Thoughts on why people are walking away from the game...

[CMCSGolf]

Hotter temperatures every summer, (due to climate change), is a also factor now. The ever-increasing oppressive summer heat can take much of the fun out of playing golf during the summer months!.

 

:golfer:

 

I don't think so. Climate change is definitively a real thing and a growing problem, but the idea that a 1-3 degree change in average temperature over a summer is the driving change is false. Most people cannot accurately assess temperature to that fine of a point. The idea that people play significantly more golf when it is 2 degrees cooler on a particular day seems silly.

[thug the bunny]

Hotter temperatures every summer, (due to climate change), is a also factor now. The ever-increasing oppressive summer heat can take much of the fun out of playing golf during the summer months!.

 

:golfer:

 

I don't think so. Climate change is definitively a real thing and a growing problem, but the idea that a 1-3 degree change in average temperature over a summer is the driving change is false. Most people cannot accurately assess temperature to that fine of a point. The idea that people play significantly more golf when it is 2 degrees cooler on a particular day seems silly.

 

But the occurrence of 'heat waves', which are generally defined as 3 or more straight days of 90+ deg, is increasing.

[CMCSGolf]

Hotter temperatures every summer, (due to climate change), is a also factor now. The ever-increasing oppressive summer heat can take much of the fun out of playing golf during the summer months!.

 

:golfer:

 

I don't think so. Climate change is definitively a real thing and a growing problem, but the idea that a 1-3 degree change in average temperature over a summer is the driving change is false. Most people cannot accurately assess temperature to that fine of a point. The idea that people play significantly more golf when it is 2 degrees cooler on a particular day seems silly.

 

But the occurrence of 'heat waves', which are generally defined as 3 or more straight days of 90+ deg, is increasing.

 

I think that's true. But if I took the five 95 degree days in the summer and made them 85 degrees, do you think that would change the number of golfers by more than 1%? It's difficult to know this answer, my only point is that I don't think this is a big issue. However, it is at least something that is different today than in 1990. So many of the "reasons" listed here are negatives of golf, but they were negatives in 1990 so it wouldn't cause people to drop out. Change in temperature is plausible, but I think the magnitude of the effect would be really really tiny, if at all.

[bobcat]

Hotter temperatures every summer, (possibly due to climate change), is a also factor now, (during the summer). The ever-increasing oppressive summer heat can take much of the fun out of playing golf during the summer months!.

 

:golfer:

 

I don't think so. Climate change is definitively a real thing and a growing problem, but the idea that a 1-3 degree change in average temperature over a summer is the driving change is false. Most people cannot accurately assess temperature to that fine of a point. The idea that people play significantly more golf when it is 2 degrees cooler on a particular day seems silly.

 

But the occurrence of 'heat waves', which are generally defined as 3 or more straight days of 90+ deg, is increasing.

 

I think that's true. But if I took the five 95 degree days in the summer and made them 85 degrees, do you think that would change the number of golfers by more than 1%? It's difficult to know this answer, my only point is that I don't think this is a big issue. However, it is at least something that is different today than in 1990. So many of the "reasons" listed here are negatives of golf, but they were negatives in 1990 so it wouldn't cause people to drop out. Change in temperature is plausible, but I think the magnitude of the effect would be really really tiny, if at all.

 

I simply pointed out that excessive heat is a 'factor' in deciding whether or not to play right now, (during the summer months). I certainly did not mean to imply it is the reason for golf's decline all by itself!! Go back to Page 5 and read Post #139 to see what I believe to be the main reason for golf's decline!

[FourTops]

Playing or not has nothing to do with weather. I think it has a lot to do with public schools who once had money to support school sports programs, but despite more money being thrown at schools, all of it goes everywhere else but school funded sports programs...unless it's football.. Thus, parents have inherited a commitment to fund their kids programs and drive them all over town to sports events. I know of one couple who spends upwards of $2,000/mo on sports activities. Plus, if a kid doesn't participate, they're not part of the "click". And all of this takes place on Sat and Sun. .

 

It's not the cost, it's the cost of other things.

[wrmiller]

I lived in Tucson, AZ for many years, and followed this method for enjoyable rounds: Play earlier in the summer months to avoid the afternoon 100+ highs. Play later in the winter months to avoid the backups caused by frost delays. Always seemed to work well for me. :)

 

As for climate change, well, the climate has been changing on this planet since it formed. Sometimes quite radically.

