MD/DC/VA Golfers - Twelve Monkeys Mental Divergence

[Kent01putt]

To your point City, course architecture has little to no interest to me in the same way you appear to look at it. If I play a course from the proper tee's and hit every club in my bag at the end of the round it probably is a very good track. I have never thought nor care if I take one picture of a course. Just does not interest me. The beauty around the course is not why I play any place. Housing on the course I could do without but do not really care. If I play from the tippies most of the trouble is out of reach for me these days so that does not make for a good round. A good course gives options and using all the clubs in my bag. I do not write long reviews because the times I have nobody seems to care or give a sh!t.

[Obee]

I have played 8. Listed below in my order:

 

LACC North

Riviera

Pebble

Spyglass

Monterey Peninsula Shore

Monterey Peninsula Dunes

.

.

.

 

Pinehurst 2

.

.

.

.

.

.

Mayacama

[Kent01putt]

I think I did a pretty good job with designing the new holes at SPCC to be installed in the future. I think I have seen enough good holes to tell the good from the bad. Again this is all about personal likes and dislikes. Kind of like a tree in the middle of a fairway. Some like it and some hate it. But over the years many opinions on here led me to believe that many top 100 course have features that people hate yet they still think the course is great, like turtle back greens. Many dislike Westminster National because of this yet love PH#2. Makes no sense to me but hay.

[dcmidnight]

Not sure if anyone out there checked out Chefs Table on Netflix. Its a really great cooking/restaurant doc-type-show if you're into that kind of thing. Really great production value/cinematography. Anyway the same team put out a series called Seven Days Out. Looks like its basically an in-depth look into the week leading up to certain events and some of them look pretty cool. One is a dog show and one is a fashion show - which isnt my thing but one is a NASA probe landing mission and one is a restaurant opening that I watched last night. Pretty good stuff.

[FAbb]

I think I did a pretty good job with designing the new holes at SPCC to be installed in the future. I think I have seen enough good holes to tell the good from the bad. Again this is all about personal likes and dislikes. Kind of like a tree in the middle of a fairway. Some like it and some hate it. But over the years many opinions on here led me to believe that many top 100 course have features that people hate yet they still think the course is great, like turtle back greens. Many dislike Westminster National because of this yet love PH#2. Makes no sense to me but hay.

 

Now I haven't played Westminster in probably 15 years, but I don't seem to remember them having much in the way of collection areas and tightly mown surrounds. You're pitching from rough to elevated, domed greens all the time, as opposed to having options like you do at PH #2.

 

Has this entire GTT been an excuse for Kenty to hate on PH #2 yet again?

[Obee]

I think I did a pretty good job with designing the new holes at SPCC to be installed in the future. I think I have seen enough good holes to tell the good from the bad. Again this is all about personal likes and dislikes. Kind of like a tree in the middle of a fairway. Some like it and some hate it. But over the years many opinions on here led me to believe that many top 100 course have features that people hate yet they still think the course is great, like turtle back greens. Many dislike Westminster National because of this yet love PH#2. Makes no sense to me but hay.

 

Now I haven't played Westminster in probably 15 years, but I don't seem to remember them having much in the way of collection areas and tightly mown surrounds. You're pitching from rough to elevated, domed greens all the time, as opposed to having options like you do at PH #2.

 

Has this entire GTT been an excuse for Kenty to hate on PH #2 yet again?

 

So what are the issues with Pinehurst 2?

[dcmidnight]

Has this entire GTT been an excuse for Kenty to hate on PH #2 yet again?

 

(nodding)

[GooseHook]

I have no dog in this fight. I've played one course on that list, and will definitely add one more this year. Outside hope of playing Pebble/Spyglass/Pasatiempo in the fall but that's a long way off.

 

What I AM excited for is the delivery of fresh Clic wheels for my 3.5. The cart is now 5 years old and the ones on mine have taken a lot of wear. And the booster clip so my new bag actually works on it.

[Kent01putt]

The problem with PH#2 is this. It is not a great layout to start with IMO. Second when your caddie tells you to miss a green left or right because it is the only way you can make a par with this pin location and you have a wedge in your hand, that sucks. Only 30% of every green is useable for a pin location(US Open Stat).If you took this course away from PH and it was a stand alone course it would go broke IMO. I have played it 8 or 9 times. After the first 3 times I only played it again because the guys I was wit wanted to play it on the trip down there. Just not my favorite. Other then one person breaking par at the U Open they had the same problem as did. Good shots ae not rewarded. That is not to say all good shots have to be rewarded but come on with this place.

