Shawn Clement Most Important Video On Grip Ever

[JeffreySpicoli]

55 minutes ago, tthomasgolfer605 said:

My assumption was correct. This is from 9 months ago. 

That’s only two rounds. A moment in time.

 

You certain that you’re not cherry-picking to try to make her look bad?

[tthomasgolfer605]

2 minutes ago, JeffreySpicoli said:

That’s only two rounds. A moment in time.

 

You certain that you’re not cherry-picking to try to make her look bad?

I was being nice because I left out the 87, 89, and 82 from other tournaments. Honestly I think what Sean is teaching her is holding her back. That's my opinion anyway.

[erikro]

5 minutes ago, tthomasgolfer605 said:

I was being nice because I left out the 87, 89, and 82 from other tournaments. Honestly I think what Sean is teaching her is holding her back. That's my opinion anyway.

I think it’s more beneficial to discuss his teaching rather than his daughters scores. How is his teaching holding her back?

[BombinJim]

22 minutes ago, tthomasgolfer605 said:

Not sure. That was end of summer last year and with Canada's winters they don't get to play much after that.

Yeah, good call. Have you tried the technique?

[JeffreySpicoli]

6 minutes ago, tthomasgolfer605 said:

I was being nice because I left out the 87, 89, and 82 from other tournaments. Honestly I think what Sean is teaching her is holding her back. That's my opinion anyway.

Cherry-picking still.

 

Not surprising as you consistently insist that you’re smarter and better than other current teachers. Tear down others to build yourself up.

[tthomasgolfer605]

5 minutes ago, JeffreySpicoli said:

Cherry-picking still.

 

Not surprising as you consistently insist that you’re smarter and better than other current teachers. Tear down others to build yourself up.

I never said I was smarter or better than anybody. I will say with that grip that Sean Clement promotes, she's very limited in varying trajectory seeing how shut the face is. Best players that ever walked the earth had neutral/weaker grips with a more square face. If Savannah were to go to someone like Butch Harmon for instance because she's not shooting the scores she should be, (she should be a plus handicap with her power) he'd change pretty much everything. 

[tthomasgolfer605]

13 minutes ago, BombinJim said:

Yeah, good call. Have you tried the technique?

Several years ago I did. Hit it left into the next county.

[tthomasgolfer605]

18 minutes ago, erikro said:

I think it’s more beneficial to discuss his teaching rather than his daughters scores. How is his teaching holding her back?

 Because Sean jumped on the distance bandwagon. I guess that's what sells these days. Savannah has a ton of power but I bet she has no control. A very strong grip like that limits versatility in the short game as well.

[BombinJim]

16 minutes ago, tthomasgolfer605 said:

49 minutes ago, erikro said:

 

 Because Sean jumped on the distance bandwagon.

Not sure that is the entirely accurate. For me, the technique results in consistent contact and good strike quality.

[Feelingofgreatness]

12 hours ago, tthomasgolfer605 said:

 Because Sean jumped on the distance bandwagon. I guess that's what sells these days. Savannah has a ton of power but I bet she has no control. A very strong grip like that limits versatility in the short game as well.

Agree! 

That swing is fine for the rec golfer looking to bomb it past his buddies, that won't work on tour. 

Watch her misses when she crazy hooks it 190y with a 7i.... That is double bogey city. 

A hook miss will destroy you at the tour level. 

[Rapidcat]

I don't enjoy posting this comment because I judge Shawn to be a top guy and a real source of good golf info but why all this left handed stuff?

 

I guess more palatable for the Canadian market but as a righty it is just annoying to do the interpretation to make it right-handed. Righty's = 90%+ of the golf world.

 

Not intending to take a swipe at lefty's you've dealt with righty-focussed instruction all your golfing life, but at least you are used to it.

 

Shawn, if you have your daughter as a participant (and you should - she is excellent and appropriate) have a right-hander to balance that out.

 

Nonetheless, a really good video that I am going to use to work on - thanks as always for the content, I am grateful. 

 

[Hilts1969]

 

Is he waffling on about cutting the top of daffodils off back handed while bobbing up and down again? I presume the perfect grip means wearing garden gloves while getting out of the way. 