 

And as it has been changing for a darn sight longer than we've been around, I suspect it will continue to do so long after the human species has gone the way of the dinosaur. Regardless of what we do.

[FourTops]

I lived in Tucson, AZ for many years, and followed this method for enjoyable rounds: Play earlier in the summer months to avoid the afternoon 100+ highs. Play later in the winter months to avoid the backups caused by frost delays. Always seemed to work well for me. :)

 

As for climate change, well, the climate has been changing on this planet since it formed. Sometimes quite radically.

 

And as it has been changing for a darn sight longer than we've been around, I suspect it will continue to do so long after the human species has gone the way of the dinosaur. Regardless of what we do.

 

Agreed. People have no clue that the Earth was an ice ball at one time. I'm going to avoid that discussion because my tin foil hat doesn't fit anymore.

[FourTops]

If everyone played appropriate tees, they'd be far happier. Guys who drive the ball 200 yards playing 7,200 yard courses are playing a much harder game than the pro's are playing...relatively speaking. Start at the reds, break 90, 80, then move back a set.

[youngstructural]

I forget the equation off the top of my head, but there is a way I once read to back calculate what tees you should play based on how far you hit your 7 iron.

[nsxguy]

I forget the equation off the top of my head, but there is a way I once read to back calculate what tees you should play based on how far you hit your 7 iron.

 

There are equations for "everything"; many of them wrong.

 

One guy here recently said one should carry one's drive twice the length of his 9 iron. :cheesy:

[shotmark]

Since this thread started, I have walked away from playing the game. I stopped because I am no longer good enough to enjoy it. Every round is torture, no amount of practice improves the situation, and no one seems to be able to help. It's as simple as that.

 

It makes me laugh looking at the replies, as to how people know your game better than you.

 

You have my sympathy. I played of 5 then lost my game completely about 12 years ago to the point where I was struggling to break 100. Even now it's very up and down. Played Saturday, level par after 15 holes. Played Tuesday, shot 95.

 

Maybe have 3 months off and re evaluate.

 

Hope it works out.

[MountainGoat]

Since this thread started, I have walked away from playing the game. I stopped because I am no longer good enough to enjoy it. Every round is torture, no amount of practice improves the situation, and no one seems to be able to help. It's as simple as that.

 

It makes me laugh looking at the replies, as to how people know your game better than you.

 

You have my sympathy. I played of 5 then lost my game completely about 12 years ago to the point where I was struggling to break 100. Even now it's very up and down. Played Saturday, level par after 15 holes. Played Tuesday, shot 95.

 

Maybe have 3 months off and re evaluate.

 

Hope it works out.

 

Thanks for the thought. I haven't played a hole since June 10th. I still go the range every day and try new things. I'm just experimenting and trying to keep it light with no thoughts of actually playing the game anymore. It's kind of a relief, actually.

 

My new goal in life is to be a driving range know-it-all. I may start posting more often in the Instruction section of this forum, too.

[shotmark]

Since this thread started, I have walked away from playing the game. I stopped because I am no longer good enough to enjoy it. Every round is torture, no amount of practice improves the situation, and no one seems to be able to help. It's as simple as that.

 

It makes me laugh looking at the replies, as to how people know your game better than you.

 

You have my sympathy. I played of 5 then lost my game completely about 12 years ago to the point where I was struggling to break 100. Even now it's very up and down. Played Saturday, level par after 15 holes. Played Tuesday, shot 95.

 

Maybe have 3 months off and re evaluate.

 

Hope it works out.

 

Thanks for the thought. I haven't played a hole since June 10th. I still go the range every day and try new things. I'm just experimenting and trying to keep it light with no thoughts of actually playing the game anymore. It's kind of a relief, actually.

 

My new goal in life is to be a driving range know-it-all. I may start posting more often in the Instruction section of this forum, too.

 

Yep, that's me. Range Pro.

[Middler]

Where I play, some guys seem to be aging out. Some guys have quit due to health problems. Some guys have quit because their quality of play has declined, and they can't handle not being as good as they used to be. These are probably things that have always happened, but I don't see much of an influx of young guys to take their place.

This last weekend I played Saturday and Sunday at a busy public course. Both rounds took just over 3 hours. Not sure what you talking about??

I guess it depends on where you are. I play 2-3 times a week and where I am it's mostly (much) older folks playing golf at every course. Found online "The largest percentage of golfers is composed of men between the ages of 18 and 59, and seniors easily outnumber younger players. The average age of golfers in the U.S. is 54."

