Is pursuing a golf career worth it anymore?

[krtgolfing]

I would never advise anyone to do it. One will have to put in crazy hours and a lot of years to achieve any type of decent salary. Did it for 3 years and hated it. Thankfully went back to college and got a great paying job right out of college.

[jmck]

^^^

 

$40k is an abysmal salary for an HP but not uncommon. Not sure the club should be expected to pay for his airfare for senior q school though. Their employee is basically trying to quit and leave them with a job opening. Good on your members though for supporting him.

 

Iteachgolf isn't quoting anything that is untrue, but he is portraying the exception as the norm and the expectation. The PGA of America does this as well, and the sham golf schools like GC of America excel at it. They show you Bob Ford and the like and don't mention the every day assistant pro that has to go tell Mr Gooderschmidt that he can't wear jeans on the practice tee because his HP is too big of a p***y to do it or the $25k a year guy that passes his PAT and still has to go in the same evening and clean carts because the high school kid got mono at prom.

 

I agree with this. Iteach is way closer to the top of his field (and deservedly so) than he is to the average outcome of someone who's kicking around the idea of becoming a pro at the age of 29 as a career change. So on the one hand, if you're going to do it, might as well do it with the goal of ending up as successful as iteach. But on the other hand, it's important to be realistic about where most people end up.....and in my experience someone washing out after a few years of working like a slave for very little (or Blade Hunter's bitter old man friend) is much more of a typical outcome that iteach's.

 

I mean the OP is 29, married, and would need to practice a bunch to pass his PAT. While there's nothing wrong with setting lofty goals for oneself then working very hard toward them, this seems like a particularly appropriate circumstance in which to temper the OP's expectations.

[golfandfishing]

^^^^

 

The average person is an idiot. That means half of the people you meet are dumber than that. The average HP makes $70k. That means probably half make less than that. You don’t ever mention those - you state the average then back it up with examples of people making more, then you dismiss examples that others give of people making less. A lot of folks don’t understand how statistics work, and that’s ok. They think the average is the floor, and that’s not true. HP at Caves Valley makes $110k, HP at an RTJ trail course makes $70. Somewhere a guy is making $30k, but you don’t acknowledge or believe that. The average is now somehow portrayed as what one can expect, and that’s not true. Roughly half of any sample will be below average.

[Ferguson]

^^^^

 

The average person is an idiot. That means half of the people you meet are dumber than that. The average HP makes $70k. That means probably half make less than that. You don't ever mention those - you state the average then back it up with examples of people making more, then you dismiss examples that others give of people making less. A lot of folks don't understand how statistics work, and that's ok. They think the average is the floor, and that's not true. HP at Caves Valley makes $110k, HP at an RTJ trail course makes $70. Somewhere a guy is making $30k, but you don't acknowledge or believe that. The average is now somehow portrayed as what one can expect, and that's not true. Roughly half of any sample will be below average.

 

 

Many cast aside good judgement and let themselves be blinded by dreams and fantasy.

[MtlJeff]

Were getting sidetracked into a discussion just about head pros. They do well, but how many pros out there don't become head pros, how many don't get jobs as assistants so end up doing something unrelated. These are all relevant questions too as there are a finite amount of positions available

 

The average NFL kicker makes what, 1M dollars? That's higher than the average salary in my job now by a wide margin, but there's only 30 kicker jobs and if i don't get one the dropoff is massive to the next comparable thing. Whereas if you don't become a marketing executive you can still be a middle manager and make an ok salary

 

I don't have all the data on the golf business, I just seem to meet more guys "looking to make it" then who have their dream job so to speak

 

Also I am not trying to bad mouth anyone in the golf business, just answer the op questions about how it compares to other businesses in terms of having success

[iteachgolf]

^^^^

 

The average person is an idiot. That means half of the people you meet are dumber than that. The average HP makes $70k. That means probably half make less than that. You don’t ever mention those - you state the average then back it up with examples of people making more, then you dismiss examples that others give of people making less. A lot of folks don’t understand how statistics work, and that’s ok. They think the average is the floor, and that’s not true. HP at Caves Valley makes $110k, HP at an RTJ trail course makes $70. Somewhere a guy is making $30k, but you don’t acknowledge or believe that. The average is now somehow portrayed as what one can expect, and that’s not true. Roughly half of any sample will be below average.

