Rounds with a Vintage Bag

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

Courses still open here, so I played 9 holes recently with my little girl. Muirfield irons 1i-SW, Mizuno MS-1 Driver and 4w, and a Taylormade TPA IX putter.

My tee shots were a bit off. I was finding the centre of the club but not the centre of the fairway. Irons were great, though the wind messed up my distances sometimes.

I played with a wound ball, and it made driving so much easier. I tried a Callaway TruVis Chrome soft alongside, and it felt like a rock compared to the wound ball. It was like a cheap two-piece from back in the day. Even the old Wilson Ultras felt better. So I used a surlyn wound today, and it made driving the ball with a persimmon so much easier. My conclusions were that most modern balls do not spin enough for persimmon drivers, which is why a Pro V1 goes as far or further with a persimmon 3w than a persimmon driver. Interestingly, I'm not sure the difference is so pronounced with irons. I hit the old wound surlyn about the same distances I would expect to hit the modern ball.

Finally, I did hit the one iron --just once-- and I hit a beauty with it. I was surprised at the height. The 2i I hit twice; one not very good, one a cracking shot. These irons have some pop!

I don't want to sound like a broken record, but...the wound ball felt fine with the persimmons and Mac Muifields, but the Callaway TruVis Chrome soft felt AWFUL on both the irons and woods. It was like a rock. Horrendous.

[NRJyzr]

Posted much of this in the Blade users thread....

So I got my first round of 2020 in yesterday. I'd planned on taking my MP-37s along, but I hadn't been yet able to have the 2 iron I'd acquired to go with it adjusted for loft and lie, and my rudimentary protractor measurements on my Auditor club ruler show it's a little too close to my 3 iron. Same with the Maxfli Revolution 1 iron I have used off and on, it appears to have been bent weak at some point. Put my recently acquired Ram TW282 1 iron to the test, it shows to be around 16-17*. Sounds perfect. In the bag went the TW282s.

This club has a Ping DGX Cushion shaft. I haven't been playing DGX for a while, wasn't sure this was such a smart idea, but decided to give it a shot anyway. Adding to the uncertainty was something I found when I was regripping for use yesterday, the stamping on the butt section showed it to be the 40.5" DGX shaft. I have a hard stepped DGX shaft in my 1 iron, LOL. Put it in the bag anyway. ?

On to the course. Hit a good iron shot on #1, just babied it too much into the wind so left me short of the pin about 40 feet. On #3, I started hitting thin irons, the lovely low line drives that look great in a baseball game. I think I got two RBI in three holes. Realized I was swinging too flat, started hitting it better.

Amusingly, in the middle of this skull parade , I got a chance to hit the 1 iron off the deck, on a par 5. I'd hit a not too good tee shot up the right side, left me with quite a bit left to the green. I'm in the rough, but my ball is sitting up a bit, why not? Hit it great, drilled up the fairway. Woo! Hit it a few more times off the tee, hit a snap hook on the next effort, but hit it good the other two attempts. No problems with the DGX shaft, which surprised me.

Distance was short, but what do you expect after 5+ months off, with only one half hour range session over the winter? Overall, I had a lot of fun hitting my TW282. I'm still not fond of the Precision shaft (these have 6.5's), but I got through it OK. ?

Here's the new content to the previous post....

In the bag were the Orlimar Driver and 3w I picked up last fall from Brother Deejaid. I was quite interested in seeing how these worked. New Old Stock, if memory serves, with DGS shafts. Really quite splendid looking. Added a bit of lead tape to get them where I like them, weight-wise, and off we went. Started with them right off, hit 3w on #1, driver on #2. Both were directly into the wind, and I was not warmed up. so distance was sort of blah, but direction was quite lovely. Wasn't making great contact, but started to figure it out towards the end of the front nine, culminating in a lovely tee shot on the 431 yd par 4, leaving me a 7 iron in.

They are passing the test in many ways.

