distance debate

[TLUBulldogGolf]

12 minutes ago, milesgiles said:

 

I can try it tomorrow if you like, whats the bet?

 

You do it in 2" bermuda and I'll bet my house, I'm not even debating that the stimpmeter design changed, but it didn't change to a catapult.

[So_Cal]

2 hours ago, MUNIGRIT said:

The accuracy guys told me how important it is at one of the toughest courses in the world and played under the USO. No way could a Bryson do anything there. Who were the 2 guys that could have won that tournament? 

IMO that Open was the poster child for the rollback crowd.  Bryson proved that distance trumps accuracy every time.  He didn’t care where it ended up so long as it went far.  Now if accuracy was important he wouldn’t have won.  JMO. 

[Titleist99]

25 minutes ago, So_Cal said:

IMO that Open was the poster child for the rollback crowd.  Bryson proved that distance trumps accuracy every time.  He didn’t care where it ended up so long as it went far.  Now if accuracy was important he wouldn’t have won.  JMO. 

That was one tournament and Bryson haven't won Jack since. In that tournament Bryson won because he putted lights out and got up and down like a man possessed.

 

Take a look at the top 20 players in driving distance and come back to me when you find one that's a prolific winner.....

 

I'm not sure if Bryson even led in driving statistic in that tournament.

[MUNIGRIT]

44 minutes ago, So_Cal said:

IMO that Open was the poster child for the rollback crowd.  Bryson proved that distance trumps accuracy every time.  He didn’t care where it ended up so long as it went far.  Now if accuracy was important he wouldn’t have won.  JMO. 

Bryson is pretty straight for how far he hits it. That is what thebroll back crowd doesn't seem to get. If Bryson is 4 percent off line vs Todd at 4 percent what is their dispersion.

 

Side note why do posts in this thread need to be moderated? This isn't the Same Trap.

Edited May 6, 2022 by MUNIGRIT

[GwrxMod]

6 minutes ago, MUNIGRIT said:

Side note why do posts in this thread need to be moderated? This isn't the Same Trap.

 

You quoted a post with a word that's on the flagged list.  

[MUNIGRIT]

My bad! Always wondered why that was happening? Is Phil a word that isn't approved?

Edited May 6, 2022 by MUNIGRIT

[Titleist99]

Max Homa was interviewed, and he was asked about the weather condition, and he said that due to the wet conditions he had to hit more mid-irons and long irons into the greens.... Just wondering if the RBs take things like this into consideration when lobbying for shorter distance with present day equipment. NOTE> without the 50-yard roll due to the soggy fairways ......some of the long drivers seem quite pedestrian.

 

Homa went on to say that any water between the ball and club face make the player lose control....now imagine playing with rolled back equipment....some tournaments might be unwatchable.   IMO

[gvogel]

15 hours ago, Titleist99 said:

Max Homa was interviewed, and he was asked about the weather condition, and he said that due to the wet conditions he had to hit more mid-irons and long irons into the greens.... Just wondering if the RBs take things like this into consideration when lobbying for shorter distance with present day equipment. NOTE> without the 50-yard roll due to the soggy fairways ......some of the long drivers seem quite pedestrian.

 

Homa went on to say that any water between the ball and club face make the player lose control....now imagine playing with rolled back equipment....some tournaments might be unwatchable.   IMO

Or they committee could move the tees up to compensate.

 

Question: what is the average score on a typical par 3?  3.something?  An easy par 4?  3.8 or 3.9?  A hard par 4?  4.3 or close?  A par 5?  4.8 or around there?

 

Distance and score are directly related.  By the way, it is easier to move the tees forward than to build new tees farther back.

[Titleist99]

45 minutes ago, gvogel said:

Or they committee could move the tees up to compensate.

 

Question: what is the average score on a typical par 3?  3.something?  An easy par 4?  3.8 or 3.9?  A hard par 4?  4.3 or close?  A par 5?  4.8 or around there?

 

Distance and score are directly related.  By the way, it is easier to move the tees forward than to build new tees farther back.

Sure, they could do that.....modify the ball and clubs to make them go shorter distances and just move all touring pros to the ladies tee. Great, let the pros play the same game every club golfer in the country play every Saturday morning. Good luck with growing the game and keeping a watered down version of the modern game on television......

 

If everyone play the same course and the lowest score wins.....why would anyone need to build tees further back? Play what you got ........