[2moreTerps]

Pete dye golf club and congressional. Just don’t care that much

 

I hate grow the game. 96% of it is either people trying to make money (golf channel, mnfrs, PGA of america, pga tour, etc) or what I call golfers guilt.

 

Also don’t care that much about snow on the ground. The break is probably good for me. I’ve been working out so hard too. Being able to do that with no concern for daily soreness is good. Gotta remember the chocolate milk post workout.

 

Playing in the hive ground hog day tourney. A month ago “I’m going to play a couple hive tournaments this year”. City “no you’re not”. Lol.

[misplacedtexan83]

Fabb that is the point. Playing different courses is fun. Not to long ago many on here did not or could not see how anyone could belong to a CC with all the stuffy people. How it appears many have seen the reasons why it is good deal.

I would think everyone would enjoy playing new places every week if possible.

 

Tex shame on you

 

Yep Kent shame on me..

 

 

 

 

[FAbb]

I like to give Kent a hard time for hating on #2, but I honestly do get where people come away with that sentiment.

 

I'm not exaggerating - I think I landed approaches on twice as many greens as I ended up staying on in regulation. It's a bad place to get caught flag chasing, and marginal iron shots aren't going to stay aboard.

 

I ended up in a spot on one green where all i did was touch my ball, and it rolled past the flag, off the green, and about 50 yards down the fairway.

 

I spent the entire round trying to figure out if I should putt, bump and run, pitch, or what around those greens when I missed them.

 

I watched mid-teen handicappers get beat to a pulp at times by the green complexes.

 

It can be brutally difficult. I shot a horrible round. My FIL got the snot beat out of him. But we're both sitting on the porch after just lusting after getting another crack at it some day. I think there's a tremendous amount to learn about the course, and how to play it to make the best possible scores. One of the other guys in our group though, you could tell just really didn't enjoy it. All he could do was sit and lament this bad bounce, or that. The putt that he couldn't keep near the hole, and so on.

[misplacedtexan83]

Pete dye golf club and congressional. Just dont care that much

 

I hate grow the game. 96% of it is either people trying to make money (golf channel, mnfrs, PGA of america, pga tour, etc) or what I call golfers guilt.

 

Also dont care that much about snow on the ground. The break is probably good for me. Ive been working out so hard too. Being able to do that with no concern for daily soreness is good. Gotta remember the chocolate milk post workout.

 

Playing in the hive ground hog day tourney. A month ago Im going to play a couple hive tournaments this year. City no youre not. Lol.

 

Golfers guilt?

 

Or maybe realizing golf takes too long for a lot of people, expensive, etc

 

So attempt to change, so we get more people playing the game. Instead of the small percentage of people that love and are addicted to it.

 

If you do not grow then you stay the same...

 

 

[baddomes]

Kent, if you don't start feeling bad for playing all of those golf courses RIGHT NOW, Tex is going to unfollow you on instagram.

[baddomes]

 

Also don't care that much about snow on the ground. The break is probably good for me. I've been working out so hard too. Being able to do that with no concern for daily soreness is good. Gotta remember the chocolate milk post workout.

 

 

Agreed on this.

 

Went to BodyPump this morning. Only guy in the class. Left 2/3rds of the way through to throw up. Came back in and finished strong. I've never been this unfit in my life. It's an interesting experience trying to dig out of this.

 

I've thrown up in that YMCA 5 times now.

[misplacedtexan83]

I will keep defending myself because well there is snow ground.

 

Never said feel sorry for playing all the great courses in the world.

 

I enjoy hearing the stories of this and that course from Kent. I like Kent a lot. He is old but we love him for that.

 

I just did not care for or like.. throwing out that we compare top 100 course to our local public.

 

Most of us know what a good, bad or great courses is. A lot of us have experienced different golf courses around the US and abroad.

 

Once again.. i love Kent, his son is awesome and his daughter is hot

 

Hugs Kent

[Kent01putt]

It's been a good life Domes, lucky to meet the right people. Still want to get up north with you this summer at Bedford.

