Why Cant I develop Accuracy in my Driver?

Ok so stats wise, my Driving accuracy is likely the WORSE based on current abilities. (Actual Average score is +14, not GHIN,) I want to clarify this as I have 70 & 90's scores that make the average 86. rather than GHIN which would kick out my 90's and make the average go down which I dont consider true in my opinion)

With that I average about 32 putts per round

I average about 40% or 7 GIR

My Fairways hit is 37%

My Penalties though average 2 per round (this is terrible) of which my penalties are off the tee (OB) (hence the blow up holes which artificially increase my overall scoring)

What I think I am inferring is if I can increase my driving accuracy. while I maintain a strong GIR, I can likely decrease my average score i.e. play higher level golf.

Mental or physically what is the limitation to my driver accuracy? I have been fit for drivers before. honestly I do NOT have a distance issue for my size, ability and tracks that I play, the ball goes well far enough. BUT I spray and when I spray its bad. I dont "Miss" the ball per say... I hit it well in the center of the face. But I have FACE control issues.

Mentally what is the thoughts that cause me to be inherently LESS accurate to lets say my 8iron.... Super confident with that club and distance (In all fairness 6-LW I am super confident) But just picking 8iron as middle of the road. YET. I stick a wood in my hand and I am praying. MORE worse my driver.

I spay way less with my Irons....while face control issues may show up in irons it does NOT seem so egregious in comparison to my driver. 30 yard diameter green yet I am pretty darn sure I can hit it. 50-80 yard Fairway and I praying JUST to hit it.

Is there something inherent that I am not focusing on with the driver that causes face angle at impact issues. Is there something I can do to get more consistent face angle at impact for a driver? Is there artificial things I can add (training aids, practice, mental thoughts etc) Again it seems purely the driver that has WORSE negative effects? Am I over thinking this and just need to get to the range and beat balls with the driver MORE now to develop some type of consistency? etc?

Thanks in advance!!

Swing flaws are generally magnified with longer clubs.

> @Krt22 said:

> Swing flaws are generally magnified with longer clubs.

Exactly. It is much harder to "mask" a swing fault that you could get away with on shorter irons when swinging longer clubs with less loft.

Little anecdote about the above statement: I recently saw my instructor (@MonteScheinblum) and told him something similar about how I am fine with everything but my driver. He quickly identified that my lower body was out-racing my upper body and while I could make it work with everything most days, the bad days were annoying to hit driver. We spent that whole lesson with a 7i in my hand and when I applied the swing thoughts and feels at the range the next day to the driver, it was a night and day difference.

> @Krt22 said:

> Swing flaws are generally magnified with longer clubs.

That I figured.... to an extent.... So again my question remains..... If I zeroed in to face manipulation to an extent..... I get all the rest of path. and take away and chicken wings.....etc.... but somehow I get the FACE of the club to the ball pretty well.... but the face angle is VERY inconsistent. Is it something I am consciously or unconsciously doing? is there something that I am not aware of, say I am doing with my irons that I am over doing with the driver... Is there some "keys" reduce face angle disparities etc.

Its Super frustrating to hit it well, but well right or well left etc....

> @lookylookitzadam said:

> > @Krt22 said:

> > Swing flaws are generally magnified with longer clubs.

>

> Exactly. It is much harder to "mask" a swing fault that you could get away with on shorter irons when swinging longer clubs with less loft.

>

> Little anecdote about the above statement: I recently saw my instructor (@MonteScheinblum) and told him something similar about how I am fine with everything but my driver. He quickly identified that my lower body was out-racing my upper body and while I could make it work with everything most days, the bad days were annoying to hit driver. We spent that whole lesson with a 7i in my hand and when I applied the swing thoughts and feels at the range the next day to the driver, it was a night and day difference.

Yups let me be perfectly clear, I am like much amateur golfers having inherent swing faults.... while I inherently except I wont be on tour, nor a scratch golfer. Its seems compounded (like you stated) but odd that what is being masked within an iron that allows me decent GIR more so confidence, but spraying off the planet with the driver. OR massive chokes that put me in worse situations.

Ive done the lessons but seem to zero on the inherent flaw of accuracy with the Driver...... So again to be more specific again.

Face angle at impact, if say an iron seems to be square and to target and ball to target, YET driver seems very inconsistent, open/closed.....Is the DRIVER swing in general cause of this, is it the DRIVER itself, that may need more weight or less weight. Should I HOLD the wrist angles etc...

It seems something is not syncing.... or something is throwing OFF the sync...... just curious what it could be?

