No new acquistions...?

[Maine Golfer]

coming out of a coke bath. A total steal under $10. 3,5,6,8,9,E 88 Hogan Apex Redlines.  I will likely get these extended up up 2 degrees lie ASAP and find a 7 later.  One of my best ever finds. 

 

[ezgoer]

Im really really excited to have some legends. It’s gonna be a project. I am the king of unfinished projects but this really is inspiring me so I feel good about this. Got the 2-P Wilson Bullet Back head’s for $60 and a component set of clubs with these Precision Rifle 6.5 shafts for $13. Added bonus the grips are great. Faces and grooves on Wilson are very good also. Gotta get some cool ferrules and pull the component heads off the shafts. Clubs were aluminum shafted so I’m told they’re gonna need to be reamed first also to be fitted with a standard shaft. Never done this before so starting to research and study up before taking this on. Starting to gather tools along with converting my bench grinder to a polisher so can shine em up. Not a full restoration but hopefully be something to be proud of. 6.5 Precision shafts may be a little much for me but I do get along well with the old Mac Propel 1 shafts in my 59 Mac CF4000 PT1 irons. Those are very heavy clubs and very stiff also. These head’s feel heavy. Heavier than the early to mid 80’s set of Top Flite professional heads I also have so wondering if it could set up similar to the Mac’s and possibly offset the X stiff shafts a little. Possibly have a set of DG S300 shafts in the works also so great fallback if these shafts are too much for me.

Edited October 1, 2023 by ezgoer

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

3 hours ago, ezgoer said:

Clubs were aluminum shafted so I’m told they’re gonna need to be reamed first also to be fitted with a standard shaft. Never done this before so starting to research and study up before taking this on. 

 

I think it's the opposite. I think you'll need a shim.

 

I've a set of old Golfcraft clubs with aluminium shafts, and the shafts are definitely thicker near the tip than steel ones.

 

I vaguely remember reading that aluminium shafts had two different tip types, but both were thicker than steel shafts.

[Stephen8802]

24 minutes ago, No_Catchy_Nickname said:

 

I think it's the opposite. I think you'll need a shim.

 

I've a set of old Golfcraft clubs with aluminium shafts, and the shafts are definitely thicker near the tip than steel ones.

 

I vaguely remember reading that aluminium shafts had two different tip types, but both were thicker than steel shafts.

I've done two full sets of aluminum shafted Staffs and several wedges. They need to be reamed, not shimmed.

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

11 minutes ago, Stephen8802 said:

I've done two full sets of aluminum shafted Staffs and several wedges. They need to be reamed, not shimmed.

 

Wow, that really surprises me, because with the aluminium shafted clubs I have, the shafts are noticeably thicker than steel ones. Measuring with callipers confirms that.

[Maine Golfer]

Keep us posted. I have a set of 70s Wilson Staff and I loath the shafts on them. 

[Stephen8802]

49 minutes ago, No_Catchy_Nickname said:

 

Wow, that really surprises me, because with the aluminium shafted clubs I have, the shafts are noticeably thicker than steel ones. Measuring with callipers confirms that.

I have this picture because this has come up before. It surprised me the first time I pulled one too.

 

Two things are true. First you would think they would have to be thicker. Second, every set of Wilson Staffs with aluminum shafts I've seen are bent near the hosel. Perhaps we can draw a line between those two points and conclude it wasn't the best design.

Edited October 1, 2023 by Stephen8802

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

13 minutes ago, Stephen8802 said:

I have this picture because this has come up before. It surprised me the first time I pulled one too.

 

Two things are true. First you would think they would have to be thicker. Second, every set of Wilson Staffs with aluminum shafts I've seen are bent near the hosel. Perhaps we can draw a line between those two points and conclude it wasn't the best design.

 

Wow. My aluminium shafts right above the ferrule measure about 0.71" (1.8cm), compared to about 0.37" on a similar spot on a steel shaft.

 

I've never pulled the aluminium shafts, so I'm not sure of the precise tip diameter. However, the 5i shaft is bent, but not near the hosel. It's more like the whole shaft is bent. 

 

Golfcraft heads. Not sure of the shaft make.

[bcstones]

@ezgoer from the Brad Meehan YouTube site...find a set of tapered spindles for your polisher/grinder (he calls them 'shaft extenders', but after searching about an hour, came across the 'tapered spindle' moniker). You just need to know the axel size (1/2" or 5/8")...cost seems to run, for a pair, $20-$40 or so. 
Awhile back I lost almost every tool I had (tool box fell out of trailer due to my lously loading) & I replaced all from the bay thingie that I lost. It was all gear I'd bought from Golfsmith decades ago. Was surprised to find it. 

