I’m calling BS on 10+ yard gains

[pinestreetgolf]

Its basically impossible to tell. I played well this afternoon, the best in a while. I hit the driver very well. But last weekend it was a horror show. Same driver, way different results.

 

If one can fire a 42 with a ball OB and a 34 with six fairways and eight greens on the front 9 of the same course within 7 days with the same driver from 2005, its hard to imagine any of us being able to tell if our swings are constant enough to say its the equipment. Just the truth in golf, unfortunately. Its all about the cycle. If you think its the driver for you, it is, because you'll get on your left foot and swing free. If you are worried about the driver, get rid of it. You'll hang back and block. Sad but true. If you believe it works. I wish it could be more scientific and that more "rules" (like the OP's) worked, but the fact is they don't and we're all different.

 

The hard part is realizing that all drivers will have bad days and sticking with the "best one" through the hard times OR realizing it actually does stink and ditching it. Is it a great club for you that's gone cold, or is the faith gone? That's the hard thing to figure out. Not which launch monitor reading to buy.

 

The real test for that Epic Flash isn't when you're swinging free and well, its when the course is soaking wet, you reach back for some more juice, and put one in the parking lot and then do it again the next week. Is it still in the bag that third weekend?

 

As they say, winning cures all ills. The real test of a driver match is if stays in the bag through the rough spots because somewhere deep inside you know its a solid club. You can't fit that, and its the most important thing.

 

 

Well fortunately for me driving in play isn't an issue.....looking for and found some much needed "confident distance" as we spoke on before, iron play is the best way to lower scores and my 15 greens can attest to this 73 today....I'm that old acting guy who hits it 200 nothing but always in play....what the FSZ has done is combined the better qualities of my last few drivers in a great looking package.....

 

Will there be a moment? Of course! it's golf but as much movement as we make equipment wise, I've learned a ton...

 

I've got 99 problems but driving ain't one!

 

Nice. In play all day is a good place to be.

 

I was just suggesting that a "well fit" driver is about a whole lot more than launch monitor data. Its mainly about faith. If the OP had said "On an unemotional robot that has constant confidence, no modern driver head is 10 yards longer than another" I would agree. If he is talking about in the hands of humans, I totally disagree. You see people who can't take drivers to the course from the sims all the time (you read posts from them in this board all the time - they usually blame fitter instead of their elevated level of fear when its off a real tee box). The most powerful force on a golf course is trust and that can add 10 yards, easy. The g400 max has a unique look at address, so do teh Titleist drivers. That can make a huge difference.

[SwooshLT]

Its basically impossible to tell. I played well this afternoon, the best in a while. I hit the driver very well. But last weekend it was a horror show. Same driver, way different results.

 

If one can fire a 42 with a ball OB and a 34 with six fairways and eight greens on the front 9 of the same course within 7 days with the same driver from 2005, its hard to imagine any of us being able to tell if our swings are constant enough to say its the equipment. Just the truth in golf, unfortunately. Its all about the cycle. If you think its the driver for you, it is, because you'll get on your left foot and swing free. If you are worried about the driver, get rid of it. You'll hang back and block. Sad but true. If you believe it works. I wish it could be more scientific and that more "rules" (like the OP's) worked, but the fact is they don't and we're all different.

 

The hard part is realizing that all drivers will have bad days and sticking with the "best one" through the hard times OR realizing it actually does stink and ditching it. Is it a great club for you that's gone cold, or is the faith gone? That's the hard thing to figure out. Not which launch monitor reading to buy.

 

The real test for that Epic Flash isn't when you're swinging free and well, its when the course is soaking wet, you reach back for some more juice, and put one in the parking lot and then do it again the next week. Is it still in the bag that third weekend?

 

As they say, winning cures all ills. The real test of a driver match is if stays in the bag through the rough spots because somewhere deep inside you know its a solid club. You can't fit that, and its the most important thing.