 

Where did I argue that some make very little? Where did I once say that I don’t believe some head pros only make $30-40k? You won’t find it because I never did. The head pro at the old course I taught at only makes $40k. So I obviously know they exist. But he only works 40 hours a week and is done every day at 2pm. He never teaches and works on his own game a bunch as he’s one of the better players in the section. He probably makes as much or more playing than he does from the club. But he took the job because of the opportunity it gave him to play a lot and be with his family. He could have a job that pays a lot more but he likes having the freedom he has.

 

I’m very aware of how statistics work. I literally said that it’s what you make out of it and if you are driven there is money to be made and if it’s just a job you won’t make money. You’re correct the average person isn’t very good, which is why I wouldn’t expect to be average. I’d expect to be much better than that. I had zero connections in the golf industry, and made more than the national average by the time I was 23. The opportunity is there if someone really wants it

[golfandfishing]

“ He probably makes as much or more playing than he does from the club.”

 

So he doesn’t make $40k. He makes $80+.

[iteachgolf]

“ He probably makes as much or more playing than he does from the club.”

 

So he doesn’t make $40k. He makes $80+.

 

Exactly. And I can promise Bladehunters example makes just as much if not more playing section events than his club pays him. He’s not only making $40k either if he’s that close to playing senior tour golf. That’s just what the club pays him.

[bladehunter]

^^^

 

$40k is an abysmal salary for an HP but not uncommon. Not sure the club should be expected to pay for his airfare for senior q school though. Their employee is basically trying to quit and leave them with a job opening. Good on your members though for supporting him.

 

Iteachgolf isn’t quoting anything that is untrue, but he is portraying the exception as the norm and the expectation. The PGA of America does this as well, and the sham golf schools like GC of America excel at it. They show you Bob Ford and the like and don’t mention the every day assistant pro that has to go tell Mr Gooderschmidt that he can’t wear jeans on the practice tee because his HP is too big of a p***y to do it or the $25k a year guy that passes his PAT and still has to go in the same evening and clean carts because the high school kid got mono at prom.

 

I agree. Wasn’t for senior tour. Just to play in the senior pga tournament. Now of course that possibility was there if he played well and gained some sort of status he’d leave in s second. Lol.

 

I just thought it would have been a nice gesture to help pay his way. One of Owners wouldn’t even kick in when I passed the hat and I took it directly to their hands. One did contribute and I saw Dust fly out of his wallet when he opened it. Lol.

 

 

[bladehunter]

“ He probably makes as much or more playing than he does from the club.”

 

So he doesn’t make $40k. He makes $80+.

 

Exactly. And I can promise Bladehunters example makes just as much if not more playing section events than his club pays him. He’s not only making $40k either if he’s that close to playing senior tour golf. That’s just what the club pays him.

 

I teach I’m not trying to argue that you’re examples don’t exist. I’ve worked in high end clubs. I know they do. But I also know that what I’m telling you is real.

 

This man is my only neighbor. Lives across the road 100 yards away. We practice together. And he’s poor. Drives a 20 year old car and rents. Doesn’t have a drinking habit nor even a wife now. And he’s a good stick. But aging out. He’s been at our club for 16 years. Two years ago they stopped giving. Him a Christmas bonus. With no explanation. And according to rounds tracked the course sees more play every year. It’s semi private and because of a few younger members like myself we have grown in spite of some members dying off. Same family has owned the course since 1969 when it was built. And they simply aren’t good to him.

 

If anyone doubts my story in him nearly qualifying for the senior pga pm me and I’ll share the name. The rounds are posted on the website. But I’m not blasting his business publically.