[TLUBulldogGolf]

20 hours ago, Titleist99 said:

That was one tournament and Bryson haven't won Jack since. In that tournament Bryson won because he putted lights out and got up and down like a man possessed.

 

Take a look at the top 20 players in driving distance and come back to me when you find one that's a prolific winner.....

 

I'm not sure if Bryson even led in driving statistic in that tournament.

Jon Rahm, Justin Thomas, Scheffler is barely outside that. Strokes gained is a better stat though.

Edited May 7, 2022 by TLUBulldogGolf

[Titleist99]

37 minutes ago, TLUBulldogGolf said:

Jon Rahm, Justin Thomas, Scheffler is barely outside that. Strokes gained is a better stat though.

My point is that you can take the top 25 tour leaders in driving distance and you'll find that winning does not corollate with driving distance IMO.......for 2022. In fact you have more and more players trying to tone it down for accuracy and longevity. Bomb and Gouge is not sustainable. IMo but you have some on this board that swear by it....

[Trippels]

Let me know if I'm an idiot for this idea, but could a solution to keep the long drivers in check be to set up the courses to be much harsher with regards to OB areas? Say rather than letting the Pros hit it anywhere and still technically be in play, make it so if they end up in the adjacent fairway for example, then they're out of bounds and need to take a penalty. Penalty strokes will be much greater deterrent than high rough. And it allows for long hitters to be rewarded for a long and straight drive, but they run a substantial risk with regards to hitting it OB. For shorter hitters it probably wouldn't make much off a difference since they're naturally less off-line.

Also wouldn't require much modification to courses. 

For amateurs this wouldn't work too well off course since it would take too much time with regards to confirming a ball is OB, but the pros got forecaddies everywhere so they would immediately know.

[MUNIGRIT]

42 minutes ago, Titleist99 said:

My point is that you can take the top 25 tour leaders in driving distance and you'll find that winning does not corollate with driving distance IMO.......for 2022. In fact you have more and more players trying to tone it down for accuracy and longevity. Bomb and Gouge is not sustainable. IMo but you have some on this board that swear by it....

Rahm, JT, Koepka are top 25. Scotty S is 27 and every bit as long as those guys if he wants.

[MUNIGRIT]

16 minutes ago, Trippels said:

Let me know if I'm an idiot for this idea, but could a solution to keep the long drivers in check be to set up the courses to be much harsher with regards to OB areas? Say rather than letting the Pros hit it anywhere and still technically be in play, make it so if they end up in the adjacent fairway for example, then they're out of bounds and need to take a penalty. Penalty strokes will be much greater deterrent than high rough. And it allows for long hitters to be rewarded for a long and straight drive, but they run a substantial risk with regards to hitting it OB. For shorter hitters it probably wouldn't make much off a difference since they're naturally less off-line.

Also wouldn't require much modification to courses. 

For amateurs this wouldn't work too well off course since it would take too much time with regards to confirming a ball is OB, but the pros got forecaddies everywhere so they would immediately know.

You act like these long guys hit foul balls and make birdies. They are pretty straight for how far they hit it. Some of the short guys aren't very straight too. Sure you can add OB, layup areas, water. The long guys will even be more accurate and deadly hitting irons out there where the short knockers will be hitting driver to same spot.

[OrangeGravy]

5 hours ago, Titleist99 said:

Sure, they could do that.....modify the ball and clubs to make them go shorter distances and just move all touring pros to the ladies tee. Great, let the pros play the same game every club golfer in the country play every Saturday morning. Good luck with growing the game and keeping a watered down version of the modern game on television......

 

If everyone play the same course and the lowest score wins.....why would anyone need to build tees further back? Play what you got ........

Wait a minute,  I've been told that wanting to play the same game as the pros is why bifurcation would hurt the game. Are you saying we aren't playing same game now? And it will hurt the game of golf if we all play the same game?

[milesgiles]

5 hours ago, Titleist99 said:

Sure, they could do that.....modify the ball and clubs to make them go shorter distances and just move all touring pros to the ladies tee. Great, let the pros play the same game every club golfer in the country play every Saturday morning. Good luck with growing the game and keeping a watered down version of the modern game on television......

 

If everyone play the same course and the lowest score wins.....why would anyone need to build tees further back? Play what you got ........

 

making the driver harder to hit = watered down??

[farmer]

Again, Miles, OEM's have to have a product to sell that WILL sell.  Shrink drivers down, take the tech out of them, no problem for a design team.  But nobody outside forum world wants that.  Nobody would buy that driver.

