Blade users thread (NO DEBATING CLUBHEADS! NO Buy Sell Trade!)

[BombinJim]

Just played my first round today after switching to a Miura combo set. MB-001’s for 5-PW and CB-501’s for 3 and 4. I had low expectations but was very impressed with the ballstrikes, flight, and spin. Felt much easier than my Ping Anser forged CB’s, and honestly picked up a few yards loft-for-loft. The pings are now officially out of the bag.

[DeNinny]

2 hours ago, BombinJim said:

Just played my first round today after switching to a Miura combo set. MB-001’s for 5-PW and CB-501’s for 3 and 4. I had low expectations but was very impressed with the ballstrikes, flight, and spin. Felt much easier than my Ping Anser forged CB’s, and honestly picked up a few yards loft-for-loft. The pings are now officially out of the bag.

So what you're saying is that Miura blades are the answers to your Ansers.   😝

 

I concur!

[NixLix26]

9 hours ago, NRJyzr said:

 

I can't remember where I saw it, but Nippon Shafts has shared diagram info to help show how they've manipulated wall thickness in some of their shafts.  

 

Over the years, many have reported lighter steel shafts having a harsher feel than their heavier siblings.  One place tech has helped is that seems less the case now, especially in Nippon shafts.

 

Yes, my first set of lighter shafts are 120 S400 True tempers on my other set is apex MB. I put prosoft inserts down each shaft and it really made a difference. I still have that set and they may be the perfect match between, the modus which spin toon much and S300 tried and true. Just getting too harsh for my range sessions 

[NixLix26]

These things did not effect me when I played X100 MP29’s in highschool 

[DeNinny]

Brother @NRJyzr FYI after I switched to my gamer BBs yesterday, which have lighter NS Pro 850s than the 950s in my backup bag, I struggled with some dead pulls with my long irons.  But the good thing is that our discussion over it helped me understand root cause better.  I *think* the lighter shaft was making it easier to get too quick in transition and I'd come OTT resulting in a pull.  I could see it in my divots.  It's something I'm gonna focus and work on today.  

 

I was also hitting about half a club longer when I did strike it well, so there's that.  🤷

[NixLix26]

I know it’s a blade iron thread. But look at this beauty. Brand new out of the box with a big boy X100 shaft.  Time to get the lumber out this summer. 

[Christen_The_Sloop]

Took a mixed bag or 6,8 and PWs to the range today - TN87, MS-203, MR23CB US Spec, Hogan Redlines, Mac pro-82 and Founders 200 series. Still haven't gotten my distances back since the broken arm and don't expect to for a while. The most I could get out of an 8 iron is 145 carry, but most are flying 135ish. I'm usually around 155 without much effort, so at least I'm in the same neighborhood as before. It's been almost exactly 3 and a half months. I still can't giver, which makes it perfect to work on mechanics/sequencing. Over the winter I read Hogan's 5 fundamentals and took a few things to heart and I can't hit a hook right now. I've never really faded the irons, but I do now. Still haven't hit driver since the crash - wonder how it'll fly, but I'm not going to go down that road for at least another couple weeks.

 

I've done a fair bit of practice with just my left handed wedges this winter and now my right arm stays pretty passive. Most of the power in the swing is a result of the turn and gravity. I used to hit a lot of draws. It'll be interesting to see how it goes. I was finding the sweet spot ok with every club and the X100s in the MR23s didn't bother me at all, so it's a relief that I won't have to change my entire set-up.

 

When I get out on the course, I definitely feel like it's going to be a different game. It's amazing how you adapt to physical limitations. My immortal soul...

 

 

 

[DeNinny]

7 hours ago, Christen_The_Sloop said:

Took a mixed bag or 6,8 and PWs to the range today - TN87, MS-203, MR23CB US Spec, Hogan Redlines, Mac pro-82 and Founders 200 series. Still haven't gotten my distances back since the broken arm and don't expect to for a while. The most I could get out of an 8 iron is 145 carry, but most are flying 135ish. I'm usually around 155 without much effort, so at least I'm in the same neighborhood as before. It's been almost exactly 3 and a half months. I still can't giver, which makes it perfect to work on mechanics/sequencing. Over the winter I read Hogan's 5 fundamentals and took a few things to heart and I can't hit a hook right now. I've never really faded the irons, but I do now. Still haven't hit driver since the crash - wonder how it'll fly, but I'm not going to go down that road for at least another couple weeks.

