What would your ball flight be if you play a 'senior' shaft but don't need one

[jordan2240]

First, I am a senior (63), and, while I don't know what my driver swing speed is, I'm pretty sure it's not above 90 simply based on a simulator session I played a year or so ago and the fact I rarely hit a drive beyond 210-220.  I recently purchased a used callaway mini-driver with a senior shaft, and having no idea if I really need a senior shaft, am wondering what my expected ball flight might be if I play one and have a swing speed that is too fast for it.  I'm assuming that, unless I'm swinging significantly over what a senior shaft is designed for, there won't be much difference between a senior shaft and regular shaft, but I could be completely wrong.  Thanks for any input.

[596]

I'm 68.  Normal drives are 220 or so.  I play regular flex in most of my clubs, but I do play a senior flex 3 wood and actually a Ladies flex in a Cobra 5H.  The 5 is 28* so play it as my 6/7 iron in my carry bag.  The senior/Ladies flex clubs have to be swung with better tempo and not overpowered.  The flight will probably be higher then normal.  At least that's what I have found.  Don't try to hit them really hard or you may flex that shaft a bit more then you want.  I love both those clubs!

[Petethreeput]

This is my understanding of the role of the shaft in the swing.

 

The senior shaft flexes with less force to increase distance and there can also be some twisting of the clubhead.  The key to squaring the clubface is the speed the shaft returns to straight.  The more flex the slower it is to return to straight which impacts the flight.  If your timing is perfect for the shaft flex you should gain distance.

 

If you are late breaking your wrists the clubhead won’t have returned to square and will be a slice bc the clubhead is behind.  If you are early the ball will hook bc the clubhead is passing your hands before impact.

 

I should add, the swing speed is important but so is the speed/ smoothness of the transition to the downswing.  A fast transition results in greater flex right away.

Edited June 25, 2023 by Petethreeput

[tm3]

When I was piddling with club making, the prescription was that if one uses a shaft that is too stiff, they lose distance, while if one uses a shaft that is too flexible, they lose control i.e. have greater shot dispersion (which is why I play XXXStiff, but still can't find the fairway --jk).  The other pearl was that how one loads the shaft (transition, acceleration) is more of a factor regarding need for stiffness as opposed to absolute swing speed.  Maybe an expert will weigh in and confirm the above or tell us the real deal.

 

I play R flex, as S flex feel strange to me.  I'm currently also using an L flex 4W borrowed from my wife and it's fine.  Almost every male I play with uses S flex, even the ones who can't even get to 200 off the tee.

 

So for you I would say, see how the club feels and see how you play with it.  You might be longer with a senior flex (or wilder).

Edited June 25, 2023 by tm3

[ShortGolfer]

I think the only way to figure out what works best is to get fitted at a place with a wide selection of shafts.

It also helps to have an open mind and consider using L flex clubs if that is what the fitter suggests.

There are stories, which I believe to be totally credible, of guys sacrificing a lot of distance because ego gets in the way of choosing the right shafts.

 

A softer flex may help if it enables you to consistently swing with the proper tempo.

 

I have color coded shafts in my bag!  I have a bunch of distinctive white shafts as well as black shafts.  The 7W has a purple shaft.

Three different colors but all senior flex for my driver and woods.  The woods are the same product line but with a higher launch than driver.

 

Edited June 25, 2023 by ShortGolfer

[aggiegolfer21]

Conventional wisdom would say that you'll hit it higher with more spin and more to the left/less to the right.  It is totally dependent on your swing and which shaft it is.  Different shafts will play differently even if they all say "senior flex" on them.  Get fit for a shaft and find out.

[Long_Left]

I'll probably take some flak for this but...

 

Shaft flex doesn't really matter for ball flight and spin.

 

Shaft flex absolutely matters for mostly 1) strike point and, to a far lesser extent, 2) head delivery conditions like spin loft and face angle etc.

 

I'm not a professional fitter, just an avid gear junkie and I'm fond of hitting anything and everything I can get my hands on and have access to a trackman. How the club feels in your hands and how you react to loading are the only factors that matter. Things like droop can have a significant impact on where the ball impacts the face and flex changes droop but your swing speed has very little to do with it.