Didn't get a chance to hit the 3w off the deck, the one shot I had a chance to do that, I chose the 1 iron (mentioned above).

edited to add: golfballs used, I alternated between a Duo Professional and a 50 Elite. At least until I duckhooked the Duo Pro into a pond on 11, anyway. LOL I'm really a fan of the Duo Pro, it's great in the wind, but the overall differences are hard to see when it's 48* and greens are a little shaggy. Both balls are quite excellent.

[deejaid]

Glad to hear those Orlimar’s are working for you. Sounds like you had a fun round! ?

[NRJyzr]

 

They're quite lovely. And thank you again.

I haven't hit the 4w yet, but I expect I will as the season goes on. Even if I'm able to play an iron in that slot, it's like Dirty Harry, I gots to know.

[deejaid]

I went out for 9 on Saturday and instead of taking my Mac’s I took my Palmer Deacons. Played my late 1960’s Powerbilt persimmon woods which are a regular flex and an active tip section. They generally fly high pretty easily. I also took an interesting ball I found in the collection, a Maxfli Revolution 100 Multilayer. Researching a bit about it I found it was a wound ball with a urethane cover circa 2000. The cover is probably the softest urethane cover I’ve ever felt. It is nothing like a modern urethane ball. It is so soft and the ball so off-white I thought was balata when I found it in my collection.

 

So I started off on #8 at my club and hit a low drive about 220 down the left side. The ball felt soft but heavy, if that makes any sense. Like I said in the Ball Thread I started, a super soft cover high compression ball feels much different than a low compression ball, even though both feel soft. Hit a 7-iron a bit fat and ended up 5 yards short of the green. A chip and a 1 putt par. The ball again felt like a marshmallow. Very soft.

 

Double bogeyed the next hole #9 after 3 putting as I had no idea how hard to hit this soft ball to lag, coupled with recently punched greens. Walked over and started on #1 and went Par and Bogey on the next two holes. Then on #3 I hit my best drive of the day with this old wound Maxfli. 250 straight down the center, which might be my best drive ever on this 520 yard par 5. Hit a perfect 5 wood next and left myself a short 70 yard pitch. Put it within 10 feet but still missed the putt and took a par.

 

Next hole par 4 decent drive of 225 or so but down the left side and in the first cut of rough. It’s at this point I realized that since the first hole all my drives had flown higher than normal and seemed to hang in the air a bit longer. I also hadn’t missed a fairway until that hole either, though I was just off by less than 5 yards.

 

The next par 3 was were my iron game started breaking down. I attribute the fat shots to the curved leading edge of the Palmers compared to the straight leading edge of my Mac’s. Although I was also leaving my iron to the right, not getting the club face square. It just wasn’t good. My wedges, particularly my early 50’s Mac 11-iron were on though, and the Maxfli really responded well.

 

I alternated pars and bogeys and ended up 7 over for 10 holes. Hit every fairway but one and the ball definitely felt different than the low compression balls I’d been using. It felt like the ball was on the face longer when struck, giving the sensation of a “heavier” feel. Didn’t lose that ball and played it for all 10 holes.

 

Next out I’m taking the Mac’s again. Will also take some NOS Titelist Pro Trajectory balatas along with my favorite ball of the early 2000’s, the urethane covered, wound Slazenger Player 90.

[NRJyzr]

 

This may be redundant or even unnecessary...

The Revolution Multilayer ball was the ultimate ancestor of your Slazenger Players ball. It's a solid core ball with a thin wound layer, same as the Players, or Srixon's HiBrid Tour. Was really quite the ball in those early days. If Maxfli had the money that Fortune Brands did, we might all still be playing some form of them.

[deejaid]

The Revolution Multilayer cover is much softer than the Slazenger but you are right, very similar construction. Another very popular ball that was a direct descendant just a couple years later was the original wound Maxfli A10. That was a great ball as well and I found I have one of those left too. Again, same construction but the cover doesn’t seem as soft as the Revolution Multilayer.

[Hit em good]

I'm brand new to vintage clubs, and just played my first round (9 holes only) yesterday.