[Rapidcat]

Here another video of Shawn's about how this strong grip set-up can reduce golfer's elbow (only 8.46 mins):

 

 

 

 

Premise is that the anatomy of our arms means that a weak grip stresses the forearm and elbow when making a swing and impacting the ground.
A strong grip utilises the structure of the ulnar & radius bones at their strongest & so can prevent golfer’s elbow.

View the video to see the theory and justification.

[vernon]

I remember when I used to play like this and hovered around scratch for a couple of years.  Then I decided I wanted to start fading the ball, weakened my grip and haven't gotten below a two since then and am currently a poor iron player that's around a five.

 

Don't think I ever realized that until watching this video.

 

Gonna definitely have to give it a try although the weather dictates that it ain't gonna happen until Friday at the earliest.

 

Kinda excited however. 

[Ri_Redneck]

I posted in this thread last year when it came out that I had used this grip and swing since around 2013. Struggled my whole life trying to play with a weakish grip and never could get consistent with face angle at impact. After many years, I finally started trying progressively stronger grip orientation until I found what worked best for me. It was a long hard road because I had to UN-learn all the things that I had worked on over the years to try to make the other grip work. I progressively got better as I learned other aspects of how I should setup to use this grip. Proper setup allows me to get in the proper positions to make my swing. I had to add rearward pelvic tilt because I had none with my previous swing. I also found I was too bent at the knees and hips. Adjusting my clubs to suit a more erect posture allowed me to generate much more speed using the same effort I did before. Lastly, I have installed my grips so that I can use the markings on them to get my hands in the same exact position every time which has added considerable consistency to my accuracy. My hcp was in the high teens back in 2013 and I have many rounds in the 70's in the last couple of years since I have improved my pitching technique, putting technique and setup procedure/PSR. I also purchased an MOI Auditor and now have my clubs much more closely balanced than before.

 

There were some that posted earlier that this grip doesn't work well with pitching, chipping, etc., but I currently have no problems with any aspect of the game and can hit any shot I need to hit and work the ball both ways with reliability. My swing feels very natural now and the results have been stellar.

 

My main problem now is letting my gained confidence override my better judgement in certain circumstances.

 

BT

[Ifelloffladder]

On 5/12/2021 at 8:12 AM, erikro said:

I think it’s more beneficial to discuss his teaching rather than his daughters scores. How is his teaching holding her back?

All that time I thought she was his wife and also didn't know she was competing. 

 

Anyway...she has become a better hitter compared to when she first appeared on his videos.

[Divot License]

On 12/1/2022 at 4:04 PM, Ri_Redneck said:

I posted in this thread last year when it came out that I had used this grip and swing since around 2013. Struggled my whole life trying to play with a weakish grip and never could get consistent with face angle at impact. After many years, I finally started trying progressively stronger grip orientation until I found what worked best for me. It was a long hard road because I had to UN-learn all the things that I had worked on over the years to try to make the other grip work. I progressively got better as I learned other aspects of how I should setup to use this grip. Proper setup allows me to get in the proper positions to make my swing. I had to add rearward pelvic tilt because I had none with my previous swing. I also found I was too bent at the knees and hips. Adjusting my clubs to suit a more erect posture allowed me to generate much more speed using the same effort I did before. Lastly, I have installed my grips so that I can use the markings on them to get my hands in the same exact position every time which has added considerable consistency to my accuracy. My hcp was in the high teens back in 2013 and I have many rounds in the 70's in the last couple of years since I have improved my pitching technique, putting technique and setup procedure/PSR. I also purchased an MOI Auditor and now have my clubs much more closely balanced than before.

 

There were some that posted earlier that this grip doesn't work well with pitching, chipping, etc., but I currently have no problems with any aspect of the game and can hit any shot I need to hit and work the ball both ways with reliability. My swing feels very natural now and the results have been stellar.

 

My main problem now is letting my gained confidence override my better judgement in certain circumstances.

 

BT

I've gone the other way. Always played with a weaker "older school" grip then two years ago got convinced in a lesson to strengthen my grip to "reduce the need for face rotation". I bought all in, completly accepted and understood the concept but saw a huge decline in m game. Over the passed couple of months I've worked back to a weaker/more neutral/opposing palms grip and have seen an improvemnet again on my overall ball control. 

 

This was definetly the case on pitch shots as using a stronger grip completly destroyed my ability to control trajectory. 

 

Different strokes for different folks. 