 

Last year he cashed 5 times in sectional events. According to him he made $2800 after travel expenses. And he has to clock a 40 hour week , sometimes more on weeks when the club has outside events coming in. He’s not a pro that gets free time to play and practice on the clock.

 

In my opinion is a single man with no kids profession 75% of the positions out there. If you have a family to think of there isn’t much future in it. And I say that as a person who tries to live for today. My wife is the planner.

[golfandfishing]

^^^

 

$40k is an abysmal salary for an HP but not uncommon. Not sure the club should be expected to pay for his airfare for senior q school though. Their employee is basically trying to quit and leave them with a job opening. Good on your members though for supporting him.

 

Iteachgolf isn’t quoting anything that is untrue, but he is portraying the exception as the norm and the expectation. The PGA of America does this as well, and the sham golf schools like GC of America excel at it. They show you Bob Ford and the like and don’t mention the every day assistant pro that has to go tell Mr Gooderschmidt that he can’t wear jeans on the practice tee because his HP is too big of a p***y to do it or the $25k a year guy that passes his PAT and still has to go in the same evening and clean carts because the high school kid got mono at prom.

 

I agree. Wasn’t for senior tour. Just to play in the senior pga tournament. Now of course that possibility was there if he played well and gained some sort of status he’d leave in s second. Lol.

 

I just thought it would have been a nice gesture to help pay his way. One of Owners wouldn’t even kick in when I passed the hat and I took it directly to their hands. One did contribute and I saw Dust fly out of his wallet when he opened it. Lol.

 

Sorry, misunderstood that. Senior q school was at TPC Champions, didn’t even think about the Senior Club Pro at Desert Mountain. The club should have kicked in something, you are correct. Even if it was just the use of the database and their influence to ask for participation in the pass the hat. Your guy’s experience is not atypical. It does fall below the “average” mark, but unfortunately is common.

[iteachgolf]

“ He probably makes as much or more playing than he does from the club.”

 

So he doesn’t make $40k. He makes $80+.

 

Exactly. And I can promise Bladehunters example makes just as much if not more playing section events than his club pays him. He’s not only making $40k either if he’s that close to playing senior tour golf. That’s just what the club pays him.

 

I teach I’m not trying to argue that you’re examples don’t exist. I’ve worked in high end clubs. I know they do. But I also know that what I’m telling you is real.

 

This man is my only neighbor. Lives across the road 100 yards away. We practice together. And he’s poor. Drives a 20 year old car and rents. Doesn’t have a drinking habit nor even a wife now. And he’s a good stick. But aging out. He’s been at our club for 16 years. Two years ago they stopped giving. Him a Christmas bonus. With no explanation. And according to rounds tracked the course sees more play every year. It’s semi private and because of a few younger members like myself we have grown in spite of some members dying off. Same family has owned the course since 1969 when it was built. And they simply aren’t good to him.

 

If anyone doubts my story in him nearly qualifying for the senior pga pm me and I’ll share the name. The rounds are posted on the website. But I’m not blasting his business publically.

 

Last year he cashed 5 times in sectional events. According to him he made $2800 after travel expenses. And he has to clock a 40 hour week , sometimes more on weeks when the club has outside events coming in. He’s not a pro that gets free time to play and practice on the clock.

 

In my opinion is a single man with no kids profession 75% of the positions out there. If you have a family to think of there isn’t much future in it. And I say that as a person who tries to live for today. My wife is the planner.

 

I’m not saying his situation isn’t real. But if it is he should leave. There are places he could go that would value his experience and playing ability and pay him more. Especially if he’s not married

[jmck]

A good question for the OP is how willing is his wife to move? If she's an RN she could get a job anywhere in the country. But if she's lucked into a tenure track position at the local college there's no way she should give that up. What about kids? Maybe they're living a town away from his or her parents, which is hugely helpful if her and the OP have kids.