 

I've done a fair bit of practice with just my left handed wedges this winter and now my right arm stays pretty passive. Most of the power in the swing is a result of the turn and gravity. I used to hit a lot of draws. It'll be interesting to see how it goes. I was finding the sweet spot ok with every club and the X100s in the MR23s didn't bother me at all, so it's a relief that I won't have to change my entire set-up.

 

When I get out on the course, I definitely feel like it's going to be a different game. It's amazing how you adapt to physical limitations. My immortal soul...

 

 

 

 

I'd consider selling my soul to hit a 145 yd 8i.  On a really good day I can hit mine 135.  

 

And yes the power in the swing comes from your turn and also "holding the lag" while you turn.  When you are holding the lag you are keeping your lead wrist hinged and your trail elbow bent.  What this does is keep the club and clubhead, including all its weight, close to the body.  This gives your overall swing a low moment of inertia.  You can turn fast this way and with low energy put into it.  And by Newton's laws of conservation of angular momentum, as soon as you start extending the clubhead away from your body, i.e. releasing the lag, you will start to rotate slower or you need to work even harder to maintain the same turning speed.  This is why casting the club at the top is such a power killer.  It gets the clubhead weight farther away from the body at the top, and this slows down the golfer's turn right from the beginning.  Casting creates a higher MOI for the swing itself.  Not good!

 

Again, 'tis better to hold the club close to the body by keeping the trail elbow bent and keeping the wrists hinged at the start of the downswing.  And then as you turn, let centripetal force and gravity pull your arms to full extension towards the latter part of the swing.  This is the theoretical way to generate clubhead speed and thus power.  Turn as fast as possible for as long as possible before extending the trail arm. 

 

And practicing this with just your left arm and hand is simple because you keep that arm straight in the swing anyway.  And all you need to do is hinge your left wrist at the top and then unhinge your left wrist through centripetal force and gravity on the way down.

 

Hogan didn't explicitly state the science behind everything in 5 lessons, but it is completely aligned with the mechanics he explains.

 

And by what you explain, you might have tried to assist this action by using your right arm more than you needed to, so you had a draw tendency.  Now that you've learned to passivate your right hand and arm, you don't draw it as much.

[Nard_S]

9 hours ago, Christen_The_Sloop said:

Took a mixed bag or 6,8 and PWs to the range today - TN87, MS-203, MR23CB US Spec, Hogan Redlines, Mac pro-82 and Founders 200 series. Still haven't gotten my distances back since the broken arm and don't expect to for a while. The most I could get out of an 8 iron is 145 carry, but most are flying 135ish. I'm usually around 155 without much effort, so at least I'm in the same neighborhood as before. It's been almost exactly 3 and a half months. I still can't giver, which makes it perfect to work on mechanics/sequencing. Over the winter I read Hogan's 5 fundamentals and took a few things to heart and I can't hit a hook right now. I've never really faded the irons, but I do now. Still haven't hit driver since the crash - wonder how it'll fly, but I'm not going to go down that road for at least another couple weeks.

 

I've done a fair bit of practice with just my left handed wedges this winter and now my right arm stays pretty passive. Most of the power in the swing is a result of the turn and gravity. I used to hit a lot of draws. It'll be interesting to see how it goes. I was finding the sweet spot ok with every club and the X100s in the MR23s didn't bother me at all, so it's a relief that I won't have to change my entire set-up.

 

When I get out on the course, I definitely feel like it's going to be a different game. It's amazing how you adapt to physical limitations. My immortal soul...

 

 

 

Glad to hear your on the mend. Have at it.

[mgoblue83]

On 3/19/2021 at 9:27 PM, NixLix26 said:

Not sure if you call it camber? But the leading edge looks almost to circular to my eye. Like it rolls and doesn’t sit flat. Just my stupid humble opinion. I would most certainly like to hit one of those sticks. 

 

Built up a 6i demo and tried it on the course for the first time today. Absolutely fantastic in looks, feel, and ball flight. It's 2 degrees stronger but it has less offset and launches the ball higher than my Scratch SB-1. It also cut through the wind instead of ballooning yet has plenty of spin and spins back a couple feet on our soft Michigan greens. Promptly ordered the rest of the set after the round.