1969 Wilson Bulletback irons, and MacGregor Velocitized persimmon woods.

I thoroughly enjoyed the round. The woods performed surprisingly great..., except for the 8th hole where my confidence was getting too strong, and I lowered my shoulder trying to hit it harder, and ended up hitting the turf 5 inches in prior to the ball!

Any way, I shot a 3 over, with 4 bogeys and a bird. Two of the bogeys were great iron shots, just a little long over the green (still learning the distances), and I failed to get up and down.

I had a great time. I plan to continue playing the vintage clubs exclusively.

Hit em good

[NRJyzr]

Have three rounds under my belt now. First two rounds were with my Golden Ram TW282 set, 1-PW, with a Ram TG-898 SW. The third round was with my MP-37s, with a Golden Ram 1 iron, adding a 52* wedge to the 56* SW. All three rounds played with Orlimar persimmon driver and 3w. Putter was an 8813 for the last two rounds, and a Cleveland Huntington Beach Anser style in the first round. Golfballs were the Wilson Staff 50 Elite the first round, the Duo Professional the last two rounds, with a Kirkland Signature 3 piece ball yesterday on the front nine.

Played my usual home course, par 71, 6100 from white tees, 6500 from blue tees. First two rounds from the whites, yesterday from the blues (my idea).

Whole experience was quite enjoyable. Likely due to a combination of offseason rust and L.O.F.T., my tee game was a bit spotty. I wasn't making solid contact consistently until yesterday. I had a few rather nicely struck tee shots, but a few too many mishits. Ironically, I had no problem centering the 3w, even hit it a few times off the deck with success. Distance was decent, but it's hard to make much of a determination; first month or more is always trying to get back what you've lost over the offseason. One of my playing partners and I were using the +1 rule, using our normal distance for iron shots, then adding one club. It seemed to work fairly well, though we'd occasionally get one short, or long. Surprise! LOL

The Golden Rams were a surprise. They're kind of visually intimidating, even for a guy like me who likes smaller clubheads. I managed to hit them rather well in the first round, had a few hiccups in the second round but managed to adjust. They're a bit on the sharp side, even with the weaker lofts I've given them. I'm also not a fan of the Precision 6.5 shafts, but I managed to get through it. The TW282 1 iron is a bit odd, it has a Ping DGX Cushin shaft, which worried me, even more after I regripped it and found it was a 2 iron shaft. I weirdly hit it better than the mid irons, go figure.

All in all, a good time. And, had something happen that hadn't before... our #17 tee is right next to #12 tee, facing opposite directions, with arborvitae and pines between them. After hitting my tee shot on #17 yesterday, one of the guys from #12 peeks around the corner and asks how old my driver was, and how I liked playing it. We chatted about it for a minute, he thanked me and went on with his round. I've not often been asked how I like playing persimmons by random folks, and this may have been the first time someone asked about them just from the sound of the tee shot.

Quick golfball comment.... the Kirkland Signature was pretty good off the tee. The feel wasn't as good as with the Duo Professional, but it was acceptable. Its compression is roughly the same as the Snell MTB Black, another ball I've used over the last year and more. The distance was quite good, similar to what I was getting with the Duo Pro; it seems the higher spin of the Kirkland combined well with the persimmon trajectory. Amusingly, my Kirkland ball use was combined with the worst nine of the last week, LOL.

I'm also experimenting with a couple leather grips. I'd bought a GripMaster Roo grip from GolfWorks, put it on my Ram 56* SW, and for my round yesterday, I installed two Best Grips Mircroperfs on the 9i and PW in my MP-37 set. When I'd tried GripMasters several years ago, I found them to be a little slick in the 40-something fall temps, and ultimately gave up on them. The Roo grip was definitely an improvement over that, I found it was tacky from the start. My first round started at 48* and was 46* when we finished, zero problem with tackiness. We got rained on for the last two holes in round #2, and the grip was as amazing in the moisture as its reputation. Just outstanding. Interestingly, I'm finding the Best Grip Microperfs to feel a little less so, unless moisture is involved. I've heard they tend to improve with use, so I'm giving them a good chance, but so far, I am preferring the GripMaster Roo. Giving serious thought to buying a full set of the Roo grips for my MP-37s.