[Ri_Redneck]

9 hours ago, Divot License said:

I've gone the other way. Always played with a weaker "older school" grip then two years ago got convinced in a lesson to strengthen my grip to "reduce the need for face rotation". I bought all in, completly accepted and understood the concept but saw a huge decline in m game. Over the passed couple of months I've worked back to a weaker/more neutral/opposing palms grip and have seen an improvemnet again on my overall ball control. 

 

This was definetly the case on pitch shots as using a stronger grip completly destroyed my ability to control trajectory. 

 

Different strokes for different folks. 

I firmly believe it depends totally on your anatomical structure. It's just the way my body works. I can flight low or high. I just found out about it too late in life. At 60, my arthritic joints don't allow consistent range of motion from day to day. But on the good days, it's a heck of a lot of fun!

 

BT

[Barfolomew]

1 hour ago, Ri_Redneck said:

I firmly believe it depends totally on your anatomical structure. It's just the way my body works. I can flight low or high. I just found out about it too late in life. At 60, my arthritic joints don't allow consistent range of motion from day to day. But on the good days, it's a heck of a lot of fun!

 

BT

 

I play a strong grip as promoted by Shawn and can play any flight or curve too.  But I'll say the grip feels completely natural to me as I went to as a self taught player and was just happy to see that a few teachers promote as normal.  No one swing an axe or hammer with a neutral or weak grip.... everyone uses a strong grip. 

 

Less or no rotation of the head seems to up the % for good contact as well as it takes a variable out of the equation.... 🐈

[tthomasgolfer605]

11 hours ago, Divot License said:

I've gone the other way. Always played with a weaker "older school" grip then two years ago got convinced in a lesson to strengthen my grip to "reduce the need for face rotation". I bought all in, completly accepted and understood the concept but saw a huge decline in m game. Over the passed couple of months I've worked back to a weaker/more neutral/opposing palms grip and have seen an improvemnet again on my overall ball control. 

 

This was definetly the case on pitch shots as using a stronger grip completly destroyed my ability to control trajectory. 

 

Different strokes for different folks. 

Smart man!

[bladehunter]

I’m all for playing whatever grip works.  But.  In the abstract, isn’t a super strong grip a compensation for something ?  Just on logic alone wouldnt neutral be ideal if you can return it to the ball in the same manner with a close to neutral path.  Isn’t that the definition of “ straight “? 

[Ri_Redneck]

1 hour ago, bladehunter said:

I’m all for playing whatever grip works.  But.  In the abstract, isn’t a super strong grip a compensation for something ?  Just on logic alone wouldn't neutral be ideal if you can return it to the ball in the same manner with a close to neutral path.  Isn’t that the definition of “ straight “? 

I don't feel like I'm compensating for anything now. With my previous grips I always struggled to square the face consistently.  The "shallowing" move always felt "un-natural" or "manufactured" and I just couldn't get it ingrained. I tried for years!

 

I have heard different definitions of "neutral" also. Some say it is just between weak and strong and others say it is where your hands should be naturally. If using the latter definition, I would be considered neutral where I am now because this grip feels completely natural. I just set up and swing the club.

 

BT

[nkurz]

1 hour ago, bladehunter said:

I’m all for playing whatever grip works.  But.  In the abstract, isn’t a super strong grip a compensation for something ?  Just on logic alone wouldnt neutral be ideal if you can return it to the ball in the same manner with a close to neutral path.  Isn’t that the definition of “ straight “? 

 

Sure, but the question is how to define "neutral", and thus what makes a grip "super strong".  Going back to the video, is the standard grip of a hammer or a baseball bat neutral?  I'd say yes, so I take the video to be arguing that what golfers think of as a strong grip might actually be anatomically neutral.   

 

A "neutral grip" would thus be the one that has the club face perpendicular to the swing direction at impact, regardless of what this looks like when you hold the club horizontal to the ground pointing out in front of you.    So yes, neutral is ideal, and anything else is compensation but first we have to all agree on what neutral means.  

 

It's always felt to me that grip at address is secondary, and the real question is the position of forearms at impact.   If you believe the video, for reliable power you need the bones in the forearm to be in line with the direction of the swing at impact, as they would be if you were swinging a hammer or baseball bat.   I think that's the real point of dispute, and not the choice of grip.  