 

Big big difference wanting to be a pro within 25-50 miles of where you currently live, and being able to move anywhere to do so. Heck, maybe his wife wants to put her foot down about living somewhere with four distinct seasons. Crossing FL, AZ, and SoCAL off your list removes an awful lot of clubs from your job search.

[bladehunter]

“ He probably makes as much or more playing than he does from the club.”

 

So he doesn’t make $40k. He makes $80+.

 

Exactly. And I can promise Bladehunters example makes just as much if not more playing section events than his club pays him. He’s not only making $40k either if he’s that close to playing senior tour golf. That’s just what the club pays him.

 

I teach I’m not trying to argue that you’re examples don’t exist. I’ve worked in high end clubs. I know they do. But I also know that what I’m telling you is real.

 

This man is my only neighbor. Lives across the road 100 yards away. We practice together. And he’s poor. Drives a 20 year old car and rents. Doesn’t have a drinking habit nor even a wife now. And he’s a good stick. But aging out. He’s been at our club for 16 years. Two years ago they stopped giving. Him a Christmas bonus. With no explanation. And according to rounds tracked the course sees more play every year. It’s semi private and because of a few younger members like myself we have grown in spite of some members dying off. Same family has owned the course since 1969 when it was built. And they simply aren’t good to him.

 

If anyone doubts my story in him nearly qualifying for the senior pga pm me and I’ll share the name. The rounds are posted on the website. But I’m not blasting his business publically.

 

Last year he cashed 5 times in sectional events. According to him he made $2800 after travel expenses. And he has to clock a 40 hour week , sometimes more on weeks when the club has outside events coming in. He’s not a pro that gets free time to play and practice on the clock.

 

In my opinion is a single man with no kids profession 75% of the positions out there. If you have a family to think of there isn’t much future in it. And I say that as a person who tries to live for today. My wife is the planner.

 

I’m not saying his situation isn’t real. But if it is he should leave. There are places he could go that would value his experience and playing ability and pay him more. Especially if he’s not married

 

Agree with you there. Was pulling for him to make the pga and place well. Then he’d have more leverage to leave with.

[bermuda]

Buy a piece of property in an area likely to grow. Open a driving range there. Put in a self-serve ball machine and hire high schoolers to pick the range. Offer lessons by appointment. In a few years, sell the land to the DOT, Wal-Mart, Amazon, Google, a home builder or some other corporation. If that piece of property is next to a state or private university that is growing, all the better. Hold out as long as you can. One university I know of recently spent the equivalent of about $4 million/acre for some property to expand (~1/4-acre lots for ~$900,000 each.)

 

Start a golf-related YouTube channel that could somehow appeal to kids (trick shots, games, whatever) and rake in the ad revenue.

[bladehunter]

Buy a piece of property in an area likely to grow. Open a driving range there. Put in a self-serve ball machine and hire high schoolers to pick the range. Offer lessons by appointment. In a few years, sell the land to the DOT, Wal-Mart, Amazon, Google, a home builder or some other corporation. If that piece of property is next to a state or private university that is growing, all the better. Hold out as long as you can. One university I know of recently spent the equivalent of about $4 million/acre for some property to expand (~1/4-acre lots for ~$900,000 each.)

 

Start a golf-related YouTube channel that could somehow appeal to kids (trick shots, games, whatever) and rake in the ad revenue.

 

 

best advice here yet

[jmck]

Buy a piece of property in an area likely to grow. Open a driving range there. Put in a self-serve ball machine and hire high schoolers to pick the range. Offer lessons by appointment. In a few years, sell the land to the DOT, Wal-Mart, Amazon, Google, a home builder or some other corporation. If that piece of property is next to a state or private university that is growing, all the better. Hold out as long as you can. One university I know of recently spent the equivalent of about $4 million/acre for some property to expand (~1/4-acre lots for ~$900,000 each.)

 

Start a golf-related YouTube channel that could somehow appeal to kids (trick shots, games, whatever) and rake in the ad revenue.