 

 

Well fortunately for me driving in play isn't an issue.....looking for and found some much needed "confident distance" as we spoke on before, iron play is the best way to lower scores and my 15 greens can attest to this 73 today....I'm that old acting guy who hits it 200 nothing but always in play....what the FSZ has done is combined the better qualities of my last few drivers in a great looking package.....

 

Will there be a moment? Of course! it's golf but as much movement as we make equipment wise, I've learned a ton...

 

I've got 99 problems but driving ain't one!

 

Nice. In play all day is a good place to be.

 

I was just suggesting that a "well fit" driver is about a whole lot more than launch monitor data. Its mainly about faith. If the OP had said "On an unemotional robot that has constant confidence, no modern driver head is 10 yards longer than another" I would agree. If he is talking about in the hands of humans, I totally disagree. You see people who can't take drivers to the course from the sims all the time (you read posts from them in this board all the time - they usually blame fitter instead of their elevated level of fear when its off a real tee box). The most powerful force on a golf course is trust and that can add 10 yards, easy. The g400 max has a unique look at address, so do teh Titleist drivers. That can make a huge difference.

 

 

All great points!

[Seeking70s]

So Does This Mean I have to Return My Driver Because of the Yards I Picked up?

[SwooshLT]

So Does This Mean I have to Return My Driver Because of the Yards I Picked up?

 

 

Very good!

[vanillafunk616]

I'm creating a hypothetical strawman in my head. I'm calling bs on it. Please argue against me.

[collingsom1a]

I might be off in my thinking and assumptions.......but I think OP is laughing at the claims we see that say the new driver X is getting 30+ yards of added distance. We've all seen these, and laughed at them as well.

 

Also, I'm thinking the OP is also thinking that all the faces on these clubs are regulated by USGA CT testing, therefore, there's no club that's going to be 30 yards longer as some posters brag about. In that regard, I agree with him.

 

Honestly, if you've been properly fitted in the last 3-5 years, it's highly probable that you're any going to see material distance advantages / changes, regardless of what all the marketing garbage claim.

[pinestreetgolf]

Also, I'm thinking the OP is also thinking that all the faces on these clubs are regulated by USGA CT testing, therefore, there's no club that's going to be 30 yards longer as some posters brag about. In that regard, I agree with him.

 

Absolute nonsense. Take a guy whose looked at turbulators since the G30 and is now in a G400. As he's walking to the tee say, "use this today" and hand him on the taylormade white/black shiny drivers. He'll *make a different swing*. Of course all conforming drivers are conforming. That isn't even close to the same thing as "players hit all drivers the same". If the look and feel effect the swing, the USGA requirement is irrelevant. Which is why the OP's post is nonsense*. There are players on here who create posts looking for an incredibly specific *sound at impact* from their driver -> you don't think those wack-a-doos (no offense :) are going to swing completely different with different sounds, feels, looks and weights?

 

*Only applies to golf played by humans outside on Earth. Under other conditions (like a robot) all conforming drivers might produce identical results.

[NoFancyUsername.]

So Does This Mean I have to Return My Driver Because of the Yards I Picked up?

 

What's your handicap and was your last driver fitted, and what driver/shaft was it?

Throw some driver stats up from your old driver compared to your new one.

[BIG STU]

Not sure about the yardage but I just saved 10% on car insurance by switching to Geico.

 

I stayed at a holiday inn express last night.

LOL--- I live a half mile from one here at the beach--- I think some of it rubs off on me every night------

[nsxguy]

My point is this: most all new major drivers releases today are similar performance. If you are properly fit, you won't gain 10+ yards going from one to another.

 

Convince me I'm wrong...

 

Also, I'm thinking the OP is also thinking that all the faces on these clubs are regulated by USGA CT testing, therefore, there's no club that's going to be 30 yards longer as some posters brag about. In that regard, I agree with him.