Going to keep the Orlimars in the bag for now. The "for now" is because I'm feeling the urge to dig out an older stainless steel driver and 3w. A different form of Retro Golf, I guess.

[NRJyzr]

Cross posting this, I'd shared these pics on the PGS bookface group, and posted them in the Blade thread in the Equipment folder.

My bag from this past weekend, so far, that is. Golden Ram TW805 driver, Golden Ram 3w, Golden Ram TW282 1-PW, Ram TG-898 SW, and a Cleveland putter. Also in the bag for Friday was a 15th club, my Louisville Smart Driver, which I randomly decided to drag on to the course for a few hits. Yes, the Smart Driver needs a bit of touch up...

First is the face of the 1 iron, dig the square toe

[Lincoln_Arcadia]

My old clubs get out on a regular basis. Typically, I’d lose a couple to a few shots with new balls. Another couple using Balata. My total distances are slightly different, because I’m more afraid of damaging them than anything else.

The clubs produce a different flight. Short carry with longer rollouts. Different strategy than I am used to these days. It would take some adjustments, and I think I could play as well as with my new clubs?

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

Got out for nine today with my daughter and a regular golfing mate of mine (whom my daughter loves). I bagged my Mizuno ANGC irons from the late Eighties (3i to 11i) with a RAM TW Custom Grind SW, a late persimmon era Powerbilt driver, Honma 3w, and the 5w spot was filled by a Koshin 5w, which was a boutique Japanese designer in days gone by.

Very enjoyable round, though I was concentrating more on making sure my daughter got around the course quickly rather than my own game. Best shot was sandwiched by my two worst. On the last, a dogleg left par five that is downhill after the bend and leads down to a green guarded by a pond, I smothered the driver off the tee--my fault, not the club). For the second, I saw a line over the trees to cut the rest of the dogleg's corner, and I nailed a 5w with a slight draw that ended up 20 yards short of the pond. Faced with an 70 yard pitch, I decided to hit a 60 yard pitch poorly and splashed down Such a stupid shot. I knew as soon as I had hit it that I had misjudged the yardage horribly.

I also played a late-era wound ball, the Titleist Professional (?). Elastomer, not balata cover. I think this was their last wound ball before the Pro V1. It felt OK, but is certainly shorter than modern balls, yet didn't have the magic spin of balatas. In that respect, not a bad ball to use for a casual persimmon round.

The driver:

The 5w:

The irons (well, 5i). They feel great, btw.

The par 5 ninth, after the dogleg bend

[LeftyMac]

My son has returned my Muirfield 20ths and is now using half a set of Golden Ram Tour Grinds, along with a LH2W driver and a PGF Little Slammer. He loves the Tour Grinds and prefers them over the Muirfields. His issue at present is the Tour Grinds start at 4 iron so he has a hole between driver and 4 iron which the Little Slammer isn't helping with. He hits moon balls with it. So we are now trying to track down a 2 or 3 iron. Somehow I think a left handed Ram Tour Grind 2 iron may be more rare than a pink unicorn.

[Tumbleweed_1968]

Finally got my first sunrise nine in today. Had a line-up change as I called a Ram Gene Littler PW and a Ping Kushin putter off the bench. Bagged a 2W, 4W, 5,7,9i as well. Played a Callaway Warbird yellow ball.

The sun only appeared briefly as rain clouds moved in. Temp was about 70 with hardly any breeze. Met a doe on the path between 1 & 2, and she let me get within 25 feet b4 she scampered away.

Scored 1 better than my last nine there with the modern bag, so I was pleased. I walked carrying a Ping L8+ bag. The new range finder worked swell. Never saw a soul except two grounds keepers on mowers.

Once I got past the first hole, my 2w drives were really good. Short game and putting cost me the most. 5th nine this year. Hope to make it out tomorrow too.

