Monte's new No Turn - Cast

[scopek]

1 hour ago, Millbrook said:

 

Harvey Penicks Magic Move;

'to start your downswing, let your weight shift to your left foot while bringing your right elbow back down to your body. This is one move not two.'

That's awesome. Thanks for posting this. 

[scopek]

I was going to post a question here to see if anyone who has Monte's 300 Yard Impact training aid was using this with the casting moves. Monte must have received questions about this because he did a video of this on Instagram today:

 

 

[JayMas]

Great content, as always from Monte. The original no turn cast video was amazing, but the in depth teaching here and use of the clock finally got me to cast in the correct direction and thus transition much more consistently (so far).

 

I think Monte said this, but for me, cast B is absolutely a reaction, maybe it would help others to not even think about that independently. Everything happens so fast that if cast A was done correctly, the club shallows and my body rotates with the room for my arms to speed up and just 2nd cast through impact. Feels like it would be super hard to think about those two things independently during a full swing when the transition itself is basically the end of your control over the swing. Could just be my own personal feelings though.

 

Again, great content, perfect compliment to the Efficient Swing. This transition idea is the most effective I've ever utilized.

[TourSpoon]

12 minutes ago, JayMas said:

I think Monte said this, but for me, cast B is absolutely a reaction, maybe it would help others to not even think about that independently. Everything happens so fast that if cast A was done correctly, the club shallows and my body rotates with the room for my arms to speed up and just 2nd cast through impact. Feels like it would be super hard to think about those two things independently during a full swing when the transition itself is basically the end of your control over the swing. Could just be my own personal feelings though.

I tried the Cast A drill today and thought the same thing. Cast B is just there if you do it right. 

[yycpaul]

22 hours ago, MaineMariner said:

Going from Cast A to Cast B is where I'm struggling. I can do all the motions separately, but trying to put them together just doesn't really work because I feel like I have no momentum to turn my body after the first cast. It just feels very weak, like I'm just sorta limply flicking my clubhead through. Maybe I just need to start speeding them up.

 

Anyone trying the Cast A and Cast B drills with their driver? I can hit my irons just fine but driver is where I can't help but leave my clubface wide open and hit annoying push fades. I think the problem is not properly turning and doing Cast B (and instead just sorta of spinning/lurching forward while holding off with the club/leaving my arms behind). I've been doing the Cast B drill with my driver on dandelions in my yard and it feels extremely foreign, but I guess that's probably a good thing.

running into the same sequencing issues on the driver, lots of push fades and power fades when I dont get it but when I do get it right it's awesome ( normally hit driver 260, cranked one 285 yesterday when all the stars aligned), just need to get it consistently.

find I need to feel cast A with the left hand (motor cycle move) and cast B feel with the right. started with feeling both in the right (cast A as a yoyo move or waiter platter) but just can't seem to sequence them correctly that way. Kind of a rub your head pat your stomach conundrum. 

[games]

I can't go wrong with Cast A, as long as I cast "to the right" or "behind" where my lead arm is pointing, causing a slight bow in the lead wrist. 

 

IF I have proper hand and wrist position at left arm parallel in the backswing, and do the above, everything else should be automatic.

[dblinden]

Dr Monte said: You work on throw 1, get it right and then try and work on throw 2 if it isn’t happening as a reaction.  They happen so close together it’s essentially the same time to the conscious mind.

 

Before reading this, I was trying to manually achieve this second throw, but was  unsuccessful. As he said, it all happens way too fast in a regular swing, but pretty easy to achieve as a drill. 

Edited September 3, 2020 by dblinden

[Hilts1969]

3 hours ago, dblinden said:

Dr Monte said: You work on throw 1, get it right and then try and work on throw 2 if it isn’t happening as a reaction.  They happen so close together it’s essentially the same time to the conscious mind.

 

Before reading this, I was trying to manually achieve this second throw, but was  unsuccessful. As he said, it all happens way to fast in a regular swing, but pretty easy to achieve as a drill. 

 

I tried the cast B from a static P6 position just out of interest(not sure if I saw that on the Monte video or elsewhere need to rewatch) and when I hit it right was amazed how far it went with a 9 from what is normally a chipping position. Will revisit it at a later date if needed. As a constant fiddler I really need to just keeping going to 7 then casting to 8 and rotate when I feel the right arm brush my torso. 

[Simpsonia]

Here's a question for when trying to string the different casts together in a fluid motion. Cast B would be at full effort, or whatever your normal effort is for a full swing (maybe 70-90%), I assume. Is Cast A also done at the same effort, or is it softer/slower and then turn into the second part? Some pros seem to have added acceleration once they hit P6, and others don't. Or is this one of those personal things where some guys do it one way, and others another. 

 

In some of my earlier attempts, I think I overdid it and got too far downwards and things went to hell from there. 