 

If all other factors are identical, a stiffer shaft is typically heavier which will delay release by some margin and lower flight and spin. But your movements dictate ball flight, think Rory and Bryson hitting driver 150 feet in the air with ultra stiff driver shafts, Martin Borgmier (spelling?) doing the same using a shaft that reacts like a bullwhip (I believe he said it was a ladies flex), and Cam Champ averaging similar ball speeds using similar equipment but hitting it to a 70 foot apex.

 

I'm not trying to compare any of us to pros or long drive champions, but it's not the saw, it's the lumberjack. 

 

Find the shaft weight and swing weight that makes you comfortable and delivers a consistent strike, then flex can be used to make minor refinements.

[MelloYello]

23 hours ago, aggiegolfer21 said:

Conventional wisdom would say that you'll hit it higher with more spin and more to the left/less to the right.  It is totally dependent on your swing and which shaft it is.  Different shafts will play differently even if they all say "senior flex" on them.  Get fit for a shaft and find out.

 

The above is accurate. 

 

Excessive flex will result in greater spin and a higher ball-flight the harder you go after it. Also, it's more often than not the case that players experience a draw-bias resulting from the shaft whipping through faster thus squaring and closing the clubface rapidly. 

 

That's before you start compensating, LOL. 

[virtuoso]

3 hours ago, Long_Left said:

I'll probably take some flak for this but...

 

Shaft flex doesn't really matter for ball flight and spin.

 

Shaft flex absolutely matters for mostly 1) strike point and, to a far lesser extent, 2) head delivery conditions like spin loft and face angle etc.

 

I'm not a professional fitter, just an avid gear junkie and I'm fond of hitting anything and everything I can get my hands on and have access to a trackman. How the club feels in your hands and how you react to loading are the only factors that matter. Things like droop can have a significant impact on where the ball impacts the face and flex changes droop but your swing speed has very little to do with it.

 

If all other factors are identical, a stiffer shaft is typically heavier which will delay release by some margin and lower flight and spin. But your movements dictate ball flight, think Rory and Bryson hitting driver 150 feet in the air with ultra stiff driver shafts, Martin Borgmier (spelling?) doing the same using a shaft that reacts like a bullwhip (I believe he said it was a ladies flex), and Cam Champ averaging similar ball speeds using similar equipment but hitting it to a 70 foot apex.

 

I'm not trying to compare any of us to pros or long drive champions, but it's not the saw, it's the lumberjack. 

 

Find the shaft weight and swing weight that makes you comfortable and delivers a consistent strike, then flex can be used to make minor refinements.

This is correct.

[jordan2240]

Played a round today at a very familiar course, and after playing with club settings and finally just strengthening my top hand, I hit the club better than the club it replaced, so whether shaft had an impact or not I don't know, but it didn't have a negative one.

[Tanner25]

If a shaft is too flexible, would it pair better with certain golf balls?

[nitram]

22 hours ago, MelloYello said:

 

The above is accurate. 

 

Excessive flex will result in greater spin and a higher ball-flight the harder you go after it. Also, it's more often than not the case that players experience a draw-bias resulting from the shaft whipping through faster thus squaring and closing the clubface rapidly.

 

19 hours ago, virtuoso said:

This is correct.

 

Hmmmm🤔

[MelloYello]

34 minutes ago, nitram said:

 

 

Hmmmm🤔

 

I stand by what I said. It's generally the case that the ball will travel on a higher flight (or at least knock-downs will be more difficult to generate) and there will be a subtle draw bias introduced. This is virtually always the case. 

 

That said, I could go play with a Senior Flex shaft right now if I wanted. The differences are barely noticeable and may even be preferable to some golfers, TBH. While many like me use X-flex by default, I stick to relatively soft models these days (see signature) not only in their S-flex but in stiffness profile, too. It's just what my swing prefers. No white or orange profiles for me, thank you. I'll take blue all day. 

 

Is the "wrong" flex going to kill someone? Absolutely not. Only a fool would blame such minor things for bad results. In the end, shaft flex is really more just personal preference. Whatever generates the best contact and what feels the least distracting is what a person should play. 