> @Exactice808 said:

> > @Krt22 said:

> > Swing flaws are generally magnified with longer clubs.

>

> That I figured.... to an extent.... So again my question remains..... If I zeroed in to face manipulation to an extent..... I get all the rest of path. and take away and chicken wings.....etc.... but somehow I get the FACE of the club to the ball pretty well.... but the face angle is VERY inconsistent. Is it something I am consciously or unconsciously doing? is there something that I am not aware of, say I am doing with my irons that I am over doing with the driver... Is there some "keys" reduce face angle disparities etc.

>

> Its Super frustrating to hit it well, but well right or well left etc....

That is the thing, when you have flaws you need to add compensations to off set them. With a driver your margin for error decreases for a multitude of reasons. One is the shaft length, the other is the CHS, and the 3rd is loft. Depending on what club you have, X% of the energy is used to propel the ball forward and Y% is used to propel the ball up (ie spin). The more the ball goes up, the larger the margin for error. With a driver, with such little loft, you get the highest ball speed, lower launch, and lower spin. So any face angle issues are going to result in much larger directional misses than a high lofted iron

There is the chance it's you, that with driver you might try to manipulate the face more and steer the ball since you battle a foul ball, but most of it is likely just the nature of the collision.

> @Krt22 said:

> > @Exactice808 said:

> > > @Krt22 said:

> > > Swing flaws are generally magnified with longer clubs.

> >

> > That I figured.... to an extent.... So again my question remains..... If I zeroed in to face manipulation to an extent..... I get all the rest of path. and take away and chicken wings.....etc.... but somehow I get the FACE of the club to the ball pretty well.... but the face angle is VERY inconsistent. Is it something I am consciously or unconsciously doing? is there something that I am not aware of, say I am doing with my irons that I am over doing with the driver... Is there some "keys" reduce face angle disparities etc.

> >

> > Its Super frustrating to hit it well, but well right or well left etc....

>

> That is the thing, when you have flaws you need to add compensations to off set them. With a driver your margin for error decreases for a multitude of reasons. One is the shaft length, the other is the CHS, and the 3rd is loft. Depending on what club you have, X% of the energy is used to propel the ball forward and Y% is used to propel the ball up (ie spin). The more the ball goes up, the larger the margin for error. With a driver, with such little loft, you get the highest ball speed, lower launch, and lower spin. So any face angle issues are going to result in much larger directional misses than a high lofted iron

>

> There is the chance it's you, that with driver you might try to manipulate the face more and steer the ball since you battle a foul ball, but most of it is likely just the nature of the collision.

Thanks @Krt22 Im really trying to be cognitive of the "Collision Factor" in all fairness... To see if its Launch related or to swing fault.

I personally do THINK its SWING fault and not collision related.

Why I think that is, I have been trying to do is find a comfortable setup. Ball position, stance open, neutral or closed. Face angle at setup and shaft lean. My natural current Ball flight is a fade. OF Course for years I fought a horrible slice. but I have at least eliminated that as a norm (from major faults) Im know I am still getting comfortable with an inside take away. To straighten out the flight, Problem is that I cant find a consistency.

Some days I setup open to target, take an inside take and the ball is a fade starting left of target back (good). The next drive setup exactly the same and its a straight bullet left no fade (might be safe left fairway or just left off the fairway). Think its a bad shot, setup up open same and its a dead block right (no fade spin just straight block).. Just zero consistency.... So again "collusion" seems similar as the ball movement is not or spin axis not going crazy... but just face angle putting it right or left.

maybe I am over thinking, maybe like you said I am manipulating to compensate, but something is surely off in regards to the driver that is killing me LOL......

How does your driver feel to you? I have issues with heavier driver heads.

One thought right off the top that has nothing to do with equipment.

With every other club in the bag, we think about a specific distance and a very small target, but often with the driver we fall into a mindset of hitting the ball as far as we can. This leads to "reaching" for more in our swings, and we get two-way misses and penalty strokes. So if you aren't already doing this, pick a VERY specific target and be sure that you are aimed there; the top of a tree in the distance is a good starting place, and lots of players use the intermediate point on the ground in addition. With to a baseball pitcher, it doesn't really matter how fast the ball gets to home plate if you don't know where it's going; it doesn't matter how far you hit the tee shot if you can't play it.