Edited September 2, 2020 by Simpsonia

[Girevik]

I'm desperate for anything to improve my game.  I'm giving it a shot. 

[MonteScheinblum]

55 minutes ago, Hilts1969 said:

 

I tried the cast B from a static P6 position just out of interest(not sure if I saw that on the Monte video or elsewhere need to rewatch) and when I hit it right was amazed how far it went with a 9 from what is normally a chipping position. Will revisit it at a later date if needed. As a constant fiddler I really need to just keeping going to 7 then casting to 8 and rotate when I feel the right arm brush my torso. 

My favorite word when I teach.

 

Some

 

Don’t get me wrong, I use exaggeration drills to show people how far off their feel is.  However, I would rather people sneak up on the their best over several weeks and months, rather than go Too extreme, get it right today and over doing it tomorrow. 

[games]

1 hour ago, Hilts1969 said:

 

...I really need to just keeping going to 7 then casting to 8 and rotate when I feel the right arm brush my torso. 

 

What would happen if you simply didn't try to time the rotation?  Just stay facing backward, until the hands pull you around?

[dblinden]

1 hour ago, Hilts1969 said:

 

I tried the cast B from a static P6 position just out of interest(not sure if I saw that on the Monte video or elsewhere need to rewatch) and when I hit it right was amazed how far it went with a 9 from what is normally a chipping position. Will revisit it at a later date if needed. As a constant fiddler I really need to just keeping going to 7 then casting to 8 and rotate when I feel the right arm brush my torso. 

 

Yep - When I practiced the drill to feel the second throw from a static position, I was amazed at how fast the clubhead speed felt. Total release that I don't feel in a full swing.  

[Rictor33]

Here is one of my swings attempting to cast to eight (and failing). I am very inflexible and it’s difficult for me to get the club back that far. It’s even worse when I try to square the face throughout the backswing. Anything you guys see that’s glaringly bad? Besides everything?

 

edit: This was filmed in slow mo yet isn’t uploading in slow mo. Link to slow mo here:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1q_5URnLvxM2g-opciTsvJb0-ySNb66lV/view?usp=drivesdk

Edited September 3, 2020 by Rictor33

[All88]

What is the down side to pre-setting a flat left wrist at address.  It seems to have eliminated one variable for me.

[games]

8 hours ago, All88 said:

What is the down side to pre-setting a flat left wrist at address.  It seems to have eliminated one variable for me.

 

I don't think there is a downside if it works for you.  Monte talks about the takeaway and the very first move is to simply get to left arm parallel in the prescribed position.  Heck, I've heard there are people who actually play golf using a variant of Monte's drill for the takeaway that shows how the individual parts work.

 

Adding:  I'm starting to wonder if the takeaway sequence is more style than fundamental.  What did Hogan say?  You don't hit the ball on the backswing?      

Edited September 3, 2020 by games
added thought

[me05501]

On 8/24/2020 at 11:23 PM, David69 said:

Jake Hutt does a quickie vid on the throw it out the back move, Steve Pratt advocates an early throw as well, and the “motorcycle move” is practically ubiquitous to modern golf teaching vids. The value for me here is the step by step getting into the backswing properly elements as well as the detailed hand and wrist action paired with the downswing leg action that is demonstrated perfectly, then shown in action with the various students at the end. I am sure that the video has merit for nearly all players that suffer from inconsistency. If there is anything missing it would be showing this with driver, but I don’t really think you need it. 

 

Through a series of recent lessons I've been focused on getting an idea backswing and getting a flat-to-flexed left wrist at the top. The motorcycle move made sense to me but I think Monte's first cast concept makes more sense. 

 

When I think about the motorcycle move it's an isolated thing, simply rotating the grip to close the face, but the first cast Monte describes is a more complex movement that actually makes more sense to me. I can feel it more easily and it doesn't feel unnatural. 

Edited September 3, 2020 by me05501

[MonteScheinblum]

2 hours ago, games said:

 

I don't think there is a downside if it works for you.  Monte talks about the takeaway and the very first move is to simply get to left arm parallel in the prescribed position.  Heck, I've heard there are people who actually play golf using a variant of Monte's drill for the takeaway that shows how the individual parts work.

 

Adding:  I'm starting to wonder if the takeaway sequence is more style than fundamental.  What did Hogan say?  You don't hit the ball on the backswing?      

Coming from a man who had one of the great backswings for his body type.

 

”Backswing doesn’t matter,” is one of the most dangerous cliches of all.  It is true you can succeed from many different backswing positions, the problem is the overwhelming majority of golfers over the handicap of 5, aren’t performing one of them.

[YYCAM]

Great content! Been to the range a couple times with these ideas in mind, been striking the ball much better than usual.