[milesgiles]

6 minutes ago, farmer said:

Again, Miles, OEM's have to have a product to sell that WILL sell.  Shrink drivers down, take the tech out of them, no problem for a design team.  But nobody outside forum world wants that.  Nobody would buy that driver.

 

pro's and amateurs in gross comps only. Duffers use whatever.

[MUNIGRIT]

3 hours ago, Titleist99 said:

My point is that you can take the top 25 tour leaders in driving distance and you'll find that winning does not corollate with driving distance IMO.......for 2022. In fact you have more and more players trying to tone it down for accuracy and longevity. Bomb and Gouge is not sustainable. IMo but you have some on this board that swear by it....

You know what is even more worthless than driving distance is driving accuracy. Look at that list of top 25 vs the top 25 of driving distance and see who has more combined wins. 

[Titleist99]

44 minutes ago, MUNIGRIT said:

You know what is even more worthless than driving distance is driving accuracy. Look at that list of top 25 vs the top 25 of driving distance and see who has more combined wins. 

And neither means Jack squat if you can't hit a green and make the putts.....

[Titleist99]

1 hour ago, milesgiles said:

 

pro's and amateurs in gross comps only. Duffers use whatever.

The appeal of golf is the fact that we can play thee same equipment and play the same courses as the Pros do......

 

I don't think little head drivers would speed the game up an y,,,,,, seven hour rounds. LOL!

Amateurs imitate pros.

[Titleist99]

2 hours ago, milesgiles said:

 

making the driver harder to hit = watered down??

Yep, I call it tricking up the equipment.....You know like you guys don't want them tricking up the golf course with defense.......

[Titleist99]

3 hours ago, OrangeGravy said:

Wait a minute,  I've been told that wanting to play the same game as the pros is why bifurcation would hurt the game. Are you saying we aren't playing same game now? And it will hurt the game of golf if we all play the same game?

Oh yes we play the same game on paper but in reality the Pros play a game for which none of us are familiar.....but in most amateurs mind it gives us something to stive for......don't kill our dream.

 

Thay's why we buy $500 new drivers without taking lessons and hit it the same 220 yards that we did with the old driver........let that soak in.

[Titleist99]

3 hours ago, OrangeGravy said:

Wait a minute,  I've been told that wanting to play the same game as the pros is why bifurcation would hurt the game. Are you saying we aren't playing same game now? And it will hurt the game of golf if we all play the same game?

I'm saying that the game is fine,,,,,why mess with it because some don't like the optics of short irons into par4s and touring pros going for the green in two shots.

 

To mess with something that isn't broken is irresponsible.......Just my opinion.

To buy more land for the situation about is moronic and imbecilic even if your name is ANGC.

But I digress.....

[MUNIGRIT]

Let's make the OEM make a different club and balls for less than a few hundred people in the world who don't even pay for equipment. Makes sense to me.

[Titleist99]

Pros battling for pars, bogies and double bogies doesn't interest me.....I can see that every Saturday morning on any Muni in the country. I predict the same with a rollback.

 

I feel sorry for the players at the Wells Fargo.

[Titleist99]

21 minutes ago, MUNIGRIT said:

Let's make the OEM make a different club and balls for less than a few hundred people in the world who don't even pay for equipment. Makes sense to me.

I'm not sure if that's your position or sarcasm.......

[milesgiles]

6 hours ago, Titleist99 said:

The appeal of golf is the fact that we can play thee same equipment and play the same courses as the Pros do......

 

I don't think little head drivers would speed the game up an y,,,,,, seven hour rounds. LOL!

Amateurs imitate pros.

 

3 hours was regarded as slow in the past 

[milesgiles]

6 hours ago, Titleist99 said:

Yep, I call it tricking up the equipment.....You know like you guys don't want them tricking up the golf course with defense.......

 

could you and clevited please decide if the bigger sweetspot is an advantage or not?

 

And if it is, further explain why the best in the world NEED 'tricked up' equipment

[OrangeGravy]

7 hours ago, Titleist99 said:

Oh yes we play the same game on paper but in reality the Pros play a game for which none of us are familiar.....but in most amateurs mind it gives us something to stive for......don't kill our dream.

 

Thay's why we buy $500 new drivers without taking lessons and hit it the same 220 yards that we did with the old driver........let that soak in.

So your real issue with any potential change is you don't want to destroy the facade?