 

Absolute nonsense. Take a guy whose looked at turbulators since the G30 and is now in a G400. As he's walking to the tee say, "use this today" and hand him on the taylormade white/black shiny drivers. He'll *make a different swing*. Of course all conforming drivers are conforming. That isn't even close to the same thing as "players hit all drivers the same". If the look and feel effect the swing, the USGA requirement is irrelevant. Which is why the OP's post is nonsense*. There are players on here who create posts looking for an incredibly specific *sound at impact* from their driver -> you don't think those wack-a-doos (no offense :) are going to swing completely different with different sounds, feels, looks and weights?

 

*Only applies to golf played by humans outside on Earth. Under other conditions (like a robot) all conforming drivers might produce identical results.

 

What are you talking about ? "Absolute nonsense" ? collingsom1a is saying, more or less, exactly what the OP said/meant.

 

It's been 2 weeks so forgive me if I'm misremembering but WHO said "players hit all drivers the same" ?

 

I quoted the OP.

 

How could ANYONE not realize that he was saying that the same player, fitted properly to A driver will NOT gain 10 yards over ANY OTHER current driver ? :blink:

[sdandrea]

I'm creating a hypothetical strawman in my head. I'm calling bs on it. Please argue against me.

 

You're wrong. So there. ?

[pinestreetgolf]

My point is this: most all new major drivers releases today are similar performance. If you are properly fit, you won't gain 10+ yards going from one to another.

 

Convince me I'm wrong...

 

Also, I'm thinking the OP is also thinking that all the faces on these clubs are regulated by USGA CT testing, therefore, there's no club that's going to be 30 yards longer as some posters brag about. In that regard, I agree with him.

 

Absolute nonsense. Take a guy whose looked at turbulators since the G30 and is now in a G400. As he's walking to the tee say, "use this today" and hand him on the taylormade white/black shiny drivers. He'll *make a different swing*. Of course all conforming drivers are conforming. That isn't even close to the same thing as "players hit all drivers the same". If the look and feel effect the swing, the USGA requirement is irrelevant. Which is why the OP's post is nonsense*. There are players on here who create posts looking for an incredibly specific *sound at impact* from their driver -> you don't think those wack-a-doos (no offense :) are going to swing completely different with different sounds, feels, looks and weights?

 

*Only applies to golf played by humans outside on Earth. Under other conditions (like a robot) all conforming drivers might produce identical results.

 

What are you talking about ? "Absolute nonsense" ? collingsom1a is saying, more or less, exactly what the OP said/meant.

 

It's been 2 weeks so forgive me if I'm misremembering but WHO said "players hit all drivers the same" ?

 

I quoted the OP.

 

How could ANYONE not realize that he was saying that the same player, fitted properly to A driver will NOT gain 10 yards over ANY OTHER current driver ? :blink:

 

Obviously he meant the same player. Reread my post. I think you missed it.

 

My point is that no particular player swings two different drivers identically and therefore it’s the variance in swings NOT the CT reading that matters. There are players who will gain or lose 10 yards because *they like the titleist head shape* (or the TM white/black design, or any of a thousand non-CT differences) and therefore swing with more confidence producing more yardage.

 

CT is a tiny part of distance. Comfort is a huge part of distance. Player X can easily be way more confident with one modern driver and not another and therefore hit it better. For high swing speed players, it can easily be 10 yards.

 

Unless you mean “properly fit†to be “ideal†in which case the OP’s post is “nobody hits another driver better than their ideal driverâ€, which I obviously agree with - as would anyone else.

[nsxguy]

My point is this: most all new major drivers releases today are similar performance. If you are properly fit, you won't gain 10+ yards going from one to another.

 

Convince me I'm wrong...

 

Also, I'm thinking the OP is also thinking that all the faces on these clubs are regulated by USGA CT testing, therefore, there's no club that's going to be 30 yards longer as some posters brag about. In that regard, I agree with him.