 

And the nearest city keeps stats for the "premier" local public course and rounds played has dropped from 43K in 1999 to 26K in 2007 and 19K in 2017 - the trend is undeniable. Unless there's an organized outing or league, you can walk on to any course within 50 miles of me and even play as a single on weekdays.

 

The condition of every course I've played within 100 miles has deteriorated over the past 20 years (as they're forced to trim costs), some subtly, others dramatically worse. There's one nearby I will never go back to it was in such terrible condition - burned greens, and they mow the entire place one length (the length of the first cut on a traditional course). There are no "fairways," just acres of light rough.

 

And most if not all the private country clubs around me, which used to be members only, now allow (encourage) the public to play. All members get for their annual/monthly dues are priority over the public, and maybe access to overpriced mediocre food & drink. Most of the people who are still members only join because their business pays for it, or they're over 70 years old and maintaining friends and "status" (which only their peers care about)...

[sheldonjhacker]

Since this thread started, I have walked away from playing the game. I stopped because I am no longer good enough to enjoy it. Every round is torture, no amount of practice improves the situation, and no one seems to be able to help. It's as simple as that.

Don't give up, MG ! Enroll in a Monte clinic. Over time, you will start to enjoy the process again.

[FourTops]

I forget the equation off the top of my head, but there is a way I once read to back calculate what tees you should play based on how far you hit your 7 iron.

 

From online....

 

"The answer to the question of how long a course should be for you is real simple. It is 28. Just multiply the length of a well hit drive for you by 28 and that, in my estimation, is the length of a course that will be challenging but enjoyable to play.

 

The logic behind the “Driver x 28” is that an ideal course will have a combination of easy, moderately difficult, and difficult holes. Knowing the length of your drive, you can estimate how far you hit your other clubs. For example, most golfers will hit their 6 iron 64% of the distance of their driver. If a medium distance par 4 is a drive and #6 iron, you know the length of a good par four for you is 164% of the distance of your drive. Having this information plus definitions for short, medium, and long holes, you can compute the total distance for an ideal course for you based upon your driving distance". [end]

 

It seems the idea is one should be hitting an average of 6 iron approach shots because that kinda mirrors (somewhat) the club pro's are hitting for approach shots.

 

Golf Digest data is similar, but appears they lean towards hitting a 7 iron average approach shot.

 

300 7,150-7,400

 

275 6,700-6,900

 

250 6,200-6,400

 

225 5,800 -6,000

 

200 5,200-5,400

 

175 4,400-4,600

[FourTops]

Where I play, some guys seem to be aging out. Some guys have quit due to health problems. Some guys have quit because their quality of play has declined, and they can't handle not being as good as they used to be. These are probably things that have always happened, but I don't see much of an influx of young guys to take their place.

This last weekend I played Saturday and Sunday at a busy public course. Both rounds took just over 3 hours. Not sure what you talking about??

I guess it depends on where you are. I play 2-3 times a week and where I am it's mostly (much) older folks playing golf at every course. Found online "The largest percentage of golfers is composed of men between the ages of 18 and 59, and seniors easily outnumber younger players. The average age of golfers in the U.S. is 54."

 

And the nearest city keeps stats for the "premier" local public course and rounds played has dropped from 43K in 1999 to 26K in 2007 and 19K in 2017 - the trend is undeniable. Unless there's an organized outing or league, you can walk on to any course within 50 miles of me and even play as a single on weekdays.

 

The condition of every course I've played within 100 miles has deteriorated over the past 20 years (as they're forced to trim costs), some subtly, others dramatically worse. There's one nearby I will never go back to it was in such terrible condition - burned greens, and they mow the entire place one length (the length of the first cut on a traditional course). There are no "fairways," just acres of light rough.

 

And most if not all the private country clubs around me, which used to be members only, now allow (encourage) the public to play. All members get for their annual/monthly dues are priority over the public, and maybe access to overpriced mediocre food & drink. Most of the people who are still members only join because their business pays for it, or they're over 70 years old and maintaining friends and "status" (which only their peers care about)...

 

You might also consider folks are growing tired of 6 hour round public courses...dumpy carts....crappy conditions...no marshals...and instead moved on to private clubs. I know many guys who've made the move because the wife can hang at the club....win-win. Also, the private clubs I'm familiar with have wait lists. So to your point...it depends on where you live.