Enjoy & have fun....

[ezgoer]

16 minutes ago, bcstones said:

@ezgoer from the Brad Meehan YouTube site...find a set of tapered spindles for your polisher/grinder (he calls them 'shaft extenders', but after searching about an hour, came across the 'tapered spindle' moniker). You just need to know the axel size (1/2" or 5/8")...cost seems to run, for a pair, $20-$40 or so. 
Awhile back I lost almost every tool I had (tool box fell out of trailer due to my lously loading) & I replaced all from the bay thingie that I lost. It was all gear I'd bought from Golfsmith decades ago. Was surprised to find it. 

Enjoy & have fun....

Yeah I saw that video also and that’s the plan. In Stephen8802 I trust. I also took his advice and joined the DIY golf club restoration FB group. Haven’t spent a ton of time there yet but the little I have Meehan is all over that and really seems like a great guy. Didn’t think about it till typing this but I bet that’s his FB group. There’s tons of links and info. 
 Only bad thing about all this is up here in Mn. we got about 5 weeks of golf left. Possibly up to Thanksgiving for the real diehards but after about the 3rd week of October you can’t count on it. Last few years about 11/10 has been the final. Since I have some legwork and gathering to do unless i rush em together they may not see real grass this season. 
 86 degrees today so off to play my vintage irons/putter and modern driver/wedges. Listen to my Vikings probably get hammered bye the Panthers. 

[bcstones]

@ezgoer thanks for the reminder about that DIY fb group...

[bcstones]

7 hours ago, bcstones said:

@ezgoer thanks for the reminder about that DIY fb group...

went to the group....seems to be mostly about restoring irons more than woods. However, he has an amazon site & offers that tapered spindle set at a very reasonable cost. 

[raggal62]

On 10/1/2023 at 1:56 AM, ezgoer said:

Im really really excited to have some legends. It’s gonna be a project. I am the king of unfinished projects but this really is inspiring me so I feel good about this. Got the 2-P Wilson Bullet Back head’s for $60 and a component set of clubs with these Precision Rifle 6.5 shafts for $13. Added bonus the grips are great. Faces and grooves on Wilson are very good also. Gotta get some cool ferrules and pull the component heads off the shafts. Clubs were aluminum shafted so I’m told they’re gonna need to be reamed first also to be fitted with a standard shaft. Never done this before so starting to research and study up before taking this on. Starting to gather tools along with converting my bench grinder to a polisher so can shine em up. Not a full restoration but hopefully be something to be proud of. 6.5 Precision shafts may be a little much for me but I do get along well with the old Mac Propel 1 shafts in my 59 Mac CF4000 PT1 irons. Those are very heavy clubs and very stiff also. These head’s feel heavy. Heavier than the early to mid 80’s set of Top Flite professional heads I also have so wondering if it could set up similar to the Mac’s and possibly offset the X stiff shafts a little. Possibly have a set of DG S300 shafts in the works also so great fallback if these shafts are too much for me.

Those heads were made heavier for use with the lighter weight of the shaft material.

[raggal62]

23 hours ago, No_Catchy_Nickname said:

 

Wow. My aluminium shafts right above the ferrule measure about 0.71" (1.8cm), compared to about 0.37" on a similar spot on a steel shaft.

 

I've never pulled the aluminium shafts, so I'm not sure of the precise tip diameter. However, the 5i shaft is bent, but not near the hosel. It's more like the whole shaft is bent. 

 

Golfcraft heads. Not sure of the shaft make.

I believe the later versions of aluminum shafts had a larger tip diameter than earlier designs to help compensate for bending and breaking issues.

[Stephen8802]

23 hours ago, raggal62 said:

Those heads were made heavier for use with the lighter weight of the shaft material.

That's what makes them special to me. I have sets of '67 and '69 that started out with aluminum shafts and I've reshafted with S300s. I even have a spare set of '67s still in the original shafts, just in case.

 

I extended them to 80s length and counterwieghted them back to D3. Add heavy head, steel shaft, and counterweight together and you get a heavy club, which really slows down my swing and dramatically reduces my major flaw, a quick down swing. It gives me a much smoother rhythm and a much more consistent swing. I'm sure heavy clubs aren't for everyone, but at my size and with my flaws, it's magic.

Edited October 3, 2023 by Stephen8802

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

41 minutes ago, raggal62 said:

I believe the later versions of aluminum shafts had a larger tip diameter than earlier designs to help compensate for bending and breaking issues.