 

Absolute nonsense. Take a guy whose looked at turbulators since the G30 and is now in a G400. As he's walking to the tee say, "use this today" and hand him on the taylormade white/black shiny drivers. He'll *make a different swing*. Of course all conforming drivers are conforming. That isn't even close to the same thing as "players hit all drivers the same". If the look and feel effect the swing, the USGA requirement is irrelevant. Which is why the OP's post is nonsense*. There are players on here who create posts looking for an incredibly specific *sound at impact* from their driver -> you don't think those wack-a-doos (no offense :) are going to swing completely different with different sounds, feels, looks and weights?

 

*Only applies to golf played by humans outside on Earth. Under other conditions (like a robot) all conforming drivers might produce identical results.

 

What are you talking about ? "Absolute nonsense" ? collingsom1a is saying, more or less, exactly what the OP said/meant.

 

It's been 2 weeks so forgive me if I'm misremembering but WHO said "players hit all drivers the same" ?

 

I quoted the OP.

 

How could ANYONE not realize that he was saying that the same player, fitted properly to A driver will NOT gain 10 yards over ANY OTHER current driver ? :blink:

 

Obviously he meant the same player. Reread my post. I think you missed it.

 

My point is that no particular player swings two different drivers identically and therefore it’s the variance in swings NOT the CT reading that matters. There are players who will gain or lose 10 yards because *they like the titleist head shape* (or the TM white/black design, or any of a thousand non-CT differences) and therefore swing with more confidence producing more yardage.

 

CT is a tiny part of distance. Comfort is a huge part of distance. Player X can easily be way more confident with one modern driver and not another and therefore hit it better. For high swing speed players, it can easily be 10 yards.

 

Unless you mean “properly fit†to be “ideal†in which case the OP’s post is “nobody hits another driver better than their ideal driverâ€, which I obviously agree with - as would anyone else.

 

We'll have to agree to disagree then.

 

He said "properly fitted". To me that means the player is comfortable swinging the club.

 

The distance factor, to ME, is a matter of "best swing". Not average, not best misses, best result. (i.e. "picking up 10 yards" (or more)). That is how an awful lot of players, many of whom should know better, choose their clubs.

 

I expect they figure that they can learn to replicate the best swing once they get more time in with that driver.

[pinestreetgolf]

What are you talking about ? "Absolute nonsense" ? collingsom1a is saying, more or less, exactly what the OP said/meant.

 

It's been 2 weeks so forgive me if I'm misremembering but WHO said "players hit all drivers the same" ?

 

I quoted the OP.

 

How could ANYONE not realize that he was saying that the same player, fitted properly to A driver will NOT gain 10 yards over ANY OTHER current driver ? :blink:

 

Obviously he meant the same player. Reread my post. I think you missed it.

 

My point is that no particular player swings two different drivers identically and therefore it’s the variance in swings NOT the CT reading that matters. There are players who will gain or lose 10 yards because *they like the titleist head shape* (or the TM white/black design, or any of a thousand non-CT differences) and therefore swing with more confidence producing more yardage.

 

CT is a tiny part of distance. Comfort is a huge part of distance. Player X can easily be way more confident with one modern driver and not another and therefore hit it better. For high swing speed players, it can easily be 10 yards.

 

Unless you mean “properly fit†to be “ideal†in which case the OP’s post is “nobody hits another driver better than their ideal driverâ€, which I obviously agree with - as would anyone else.

 

We'll have to agree to disagree then.

 

He said "properly fitted". To me that means the player is comfortable swinging the club.

 

The distance factor, to ME, is a matter of "best swing". Not average, not best misses, best result. (i.e. "picking up 10 yards" (or more)). That is how an awful lot of players, many of whom should know better, choose their clubs.

 

I expect they figure that they can learn to replicate the best swing once they get more time in with that driver.

 

His post is a tautology if you take "properly fitted" that way. Of course its true. "You won't get any yards with another driver over one that is the best one for you." OK, I agree.

