Pete Dye Best Ever (?)

[NevinW]

Play Pete Dye GC in Bridgeport, WV and then tell me he isn't one of the best.

[Jack Pearsall]

Cannot think of a Dye course that didn't just rip a hole into your golf psyche should you let it. Some of the bunkers were 20 or more feet deep, very steep face. Paiute in Las Vegas. And it was windy as hell! The Brutalz were out my friends...

[mosesgolf]

Lost Canyons Golf Course (Shadow &Sky) was a Dye course that opened in Simi Valley back in the boom days of golf course construction. It was probably around 2002 with Fred Couples input. This course was so freaking hard that people just didn't go back. They had to discount green fees to get people to go there to no avail. The courses imo were typical Dye tricked out. Both courses ended up closing recently and is being developed into houses.

 

Some of the holes were utterly ridiculous. IMO many holes were designed to be "dyebolical". I heard Charlie Wie held the course record 65 for the Sky Course from the tips. That is incredible for how difficult the course was.

 

On a personal level the only Dye course I like is TPC Sawgrass.

[WidespreadPanic]

I don't think he's the best, but I can say for sure that he is better than PB Dye.

[warfelg]

I don't think he's the best, but I can say for sure that he is better than PB Dye.

 

Ugh. I took a PAT on a PB Dye course and only 2 people out of 45 passed.

[troublelove]

In conversations about the greats, HS Colt always seems to get missed out. He had a hand in Pine Valley, Sunningdale (old and new), Muirfield, Wentworth (before Ernie killed it), Royal Liverpool, Royal County Down, Lytham, Royal Portrush and Swinley Forest.

 

Pretty sure he didn't use too many bulldozers.

[warfelg]

In conversations about the greats, HS Colt always seems to get missed out. He had a hand in Pine Valley, Sunningdale (old and new), Muirfield, Wentworth (before Ernie killed it), Royal Liverpool, Royal County Down, Lytham, Royal Portrush and Swinley Forest.

 

Pretty sure he didn't use too many bulldozers.

 

He gets lost in the eyes of most of us Americans because not many get to play his courses.

[bullie76]

Frig no.

[stickfish]

Not a Dye fan. I can appreciate his skill as a course architect, but I'm not a fan of some of the tricks he uses on his golf courses. The Straits course is a good example. There's just too many holes where it's very deceiving off the tee.

 

I like a lot of the old designers. Seth Raynor, CB McDonald, Tillinghast.

Kind of hard to lay all the blame - or rewards on the architect alone as they are employed by an owner, or worse yet a group of them. Surely Herb had much to say about the Kohler layouts as had the the PGA whom have decimated Sawgrass IMHO. I have enjoyed many early Dye designs who with the input of his wife create some memorable holes - albeit at times not all positive. And at the end of a destination round what I really want is for a layout to impart some lasting memories. I might suggest for those that are interested to play some Dye designs that did not have the onus of owner whims per se so much i. e. Kampen, Tippecanoe CC, Eagle Creek, etc venture out and discover what he really had to offer. And then I might also suggest playing some of his prodigy's work - for me Tim Liddy and see his real influence in the design arena.

Cheers

<><

Decimated? I didn't think the length had altered significantly, certainly not reduced by a tenth.

Didn't mention length on the Sawgrass changes, although most everyone assumes that alone is the most significant impact and certainly can be. The approach lines to the greens along with altererations to the greeens themselves have been radically altered since the course was open. On the plus side the PGA did build a swank clubhouse.

 

You said decimated which means reduced by one tenth.

 

Etymological Fallacy, a tendency to believe that a word’s current meaning should be dictated by its roots. Fortunately Oxford has my back. Good one on you for pointing it out though - truly. My wife who teaches university English clearly sees your response as it were to be accurate based on the root. Well played. The things I learn on this site.

 

Cheers

<><

[AppAlum]

I don't think he's the best, but I can say for sure that he is better than PB Dye.

 

Truth.

 

I don't think he is the best but I have enjoyed some of his tracks. Teeth of the Dog, Dye Fore, and Harbour Town are just a few that I really enjoyed. One I've never liked is the old Cardinal CC in Greensboro, NC.

[Night train]

I've always thought really good golf courses offer a test for a skilled player but can still be enjoyed by an average player.......easier said than done.

 

Never enjoyed Pete Dye stuff, it's far too frustrating and demanding for average players.........give me a nice Tom Fazio or Coore/Crenshaw and it's enjoyable

[msd71]

Not a huge fan. My favorite Dye course is one of his least Dye-like, and also one of his first - Radrick Farms in Ann Arbor, MI.

[AC168]

I think he's done a lot of great courses. I haven't played The Golf Club which I hear is fantastic but most of his courses that I've played are excellent.

[aliikane]

Never played a Pete Dye course, but I definitely want to. From my understanding is that he is a master of visually tricking the player by making things look much more intimidating. I respect that. Haha.

[playa]

Nope, just a tricked up layout, trying to provide the ultimate test out of a swamp. It's just not what I call a good test of golf, maybe a good result of luck at times. The 17th is an example of tricked up. Yes it's a different and great hole for excitement on TV, but a good test, nope; at 28 yards wide and 22 yards deep (at the longest measurement), no bail out, bunker in front occupying much of the carry to the middle and right, wind; maybe at 148 yards some players might thing that's short, but I've played the hole more than three times and haven't missed the green, no wind at all each time.

 

I might add that every time I played the course it was muddy and the greens were very soft, made things much easier.

I agree. My course is less than 6,000 yards from the tips, is flat and has small flattish greens. But it's tight and has water and ob everywhere, and I guarantee if it was tricked up like the tpc was this week it would embarrass the tour players. My point being that tour players shooting big numbers doesn't make a course great, any course can be unplayable if tricked up enough. I personally think it is a great course for tournament golf, but I don't put much weight in tournament scores. If they set it up soft and the winning score was 25 under it wouldn't make the design worse.

[gvogel]

Go play some James Braid

 

+1.

 

Kings and Queens - wonderful routing, really fun to play.