[ceejay81]

This 19-20 capper wants PH#2 to be his home course forever. I just love the fact I can spray the ball anywhere and I'll always find my ball. I absolutely love the green complexes and the conditions of the greens, too. All of that combined with the history of the course just makes it top notch for me. We don't see many of the characteristics of this course at home. Having all of the shaved areas around the greens are a lot of fun to maneuver around. It's not an automatic "miss the green in the rough, lob wedge it close, putt out" when you're on #2. It's different, it's fun, it's challenging.

 

I don't think it can be discounted too much when someone at my skill level loves playing a course due to the fact it's near impossible to lose a ball. Gil Hanse has talked a lot about it. The course is still hard AF, but I'm always able to find my ball and play my next shot.

[siegel159]

I like to give Kent a hard time for hating on #2, but I honestly do get where people come away with that sentiment.

 

I'm not exaggerating - I think I landed approaches on twice as many greens as I ended up staying on in regulation. It's a bad place to get caught flag chasing, and marginal iron shots aren't going to stay aboard.

 

I ended up in a spot on one green where all i did was touch my ball, and it rolled past the flag, off the green, and about 50 yards down the fairway.

 

I spent the entire round trying to figure out if I should putt, bump and run, pitch, or what around those greens when I missed them.

 

I watched mid-teen handicappers get beat to a pulp at times by the green complexes.

 

It can be brutally difficult. I shot a horrible round. My FIL got the snot beat out of him. But we're both sitting on the porch after just lusting after getting another crack at it some day. I think there's a tremendous amount to learn about the course, and how to play it to make the best possible scores. One of the other guys in our group though, you could tell just really didn't enjoy it. All he could do was sit and lament this bad bounce, or that. The putt that he couldn't keep near the hole, and so on.

 

Would you say playing at EPP has prepared me for #2?

 

#outofshapeWRX Also trying to get more seriously into the gym again/being healthy. I almost stopped exercising entirely last Fall, only hitting the climbing gym like once a week. I haven't eaten ice cream in like 3 weeks now. It's been tough

[GooseHook]

Pete dye golf club and congressional. Just don't care that much

 

I hate grow the game. 96% of it is either people trying to make money (golf channel, mnfrs, PGA of america, pga tour, etc) or what I call golfers guilt.

 

Also don't care that much about snow on the ground. The break is probably good for me. I've been working out so hard too. Being able to do that with no concern for daily soreness is good. Gotta remember the chocolate milk post workout.

 

Playing in the hive ground hog day tourney. A month ago "I'm going to play a couple hive tournaments this year". City "no you're not". Lol.

 

After a month of keto, chocolate milk might make me sick for a whole week.

 

I need to get back into some body weight work and spinning. I'm at my best weight in 15 years, and lean, but probably way weaker than I was when lifting frequently.

[FAbb]

I hate grow the game.

 

[baddomes]

#contractthegame

[Obee]

The problem with PH#2 is this. It is not a great layout to start with IMO. Second when your caddie tells you to miss a green left or right because it is the only way you can make a par with this pin location and you have a wedge in your hand, that sucks. Only 30% of every green is useable for a pin location(US Open Stat).If you took this course away from PH and it was a stand alone course it would go broke IMO. I have played it 8 or 9 times. After the first 3 times I only played it again because the guys I was wit wanted to play it on the trip down there. Just not my favorite. Other then one person breaking par at the U Open they had the same problem as did. Good shots ae not rewarded. That is not to say all good shots have to be rewarded but come on with this place.

 

Interesting.

 

I played Pinehurst 2 in 1997. Found it only moderately difficult. Greens were perfect, and fast. But that was (well) before the restoration. REALLY looking forward to giving it another go.

 

Most caddies are ... well ... not very good. Even caddies at top resorts. They get jaded and give people ridiculous advice, like "miss the green over there, on purpose." PUH. LEEZE.

 

Every once in a GREAT while — and usually only if you are in jail and have only a couple options — is missing the green on purpose the right play.

 

Often, at tough courses with penal green complexes, purposely leaving yourself a 20 - 30 footer under the hole with a good angle (rather than firing at a pin) is the right play, but that's different than missing the green being the best play.