 

I took "properly fitted" to mean "fitted on a launch monitor on a range or in a store" not "driver the player is best with".

[rdangelo1077]

I just went for a re-fitting at club champion yesterday. Was previously fit into a 2017 M2/fuji speeder evo II 661 stiff by the same fitter. Have been playing a lot and working on technique through regular lessons. Over the last few months of this year I didn't have control of my shots. During the fitting found out I had picked up about 7 mph club head speed and shaft I previously had was no longer a good fit. Within about 30 minutes had a couple of shafts that had me back to where I wanted to be. Figured we might as well try some new heads from this year. Hit pretty much everything except the Mizuno's. Saw pretty much no difference in dispersion or distance with the various heads we hit. Best new performer was the PXG which saw a couple of bombs but no appreciable difference in average distance.

 

My story is just one, but I can't see dropping an extra $500 for a new head which doesn't change the way I would be playing a particular tee shot, but I'm more than happy to see how a shaft can make a drastic difference and can potentially save a few hundred.

[Lefty96]

I believe where people see great increases in distance is when they move from something that was a "poor fit" to a "good fit". I recently switched from a 910 D3 (Stiff Adilia RIP alpha) to a rogue subzero (Hzrdus yellow 6.5 (-1/2 inch)). I saw a pretty significant increase in distance (about 15 yards). This was my first time being fit on a launch monitor and first tome being fit since I got the 910 when it was new. I was spinning the ball way too much and the switch really lowered that. Also going to a heavier shaft (76g) really helped my dispersion.

 

I think if you haven't been fit, or at least not in a while/ on a monitor, there could be distance gains to be found.

[HuskyFan]

Check out the TXG video on YouTube that just came out this morning. The guy was 10 yards longer with a fitted F9 vs fitted TS3.

[steph_alex]

Check out the TXG video on YouTube that just came out this morning. The guy was 10 yards longer with a fitted F9 vs fitted TS3.

 

....And 16 yards between the G410 and the F9...

 

No one can say that Matt is not fitted properly....and not a good player with a repeatable swing...

 

His speed and length may exaggerate the spread between two heads but with a swing speed > 100/105 mph, we'd still see a close to 10 yards difference.

 

There definitely are differences between heads of the same year.

10 yards is not that big of a spread.

[tcutshaw1723]

Check out the TXG video on YouTube that just came out this morning. The guy was 10 yards longer with a fitted F9 vs fitted TS3.

 

....And 16 yards between the G410 and the F9...

 

No one can say that Matt is not fitted properly....and not a good player with a repeatable swing...

 

His speed and length may exaggerate the spread between two heads but with a swing speed > 100/105 mph, we'd still see a close to 10 yards difference.

 

There definitely are differences between heads of the same year.

10 yards is not that big of a spread.

as a lefty I both admire and am so jealous when I watch Matt swing! He makes it look effortless. Watching him hit the epic flash sz 3 wood over 300 yards in carry was crazy. On a side note, I did get over 10+ yards from my fitted Rogue sz to the stock m5. My swing has definitely improved this past year but I did gain distance. I do agree that if you're fit perfectly to drivers of the last 3 or so years that you'll see minimal distance gains. Some heads are just better for your swing type. This is a very interesting topic though

[LUMA]

I did gain 10-15 yards going from my beloved 910 D3 to Epic Sub Zero. I wasn't even fitted for a shaft for the new driver. I just hit a demo and I'm like, "Ok I'm going the f****** buy this right now". Still playing the shaft that came with it. Who knows.

 

I will be getting a shaft fit for this driver in the next few weeks tho.

[nsxguy]

Check out the TXG video on YouTube that just came out this morning. The guy was 10 yards longer with a fitted F9 vs fitted TS3.

 

....And 16 yards between the G410 and the F9...

 

No one can say that Matt is not fitted properly....and not a good player with a repeatable swing...

 

His speed and length may exaggerate the spread between two heads but with a swing speed > 100/105 mph, we'd still see a close to 10 yards difference.

