2018 Kingsmill Championship May 17-20

[Warrick]

Good finish, but hate these shortened tournaments. I was gutted for In Gee, thought she was going to pull this off. You have to give credit to Ariya and Nasa with those second shots on 18, pretty clutch.

 

Another great round and tourney from Brooke.

[the bishop]

Man I absolutely love Ariya Jutanagarn. Her mental game is so strong. Those two birdies in the playoff were no gimmies but she seems to be able to will the ball into the hole at times when she absolutely has to have it. Another step in the learning ladder for Nasa. Her breakthrough is coming pretty soon I would think.

[tbowles411]

It sounds crazy but I don't believe that Ariya doesn't know how good she is. She's confident, but I don't think that's the same thing. Maybe the fact she's so humble about it, makes it appear or feel that way. Or I could be full of crap. :)

[Argonne69]

It sounds crazy but I don't believe that Ariya doesn't know how good she is. She's confident, but I don't think that's the same thing. Maybe the fact she's so humble about it, makes it appear or feel that way. Or I could be full of crap. :)

 

Imagine if she ever got confident with the driver.

[tbowles411]

It sounds crazy but I don't believe that Ariya doesn't know how good she is. She's confident, but I don't think that's the same thing. Maybe the fact she's so humble about it, makes it appear or feel that way. Or I could be full of crap. :)

 

Imagine if she ever got confident with the driver.

THAT would be scary. But the way she hits her 2-iron puts her just as far as her peers. It's insane.

[Argonne69]

It sounds crazy but I don't believe that Ariya doesn't know how good she is. She's confident, but I don't think that's the same thing. Maybe the fact she's so humble about it, makes it appear or feel that way. Or I could be full of crap. :)

 

Imagine if she ever got confident with the driver.

 

THAT would be scary. But the way she hits her 2-iron puts her just as far as her peers. It's insane.

 

 

Have you checked out the World Long Drive Tour? The women have now surpassed 400 yards. Moderate swings are 330+. The rookie Alexis Belton won the Clash in the Canyon event in April, and has a swing that would look right at home on the LPGA. There's no reason Ariya couldn't be hitting 300+ yards on a regular basis.

[legitimategolf]

I think Ariya is one of the most talented females in the history of golf. By rights she should be on the leaderboard every week.

[tbowles411]

It sounds crazy but I don't believe that Ariya doesn't know how good she is. She's confident, but I don't think that's the same thing. Maybe the fact she's so humble about it, makes it appear or feel that way. Or I could be full of crap. :)

 

Imagine if she ever got confident with the driver.

 

THAT would be scary. But the way she hits her 2-iron puts her just as far as her peers. It's insane.

 

 

Have you checked out the World Long Drive Tour? The women have now surpassed 400 yards. Moderate swings are 330+. The rookie Alexis Belton won the Clash in the Canyon event in April, and has a swing that would look right at home on the LPGA. There's no reason Ariya couldn't be hitting 300+ yards on a regular basis.

Their swings are LPGA pure. My wife even stopped what she was doing to watch. 300 "might" be a stretch, but Lexi long is definitely a lock.

[tbowles411]

I think Ariya is one of the most talented females in the history of golf. By rights she should be on the leaderboard every week.

If memory serves, she's usually up there.

[puresurfr]

It sounds crazy but I don't believe that Ariya doesn't know how good she is. She's confident, but I don't think that's the same thing. Maybe the fact she's so humble about it, makes it appear or feel that way. Or I could be full of crap. :)

 

Imagine if she ever got confident with the driver.

 

THAT would be scary. But the way she hits her 2-iron puts her just as far as her peers. It's insane.

 

 

Have you checked out the World Long Drive Tour? The women have now surpassed 400 yards. Moderate swings are 330+. The rookie Alexis Belton won the Clash in the Canyon event in April, and has a swing that would look right at home on the LPGA. There's no reason Ariya couldn't be hitting 300+ yards on a regular basis.

 

That clash in the canyon is done at altitude.....if you look at the swing speed, its great but not crazy. I saw a bunch of 116-118 for the very top contenders and winners.....The girls onLPGA tour are actually very close to this number and can probably compete. Im sure Lexi can get up to 110 if she wanted to. There is a much larger separation in the mens game. The men on long drive have ball speed in the 150s and the longest PGA Tour players can get to the high 120s.