[thug the bunny]

People are leaving the game due to the MB vs CB controversy, cargo shorts and untucked shirts, music on the course, and others not playing strictly by the rules. Oh, and yelling babba bouy at pro tournaments. Oh, and TW not winning another major.

 

;-)

[acemandrake]

I forget the equation off the top of my head, but there is a way I once read to back calculate what tees you should play based on how far you hit your 7 iron.

 

From online....

 

"The answer to the question of how long a course should be for you is real simple. It is 28. Just multiply the length of a well hit drive for you by 28 and that, in my estimation, is the length of a course that will be challenging but enjoyable to play.

 

The logic behind the “Driver x 28” is that an ideal course will have a combination of easy, moderately difficult, and difficult holes. Knowing the length of your drive, you can estimate how far you hit your other clubs. For example, most golfers will hit their 6 iron 64% of the distance of their driver. If a medium distance par 4 is a drive and #6 iron, you know the length of a good par four for you is 164% of the distance of your drive. Having this information plus definitions for short, medium, and long holes, you can compute the total distance for an ideal course for you based upon your driving distance". [end]

 

It seems the idea is one should be hitting an average of 6 iron approach shots because that kinda mirrors (somewhat) the club pro's are hitting for approach shots.

 

Golf Digest data is similar, but appears they lean towards hitting a 7 iron average approach shot.

 

300 7,150-7,400

 

275 6,700-6,900

 

250 6,200-6,400

 

225 5,800 -6,000

 

200 5,200-5,400

 

175 4,400-4,600

 

 

Judy Rankin said that players should play from the set of tees where the majority of their approach shots are 7-iron or less.

 

This makes sense. A round where most approaches are 6-iron or more is not fun for most people.

 

:golfer:

[TinCup6969]

I forget the equation off the top of my head, but there is a way I once read to back calculate what tees you should play based on how far you hit your 7 iron.

 

From online....

 

"The answer to the question of how long a course should be for you is real simple. It is 28. Just multiply the length of a well hit drive for you by 28 and that, in my estimation, is the length of a course that will be challenging but enjoyable to play.

 

The logic behind the “Driver x 28” is that an ideal course will have a combination of easy, moderately difficult, and difficult holes. Knowing the length of your drive, you can estimate how far you hit your other clubs. For example, most golfers will hit their 6 iron 64% of the distance of their driver. If a medium distance par 4 is a drive and #6 iron, you know the length of a good par four for you is 164% of the distance of your drive. Having this information plus definitions for short, medium, and long holes, you can compute the total distance for an ideal course for you based upon your driving distance". [end]

 

It seems the idea is one should be hitting an average of 6 iron approach shots because that kinda mirrors (somewhat) the club pro's are hitting for approach shots.

 

Golf Digest data is similar, but appears they lean towards hitting a 7 iron average approach shot.

 

300 7,150-7,400

 

275 6,700-6,900

 

250 6,200-6,400

 

225 5,800 -6,000

 

200 5,200-5,400

 

175 4,400-4,600

 

 

 

250x28=7000

275x28=7700

300x28=8400???

 

Those are pretty long courses by the 28 calculation.

[OLD_BONES]

Pace of play! Everyone these days wants things at lightning speed, especially the younger generation. I know I get frustrated with 5+ hour rounds.

[bhigh]

Golfs decline is a number of factors, all of which have been discussed in this thread. My take is; effort to reward is skewed. It's an extremely tough and unforgiving game. Driving ranges (and courses) are full of people trying to improve by ticking the box of "hitting balls", yet very few are actually improving. Just like everything in life, results come with hard, focused work. I believe a chunk of people are unwilling (or unaware on how) to work at the game to get better.

 

Im curious if length of round debate can be swayed by results. Would you care that your round was 5 1/2 hours if you shot a personal best, or played a solid round?

[FourTops]

I forget the equation off the top of my head, but there is a way I once read to back calculate what tees you should play based on how far you hit your 7 iron.

 

From online....

 

"The answer to the question of how long a course should be for you is real simple. It is 28. Just multiply the length of a well hit drive for you by 28 and that, in my estimation, is the length of a course that will be challenging but enjoyable to play.