 

I do however find myself bending my lead arm more at the top in an attempt 'help' the cast if that makes any sense. Anyone else run into this? I suppose it doesn't really matter if the I'm hitting the ball better but it seems to be a disaster waiting to happen.

[chigolfer1]

17 minutes ago, MonteScheinblum said:

Coming from a man who had one of the great backswings for his body type.

 

”Backswing doesn’t matter,” is one of the most dangerous cliches of all.  It is true you can succeed from many different backswing positions, the problem is the overwhelming majority of golfers over the handicap of 5, aren’t performing one of them.

 

Thanks for this.   That saying is really misinterpreted for the exact reason you just said.   

[scopek]

It’s taken several days but I’m starting to make decent contact with the drills. I’ve noticed a couple things:

- When I get to the cast A position and pause at 8 o’clock I found I still need to feel like the club head is dropping behind me as I go to hit the ball otherwise I revert back to kicking my right shoulder out towards the ball rather then continuing to rotate down and around

- I know we’re not supposed to think about cast B when we’re working on cast A. However my contact is just better when I do cast A then cast B. I know when I’m doing a real swing I won’t be able to separate the 2 casts but it works nicely as a drill for me

- I’m going to need a LOT of reps doing this before it’s going to show up in a real swing. I’m thankful for Monte keeping it real about how hard swing changes are. I’m fine with that...if it takes months I’m ok as long as I can trust I’m ingraining the correct movements. I’m trusting Monte on this 

[glk]

14 hours ago, All88 said:

What is the down side to pre-setting a flat left wrist at address.  It seems to have eliminated one variable for me.

a flat or bowed (and some pro hit with a cupped or extended left wrist) is a dynamic position.    a very weak grip will get a near flat wrist but then you have better really motorcycle the club and get the body really open - Jon Rahm is a good example of a weak grip player,   Spieth too,  old school Corey Pavin.     Otherwise if you have a neutral to strong grip it should naturally have extension at setup - and will only be flat depending on the relationship of the hands.    Attempting to preset impact position at setup doesn't really work out to well for folks.

 

 

Edited September 3, 2020 by glk

[All88]

Just to clarify my last post.

 

 I am assuming that the flat left wrist at 7 and 8 under NTC is a static position and not a dynamic position.

 

This is in line with the MDLT school of thought.

[glk]

1 minute ago, All88 said:

Just to clarify my last post.

 

 I am assuming that the flat left wrist at 7 and 8 under NTC is a static position and not a dynamic position.

 

This is in line with the MDLT school of thought.

Aside from setup and before takeaway there is nothing static about the wrists in the swing.

[GolfTurkey]

Would you guys say this is a good video for chronic handle draggers?

[Girevik]

Some thoughts from the highest of high handicappers.

 

I bought the video yesterday.  I haven't gotten quite all the way through it yet, but I tried to incorporate what I had seen at the range today.  First, I love the backswing thoughts.  One of my biggest issues (and I have many), is my backswing, both taking the club back too far and just general inconsistency.  This helps me get back to a consistent position each time.  I also really like the thought of starting with a shift forward because another one of my myriad issues is getting quick and letting my arms get in front of my hips.  This seems to help me stay back.

 

Unfortunately so far it hasn't helped with the hook / pull-hook I've been fighting.  I know there is not magic bullet for a swing as bad as mine, but I'd hoped to see some progress in that area.

 

And all of that I said relates to my irons.  I was totally clueless off the tee. Didn't hit a decent driver shot all session. 

[Ntv69]

I thought i was doing the Cast A enough naturally as i basically cast from top, straight into a big EE and straight arms through impact, so thought i should be working on the Cast B but haven't had much success.  I even hit a house with my 3 wood tee shot on first hole yesterday.  Rough Start!

Edited September 4, 2020 by Ntv69

[Weetbix]

5 hours ago, GolfTurkey said:

Would you guys say this is a good video for chronic handle draggers?

 

I think this was almost exactly what the initial drill was combating - so yeah

[TourSpoon]

Today I warmed up with the Cast A drill from the static position, did a rhythmic variation of drill A to feel the drill with a little more speed, and then went into the full swing. To do it just get in position for drill, start as normal with the move down but pass over the ball and at the finish just swing it back and through again this time hitting the ball.  The rhythm really helped and looked great on video with the impact position greatly improved.  It was a little easier to feel it in the full swing after doing this. This video series has so much good stuff! Thanks  @MonteScheinblum 

Edited September 4, 2020 by TourSpoon
Added content

[dannygrz]

This has been a huge game changer for me over the past week and a half. I’m striking the ball much more consistently even though there is a ton of work left to do. 
 

I do have a question for @MonteScheinblum if he could answer or anyone else that may explain this better.... 

 

When I put everything together, what should I “feel” when I start the cast? Am I trying to over exaggerate the throw to 8?