I will post up pictures and stats for sure. 

 

I'm not willing to pay for a legit Autoflex to cut, but I've found a few Ventus I'm watching on ebay that should be legit. 

[lefthack]

Just showed up, didn't even get a tracking update yet, damn. 

[lefthack]

Hmm. Close. Aren't they supposed to be 50g and 65g? How much margin is allowed? 

 

 

 

[JAM01]

Without knowing for sure I’d expect an uncut Fujikura to be really close to the stated weight. I have heard the variance on the auto flex might be a touch more. 

[grm24]

6 hours ago, lefthack said:

Hmm. Close. Aren't they supposed to be 50g and 65g? How much margin is allowed? 

Per the Fujikura website the Venus TR Black 6-S s/b 69.5 grams and 46 inches. 

 

https://fujikuragolf.com/shaft-specs

Edited June 25, 2023 by grm24

[lefthack]

11 minutes ago, grm24 said:

Per the Fujikura website the Venus TR Black 6-S s/b 69.5 grams and 46 inches. 

 

https://fujikuragolf.com/shaft-specs

 

Thanks, so that's even more off than I thought. I'm kinda of surprised they aren't the same. But they are closer to each other than the shafts they are pretending to be. 🤣 

 

Got adapters epoxied, getting close. Need to schedule the Sim hour, but it seems they are pretty open during the day. 

[zip7111]

Remember your “fake” shafts are an inch short of normal, so that will add a few grams to the 63 grams on your scale.

Edited June 25, 2023 by zip7111

[lefthack]

1 hour ago, zip7111 said:

Remember your “fake” shafts are an inch short of normal, so that will add a few grams to the 63 grams on your scale.

 

Oh wow, I didn't even notice they were only 45". I was just marking them to be the same length as my Hzrdus stock shaft.

 

I'll weight the inch I cut off and add that to the total. So the Autoflex seems way over then.

 

<edit> add 1.6g for the inch missing. 

Edited June 25, 2023 by lefthack

[I'_rather_be_golfing]

OP when will you be able to post some numbers? And are you able to do a comparison between real and fake shafts?

[lefthack]

I'm trying to find a Ventus used, but the real Autoflex is out of the question. I just got the shafts built up, so I'm trying to go at lunch this week to the simulator. 

 

I want to try the real vs fake side by side if possible as well. So the first round will be the two fake shafts vs my stock shaft. Then build up the real Ventus and compare it to the fake one. 

 

I would like to see if I can get frequency measurements to compare as well, but that might be a challenge. 

[Pleasedwith3putts]

On 6/25/2023 at 2:26 AM, zip7111 said:

Remember your “fake” shafts are an inch short of normal, so that will add a few grams to the 63 grams on your scale.

Genuine Autoflex standard length is 45" seemingly the same as the fake. Only the Ventus fake is short

[Pleasedwith3putts]

 

 

Not the greatest images, but bottom photo is a fake I bought off a certain auction site from a dealer claiming he was sure it was genuine but could not tell me why he "knew". No ID sticker (apparently an early model so none used) but check out the poor paintwork where it transitions from fully painted to unpainted vs genuine with sticker from AF dealer in top photo. The fake has some kind of finishing coat to some of the unpainted area, the genuine does not. And the biggest giveaway was how it played. AF has an unmistakeable feel to it of a fishing rod when you first use it, you could pick one in a blind comparison as the fake felt like most lightweight shafts. Finally in terms of numbers, fake was adding nothing to clubhead or ballspeed, genuine had an extra gear.

Edited June 28, 2023 by Pleasedwith3putts

[JackHasGame]

Any updates OP? cheers

[lefthack]

1 hour ago, JackHasGame said:

Any updates OP? cheers

 

Unfortunately no, my wife got COVID then a month later I got it. I just got over it last week actually. It looks like Sim Golf is open tomorrow, so I might try to get in for an hour and see what happens. I've had the shafts in my truck for like 2 months. 🤣

[lefthack]

Ok, that was fun, going to do that again soon. So this place just opened up 15 minutes from my office (right across the street from Intel). Single simulator, members have 24/7 access, booking in 30 minute increments. I think it was $36 for the hour.

 

https://booking.launchhouse.golf/simulator

 

I spent 15 minutes with my stock shaft, then 15 with the Autoflex, then 10 minutes with the Ventus, then 5 more with the Autoflex. The Autoflex is noticably more flexy. The sim guy said it felt like a senior flex. I thought it felt like the Honma Vizard shaft, very whippy. I don't swing hard, so don't make too much fun of my numbers. This was my first time on a sim.

 

 

 

Stock:

 

Autoflex 

 

Ventus Blue non velocore.

 

I actually left the Ventus in for now. I will buy a real Ventus to compare if I can find one. I really liked how it feels.

Edited October 4, 2023 by lefthack
Labeled pics

[HillbillyHoma]

15 hours ago, lefthack said:

Ok, that was fun, going to do that again soon. So this place just opened up 15 minutes from my office (right across the street from Intel). Single simulator, members have 24/7 access, booking in 30 minute increments. I think it was $36 for the hour.

 

https://booking.launchhouse.golf/simulator

 

I spent 15 minutes with my stock shaft, then 15 with the Autoflex, then 10 minutes with the Ventus, then 5 more with the Autoflex. The Autoflex is noticably more flexy. The sim guy said it felt like a senior flex. I thought it felt like the Honma Vizard shaft, very whippy. I don't swing hard, so don't make too much fun of my numbers. This was my first time on a sim.

 

 

 

Stock:

 

Autoflex 

 

Ventus Blue non velocore.

 

I actually left the Ventus in for now. I will buy a real Ventus to compare if I can find one. I really liked how it feels.

Interesting that the fake ventus jumped your spin rate nearly 1000 rpms over stock/autoflex.

[lefthack]

So I found a new uncut Ventus blue 6s and will get that ordered. The Ventus seemed more consistent, but it could be my imagination. I didn't hit it as much as the the Autoflex because it just worked. I went back to the Autoflex trying to get over or into the whippy feeling. The results weren't bad, it just feels weird. 

[dbdors]

3 hours ago, jbeer7375 said:

Interesting that the fake ventus jumped your spin rate nearly 1000 rpms over stock/autoflex.

Its a fake shaft, it is not designed to function like a true Ventus Velocore shaft.  Its only design function is to get your money.

 

As the OP stated early on, "My theory is they are some generic shaft with a paint job and sticker."  That is all they are.  

[lefthack]

5 minutes ago, dbdors said:

Its a fake shaft, it is not designed to function like a true Ventus Velocore shaft.  Its only design function is to get your money.

 

As the OP stated early on, "My theory is they are some generic shaft with a paint job and sticker."  That is all they are.  

 

What's interesting is that I like the fake Ventus better than my Hzrdus Black. 🤣 

 

I'm also curious about the Autoflex because it feels like the real one is described. Is it just a senior or ladies flex shaft? It's noticably different than the other 2 I was hitting. That's why I went back to it. 

 

So I need to bug Haywood for another adapter or steal the one off the Autoflex for the "real" Ventus.