 

The logic behind the “Driver x 28” is that an ideal course will have a combination of easy, moderately difficult, and difficult holes. Knowing the length of your drive, you can estimate how far you hit your other clubs. For example, most golfers will hit their 6 iron 64% of the distance of their driver. If a medium distance par 4 is a drive and #6 iron, you know the length of a good par four for you is 164% of the distance of your drive. Having this information plus definitions for short, medium, and long holes, you can compute the total distance for an ideal course for you based upon your driving distance". [end]

 

It seems the idea is one should be hitting an average of 6 iron approach shots because that kinda mirrors (somewhat) the club pro's are hitting for approach shots.

 

Golf Digest data is similar, but appears they lean towards hitting a 7 iron average approach shot.

 

300 7,150-7,400

 

275 6,700-6,900

 

250 6,200-6,400

 

225 5,800 -6,000

 

200 5,200-5,400

 

175 4,400-4,600

 

 

 

250x28=7000

275x28=7700

300x28=8400???

 

Those are pretty long courses by the 28 calculation.

 

I think what happens is the tour courses become far more difficult to offset the longer drives. Plus, there's a diminishing return as to how close someone can place their approach shot near the pin. Just IMO.

[FourTops]

I think folks need to just LET GO and PLAY golf. Stop WORKING golf.

 

I play the piano. When I'm trying to learn a new piece, I eventually learn by "letting go"....just playing...no looking back at mistakes...GO GO GO. It's downright surprising how much better I play vs. obsessing over every missed note. Piano and guitar teachers always say to keep going....don't stop...PLAY to the end. And also, and in-line with my comments about course yardage above, those learning either instrument do not start out expecting to play Mozart or Hendrix...they start slowly...learn the scales...get used to the feel / sound of playing...especially the rhythm. It's kinda the same for golf...play tees that allow you to learn the game vs. constant struggling by attempting to do things you're simply not ready to perform yet.

 

I know...one too many Chardonnays! But it's TGIF!

[uitar9]

I lived in Tucson, AZ for many years, and followed this method for enjoyable rounds: Play earlier in the summer months to avoid the afternoon 100+ highs. Play later in the winter months to avoid the backups caused by frost delays. Always seemed to work well for me. :)

 

As for climate change, well, the climate has been changing on this planet since it formed. Sometimes quite radically.

 

And as it has been changing for a darn sight longer than we've been around, I suspect it will continue to do so long after the human species has gone the way of the dinosaur. Regardless of what we do.

 

Agreed. People have no clue that the Earth was an ice ball at one time. I'm going to avoid that discussion because my tin foil hat doesn't fit anymore.

 

I hear it wasn't that long ago (10,000 years or so) that Ireland, scotland , wales and england were under ice. Golf came back after that set back.

[FourTops]

I lived in Tucson, AZ for many years, and followed this method for enjoyable rounds: Play earlier in the summer months to avoid the afternoon 100+ highs. Play later in the winter months to avoid the backups caused by frost delays. Always seemed to work well for me. :)

 

As for climate change, well, the climate has been changing on this planet since it formed. Sometimes quite radically.

 

And as it has been changing for a darn sight longer than we've been around, I suspect it will continue to do so long after the human species has gone the way of the dinosaur. Regardless of what we do.

 

Agreed. People have no clue that the Earth was an ice ball at one time. I'm going to avoid that discussion because my tin foil hat doesn't fit anymore.

 

I hear it wasn't that long ago (10,000 years or so) that Ireland, scotland , wales and england were under ice. Golf came back after that set back.

 

See...there is a God.

[John L.]

Golf will always have it's core of players who are passionate about the game.

 

I knew the game would right size itself again after the boom of casual golfers on the late 80's to mid 2000's.

 

Golf will be just fine.

[Naptime]

T-ball is easy. Take a swing. Lead with your legs. Now put the T lower. Bend at the waist. Hit the ball on the tee. You too can play golf.

 

If someone can make contact and get the ball in the air they can shoot 100 or so. Enjoy a day and work from there to improve your game.

[MountainGoat]

T-ball is easy. Take a swing. Lead with your legs. Now put the T lower. Bend at the waist. Hit the ball on the tee. You too can play golf.

 

If someone can make contact and get the ball in the air they can shoot 100 or so. Enjoy a day and work from there to improve your game.

 

Ha! Wait a few years. The day will come when your clubs will sit in a dusty corner of the garage, and you'll tell everyone how good your could have been if you had time to practice more.

[Naptime]

Playing 40 years. 50+ rounds this year. After seeing all the instructional gurus say do this or that while also doing all these other things I decided to go with one swing thought. Marked improvement and then was easier to work on the details of wedge distance, funky lies etc.