The two technical reasons are going to be a swing flaw, such as being too flat, which leads to either high blocks to the right or low hooks to the left, or a driver that is particularly unsuited to you because of too little loft or to stiff a shaft, or whatever. These are things that have to be addressed by a good teaching pro in the first case, or a good club fitter in the second. Nobody here can fix the technical part, I assure you.

the biggest improvement on my driving has been resisting the initial swing as hard as you can from the top. I have only lost 2-3mph swing speed but gained not going left and right. now everything stays straight or fades off right. Distance is unchanged if not longer. Hitting center face more consistently.

> @Krt22 said:

> Swing flaws are generally magnified with longer clubs.

That's true but I'm most accurate and feel most confident with my driver at the moment. In fact I'm most confident with my driver and my three hybrids. It's the irons that are causing me grief at the moment :-/

> @andrue said:

> > @Krt22 said:

> > Swing flaws are generally magnified with longer clubs.

>

> That's true but I'm most accurate and feel most confident with my driver at the moment. In fact I'm most confident with my driver and my three hybrids. It's the irons that are causing me grief at the moment :-/

That’s why he said “generally”

You have a swing fault that makes it easier hitting off a tee or sweeping the ball with the hybrids.

> @ryan983 said:

> > @andrue said:

> > > @Krt22 said:

> > > Swing flaws are generally magnified with longer clubs.

> >

> > That's true but I'm most accurate and feel most confident with my driver at the moment. In fact I'm most confident with my driver and my three hybrids. It's the irons that are causing me grief at the moment :-/

>

> That’s why he said “generally”

>

> You have a swing fault that makes it easier hitting off a tee or sweeping the ball with the hybrids.

Yeah. I seem to have spent my golfing 'career' alternating between good with long clubs or good with irons. I'm working on the irons now and am hopeful I might finally get them all flying well but I dunno. Looking on the bright side at least it gives me something to keep my busy during retirement :)

It seems like you want to manipulate the face/path to a better outcome. You need to go opposite direction, neutralize hands, setup, take them (& arms too) out of "answer" and address the issue at body sequencing level. I've always swung irons better than metals too, once I addressed it the core level (knees to to shoulders) did my driving accuracy get a lot better and contact cluster became a lot tighter. A bridge to get there gear wise was going with a heavier setup on weight but it's just of help and not true North answer..

> @ryan983 said:

> > @andrue said:

> > > @Krt22 said:

> > > Swing flaws are generally magnified with longer clubs.

> >

> > That's true but I'm most accurate and feel most confident with my driver at the moment. In fact I'm most confident with my driver and my three hybrids. It's the irons that are causing me grief at the moment :-/

>

> That’s why he said “generally”

>

> You have a swing fault that makes it easier hitting off a tee or sweeping the ball with the hybrids.

Bingo. Most ams are too steep which makes hitting longer clubs hard. If you are too shallow hitting a ball off a tee tends to be easier

Look towards slack being introduced into your system, probably not handling changes in direction well.

Plus you generally have a very flexible graphite shaft in the driver which you don't have in your wedges or maybe also in all your irons.

@Krt22 has posted some really excellent information here. One additional piece to add on to his last bit is D Plane. Its worth a look to watch a few video's explaining this. It hopefully will explain some of the ball flight differences between a tee'd up ball and a ball on the ground as far as how your path shifts with the exact same swing. Trackman university has a couple good video's about it.

That being said I wouldn't overthink it too much. Swing Problems + Consciouness on the tee = steering which is no bueno. How much time do you spend on practicing full swing driver shots? With good feedback on strike and launch numbers? And then work on getting the strike and launch and shape you want?

It’s funny. I guess. Lack of confidence leads to more. Issues. You all have pointed out. Excellent points. Oddly when I sit hear and read it’s painfully obvious as well....picking a target and sticking to the target. Steering. As I admit and stated it many times in this thread I have face angle issues. It means I am doing something to adjust during my swing. I think the lack of confidence has me compensating out of fear.

I think I need to create confidence by forcing a target without “steering” and then sticking with it. As I mentioned in a prior post I was still trying to find a comfortable setup. And this is probably half the issue as don’t have a fall back or go too shot. It’s funny my setup with irons are set. But I do move around. Open/closed stance. Forward call posturing. Back ball position. This. Indecisiveness is probably. Half the killer.

> @Mikey5e said:

> Plus you generally have a very flexible graphite shaft in the driver which you don't have in your wedges or maybe also in all your irons.

What?

> @Mikey5e said:

> Plus you generally have a very flexible graphite shaft in the driver which you don't have in your wedges or maybe also in all your irons.

What? X2


I'll be honest... I can usually full swing a driver well. I can hit a cut or draw or low draw etc. I can hit it dead straight... But there are days where... The heat, or mental issues mess with my swing.

