DON'T go to the range.....

[z3bracakes]

25 minutes ago, phizzy30 said:

Practice with a purpose.  That's what my college coach taught me.  My father's CC had small greens with pins so I would aim at those and hit balls.  When we had official team meetings at the range at our home course, we would often play games at the range and short game area.  Kept things interesting and and productive. 

I think part of the problem, at least for me is, our local ranges suck. They aren't conducive to "practicing with a purpose". It's basically a field with a bunch of sticks in the ground and you never know what yardage your hitting to unless your shooting it with a range finder. 

 

Some have decent short game areas, and if I'm ever at a range that's normally where you would find me.

 

Edited May 15, 2023 by z3bracakes

[Is Golf Fun or Work]

1 hour ago, bluedot said:

This isn’t about the range or practice; it’s about your friend not knowing HOW to practice.

What does your crystal ball say he should practice?

[RichieHunt]

Depends on the person.  Some are really good at playing golf despite spending all of their time on the range and rarely going out to play.  Others need to play more often than they go to the range.

 

But it also depends on the experience and age.  A golfer under the age of 16 should be playing far more than they should be practicing.  They need to learn the game as much as they can before they start to learn their own mechanics.  It doesn't mean that they shouldn't practice, but more of their time should be spent on the course than on the range.  Without fail I see this with junior golfers...the best golfers that end up getting the D1 scholarships are the ones that play more than they practice while the ones that put almost all of their time into the range just never get to that next level and usually have real problems going low (part of it is due to the low sample size of rounds played, so they have less opportunity to actually shoot a low round of golf).

 

IIRC, it was Dr. Fran Pirozzollo that has talked about how playing enough golf will actually help the golfer that is working on their swing being able to execute their desired mechanics more quickly.  Probably something that doesn't get mentioned enough.

 

 

 

 

RH

[Texasaggie2016]

46 minutes ago, Jayjay_theweim_guy said:

Completely agree on the drills are only as good as the data you get from them part.  But the data from drills often isn't a numeric outcome, it's your body learning the feel from a different motion and seeing what different positions that puts you into, or sometimes---and this where your LM comes in---seeing what that different movement does to contact and speed.

 

I chimed in though mainly for the quoted phrase.  Certainly, it can be expensive to build a wedge matrix at the driving range.  Not to mention that range balls are going to behave differently than your game balls. 

 

But I use a range near my home (a pipeline right of way), and build out my carry distances and windows there with my four wedges, and other clubs I feel like using for feel shots.  A shag bag helps immensely.  Much shorter trip too, as I don't live near any range besides TopGolf, and...yeah.  Plus the ranges here shut down at seemingly any rain, and it rains a bit in SE Texas.

 

If you don't have that space though (and chipping greens, depending on the course/practice facility, don't really allow for this, IME), then a driving range is better than nothing, IMHO.

This is where my analytical mind comes in. If I am getting the performance I want/need and it feels off, I keep doing it until it doesn't. Know this is a challenge for most, but it works for me.

 

I agree the driving range is better than nothing, but that is why the LM was one of the best investments in my game. Gives me the hard data (reasonably accurately) and I don't need more than an 8x20 space in my shop/backyard. 

 

I feel the rain comment...1.5-hr south down HWY 59 from you.

[vandyfan]

On 5/14/2023 at 8:32 AM, Ripper212 said:

Doesn't anyone else here just use the range because it's FUN?

 

Came here to post this. I love hitting balls on the range. A really nice, secluded range (especially those at high end remote resorts) are AWESOME. Where the grass is perfect (yes I know that is not how real golf is) and the balls are soft and you just hit every shot you can think of. I think because right now I rarely have time to get to the range so when I do I really appreciate being there. I might feel differently if I had the job or lifestyle that allowed me to be at the range every day. That might take some luster off it. 

 

Right now, partly because I am cheap and partly because there are not any nice ranges near me, I scour the areas around my house and my work for the best grass and empty areas to hit golf balls with my shag bag (large baseball field complexes work well). Then I hit 9 irons and 60 of my shag balls and go pick them up. This accomplishes both the practice goal and requires me to be more focused on where all my shots end up so that I can go find them all. I find hitting balls to be more relaxing and therapeutic than playing golf. Golf practice is a leisure activity but actually playing golf is a bit more stressful than that. 