[tbowles411]

That clash in the canyon is done at altitude.....if you look at the swing speed, its great but not crazy. I saw a bunch of 116-118 for the very top contenders and winners.....The girls onLPGA tour are actually very close to this number and can probably compete. Im sure Lexi can get up to 110 if she wanted to. There is a much larger separation in the mens game. The men on long drive have ball speed in the 150s and the longest PGA Tour players can get to the high 120s.

Altitude helps, but I've seen Troy Mullins pound a drive at sea level 340. It still amazes me she gets so much ball speed out of that swing.

[Argonne69]

I think Ariya is one of the most talented females in the history of golf. By rights she should be on the leaderboard every week.

 

She gets a lot of attention for her driving iron skills, but she has amazing touch around the greens. Well, other than the poorly executed flop shot on the par 5 15th yesterday. She's also 2nd in putting average and putts per GIR.

 

Crazy that's she's 4th in driving distance hitting irons and a 3 wood.

[Stooch]

It sounds crazy but I don't believe that Ariya doesn't know how good she is. She's confident, but I don't think that's the same thing. Maybe the fact she's so humble about it, makes it appear or feel that way. Or I could be full of crap. :)

 

Imagine if she ever got confident with the driver.

 

THAT would be scary. But the way she hits her 2-iron puts her just as far as her peers. It's insane.

 

 

Have you checked out the World Long Drive Tour? The women have now surpassed 400 yards. Moderate swings are 330+. The rookie Alexis Belton won the Clash in the Canyon event in April, and has a swing that would look right at home on the LPGA. There's no reason Ariya couldn't be hitting 300+ yards on a regular basis.

 

There's probably a big reason, she doesn't want to become Yani Tseng, hitting +300 yrd drives is great but not so much when they are 50 yrds from the edge of the fairway too lol. Obviously Ariya can't control the shot dispersion with her driver misses, I applaud the restraint actually, it's still easier to score from the fairway.

[mudge]

It sounds crazy but I don't believe that Ariya doesn't know how good she is. She's confident, but I don't think that's the same thing. Maybe the fact she's so humble about it, makes it appear or feel that way. Or I could be full of crap. :)

 

Imagine if she ever got confident with the driver.

 

THAT would be scary. But the way she hits her 2-iron puts her just as far as her peers. It's insane.

 

 

Have you checked out the World Long Drive Tour? The women have now surpassed 400 yards. Moderate swings are 330+. The rookie Alexis Belton won the Clash in the Canyon event in April, and has a swing that would look right at home on the LPGA. There's no reason Ariya couldn't be hitting 300+ yards on a regular basis.

 

That clash in the canyon is done at altitude.....if you look at the swing speed, its great but not crazy. I saw a bunch of 116-118 for the very top contenders and winners.....The girls onLPGA tour are actually very close to this number and can probably compete. Im sure Lexi can get up to 110 if she wanted to. There is a much larger separation in the mens game. The men on long drive have ball speed in the 150s and the longest PGA Tour players can get to the high 120s.

 

What LPGA tour players are "very close" to swinging in the mid 110s?

[Mellow]

Recall that In Gee's win at the Evian when the conditions were soaking wet for three days. Her deliberate style of play seems to be suited for conditions when focus is needed. I think she may have benefited from another day of foul weather.

 

Yeah! I actually did think just of her in Evian when I posted that. I wouldn't have thought it, but maybe she does!

 

Man I absolutely love Ariya Jutanagarn. Her mental game is so strong.

 

This is so cool! In years past just would never have seen this said about Ariya. It seemed like mental was the achilles heel holding her back. How far she's come!

[Shilgy]

It sounds crazy but I don't believe that Ariya doesn't know how good she is. She's confident, but I don't think that's the same thing. Maybe the fact she's so humble about it, makes it appear or feel that way. Or I could be full of crap. :)

TB would you rephrase that first sentence? Or not? Do you actually mean what you wrote? That you do believe Ariya knows how good she is? Are you saying others feel that Ariya doesn't know she's good?

 

Phew! Trying to make sense of double negatives. :)

[tbowles411]

It sounds crazy but I don't believe that Ariya doesn't know how good she is. She's confident, but I don't think that's the same thing. Maybe the fact she's so humble about it, makes it appear or feel that way. Or I could be full of crap. :)

TB would you rephrase that first sentence? Or not? Do you actually mean what you wrote? That you do believe Ariya knows how good she is? Are you saying others feel that Ariya doesn't know she's good?