[vakaviti]

@Kingcat990

 

Got a set of 4 to PW heads in this week going to get them shafted up in some MMT's. 

 

Cant wait to get them out on course

 

 

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

1 hour ago, vakaviti said:

@Kingcat990

 

Got a set of 4 to PW heads in this week going to get them shafted up in some MMT's. 

 

Cant wait to get them out on course

 

 

 

I don't see many JBeam irons around here. Woods, yes, and also a few wedges, but not irons.

They have pretty strong lofts, don't they?

[Tree Levino]

16 hours ago, DeNinny said:

 

I'd consider selling my soul to hit a 145 yd 8i.  On a really good day I can hit mine 135.  

 

And yes the power in the swing comes from your turn and also "holding the lag" while you turn.  When you are holding the lag you are keeping your lead wrist hinged and your trail elbow bent.  What this does is keep the club and clubhead, including all its weight, close to the body.  This gives your overall swing a low moment of inertia.  You can turn fast this way and with low energy put into it.  And by Newton's laws of conservation of angular momentum, as soon as you start extending the clubhead away from your body, i.e. releasing the lag, you will start to rotate slower or you need to work even harder to maintain the same turning speed.  This is why casting the club at the top is such a power killer.  It gets the clubhead weight farther away from the body at the top, and this slows down the golfer's turn right from the beginning.  Casting creates a higher MOI for the swing itself.  Not good!

 

Again, 'tis better to hold the club close to the body by keeping the trail elbow bent and keeping the wrists hinged at the start of the downswing.  And then as you turn, let centripetal force and gravity pull your arms to full extension towards the latter part of the swing.  This is the theoretical way to generate clubhead speed and thus power.  Turn as fast as possible for as long as possible before extending the trail arm. 

 

And practicing this with just your left arm and hand is simple because you keep that arm straight in the swing anyway.  And all you need to do is hinge your left wrist at the top and then unhinge your left wrist through centripetal force and gravity on the way down.

 

Hogan didn't explicitly state the science behind everything in 5 lessons, but it is completely aligned with the mechanics he explains.

 

And by what you explain, you might have tried to assist this action by using your right arm more than you needed to, so you had a draw tendency.  Now that you've learned to passivate your right hand and arm, you don't draw it as much.

“Holding lag” is quite possibly one of the most overused, misunderstood, and false ideas in golf. Forces oppose one another and trying to get rid of angles can actually 1) gain you speed and 2) get your impact position looking more like you’re holding lag. 
 

I had some swing issues with driver in the off season and messed around with Montys no turn cast and in combination with my work with my pro I sorted out my driver with a feel that is casting but actually lowers my spin loft and dynamic loft...  go figure. 
 

Also, for giving a big run down about how holding angles is a good thing and gains you speed and power you admittedly only carry 8 135. My 38 degree 8 iron comfortably carries 170 but I can get it to 180 carry if I go after it (which I don’t do). I don’t say this for bragging rights at all because I genuinely think it doesn’t matter how far you hit it to an extent as long as you can repeatedly hit that number, I just struggle with people preaching to hold lag. 

[DeNinny]

23 minutes ago, TigerInTheWoods said:

“Holding lag” is quite possibly one of the most overused, misunderstood, and false ideas in golf. Forces oppose one another and trying to get rid of angles can actually 1) gain you speed and 2) get your impact position looking more like you’re holding lag. 
 

I had some swing issues with driver in the off season and messed around with Montys no turn cast and in combination with my work with my pro I sorted out my driver with a feel that is casting but actually lowers my spin loft and dynamic loft...  go figure. 
 

Also, for giving a big run down about how holding angles is a good thing and gains you speed and power you admittedly only carry 8 135. My 38 degree 8 iron comfortably carries 170 but I can get it to 180 carry if I go after it (which I don’t do). I don’t say this for bragging rights at all because I genuinely think it doesn’t matter how far you hit it to an extent as long as you can repeatedly hit that number, I just struggle with people preaching to hold lag. 