 

 

best advice here yet

 

Yep. Lots of ranges and courses are worth way less as ranges and courses than as the raw land they're sitting on. Get familiar with zonings, city/town/county government, the rezoning process, and how public water and sewer work in that area and buy accordingly so you're an appealing parcel when the developers come knocking. Find the right piece of land and you're retired in 10 or 15 years with the money to play golf all day.

[bigcountry1219]

Best of luck to you man. I'm 31 and trying to change careers as well - although I'm trying to get into Law Enforcement. It's not easy though. I'm leaving a successful job in finance to do it - scary stuff, but if you know you'll love it and can do decent enough, I say go for it.

[Anser]

Buy a piece of property in an area likely to grow. Open a driving range there. Put in a self-serve ball machine and hire high schoolers to pick the range. Offer lessons by appointment. In a few years, sell the land to the DOT, Wal-Mart, Amazon, Google, a home builder or some other corporation. If that piece of property is next to a state or private university that is growing, all the better. Hold out as long as you can. One university I know of recently spent the equivalent of about $4 million/acre for some property to expand (~1/4-acre lots for ~$900,000 each.)

 

Start a golf-related YouTube channel that could somehow appeal to kids (trick shots, games, whatever) and rake in the ad revenue.

 

You think parcels like this aren't already on those entities radar?

 

That strategy used to work but it was a long game, 10 years or so. Everyone is too aware of what cheap land can end up being worth.

 

And running a driving range is the absolute worst thing in golf and good luck getting hs kids to work lol. Why would they work when Mommy and Daddy just give them money?

[Forged4ever]

If you have to ask the question?

 

No....

 

Fairways & Greens 4ever My Friend⛳️

RP

[Forged4ever]

Buy a piece of property in an area likely to grow. Open a driving range there. Put in a self-serve ball machine and hire high schoolers to pick the range. Offer lessons by appointment. In a few years, sell the land to the DOT, Wal-Mart, Amazon, Google, a home builder or some other corporation. If that piece of property is next to a state or private university that is growing, all the better. Hold out as long as you can. One university I know of recently spent the equivalent of about $4 million/acre for some property to expand (~1/4-acre lots for ~$900,000 each.)

 

Start a golf-related YouTube channel that could somehow appeal to kids (trick shots, games, whatever) and rake in the ad revenue.

 

You think parcels like this aren't already on those entities radar?

 

That strategy used to work but it was a long game, 10 years or so. Everyone is too aware of what cheap land can end up being worth.

 

And running a driving range is the absolute worst thing in golf and good luck getting hs kids to work lol. Why would they work when Mommy and Daddy just give them money?

I had one and you’re exactly right regarding the non-professional help, lol. Good luck with that, lmao.

 

I ended up having to ride the ball cagecart myself to pick up balls cuz I couldn’t keep help and I paid $2.50 more than any range around and gave em great discounts on the shop stuff, apparel, clubs and free balls, etc., but it didn’t matter. Many didn’t even stay a full pay period(two weeks).

 

It was supposed to be a “passive” investment??

 

Jesus Christ, if Madison and two other Pros who taught there didn’t help me out, it’d have been my full time job, lolol

 

I’ll tell ya what though~

 

The kids who used the range had the nicest clubs money could buy and they were dressed to the nines, lol. They looked like mini-Rickies or lil Adams, lmao. It was funny cuz they’d be next to a union guy who got off his shift or a another working stiff who stopped by after work and it was like two different worlds, lolol.

 

Nice kids though the work ethic wasn’t there~

 

I’d offered every single one who was a regular if they wanted a part time job and only two took me up on it and one lasted a week and the other about a month.

 

Funny story on the kid who lasted a month~

 

He was a great kid, polite, kind and well mannered and while I got them golf shirts with our name on it, most wore em untucked and they looked like they’d used it as a bib for an all ya can eat pasta dinner with your mouth only, lol. Jamie had his shirt tucked in, clean and always had a nice pair of bermudas on and FJ shop shoes(First 15yo I saw with shop shoes??).