 

That's my view on it, having tried tons and tons of different shaft types. I guess I'd fall into the "play the softest thing you can control" category. Such shafts usually create the kinds of ball-flight that inspire confidence and thus better swings. Heavier and/or stiffer shafts tend to throw a player out of whack almost instantly. Counter-balanced can do the same. 

 

If I have to choose whether my pants are a size too tight or a size too big, I'll take the latter. Nothing wrong with a little slack in the line. 

 

.

Edited June 27, 2023 by MelloYello

[Three_Jack]

Martin Borgmeier said Long Drive guys DON'T use stiff shafts. They use regular and senior like flexes. 

[golfinbrad]

There is no blanket response on how it will perform.  Also doesn't help that there is no industry standard for flex ratings.  Rocco Mediate has a video saying the stiffer the shaft, the more he draws it.  For me, it is high and right.  For others, it is the opposite.  It will vary person to person.  Keep in mind weight and shaft profile play a factor as well.  I think one thing that we can agree on is dispersion or control.  A shaft that doesn't work is one where you have difficulty making solid contact and a consistent flight or results.

[Denny100]

On 6/25/2023 at 12:45 AM, jordan2240 said:

First, I am a senior (63), and, while I don't know what my driver swing speed is, I'm pretty sure it's not above 90 simply based on a simulator session I played a year or so ago and the fact I rarely hit a drive beyond 210-220.  I recently purchased a used callaway mini-driver with a senior shaft, and having no idea if I really need a senior shaft, am wondering what my expected ball flight might be if I play one and have a swing speed that is too fast for it.  I'm assuming that, unless I'm swinging significantly over what a senior shaft is designed for, there won't be much difference between a senior shaft and regular shaft, but I could be completely wrong.  Thanks for any input.

 

The ball flight you will see is however the shaft affects your delivery and timing. Will differ player to player.

 

In of itself, there will be no effect IF you swing the same way with the XXXXX flex and the senior flex.

[NoTalentLefty]

1 hour ago, Three_Jack said:

Martin Borgmeier said Long Drive guys DON'T use stiff shafts. They use regular and senior like flexes. 

Now you did it! I wanna senior flex shaft

[PracticeSwinger]

1 hour ago, Three_Jack said:

Martin Borgmeier said Long Drive guys DON'T use stiff shafts. They use regular and senior like flexes. 

I'm guessing the fact that one player tries to fit one shot out of eight into a grid and it has to end up at 400+ yards or else it's useless while the other type tries to fit as many drives into a 40 yards wide window in the 300 yards range has to do with what they're swinging

[nitram]

3 hours ago, MelloYello said:

 

I stand by what I said. It's generally the case that the ball will travel on a higher flight (or at least knock-downs will be more difficult to generate) and there will be a subtle draw bias introduced. This is virtually always the case. 

 

That said, I could go play with a Senior Flex shaft right now if I wanted. The differences are barely noticeable and may even be preferable to some golfers, TBH. While many like me use X-flex by default, I stick to relatively soft models these days (see signature) not only in their S-flex but in stiffness profile, too. It's just what my swing prefers. No white or orange profiles for me, thank you. I'll take blue all day. 

 

Is the "wrong" flex going to kill someone? Absolutely not. Only a fool would blame such minor things for bad results. In the end, shaft flex is really more just personal preference. Whatever generates the best contact and what feels the least distracting is what a person should play. 

 

That's my view on it, having tried tons and tons of different shaft types. I guess I'd fall into the "play the softest thing you can control" category. Such shafts usually create the kinds of ball-flight that inspire confidence and thus better swings. Heavier and/or stiffer shafts tend to throw a player out of whack almost instantly. Counter-balanced can do the same. 

 

If I have to choose whether my pants are a size too tight or a size too big, I'll take the latter. Nothing wrong with a little slack in the line. 

 

.

Not disagreeing with you. It's just the two quoted posts were 180 degrees apart . . .

[golfarb1]

All touring pros have access to a variety of shafts and use equipment like Trackman to maximize  various parameters .

This is in contrast to amateur golfers , who often buy their drivers off the rack with very little if any testing .

I recently told a friend that I could guarantee him 20 yards if he were willing to spend the extra money to be fit by a competent ( and more expensive ) fitter. 
He  chose to remain with his current driver .