Because of the way the actual term has been taught and explained, it wasn't the best choice of words and I understand what you are saying.  I DO NOT mean it in terms of what teachers typically teach.  I agree that the term is overused and misunderstood.  That's why I put it in quotes! Please understand this.  I meant it only in terms of "not releasing it" or "not casting".

 

My main point is that to generate turning speed you have to turn with a low moment of inertia which is to keep the club weight close to the body.  This is the theoretical way to turn with speed.  That is physics fact.  And that's all I am trying to explain.

 

As to what you've been taught to generate power I doubt what I'm saying is in contradiction, but I'd have to actually look at it.  Again I'm not trying to explain it like a golf teacher.  I'm just giving physics information.

Edited March 30, 2021 by DeNinny

[vakaviti]

7 hours ago, No_Catchy_Nickname said:

 

I don't see many JBeam irons around here. Woods, yes, and also a few wedges, but not irons.

They have pretty strong lofts, don't they?

 

You are correct they have very strong lofts....cant complain about the looks and small profile will see how they play out at standard lofts might weaken them a couple of degrees down the track.

[DeNinny]

@Christen_The_Sloop and @TigerInTheWoods so as not to get into a golf teachings semantics argument, here is all I meant by initially turning with the club close to the body so as to generate turning speed:

 

 

 

That's all!

 

[Tree Levino]

Hogan: "If you don't mind, I'll hit a ball"
Me: "Please f*cking do!"

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

14 minutes ago, vakaviti said:

 

You are correct they have very strong lofts....cant complain about the looks and small profile will see how they play out at standard lofts might weaken them a couple of degrees down the track.

 

I'd certainly play them as they are first, like you said.

 

I'm not sure why they went with strong lofts in a blade. Looking at the lofts, it's like a 4i to 9i set🤔

Still, pretty cool, rare set to have👍

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

I played a persimmon and blades half round this evening, taking out my Taylormade TD irons. These came out in 1988 or 89, and featured hollow body long irons (1i - 4i). I had a set as a junior with either a 1i or 2i, but unfortunately they were stolen. 

 

Anyhow, I found a 3i-SW set here and picked them to rekindle some old memories. Back in the day, I never liked hitting the hollow body long irons off the deck, as I thought the soles were too wide. Now, with hybrids and hollow body driving irons, the long irons look positively slim, and I was striping them today. I don't think I've ever hit long irons as well as this; two perfect layups on the par 5s, and one 3i into a long par four that finished on the right edge of the green (pretty much where I wanted to be, because there's OB tight left, and I draw the ball). 

 

 

These Taylormades were tons of fun to play. The middle and short irons are pure blades, and look great at address. They're cast stainless, so the feel isn't as soft as a good forged iron, but it's OK.

 

I also paired them a Taylormade TPA XVIII putter, but I didn't do quite as well with that. 19 putts over nine holes, including three-putting a birdie attempt on the first and three-putting a par save from 6ft after that 3i on the long par 4. Ugh.

 

4-over par 40 with clubs over 40 years old [edit: 30 years old, not 40]. And an old wound surlyn ball😉

 

Here's the 3i at address.

 

Edited April 2, 2021 by No_Catchy_Nickname

[Nard_S]

22 minutes ago, No_Catchy_Nickname said:

I played a persimmon and blades half round this evening, taking out my Taylormade TD irons. These came out in 1988 or 89, and featured hollow body long irons (1i - 4i). I had a set as a junior with either a 1i or 2i, but unfortunately they were stolen. 

 

Anyhow, I found a 3i-SW set here and picked them to rekindle some old memories. Back in the day, I never liked hitting the hollow body long irons off the deck, as I thought the soles were too wide. Now, with hybrids and hollow body driving irons, the long irons look positively slim, and I was striping them today. I don't think I've ever hit long irons as well as this; two perfect layups on the par 5s, and one 3i into a long par four that finished on the right edge of the green (pretty much where I wanted to be, because there's OB tight left, and I draw the ball). 

 

 

These Taylormades were tons of fun to play. The middle and short irons are pure blades, and look great at address. They're cast stainless, so the feel isn't as soft as a good forged iron, but it's OK.

 

I also paired them a Taylormade TPA XVIII putter, but I didn't do quite as well with that. 19 putts over nine holes, including three-putting a birdie attempt on the first and three-putting a par save from 6ft after that 3i on the long par 4. Ugh.