 

So at about one month, his mother, a sweet lady who took(still does) lessons from Madison shows up and asks what she can do to help as she was “filling in” for her son.

 

I thought she was kidding and I chirped, “go clear the trees(balls that the long ballers sent into the one side that was 305yds out) and then ride the cage from back to front,” and I laughed. With a serious face she asked me if she could ride the cage out to the treeline.

 

I looked at her and said “you’re serious?” and she said yes that Jamie didn’t want to work any more and she felt badly and would work the last two days of the pay period, lol

 

I thanked her and said no need as I was used to it and would take care of it myself.

 

I told Madison that it was too bad that she didn’t ingrain THAT trait in her son, lol

 

Have a great season An?

 

My Best,

RP

[Schley]

Does anyone counsel anyone to avoid teaching, police, fire anymore? They are civil servants and it feels good to give back. Those working in golf are performing a service as well and very noble for there are much better professions in terms of compensation, but having the passion for it really makes my experience as a golfer better and I appreciate your passion!

[golfandfishing]

“Does anyone counsel anyone to avoid teaching, police, fire anymore? ”

 

Yes. The last 3 weeks TV and radio in our area has been filled with teachers saying they regret their decision, would not do it again and are advising young people not to do it unless the structure is changed drastically.

[Schley]

"Does anyone counsel anyone to avoid teaching, police, fire anymore? "

 

Yes. The last 3 weeks TV and radio in our area has been filled with teachers saying they regret their decision, would not do it again and are advising young people not to do it unless the structure is changed drastically.

 

That is after the fact.... I mean growing up... you are focusing on the media. Those jobs are now, and always have been civil servants and valued to those whose opinion is pure (not political).

[Forged4ever]

Does anyone counsel anyone to avoid teaching, police, fire anymore? They are civil servants and it feels good to give back. Those working in golf are performing a service as well and very noble for there are much better professions in terms of compensation, but having the passion for it really makes my experience as a golfer better and I appreciate your passion!

Unfortunately “passion” doesn’t always equate to paying the bills and raising a family though I will say that the Pros that came through our club along with the ones at my range who had a deep “passion” and drive to succeed have done very well for themselves and while not all ended up in club jobs or HP jobs, quite a few parlayed their passion, focus and drive into very successful careers as a result of the networking opportunities that being a Class A Pro gave them.

 

As I tried to insinuate in my original response, and I got this from my Teacher because if a college guy would ask him if “I should be a Class A Pro” Pete would always say no.

 

Some, being the sheep that they were would accept his answer with no further questions however a few would ask, “why not?”

 

He replied simply that if you have to ask that question, it’s not for you. It was tougher to make a buck back in Pete’s day than today(the 1950’s-1970’s) and he said that he KNEW that he wanted to be a Teaching Pro since he was a kid/teenager, just as Sam KNEW that he wanted to be a Tour Pro.

 

How much of a chance do you think that a kid would stand who asked “should I be a Tour Pro” of actually achieving that???

 

Why should succeeding as a Class A be any different?

 

Nice post Schley??

 

My Best,

RP

[golfandfishing]

"Does anyone counsel anyone to avoid teaching, police, fire anymore? "

 

Yes. The last 3 weeks TV and radio in our area has been filled with teachers saying they regret their decision, would not do it again and are advising young people not to do it unless the structure is changed drastically.

 

That is after the fact.... I mean growing up... you are focusing on the media. Those jobs are now, and always have been civil servants and valued to those whose opinion is pure (not political).

 

It wasn’t the media telling people not to be teachers, it was teachers. They simply used the news media to make their point. And of course it was after the fact - career counseling comes from those that have been there. Pretty tough for a chef to tell people not to be teachers because of their experience cooking food for a living.

[Schley]

"Does anyone counsel anyone to avoid teaching, police, fire anymore? "

 

Yes. The last 3 weeks TV and radio in our area has been filled with teachers saying they regret their decision, would not do it again and are advising young people not to do it unless the structure is changed drastically.