 

Phew! Trying to make sense of double negatives. :)

I think I was a quart low on caffeine. My head hurt after I read it! :( WTH?! LOL

[4waymiss]

I just noticed Ariya is currently #4 in driving distance ( with her 3 wood ) and #1 in total putting ( LPGA version of ) . That just blows my mind.

 

I guess the golf gods have mercy on the other girls and put a curse on her driver. Had she been able to land her drives anywhere in bound, we would be talking about an Ariya Slam.

[Stooch]

oops!

[KBong]

It sounds crazy but I don't believe that Ariya doesn't know how good she is. She's confident, but I don't think that's the same thing. Maybe the fact she's so humble about it, makes it appear or feel that way. Or I could be full of crap. :)

 

Imagine if she ever got confident with the driver.

That's why I think Ariya is a bit mentally soft why she can't hit a driver well and won't put it in the bag F/T.

To gain more control she could have a 12*, 43.5", high kick point low launching stiff shaft driver...she has all the customization available at her disposal.

 

I also think Gary Gilchrist has somewhat failed as a coach...he hasn't mentally convinced Ariya to play a driver.

He has done nothing to resurrect Yani, Creamer, Lydia (Tina only gave Gary a year and bailed)...am I missing others?

 

Luckily he has Jenny Money to save his reputation and Shanshan always has good things to say about Gilchrist.

But I don't think Feng needs much coaching nor instruction...I think Shanshan is another Dame Davies who doesn't practice too much.

We never talk much about Feng confidence....I saw Shanshan continually pound driver off the tee on a tree lined course while many other pros would use a 3W as a more conservative play.

Jenny Money's flat stick prevents her from winning more.

[KBong]

oops!

Stooch...wrong thread...the Kingsmill was played last week.

The cold Northern Ontario weather has given you a brain freeze.

[Shilgy]

It sounds crazy but I don't believe that Ariya doesn't know how good she is. She's confident, but I don't think that's the same thing. Maybe the fact she's so humble about it, makes it appear or feel that way. Or I could be full of crap. :)

 

Imagine if she ever got confident with the driver.

That's why I think Ariya is a bit mentally soft why she can't hit a driver well and won't put it in the bag F/T.

To gain more control she could have a 12*, 43.5", high kick point low launching stiff shaft driver...she has all the customization available at her disposal.

 

I also think Gary Gilchrist has somewhat failed as a coach...he hasn't mentally convinced Ariya to play a driver.

He has done nothing to resurrect Yani, Creamer, Lydia (Tina only gave Gary a year and bailed)...am I missing others?

 

Luckily he has Jenny Money to save his reputation and Shanshan always has good things to say about Gilchrist.

But I don't think Feng needs much coaching nor instruction...I think Shanshan is another Dame Davies who doesn't practice too much.

We never talk much about Feng confidence....I saw Shanshan continually pound driver off the tee on a tree lined course while many other pros would use a 3W as a more conservative play.

Jenny Money's flat stick prevents her from winning more.

Except Ariya is still longer than Feng on your tree lined course. Why hit a driver you have a more difficult time controlling if you hit three wood long enough?

 

What would she get from your equipment suggestion? 10 yards?

[KBong]

Except Ariya is still longer than Feng on your tree lined course. Why hit a driver you have a more difficult time controlling if you hit three wood long enough?

 

What would she get from your equipment suggestion? 10 yards?

Because there are some courses and some holes where Ariya could have an even greater advantage by hitting a driver further than her 3W.

Yes....Ariya can hit many par 5's in 2 with her current set-up....but if she'd use a driver....I think she'd be 1 to 3 clubs less on her 2nd approach shots....giving her a higher probability of being closer to the pin....proximity to the hole.

 

Obviously, I'm biased because my driver is one of the strengths to my game.

I just can understand how some players (pros and Am's) aren't comfortable with a driver...it has more room for error and a much larger sweet spot when one doesn't hit the center of the face.

 

But Ariya isn't the only LPGA pro who struggles to play a driver...Carlota is another....and then we have Stenson on the PGA tour....though I'm not sure if Stenson's reason for not hitting a driver is his lack of confidence with the big stick.

 

A WRX'er who we haven't seen for a while who struggled with a driver was DuffnersWaggle....I think the guy bought/experimented with every 3W sold....lol.

[Golf Dino]

Except Ariya is still longer than Feng on your tree lined course. Why hit a driver you have a more difficult time controlling if you hit three wood long enough?

 

What would she get from your equipment suggestion? 10 yards?

Because there are some courses and some holes where Ariya could have an even greater advantage by hitting a driver further than her 3W.