 

4-over par 40 with clubs over 40 years old. And an old wound surlyn ball😉

 

Here's the 3i at address.

 

I remember an ICW club made by TM that had the same progressive hollow body design.

 

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

3 minutes ago, Nard_S said:

I remember an ICW club made by TM that had the same progressive hollow body design.

 

 

Yep. I think the ICWs were released following the TDs. There were one or two different iterations of the ICW as well, IIRC. 

 

I have to say, I was really impressed with how the TDs played. The hollow long irons felt way, way better than I remembered. The SW is also a hidden gem. Really nice shape to it.

 

[Gsea]

4 hours ago, No_Catchy_Nickname said:

I played a persimmon and blades half round this evening, taking out my Taylormade TD irons. These came out in 1988 or 89, and featured hollow body long irons (1i - 4i). I had a set as a junior with either a 1i or 2i, but unfortunately they were stolen. 

 

Anyhow, I found a 3i-SW set here and picked them to rekindle some old memories. Back in the day, I never liked hitting the hollow body long irons off the deck, as I thought the soles were too wide. Now, with hybrids and hollow body driving irons, the long irons look positively slim, and I was striping them today. I don't think I've ever hit long irons as well as this; two perfect layups on the par 5s, and one 3i into a long par four that finished on the right edge of the green (pretty much where I wanted to be, because there's OB tight left, and I draw the ball). 

 

 

These Taylormades were tons of fun to play. The middle and short irons are pure blades, and look great at address. They're cast stainless, so the feel isn't as soft as a good forged iron, but it's OK.

 

I also paired them a Taylormade TPA XVIII putter, but I didn't do quite as well with that. 19 putts over nine holes, including three-putting a birdie attempt on the first and three-putting a par save from 6ft after that 3i on the long par 4. Ugh.

 

4-over par 40 with clubs over 40 years old. And an old wound surlyn ball😉

 

Here's the 3i at address.

 

I actually have just the 3 iron that I picked up years ago for the exact reason of it being so easy to hit (when everyone was jumping on hybrids). Not sure of the loft, I think its 22*. Anyone know for sure?

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

5 hours ago, Gsea said:

I actually have just the 3 iron that I picked up years ago for the exact reason of it being so easy to hit (when everyone was jumping on hybrids). Not sure of the loft, I think its 22*. Anyone know for sure?

 

I'm pretty sure that's right. I think the specs were:

SW: 56* (May have been 55*, but I think 56* is more likely. There was also a 61* lob wedge offered).

PW: 50* (sure about this)

9i: 45*

8i: 41*

7i: 37*

6i: 33*

5i: 29* (standard lie was 60*)

4i: 25

3i: 22*

2i: 19*

1i: ? (Ironfinder says 17*)

 

Incidentally, those lofts from 3i-SW are what I measured mine at AND what I found on the net, so I'm guessing they're correct. My SW was 55.5*.

 

The black dot on the sole of mine indicates standard loft. I can't remember what the other colours were, but I think they offered three lie options, flat, standard, upright. Sorry, no idea what the difference in actual lie were between the three options.

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

10 hours ago, Nard_S said:

I remember an ICW club made by TM that had the same progressive hollow body design.

 

 

Just did a bit of digging for TD specs, and found some info on the ICW. "ICW" stood for Inner Cavity Weighting, and the ICW 5s came out first. They featured a hollow body in the long irons down to the 5i. Later, the ICW 11s came out featuring, you guessed it, a hollow body in all 11 irons--which I presume means 1i to SW or gap wedge if there was one. Now that is something. Hollow body even in the SW!?

 

Incidentally, the TD stood for tri-dimensional, meaning they balanced the club on three axes: sole to topline, toe to heel, and front to back. Kind of applying the principles of wood design to irons, I suppose. Sounds a lot like bull***t to me.

Edited April 2, 2021 by No_Catchy_Nickname
spelling

[DeNinny]

23 hours ago, No_Catchy_Nickname said:

Incidentally, the TD stood for tri-dimensional, meaning they balanced the club on three axes: sole to topline, toe to heel, and front to back. Kind of applying the principles of wood design to irons, I suppose. Sounds a lot like bull***t to me.