 

That is after the fact.... I mean growing up... you are focusing on the media. Those jobs are now, and always have been civil servants and valued to those whose opinion is pure (not political).

 

It wasn't the media telling people not to be teachers, it was teachers. They simply used the news media to make their point. And of course it was after the fact - career counseling comes from those that have been there. Pretty tough for a chef to tell people not to be teachers because of their experience cooking food for a living.

 

I don't know what your point is. I'm referencing the merits and pursuits of a career, not interviewing a teacher today asking: "should I or not?" It is society I'm referencing which is one in the USA where we value civil servants and respect them. Despite what your isolated media reports may show.

 

I have love for civil servants and appreciation for them, by only encouraging them if they have a passion for it. I used to be a teacher for 10 years, my opinion is only one, but when I leave what I'm doing now I'm going back.

[jmck]

I don't know what your point is. I'm referencing the merits and pursuits of a career, not interviewing a teacher today asking: "should I or not?" It is society I'm referencing which is one in the USA where we value civil servants and respect them. Despite what your isolated media reports may show.

 

I have love for civil servants and appreciation for them, by only encouraging them if they have a passion for it. I used to be a teacher for 10 years, my opinion is only one, but when I leave what I'm doing now I'm going back.

 

No offense, but that bolded bit hasn't been true for quite some time. You're describing an ideal version of America, rather than the current reality on the ground. Teachers have lately had to walk out on strike in multiple states due to the lack of respect shown and value placed on them by their respective state legislatures. Teachers are having to go on strike because they're being paid less than a living wage. Think about that for a second, and what it says about our priorities as a society. And that's in K-12. Don't even get me started on higher education's reliance on adjuncts (again, making less than a living wage), or the explosion of highly paid administrative positions that marches in lockstep with tuition increases, or the increasingly usurious student loans being handed out, or the bought and paid for loopholes that particular industry has put into law for their own benefit.

[golfandfishing]

I’m not sure how you miss the point. Your question was: “"Does anyone counsel anyone to avoid teaching, police, fire anymore? "

 

The answer to that was yes. You countered with “that’s just the media” and “after the fact”. It’s not the media telling young people to not be teachers, it was teachers and it was by the tens of thousands over a 5 day walk out that closed public schools in the entire state. If that’s isolated, then yeah, alright.

[Schley]

I'm not sure how you miss the point. Your question was: ""Does anyone counsel anyone to avoid teaching, police, fire anymore? "

 

The answer to that was yes. You countered with "that's just the media" and "after the fact". It's not the media telling young people to not be teachers, it was teachers and it was by the tens of thousands over a 5 day walk out that closed public schools in the entire state. If that's isolated, then yeah, alright.

 

This is freedom being put into action, this is the history of labor in free societies and the advent of unions have these tactics to get the attention of decision makers to leverage them for negotiation. It is a big difference from quitting and leaving the profession. I believe it is the most numerous profession requiring a degree in the states year over year, well over 3 million. "news" or the media highlights which is much farther left wing than it has ever been in the history of the country tends to be drawn to stories that attract readers. I don't make up my mind based on what the news leads with and some talking head tells me what I should think the significance is. I certainly don't think a critical mass of teachers are telling their students, whatever you do don't follow your passion and become a teacher, no matter how much self satisfaction, student and parent appreciation you receive, or difference you make recognized or not on a daily basis. Please, heavens no.

 

Civil servants are valued and appreciated by the citizens, I agree they should be compensated more so as a taxpayer why not vote and advocate for that platform. I simply don't agree that the USA is fundamentally changed by not valuing police, fire, military, or teachers as we traditionally have.

 

BTW those working in the golf profession I value as a golfer for they are there for customer service on many levels, for little pay. Is it worth it? How much do they make? They make a difference. Ok off the soapbox until someone dangles a carrot to have to jump up again.