Yes....Ariya can hit many par 5's in 2 with her current set-up....but if she'd use a driver....I think she'd be 1 to 3 clubs less on her 2nd approach shots....giving her a higher probability of being closer to the pin....proximity to the hole.

 

Obviously, I'm biased because my driver is one of the strengths to my game.

I just can understand how some players (pros and Am's) aren't comfortable with a driver...it has more room for error and a much larger sweet spot when one doesn't hit the center of the face.

 

But Ariya isn't the only LPGA pro who struggles to play a driver...Carlota is another....and then we have Stenson on the PGA tour....though I'm not sure if Stenson's reason for not hitting a driver is his lack of confidence with the big stick.

 

I do agree with you though that Ariya would enjoy a bigger advantage if she hit driver more often. The ability to hit the driver consistently and effectively is one reason why Brooke Henderson is generally competitive every week. That gal is fearless with the driver!

 

A WRX'er who we haven't seen for a while who struggled with a driver was DuffnersWaggle....I think the guy bought/experimented with every 3W sold....lol.

 

KBong ...to be fair though, for the overwhelming majority of amateurs are challenged with the driver. Despite the driver having a larger sweet spot than any other club, it's lack of loft and the length of its shaft makes it difficult to swing consistently to enjoy the distance advantage that it can offer.

 

The driver, with its lack of loft, etc., means that it will amplify the shortcomings in a person's swing. So someone who comes over the top will undoubtedly hit big banana slices regularly. Then also factor in that most amateur (and I mean recreational players) simply buy drivers off the rack or with minimal fitting involved thereby exacerbating their swing shortcomings with the driver.

[Argonne69]

But Ariya is not a weekend hacker. There's no reason she shouldn't be hitting driver on half the holes. Yes, there are times when the 3rd wood is the smart play. However, when the hole is trouble free it should be bombs away.

 

 

[KBong]

1) KBong ...to be fair though, for the overwhelming majority of amateurs are challenged with the driver.

 

2) The driver, with its lack of loft, etc., means that it will amplify the shortcomings in a person's swing. So someone who comes over the top will undoubtedly hit big banana slices regularly.

 

3) Then also factor in that most amateur (and I mean recreational players) simply buy drivers off the rack or with minimal fitting involved thereby exacerbating their swing shortcomings with the driver.

1) And these same amateurs would struggle off the tee with a 3W too.

 

2) And these same hacks will also flair a banana ball off to the right with a 3W with the same swing that comes over the top.

 

3) And these same recreational golfer with have basically the same results with a driver off the rack vs. a fitted driver.....and custom fit driver won't fix swing flaws.

I've never been fitted for clubs....always 'stock' equipment....in fact my current bag of used equipment cost me $340....excluding tax and shipping...my 2 wedges were given to me and I'm still playing my dad's 1970 Anser putter.,,,I've carried a cap of 6-8 for the last 38 years.....indian vs, arrow......but the OEM's are glad many golfer like new arrows.

Fitted clubs won't stop me from chunking & thinning shots or stop me from making mental errors.

[KBong]

But Ariya is not a weekend hacker.

 

There's no reason she shouldn't be hitting driver on half the holes. Yes, there are times when the 3rd wood is the smart play. However, when the hole is trouble free it should be bombs away.

+1000000000000000000000000000000000

Exactly.

Ariya has a club fitter in Bangkok....I think the Jutanugarn's reside in Orlando in the golf season and would have access to the best fitter there.

I'm sure after 100's of combo's and permutations of testing they could fit a driver for a world premier female pro that she could feel confident hitting off some holes...especially the par 5's.

 

Gilchrist supposedly focuses a lot on the mental side of the game....and has failed to get into Ariya's head to put a driver into the bag.

But in the end...it all falls on Ariya's shoulder to use a driver.

I just SMH that a gal with Ariya's world class talent....can't hit a driver with confidence.

[Golf Dino]

1) KBong ...to be fair though, for the overwhelming majority of amateurs are challenged with the driver.

 

2) The driver, with its lack of loft, etc., means that it will amplify the shortcomings in a person's swing. So someone who comes over the top will undoubtedly hit big banana slices regularly.

 

3) Then also factor in that most amateur (and I mean recreational players) simply buy drivers off the rack or with minimal fitting involved thereby exacerbating their swing shortcomings with the driver.

1) And these same amateurs would struggle off the tee with a 3W too.