I take 1 swing thought with me to focus on... Just 1. If I'm not having an accurate day with the driver... I will swing 80% speed. I will miss maybe 1 fairway with an 80% swing.

Maybe hit the range or course and go driver with a slower swing... Yes less distance, but a playable shot. Try it.

> @Jagpilotohio said:

> > @Mikey5e said:

> > Plus you generally have a very flexible graphite shaft in the driver which you don't have in your wedges or maybe also in all your irons.

>

> What? X2

Don't question the man with 5 eagles in one season.

> @Jkinluv said:

> I'll be honest... I can usually full swing a driver well. I can hit a cut or draw or low draw etc. I can hit it dead straight... But there are days where... The heat, or mental issues mess with my swing.

>

> I take 1 swing thought with me to focus on... Just 1. If I'm not having an accurate day with the driver... I will swing 80% speed. I will miss maybe 1 fairway with an 80% swing.

>

> Maybe hit the range or course and go driver with a slower swing... Yes less distance, but a playable shot. Try it.

Oddly. I don’t know how to properly do this. What I mean is most drives if ever do I swing full out. What I mean is only time is at a scramble tournament or when trying for one of those long drive holes in random tournaments. Normally I feel I am swinging 80-90%. Now here is the messed up part if I try to swing any slower. My tempo fails horrible and the shots are Way worse lol. I lack talent so only thing I can do is Drill a swing unfortunately. That means going to a range and beating balls till the body forgets a bad habit and remembers a good habit.

> @Krt22 said:

> > @ryan983 said:

> > > @andrue said:

> > > > @Krt22 said:

> > > > Swing flaws are generally magnified with longer clubs.

> > >

> > > That's true but I'm most accurate and feel most confident with my driver at the moment. In fact I'm most confident with my driver and my three hybrids. It's the irons that are causing me grief at the moment :-/

> >

> > That’s why he said “generally”

> >

> > You have a swing fault that makes it easier hitting off a tee or sweeping the ball with the hybrids.

>

> Bingo. Most ams are too steep which makes hitting longer clubs hard. If you are too shallow hitting a ball off a tee tends to be easier

Yeah. I also found that a reverse pivot is a good way to launch a driver but those days are long behind me. I am genuinely hopeful that over the coming weeks I'm finally going to be good with irons and driver. I've been getting better at launching irons but my accuracy is still not better than with the longer clubs. And that ain't right :-/

It's a driver!!! it has the least amount of loft which results in the greatest side spin of all the clubs period!! Now find the side of the golf course that you can hit most of the time and do what ever you have to put the ball on the at side of the fairway. A neutral swing is great until your body can't control it from swing to swing. Find an extreme set up that always works the ball the same way and and then work back from that to a repeatable comfort spot. It's your swing not something from You Tube. Once the ball is in play then the game of golf can begin for you.

Driver demands that tweaks of setup are minimal. Ball height and maybe an inch of position are about it. As far as swing don't swing slower or try to shorten it but it is of benefit to to start lower body transition earlier. Left arm gets parallel to ground, start re-planting left foot and have duality of lower going back to ball and upper finishing back swing. The Pro's don't smooth out their arms, they have bodies that just work better and are up to the job. The fulcrum of the swing is getting shoulders/torso target bound with the arms in front of them and done with greater efficiency. Spent this entire Spring getting trail shoulder to go target bound back and through, never have hit the big dog better.

IMO - If you're not squaring the face angle at impact, dispersion, for my expectations is probably too high. I see far too often people swinging out of their shoes on every hole as opposed to choosing the proper club off the tee. Also, it may be their driver isn't set up right them and or they're trying too hard to maximize distance, at any cost but then don't have the next shot in the bag from junk. Example, recently on the first tee, facing a dog-leg right Par 5, I chose 2 iron to reach the turn. My three playing partners each chose driver. Two hit it through the dog-leg and the other bit off more than he could chew over the inside dog-leg costing him a ball. I took Par, and one took 7 the other two took 8's. The result was a poor choice in a club, some lack of self-control and not having the next shot in the bag. They could have bogeyed the hole.

I recently took back TS2 10.5 on account trajectory was too high and got a 9.5. Threw the OEM shaft in a barrel and when with my two after-market shafts options. Project X 6C12 tour issue is for when I am feeling really strong and want to swing as fast as possible. The other listed in my Sig "Fujikura Fuel Tour Spec 60" is my trustworthy low-dispersion fairway finder.

How long is your driver? Cutting mine down 2” was the best thing I ever did equipment-wise. I’m 6’3” for reference.