Edited May 15, 2023 by vandyfan

[MonteScheinblum]

Jason Day wins after 5 years.  Talked to Chris yesterday, the change took a year and then some.  
 

Ams want the next shot after a change to be a 1 yard flushed draw on target.

[bladehunter]

On 5/14/2023 at 9:32 AM, Ripper212 said:

Doesn't anyone else here just use the range because it's FUN?

Yes. My home range ( at my home ) is where I unwind. Have fun.  And seek peace and quiet.  I love hitting balls. But id never do this on a mat range.  Grass or nothing 

Edited May 15, 2023 by bladehunter

[Rbsiedsc]

2 minutes ago, bladehunter said:

Yes. My home range ( at my home ) is where I unwind. Have fun.  And seek peace and quiet.  I love hitting balls. But id never do this on a mat range.  Grass or nothing 

i wish I could do this on grass. Only two courses by me have grass and charge and extra four dollars a bucket to use it. For me, playing more is a better way to practice and use it as practice dropping multiple balls.

[bladehunter]

1 minute ago, Rbsiedsc said:

i wish I could do this on grass. Only two courses by me have grass and charge and extra four dollars a bucket to use it. For me, playing more is a better way to practice and use it as practice dropping multiple balls.

I get it.  The one really huge plus I get from having farmland that I work 7 days a week to keep up , is that it allowed me room to build a wedge and long iron / driver range. Only kicker is of course I have to walk and pick it myself.  But it’s not so bad.  I truly can’t imagine playing this game without it currently. Because I’m lucky if I see the course once a week.  

[PhillipG78]

2 hours ago, bluedot said:

Bingo!
 

And I’d add these:

1. The exception proves the rule.  Naming two guys known for NOT practicing is a remarkably small sample size, isn’t it?  What do you suppose the Tour average is for practice time?

2. We only know what Daly and Lietzke did, not what they MIGHT have done had they chosen to approach things differently.  Maybe better, maybe worse, but assuming that they accomplished what they did BECAUSE they didn’t practice much is a heavy duty logical fallacy.,

3. The fact that there might be a few Tour pros who don’t seem to practice much is meaningless to me; professional athletes are touched by god.  I have to work at it.  

Literally NOBODY should do what big John does, quite frankly I’m amazed the man’s still alive 

[bakere]

27 minutes ago, bladehunter said:

I get it.  The one really huge plus I get from having farmland that I work 7 days a week to keep up , is that it allowed me room to build a wedge and long iron / driver range. Only kicker is of course I have to walk and pick it myself.  But it’s not so bad.  I truly can’t imagine playing this game without it currently. Because I’m lucky if I see the course once a week.  

I have a similar situation. I don't have a farm but am surrounded by farmer's fields. I do most of my practice into a net off a mat and record swings. But the last few balls are always off my lawn (shortly mowed area) into the farmers field so I can confirm ball flight and low point. I have to shag the balls myself, but I wait until there are 30-40 out there and collect, which is usually monthly.

 

I only play 9 holes once, sometimes twice a week and it's at a busy muni where I cannot drop multiple balls very often.

[ThinkingPlus]

The range is where you work on things where you need a consequence free zone or are using swing aides, drills, etc... i.e. not hitting golf shots.

 

The course is where you begin applying pressure to changes you have made in your game.

 

Without pressure, you will never know whether swing changes work in all circumstances.  As you feel comfortable with the changes testing them casually on the course, then you ratchet up the consequences with friendly comps, club championships, state events, etc... . Course only play usually never allows development of swing changes because the consequence gets in the way.

 

Most folks need both range work and play to improve as a player. You can't fix the plumbing with the water on and you can't validate a repair without water pressure.

 

 

 

[bluedot]

1 hour ago, PhillipG78 said:

Literally NOBODY should do what big John does, quite frankly I’m amazed the man’s still alive 

Three years ago at the SAS Champions Tour event in Cary, NC, I was less than 10' away from Mr. Daly as he walked from the green to his cart before driving the cart 25 yards to the next tee.  Looking at him up close, I had that exact thought; "I can't believe he's lived thru what he's done to himself."

[Double Mocha Man]

42 minutes ago, bluedot said:

Three years ago at the SAS Champions Tour event in Cary, NC, I was less than 10' away from Mr. Daly as he walked from the green to his cart before driving the cart 25 yards to the next tee.  Looking at him up close, I had that exact thought; "I can't believe he's lived thru what he's done to himself."