 

2) And these same hacks will also flair a banana ball off to the right with a 3W with the same swing that comes over the top.

 

3) And these same recreational golfer with have basically the same results with a driver off the rack vs. a fitted driver.....and custom fit driver won't fix swing flaws.

I've never been fitted for clubs....always 'stock' equipment....in fact my current bag of used equipment cost me $340....excluding tax and shipping...my 2 wedges were given to me and I'm still playing my dad's 1970 Anser putter.,,,I've carried a cap of 6-8 for the last 38 years.....indian vs, arrow......but the OEM's are glad many golfer like new arrows.

Fitted clubs won't stop me from chunking & thinning shots or stop me from making mental errors.

 

Kbong ... you seem offended. Not my intention to offend. I merely want to add a dose of "reality" or to insert a bit more moderation or qualification into your observations about some golfers (pros and amateurs) being reluctant to use the driver.

 

Firstly, I agreed with your point about Ariya gaining an even bigger advantage off of the tee with the driver vs. 3W. Here is my statement from my earlier post:

• "I do agree with you though that Ariya would enjoy a bigger advantage if she hit driver more often. The ability to hit the driver consistently and effectively is one reason why Brooke Henderson is generally competitive every week. That gal is fearless with the driver!"
  

Unfortunately, when I typed this statement, it accidentally was inserted into your "quote" rather than in my reply. I gather that I was scrolling up and down too much and inadvertently moved my cursor to the wrong spot when I started typing.

 

Now back to your comments:

• Obviously, I'm biased because my driver is one of the strengths to my game.
  
• I just can understand how some players (pros and Am's) aren't comfortable with a driver...it has more room for error and a much larger sweet spot when one doesn't hit the center of the face. But Ariya isn't the only LPGA pro who struggles to play a driver...Carlota is another....and then we have Stenson on the PGA tour....though I'm not sure if Stenson's reason for not hitting a driver is his lack of confidence with the big stick.
  

My observations about the driver are on point. The driver remains the most difficult club in the bag to swing. It is precisely because of the lack of loft and the length of the club that makes it so difficult to strike the ball consistently.

• 1) And these same amateurs would struggle off the tee with a 3W too.
  

• 2) And these same hacks will also flair a banana ball off to the right with a 3W with the same swing that comes over the top.
  

 

Again, for the vast majority of golfers, (and I am referring to recreational players vs. a professional player), it is generally easier to swing a 3W vs. a Driver. The distance gained with a driver means that wayward shots go further too than it would with a 3W. The 3W can help the player keep the ball in play more often than it can with the driver.

 

More loft and a shorter club generally allows a golfer to get the club back to square more often as opposed to a driver. This continues throughout the bag. This is why it is easier to swing short clubs vs. long clubs. It's a major part of the reason why many golfers also struggle with a 3 or 4 Iron vs. a 7 or 8 iron.

 

There is a reason why beginners to golf are always taught using the shorter clubs in the bag (ie: 7 or 8 iron) and not a driver. It is just so much easier to swing the shorter club.

 

Now back to your original point about Ariya and the driver. Should a professional player like Ariya be able to consistently hit driver? Of course and especially when the rest of her game is so solid. Again, I agree with your observation about her situation being a matter of confidence and the mental aspect of her game.

 

But, for Ariya, she has been working with Pia Nilsson and the Vision 54 group to develop the mental aspects of her game. Next time you see her on television, look for her to have a big smile as she is setting up for her shot. It is a technique that she has utilized in the last few years as a way of helping her to reduce stress and nervousness when playing. Whether it is real or imagined on Ariya's part, it has nevertheless had a huge effect on Ariya's game and results.

 

Anyway, I type this over a morning cup of coffee. I have to get myself up and ready for a weekend of golf! I hope everyone gets the chance to get out and play too! Maybe we will run into each other one day on the course Kbong!

[legitimategolf]

When Stenson does it he is a badass viking. Ariya does the exact same and is labeled as weak and scared. Please explain.

[KBong]

When Stenson does it he is a badass viking. Ariya does the exact same and is labeled as weak and scared. Please explain.

When I see a pro put on a stupid fake smile as her pre-shot routine to reduce the stress....it indicates to me....mentally soft.

 

When Yani started to go into her slump,,,she tried to be less stressed on the course and have more fun.

In 2012, I saw her employ this new outlook in between the ropes...Yani was talking more than she normally would with Laura Diaz...this new methodology hasn't worked out for Yani in the past 6 years among others issues with her game.