 

That would make sense, because I think my clubs were 1970, maybe 71, but probably 70, and at the back end of the aluminium shaft era.

 

When I think about it, aluminium shafts can only have lasted 4 years max. Palmer wins in 1967, yet by 1971, they were all but obsolete.

[raggal62]

1 hour ago, No_Catchy_Nickname said:

 

That would make sense, because I think my clubs were 1970, maybe 71, but probably 70, and at the back end of the aluminium shaft era.

 

When I think about it, aluminium shafts can only have lasted 4 years max. Palmer wins in 1967, yet by 1971, they were all but obsolete.

I always wondered how those first generation Alcoa shafts held up in the long run to Palmer's aggressive swing. I would suspect he bent a few.

[bcstones]

22 minutes ago, raggal62 said:

I always wondered how those first generation Alcoa shafts held up in the long run to Palmer's aggressive swing. I would suspect he bent a few.

I would also suspect that "letting the clubhead do the work" instead of "aggreressively swinging w/total body strength", that more traditional swing might not have bent many of those aluminium shafts...

Edited October 2, 2023 by bcstones

[Coletrain]

10 hours ago, bcstones said:

I would also suspect that "letting the clubhead do the work" instead of "aggreressively swinging w/total body strength", that more traditional swing might not have bent many of those aluminium shafts...

Palmers swing looks pretty aggressive during the 60s and early 70s. Don't think he was really holding anything back.

[bcstones]

1 hour ago, Coletrain said:

Palmers swing looks pretty aggressive during the 60s and early 70s. Don't think he was really holding anything back.

Palmer was the poster boy for the "hit the ball with everything you got" - every ounce of effort, every muscle fiber behing the strike. The club & ball manufactures had been pushing that concept for quite a number of years prior to Palmer, pushing the "distance is king" stragety that sells clubs & balls. 
In contrast, there was Ernest Jones, a excellent amateur golfer in the UK prior to WWI. He was a combat pilot during that conflict, lost a leg. Afterwards he returned to golf, first relearning his swing one legged. Try that sometime, the idea of swinging w/every ounce of energy will make you a whirling dervish, if you even hit the ball. You have to let the clubhead do it's work, learn not only your personal center of balance but also the axis of your body thru the swing...interestingly, when Ernest Jones got his artifical leg & returned to golfing, he became an excellent instructor. Came to the US with his style of instruction (fun point, he was quite successful...so successful, that a lot of US Pro's objected to his presence, if my memory serves correctly). He was hired by MacGregor sometime in the 1930s. You can still find his book on "Just Swing", it's an interesting read.

 

[Coletrain]

4 hours ago, bcstones said:

Palmer was the poster boy for the "hit the ball with everything you got" - every ounce of effort, every muscle fiber behing the strike. The club & ball manufactures had been pushing that concept for quite a number of years prior to Palmer, pushing the "distance is king" stragety that sells clubs & balls. 
In contrast, there was Ernest Jones, a excellent amateur golfer in the UK prior to WWI. He was a combat pilot during that conflict, lost a leg. Afterwards he returned to golf, first relearning his swing one legged. Try that sometime, the idea of swinging w/every ounce of energy will make you a whirling dervish, if you even hit the ball. You have to let the clubhead do it's work, learn not only your personal center of balance but also the axis of your body thru the swing...interestingly, when Ernest Jones got his artifical leg & returned to golfing, he became an excellent instructor. Came to the US with his style of instruction (fun point, he was quite successful...so successful, that a lot of US Pro's objected to his presence, if my memory serves correctly). He was hired by MacGregor sometime in the 1930s. You can still find his book on "Just Swing", it's an interesting read.

 

wow, that's quite interesting, will check this out, thanks for the info.

I think jack might have the most violent swing I've ever seen though. Watson also started with the same type of swing but transitioned later to a much more controlled version.

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

For the record, I checked the make of the aluminium shafts in my Golfcraft irons: True Temper Aluminium Rockets

Edited October 3, 2023 by No_Catchy_Nickname

[bcstones]

1 hour ago, No_Catchy_Nickname said:

For the record, I checked the make of the aluminium shafts in my Golfcraft irons: True Temper Aluminium Rockets

Interesting, that is the same shaft that is on one of the 1 irons I posted....USG Sceptre Stainless w/that TT Aluminium Rocket shaft & Grip Pride Classic DTA grip. 