Woke up with pain in both feet. Right one kept me awake last night. But I was determined to walk and carry today so I went. After a while things loosened up and it wasn't so bad.

I'll probably keep the putter in, but might swap out the PW for the next round. Also could have used an 8i so the 9i could go too. And, i might just swap out the 4w for a MacGregor 3w, but I do like that 4w alot.

Anyway, fun times today.

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

Sounds like beautiful conditions for 9 holes...or even a cheeky 18. I love seeing deer on the course. There's one course I used to play quite frequently which seemed to have a resident herd of wee deer. A couple of us would always admire them while also lamenting the beautiful venison escaping before us.

[Tumbleweed_1968]

Just finished my 2nd sunrise round. Shot 5 strokes better than the previous day. No 3 putts! Horray! Swaped the 4w for a 3w, and the 9i for the 8i. PW was a NW Thunderstick, which is surprisingly good out of the sand. Callaway Warbird yellow ball.

Started using a tee as a ball marker, laid down pointing at the line. Cleaned the ball, and use the writing to make the final adjustment. Set up to the writing on the ball, then just think speed and feel. Putting improved.

Next time out I'm swaping the 5i for the 4w, and the Citation 3w for a MacGregor 3w. 9i going back in too, an old Louisville 9 with weight added.

Saw 3 adult turkeys and about 5 chicks, along with assorted rabbits and geese. Nice day, about 70 at 5:30 with light fog. My kind of day! Didn't carry today, used the trolley.

I just love shooting a 45 with 50 year old clubs! That's why I play vintage. Can't beat having your best drive ever on a par 5 with a 2w. Or hitting that 7 iron pin high on a difficult par three. Or using a PW out of wet sand and putting it within 6 feet. Love it!

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

Played a very early morning round recently with Mizuno persimmons and RAM irons. An funny old Macgregor putter that I have recently taken a fancy to completed the bag.

I started off by hitting my driver out of bounds--at least I thought it was OB, but found it on the next hole in the fairway bunker. Anyway, it was OB so a 7 on that hole. Recovered with a birdie, and kept it together for a 39 on the front nine. Then the wheels feels off. On the back nine, I topped 4 out of 7 tee shots with my 3w. The weird thing was, I was nailing my fairway woods (4 and 5). So I'd top my 3w, leaving myself out of reach of the green, nail a fairway wood to leave wedge on, then hit an average wedge and 2-putt for a bogey. Some holes, however, did not go as well as that. Ended up with a 49 on the back nine. Such a strange round.

[Foozle]

Loving the Tour Grinds! Stunning irons that bring back happy memories. I played mine to virtual destruction over a 10 year period. They still get an occasional sentimental outing which your story and pictures reminds me is overdue.....

[NRJyzr]

Love seeing Rams in this thread  ?

[NRJyzr]

Was playing this last Saturday, had my 1980 Rams in the bag.  Not fond of the grips I have on them, wasn't hitting them that great.  Also wasn't hitting my Cobra driver all that well.  Had my Orlimar woods in the car, and my TW282 Rams.  Swapped out the entire bag at the turn, LOL.

 

Had more fun, was hitting the TW282 better (different grips), which is ironic, since I'm not all that fond of Precision shafts.  The woods were a load of fun.  Was hitting driver reasonably close to the same distance I was hitting my Cobra, until I necked one on #17. ?

 

Bogeyed the last thanks to poor PW second shot and goosed chip shot to shoot +3 on the back nine, compared to +4 on the front.  Not all that much difference, but it was more fun on the back, certainly.

 

Going to put some Ram woods in the bag for my next round.

[The Aspidistra in the Hall]

I'm new here. Is there a cut-off date for 'vintage'?

[Jiggered]

15 hours ago, The Aspidistra in the Hall said:

I'm new here. Is there a cut-off date for 'vintage'?

Not really but most people use the end of the persimmon era as a marker, late 1980s early 1990s.

But there's no formal definition, play what you enjoy.