 

The human body is amazingly resilient.

[Ripper212]

3 hours ago, bladehunter said:

Yes. My home range ( at my home ) is where I unwind. Have fun.  And seek peace and quiet.  I love hitting balls. But id never do this on a mat range.  Grass or nothing 

I'm lucky to live on the water and occasionally hit old balls into the ocean. Once I was doing this just wearing a bathing suit and my son filmed me from the porch (I didn't know he was there). He then posted video on Instagram with the obvious Seinfeld reference "Is that a Titleist?"

[cheeser]

The ranges where I live are notoriously substandard.  For as good as conditions can be on the course itself, the ranges are lacking.  Let's not even talk about the range balls.  Anyways, going to the range to work on anything full swing is futile.  It does me more harm than good.  So, I stick to putting and chipping.  I really only hit balls before a round of golf and that's just tempo and loosening up.

[Barfolomew]

All practice is the same..... no matter what part of the game or where it happens..... its all important

 

You're exploring thru experimentation or maybe you're experimenting thru exploration..... you pick which ever one sounds cooler

 

You have to figure out what you like and do not like.  Sure you're million dollar coach can show you something but you have to chip away and make it yours and that happens hitting many balls over and over.... just ask Moe he knows

 

 

[z3bracakes]

4 hours ago, PhillipG78 said:

Literally NOBODY should do what big John does, quite frankly I’m amazed the man’s still alive 

JD is a national treasure. I'm partial to the man though as I'm only a few minutes away from the University of Arkansas. 

 

We only live once, rip a couple darts and drink a 12 pack of diet coke on the course.

[PhillipG78]

21 minutes ago, z3bracakes said:

JD is a national treasure. I'm partial to the man though as I'm only a few minutes away from the University of Arkansas. 

 

We only live once, rip a couple darts and drink a 12 pack of diet coke on the course.

Big John is not a mortal and bad things happen when mortals have the hubris to do what the gods do. 

[golfarb1]

There seems to be 3 categories of golfer whom you see at practice ranges 

The first group is what I call the “ Top golf “

golfer . They treat going to the local driving as similar to going Top Golf without the arcade effects . They hit mainly drivers , often as hard as the can with their only goal 

blasting a few as far as they can . 
The second  group , which is over represented by those on Golfwrx , are serious golfers whose goal is to lower their handicaps . These golfers need to be anal about their setups and require at least occasional feedback  ( think at least video ) to verify that they are performing their swing goals correctly . Most often they have been/ are working with a pro . They need to realize that their genetic makeup places a ceiling on how much they will improve . 
The third group , which is a subgroup of the second does not give a damn about lowering their handicap ; their  goal is the feeling of compressing as many shots as is possible . This subgroup will never hit off of mats  and probably enjoys practicing more than playing . The ultimate representative of this subgroup is Moe Norman , especially  after his competitive days were over . 
Unless you are a touring pro or unless you make your money as a teaching or club pro, the ONLY reason why you play and practice golf is personal satisfaction and comaraderie.
Which of the three above groups ranks highest is this regard ?

[Hot Rod 71]

Some of my best scores have happened after walking from my truck to the first tee. A couple of warm up swings beside the tee box and then play. 
 

I’ve found the looser I get on the range, the more likely I am to overswing at the beginning of the round. If I go straight to the first tee, my body loses up over the course of the first few holes and my scoring throughout the round is more consistent. YMMV. 

[ebk]

6 hours ago, MonteScheinblum said:

Jason Day wins after 5 years.  Talked to Chris yesterday, the change took a year and then some.  
 

Ams want the next shot after a change to be a 1 yard flushed draw on target.

BTW - Happy B-Day, Monte!

 

[bluedot]

7 hours ago, Is Golf Fun or Work said:

What does your crystal ball say he should practice?

Go ahead and be sarcastic; that's ok.

 

WHAT he should practice depends 100% on him.  I know what I need to practice when I go to the range and the short game area; I don't know anything about your friend.