 

Regarding the US Open there: yeah, we won't be playing it with the greens US Open firm or fast... :-)

 

 

 

 

[HighBoomingDraws]

Omg I just skimmed through all that and am reeling. Very interested in the blockchain ferrule technology though. #bitcoinbombs

[therealsneek]

I don't know if anyone else has read the recent WSJ article about golf course closures, but it was eye opening to me. Over 200 courses closed last year while 15 new ones opened. That wasn't the main point of the article, but it is the one that hit me the most. This has to be a direct result of the over building of courses (most of them unremarkable) during peak Tiger. The number of golfers and rounds played was never sustainable. The large number of housing communities with their mandatory golf dues were never sustainable. I think golf is still regressing to its mean and I don't think that is a necessarily a bad thing. That was a long way of saying that I don't like "grow the game" either.

[FAbb]

Also don't care that much about snow on the ground. The break is probably good for me. I've been working out so hard too. Being able to do that with no concern for daily soreness is good. Gotta remember the chocolate milk post workout.

 

 

Agreed on this.

 

Went to BodyPump this morning. Only guy in the class. Left 2/3rds of the way through to throw up. Came back in and finished strong. I've never been this unfit in my life. It's an interesting experience trying to dig out of this.

 

I've thrown up in that YMCA 5 times now.

 

I got you, Domes. We've got 3 weeks to train for our debut as a powerhouse team at The Woodmore Groundhog Day Open, presented by The Hive.

 

[TheCityGame]

Pete dye golf club and congressional. Just don’t care that much

 

I hate grow the game. 96% of it is either people trying to make money (golf channel, mnfrs, PGA of america, pga tour, etc) or what I call golfers guilt.

 

Also don’t care that much about snow on the ground. The break is probably good for me. I’ve been working out so hard too. Being able to do that with no concern for daily soreness is good. Gotta remember the chocolate milk post workout.

 

Playing in the hive ground hog day tourney. A month ago “I’m going to play a couple hive tournaments this year”. City “no you’re not”. Lol.

 

Golfers guilt?

 

Or maybe realizing golf takes too long for a lot of people, expensive, etc

 

So attempt to change, so we get more people playing the game. Instead of the small percentage of people that love and are addicted to it.

 

If you do not grow then you stay the same...

If *I* don't grow, but, I'm not the game. "The world" will tell the golf industry what size the game is supposed to be. "Growing the game" is not something I care about. It's something the industry cares about.

 

(is that too argumentative? i'm not trying to be, I swear. Heckin' snow.)

 

Golfer's Guilt, if I get what 2More is saying, is similar to any kind of "moneyed guilt".

 

Certain people know that they have tons of time, and leisure, and money, more than they know what to do with (or that they feel they actually deserve). . .so donating a two year old set of golf clubs to the First Tee and telling themselves they're helping to "grow the game" assuages some of that guilt.

 

Ask one of these guys if he's willing to give up his club one Saturday a month to let kids play out there and see how into "growing the game" he is.

 

Sort of on this topic, I just finished a very interesting book called "Winners Take All : The Elite Charade of Changing the World". Its primary thesis is that the high wealth charity that is done worldwide serves to benefit the rich and powerful at least as much as it does the people they're helping (usually through "win-win" business solutions to supposedly create "opportunity" for the destitute), and that truly sacrificing (in many ways he lays out in the book) would be more useful, but these people aren't willing to do that. I'm not going to go into all the arguments he lays out in the book, but he makes a good case.

 

Anyway, you can look at something like "The First Tee" through that prism. There's nothing wrong with "the first tee", per se, but let's not think that getting a few kids out chipping balls and teaching them that in golf you call penalties on yourself, so therefore they have integrity in life is actually making a meaningful societal change. (lots more stuff edited out here because it's getting too deep into politics)

[TheCityGame]

Also don't care that much about snow on the ground. The break is probably good for me. I've been working out so hard too. Being able to do that with no concern for daily soreness is good. Gotta remember the chocolate milk post workout.

 

 

Agreed on this.

 

Went to BodyPump this morning. Only guy in the class. Left 2/3rds of the way through to throw up. Came back in and finished strong. I've never been this unfit in my life. It's an interesting experience trying to dig out of this.

 

I've thrown up in that YMCA 5 times now.

 

I got you, Domes. We've got 3 weeks to train for our debut as a powerhouse team at The Woodmore Groundhog Day Open, presented by The Hive.

 

I forgot to mention, I'm playing with 2More at Groundhog Day.

 

So, here's a little update to your gif.

 

[ceejay81]

Live shot of FAbb gaining 5-7 mph swing speed.

 

 

Here's Domes running backwards telling FAbb "you'll never see gainz unless you put in the work!"

 

[baddomes]

Who else is playing in that thing?