[baloo]

Went to a 9 hole course last weekend in bad shape. Left the driver and sand wedge at home and proceeded to shoot -2 with 12 clubs. Felt more like an even par round as the setup is questionable. 

They have 2 driveable par 4s and a 422 yard par 5?? They also have a nearly 600 yard par 5. Very odd layout that should be par 34 or 35 but they call it par 36. Small, shaggy greens. But, it wasn't busy and we got around fast when all the nice courses are packed beyond belief. I enjoy odd courses, so no complaints.

Moral of the story though, I felt very comfortable hitting fairway woods off the tee and doing all the chipping with a 52* PW. Never got in any kind of trouble. Better to play clubs you trust and execute with, even if that means taking fewer than 14.

So, like I said, didn't feel like a true 2 under round, but I was very happy regardless of my play. 

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

6 hours ago, baloo said:

Went to a 9 hole course last weekend in bad shape. Left the driver and sand wedge at home and proceeded to shoot -2 with 12 clubs. Felt more like an even par round as the setup is questionable. 

They have 2 driveable par 4s and a 422 yard par 5?? They also have a nearly 600 yard par 5. Very odd layout that should be par 34 or 35 but they call it par 36. Small, shaggy greens. But, it wasn't busy and we got around fast when all the nice courses are packed beyond belief. I enjoy odd courses, so no complaints.

Moral of the story though, I felt very comfortable hitting fairway woods off the tee and doing all the chipping with a 52* PW. Never got in any kind of trouble. Better to play clubs you trust and execute with, even if that means taking fewer than 14.

So, like I said, didn't feel like a true 2 under round, but I was very happy regardless of my play. 

 

What was the reason for leaving the SW, or did you just forget it? I think I'd struggle in bunkers with a PW because of the thin sole and lack of bounce, even if it had 52* of loft.

 

[baloo]

I chip and pitch much better with my PW than a SW. I tried working on some bunker shots the other day with the PW and found it worked just fine. There are a few things I can't do with a pitching wedge (flop shots) the same way I could with a SW. But those particular shots are rarely needed and I'm not great at them anyway.

It was my first outing without the SW in the bag, so we'll see if it sticks.

[No_Catchy_Nickname]

@baloo

 

I too chip much better with a PW, and pitch equally badly with a SW or PW, but it's the bunker shot with a PW that I don't think I could pull off well. But now you've planted an idea in my head for my next round...

[NRJyzr]

I'm finding the hardest aspect to a Vintage round is selecting the clubs to take to the course.  ?

 

Even if I just decide to take the Rams, there's some effort involved.   LOL 

[baloo]

Well, I played a partly vintage bag yesterday. Driver, 3W, and 1 iron vintage, then my Callaway irons and wedges I've had for a while but rarely use. In fact, all my other 18 hole rounds this year were with all vintage equipment. My buddy works at Callaway, so I got a deal on the Apex MBs. 

Anyway, step up on the par 3 3rd. It's playing 151, so I grab a 9 iron. Would be an 8 with my Dynapowers. Looks great in the air, fading right at the pin. Lands about 3 feet long and left and spins right into the hole! My second ever - had a hole-in-one in a high school tournament (2007).

Obviously extatic about it, but a bit funny it happened on the very rare occasion that I carried my modern irons.

 

[NRJyzr]

Hearty congrats, @baloo!  

 

I can identify with the irony.  I got my first ace last year, during the several weeks i was playing TaylorMade TP MC irons at the start of the season.  Go figure.

Edited September 20, 2020 by NRJyzr

[thepunch_out]

On 8/27/2020 at 10:10 AM, NRJyzr said:

I'm finding the hardest aspect to a Vintage round is selecting the clubs to take to the course.  ?

 

Even if I just decide to take the Rams, there's some effort involved.   LOL 

I can second this emotion. I don't even want to admit how long I'll sometimes stand in front of my persimmon collection trying to figure out which clubs to take for the round. I have to start making decisions the night before, otherwise I'd be late for half my tee times. This photo is Drivers and 2-woods only.