Brother @No_Catchy_Nickname you have a good BS gauge.  

 

I don't care what type of club is being marketed - I will tell you that the moment the marketing "science" gets into the "physics" of the clubhead as a free-floating body that is detached from the shaft, you can definitely call it a load of bull***t.  The clubhead's attachment to the shaft is both key and integral to the physics of the entire club striking the ball at the clubface.  The shaft is what actually keeps the clubhead stable through impact!  Without the shaft attachment, there's an entirely different collision that would occur between the ball and clubface.  And it wouldn't be ideal whatsoever.  It's like trying to analyze the physics of a bridge's stability without considering the foundation pillars and what they do.

 

So whether or not you know exactly why golf club marketing "science" is bull***t, rest assured it will be if said "science" neglects how that head performs with the shaft attached to it.  Anyone that says otherwise needs to revisit their understanding of structural physics.

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

14 hours ago, DeNinny said:

Brother @No_Catchy_Nickname you have a good BS gauge.  

 

I don't care what type of club is being marketed - I will tell you that the moment the marketing "science" gets into the "physics" of the clubhead as a free-floating body that is detached from the shaft, you can definitely call it a load of bull***t.  The clubhead's attachment to the shaft is both key and integral to the physics of the entire club striking the ball at the clubface.  The shaft is what actually keeps the clubhead stable through impact!  Without the shaft attachment, there's an entirely different collision that would occur between the ball and clubface.  And it wouldn't be ideal whatsoever.  It's like trying to analyze the physics of a bridge's stability without considering the foundation pillars and what they do.

 

So whether or not you know exactly why golf club marketing "science" is bull***t, rest assured it will be if said "science" neglects how that head performs with the shaft attached to it.  Anyone that says otherwise needs to revisit their understanding of structural physics.

 

That all makes sense, but I still like to believe that the only thing keeping the clubhead stable at impact is my Zen-like control over the swing🤣

 

Edit: My Zen-like control seems to favour the left side of the golf course.

Edited April 3, 2021 by No_Catchy_Nickname
Truthiness

[Nard_S]

Those TD's & ICW's were ahead of their time, no? TM shows spurts of genius at times. The R510 is still one bitchin driver, the TP blades were awesome too.  I really like the new P730's, they're not so cookie cutter. 

 

Hit the range for the 1st time in 2 months, felt good. Amazing how out of shape the old body feels but over all it went well. My 681's are worn in Levi's, real comfortable. This is usually the point where I start thinking, "time for new clubs", lol, but not this time. I find myself swinging with a much higher sense of geometry and awareness of club mass. I hope to stay with that. Looking to sling a bag next week & get the season going.

[DeNinny]

5 hours ago, Nard_S said:

Those TD's & ICW's were ahead of their time, no? TM shows spurts of genius at times. The R510 is still one bitchin driver, the TP blades were awesome too.  I really like the new P730's, they're not so cookie cutter. 

Yeah the R510 was and still is a great driver.

 

To me the V-Steel woods are TaylorMade's finest clubs.

[Nard_S]

2 minutes ago, DeNinny said:

Yeah the R510 was and still is a great driver.

 

To me the V-Steel woods are TaylorMade's finest clubs.

I've heard good things about V-Steel, have never even seen one. I have two R510 TP's . True "blade" of big Ti. When you lock into it, it's a real fun club.

[DeNinny]

27 minutes ago, Nard_S said:

I've heard good things about V-Steel, have never even seen one. I have two R510 TP's . True "blade" of big Ti. When you lock into it, it's a real fun club.

I have the V-Steel next generation in the R5 Duals (3/5/7w), and I've hit my father's 5w.  I've also hit his R510 TP.  They are all still great clubs with an awesome feeling hit.  And all of them are from the almost bygone era when the titanium was still an alloy and a true metal construction.  And because of this is why they are still great playing clubs today.  Their construction is from durable and quality materials.

 

Fast forward to today and you see all these carbon fiber and lower overall titanium and steel heads.  They are super lightweight and such, which although helps offset the added weight of an adjustable and quick disconnect fitting on the shaft, plus they are cheaper to construct, but they also aren't as durable and don't feel as solid as the more pure titanium metal heads like the R510 and V-Steels.