 

I just had a lesson last Tuesday to work on wedge play, full and partial.  I spent the rest of the week working on the content of that lesson before I played again.  I was coming out of a match play interclub competition in which I had hit 13/14 fairways, but only 6 greens, and I had hit my 4 hybrid better than my gap wedge.  I wanted to vomit when I finished the round, so my path forward was clear to me.  I was fortunate that not only is the head pro at my club one of the very best in NC, but that the stuff we had to fix was all setup; ball position, hand position, alignment, distance to the ball; really nothing about the swing at all.  It took him a half hour to show me, and I then spent three days and about 500 balls working on it.

 

What somebody else needs to work on is individual.  But the idea that somehow a golfer could be better off without practicing just means they either don't know where they are losing strokes, which is not uncommon, or they aren't putting any time and thought into devising a decent practice plan.

 

This is always amusing to me.  There isn't another sport that I know of where this is even a discussion.

[z3bracakes]

2 hours ago, golfarb1 said:

The first group is what I call the “ Top golf “

golfer . They treat going to the local driving as similar to going Top Golf without the arcade effects . They hit mainly drivers , often as hard as the can with their only goal 

Definitely me, nobody goes to top golf and not try to blast driver over the fence.

 

2 hours ago, Hot Rod 71 said:

Some of my best scores have happened after walking from my truck to the first tee. A couple of warm up swings beside the tee box and then play. 
 

Preach brother, first time I ever broke par was exactly like this. I think the whole round the only thought I had in my head was if I wanted the club sandwich or wings afterwards in the clubhouse.

 

9 hours ago, RichieHunt said:

IIRC, it was Dr. Fran Pirozzollo that has talked about how playing enough golf will actually help the golfer that is working on their swing being able to execute their desired mechanics more quickly.  Probably something that doesn't get mentioned enough

This.....

[Ri_Redneck]

The great thing about the range is you only go if you want to. If you don't want to, you don't even know who the heck IS there. So why worry. Do what suits your game and your passion. Then, don't criticize those who go and don't get better. Instead, suggest something that will help them!

 

BT

[dubbelbogey]

3 hours ago, Hot Rod 71 said:

Some of my best scores have happened after walking from my truck to the first tee. A couple of warm up swings beside the tee box and then play. 
 

I'm sure most of us have experienced this at some point. I think there's something to going out without too many thoughts and expectations and just playing.

 

Go read the story in the General forum about how Steph Curry has had some of his best games after skipping team practice and instead going to the golf course. But nobody in his right mind would assert that if all he did was play golf that he'd be performing his best on the basketball court. Curry is known for his work ethic and superhuman efforts on the practice court. That (and talent) is what makes him so good. The fact that he goes off sometimes after not practicing and playing golf instead is that he knows when he needs a break from the grind.

 

As for crappy ranges, yeah - they suck. I have one in my area that I still go to anyway just because it's so close to home (despite having a good number of pretty nice ranges a bit farther away).  But I still think you can work on full swing strike even if the balls suck and you're hitting off of mats. If you're honest with yourself, you know when you hit it fat, yet the ball still flies ok. But a clean strike is a clean strike, no matter if the ball only flies 75% of what it would normally do if it were a ProV1 off of nice turf.

 

But, like I said before, mindless range time is likely not a productive way to improve. That's not an indictment of the range, though.

 

 

[golferdude54]

No one in the history of golf has ever became the best golfer in the world by ONLY playing the golf course everyday with no coach or instruction and zero driving range, short game area, and putting green experience.
 

It doesn’t matter if they start playing from the time they were born, it’s 100% impossible to play with zero practice or instruction and expect to become the best. Not even the best in the world in that case, just the best they can be period.

[bluedot]

The posts about good rounds without hitting balls on the range THAT DAY are about warming up, rather than about practicing.  We’ve all had those rounds, if only because we were playing a course with no range, or because the range was closed.  That has nothing to do with the question of whether or not range time is beneficial.

[PhillipG78]

On 5/15/2023 at 12:32 PM, bluedot said:

Three years ago at the SAS Champions Tour event in Cary, NC, I was less than 10' away from Mr. Daly as he walked from the green to his cart before driving the cart 25 yards to the next tee.  Looking at him up close, I had that exact thought; "I can't believe he's lived thru what he's done to himself."

Big John is clearly not a mortal man

[Ripper212]

1 hour ago, PhillipG78 said:

Big John is clearly not a mortal man

Was next to him at driving range at Tiburon several years ago. He had a cigarette in his mouth, talking on cellphone in his right hand, while hitting the most beautiful left handed wedge shots. Probably could have been drinking a beer too!