Sure would love to know more about the who made this iron, can find no info anywhere (yet)

[bcstones]

3 hours ago, Coletrain said:

I think jack might have the most violent swing I've ever seen though. Watson also started with the same type of swing but transitioned later to a much more controlled version.

it's my belief (and I have nothing to back that up with), that with a "let the clubhead do the work" traditional swing, you'll play longer. Think on it, when you swing w/every muscle fiber, that puts an enormous strain on muscle, tendon and joint...the longer you stress the sooner you'll have some kind of injury. Look at Woods (he's just shy of 50 by a couple of years), he has had knee issues for quite some time, prior to that vehicle accident & since, plus back surguries...my question is - will he even be able to play golf into his 60s, unless he changes.

JFK, I'd read, had a beautiful traditional swing, it even helped his back injury. Mickey Wright, after she retired, played w/just 2 clubs - a 6 iron & putter...and still broke 90 & she played into her 80s. For fun, check out @Jiggered 's video, where he plays w/2 "clubs from hell"...
Anyway, have fun....just make sure the ball goes into the hole & forget how many strokes it takes...enjoy the fresh air while you touch the earth...

[ezgoer]

11 minutes ago, bcstones said:

it's my belief (and I have nothing to back that up with), that with a "let the clubhead do the work" traditional swing, you'll play longer. Think on it, when you swing w/every muscle fiber, that puts an enormous strain on muscle, tendon and joint...the longer you stress the sooner you'll have some kind of injury. Look at Woods (he's just shy of 50 by a couple of years), he has had knee issues for quite some time, prior to that vehicle accident & since, plus back surguries...my question is - will he even be able to play golf into his 60s, unless he changes.

JFK, I'd read, had a beautiful traditional swing, it even helped his back injury. Mickey Wright, after she retired, played w/just 2 clubs - a 6 iron & putter...and still broke 90 & she played into her 80s. For fun, check out @Jiggered 's video, where he plays w/2 "clubs from hell"...
Anyway, have fun....just make sure the ball goes into the hole & forget how many strokes it takes...enjoy the fresh air while you touch the earth...

Look at Sam Snead also. Limber well into his late years. The modern max effort does seem to take a toll for some. Bryson is scaling back now too. I think Tiger may have done a lot of his damage with his legendary workouts. Can’t remember if it was the knee or the back he tweaked working out with Navy Seals supposedly. Who knows how long his back would have held up anyways. 
 Kinda ironic that his dedication to fitness may have prevented him from crushing Jack’s major’s total. 

[ezgoer]

5 hours ago, Coletrain said:

wow, that's quite interesting, will check this out, thanks for the info.

I think jack might have the most violent swing I've ever seen though. Watson also started with the same type of swing but transitioned later to a much more controlled version.

Search out a slow motion of young Jack’s swing. He first slid his left knee towards the target a touch then violently snapped it straight. Amazing it could sustain that for as long as it did. 
 Nicklaus and Palmer probably never got a club head speed in their prime and we all know it would have been as high as anyone’s. I read Norman would swing a 44 inch long 4x stiff and unbelievably tip trimmed (old TT shaft even) persimmon driver at 124mph. Even the tour pros would marvel at his driving abilities and the height he hit it. 

Edited October 3, 2023 by ezgoer

[NRJyzr]

1 hour ago, ezgoer said:

I think Tiger may have done a lot of his damage with his legendary workouts.

 

Not sure about the back, but the knee was an additional injury sustained during a run...

 

[bcstones]

1 hour ago, NRJyzr said:

 

Not sure about the back, but the knee was an additional injury sustained during a run...

 

I understand what you and @ezgoer are saying...I guess my point is that w/today's super aggressive swing style, it puts alot of stress on the body & even more so w/pre-existing injuries...and if a golfer is using weight or circut training to build up muscle strength, I'd be thinking that increased muscle strength would also increase the stress on the joints, tendons/ligaments, back...
Remember JFK's back injury was in WWII, yet 20 years later, he was still playing golf & seems to have been a very credible golfer...

Edited October 3, 2023 by bcstones

[raggal62]

12 hours ago, No_Catchy_Nickname said:

For the record, I checked the make of the aluminium shafts in my Golfcraft irons: True Temper Aluminium Rockets

Almost sure those had the .390" or .395" tip diameters.

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

3 hours ago, raggal62 said:

Almost sure those had the .390" or .395" tip diameters.

 

Based on where I measured it (at the top of the fairly long hosel), that sounds about right. I seem to recall reading a Japanese site a few years ago soon after I got this aluminium-shafted clubs that said the tips were a shade under or over 1cm, and 1 cm = 0.394".

 

And I bet Palmer must have bent this shafts back in the day much in the same way that modern pros go through carbon-headed drivers.

 

It's great if you've got the OEM's sponsorship, but not so great if you're having to pay out of pocket every time.