[elsie451]

Truth be told, I didn't really pay attention to the whole video, but saw the guy hammering down and then forward and figured I got the gist of the idea.  So I went to the range and held the club with the face straight down like I was hammering down with it, and then set up with that super strong grip.

Generally speaking, I felt like I had great compression and the ball seemed to fly a little higher and further than usual.

I missed a few to the left with the short irons. But interestingly, as I moved to the longer irons, the misses that I had were leaks out to the right. I'm guessing that I was somehow subconsciously opening the face because I was worried about pull hooking it off the planet.

I didn't try any pitching, chiping, or partial shots, but all in all, I think it's worth it for me to keep trying this grip and see where it goes.

[Rapidcat]

17 hours ago, elsie451 said:

Truth be told, I didn't really pay attention to the whole video, but saw the guy hammering down and then forward and figured I got the gist of the idea.  So I went to the range and held the club with the face straight down like I was hammering down with it, and then set up with that super strong grip.

Generally speaking, I felt like I had great compression and the ball seemed to fly a little higher and further than usual.

I missed a few to the left with the short irons. But interestingly, as I moved to the longer irons, the misses that I had were leaks out to the right. I'm guessing that I was somehow subconsciously opening the face because I was worried about pull hooking it off the planet.

I didn't try any pitching, chiping, or partial shots, but all in all, I think it's worth it for me to keep trying this grip and see where it goes.

 

"Truth be told, I didn't really pay attention to the whole video, but saw the guy hammering down and then forward and figured I got the gist of the idea."

 

So you're changing your swing based on this? Really?

[elsie451]

11 minutes ago, Rapidcat said:

So you're changing your swing based on this? Really?

Not a swing change, just a grip change. And he takes 35 minutes to explain something that should take 3 minutes. I doubt many people can pay full attention to the whole thing. After all he explains the exact same thing using a hammer, a baseball bat, a tennis racquet and a golf club.

[Rapidcat]

2 minutes ago, elsie451 said:

Not a swing change, just a grip change. And he takes 35 minutes to explain something that should take 3 minutes. I doubt many people can pay full attention to the whole thing. After all he explains the exact same thing using a hammer, a baseball bat, a tennis racquet and a golf club.

 

Yeah, I can understand your point, he is verbose.

 

Hogan once said it took him a year to make a minor grip change; consider that with all his practice work.

 

Good luck to you.

[Zitlow]

On 2/18/2023 at 6:30 AM, bladehunter said:

I’m all for playing whatever grip works.  But.  In the abstract, isn’t a super strong grip a compensation for something ?  Just on logic alone wouldnt neutral be ideal if you can return it to the ball in the same manner with a close to neutral path.  Isn’t that the definition of “ straight “? 

Bingo! The golf swing is a lot easier when we work with our anatomy and physiology instead of working against it. 

[bladehunter]

20 hours ago, elsie451 said:

Truth be told, I didn't really pay attention to the whole video, but saw the guy hammering down and then forward and figured I got the gist of the idea.  So I went to the range and held the club with the face straight down like I was hammering down with it, and then set up with that super strong grip.

Generally speaking, I felt like I had great compression and the ball seemed to fly a little higher and further than usual.

I missed a few to the left with the short irons. But interestingly, as I moved to the longer irons, the misses that I had were leaks out to the right. I'm guessing that I was somehow subconsciously opening the face because I was worried about pull hooking it off the planet.

I didn't try any pitching, chiping, or partial shots, but all in all, I think it's worth it for me to keep trying this grip and see where it goes.

Wait till you get the shortgame yips !  Lol.  Name a super strong grip player who’s great around the greens.  I can’t name one.  I mean Fitzpatrick had to go cross handed to stop that grip.   Morikowa has a shortgame coach full time trying to stop his grip from interfering.   And on and on.  It does turn the face down and it does provide more pop. But there’s always a trade.  

[geauxt]

6 minutes ago, bladehunter said:

Wait till you get the shortgame yips !  Lol.  Name a super strong grip player who’s great around the greens.  I can’t name one.  I mean Fitzpatrick had to go cross handed to stop that grip.   Morikowa has a shortgame coach full time trying to stop his grip from interfering.   And on and on.  It does turn the face down and it does provide more pop. But there’s always a trade.  

I don’t know enough to argue either way but I recall Zach Johnson as being fantastic with a wedge in his hands.

 

Morikawa plays with a fairly weak lead hand so not sure why he was mentioned.