 

There definitely are differences between heads of the same year.

10 yards is not that big of a spread.

 

OY,,,,,,,,,,,,

 

Look at the difference in BALL SPEED. .8 and .3

 

For purposes of this particular discussion that is ALL that matters. 1MPH is worth roughly 2.5 yards in carry.

 

ALL the rest, ANY distance difference, is based on launch conditions. Get the same launch angle and spin rate and 2 drivers with the same ball speed will go the SAME distance.

 

And since the CT/COR is LIMITED and they're all right at the max, every player should be able to get their same max swing speed unless you believe there's something more aerodynamic that will make 4 MPH worth of SS difference. Good luck with that.

[pinestreetgolf]

Check out the TXG video on YouTube that just came out this morning. The guy was 10 yards longer with a fitted F9 vs fitted TS3.

 

....And 16 yards between the G410 and the F9...

 

No one can say that Matt is not fitted properly....and not a good player with a repeatable swing...

 

His speed and length may exaggerate the spread between two heads but with a swing speed > 100/105 mph, we'd still see a close to 10 yards difference.

 

There definitely are differences between heads of the same year.

10 yards is not that big of a spread.

 

OY,,,,,,,,,,,,

 

Look at the difference in BALL SPEED. .8 and .3

 

For purposes of this particular discussion that is ALL that matters. 1MPH is worth roughly 2.5 yards in carry.

 

ALL the rest, ANY distance difference, is based on launch conditions. Get the same launch angle and spin rate and 2 drivers with the same ball speed will go the SAME distance.

 

And since the CT/COR is LIMITED and they're all right at the max, every player should be able to get their same max swing speed unless you believe there's something more aerodynamic that will make 4 MPH worth of SS difference. Good luck with that.

 

Nobody would argue that. Of course all modern drivers are the same with the same inputs like launch angle, club speed, etc...

 

The issue is that two driver heads that look different and feel different and sound different will never share the same launch conditions when swung by the same human golfer. Our feel matters so much to our golf swings that the right or wrong head could cause those conditions to differ by enough to mean 10 yards.

[nsxguy]

Check out the TXG video on YouTube that just came out this morning. The guy was 10 yards longer with a fitted F9 vs fitted TS3.

 

....And 16 yards between the G410 and the F9...

 

No one can say that Matt is not fitted properly....and not a good player with a repeatable swing...

 

His speed and length may exaggerate the spread between two heads but with a swing speed > 100/105 mph, we'd still see a close to 10 yards difference.

 

There definitely are differences between heads of the same year.

10 yards is not that big of a spread.

 

OY,,,,,,,,,,,,

 

Look at the difference in BALL SPEED. .8 and .3

 

For purposes of this particular discussion that is ALL that matters. 1MPH is worth roughly 2.5 yards in carry.

 

ALL the rest, ANY distance difference, is based on launch conditions. Get the same launch angle and spin rate and 2 drivers with the same ball speed will go the SAME distance.

 

And since the CT/COR is LIMITED and they're all right at the max, every player should be able to get their same max swing speed unless you believe there's something more aerodynamic that will make 4 MPH worth of SS difference. Good luck with that.

 

Nobody would argue that. Of course all modern drivers are the same with the same inputs like launch angle, club speed, etc...

 

Good, because that's what the OP was going for. That was his "beef".

 

The rest is all noise.

 

Thanks. :hi:

[steph_alex]

Check out the TXG video on YouTube that just came out this morning. The guy was 10 yards longer with a fitted F9 vs fitted TS3.

 

....And 16 yards between the G410 and the F9...

 

No one can say that Matt is not fitted properly....and not a good player with a repeatable swing...

 

His speed and length may exaggerate the spread between two heads but with a swing speed > 100/105 mph, we'd still see a close to 10 yards difference.

 

There definitely are differences between heads of the same year.

10 yards is not that big of a spread.

 

OY,,,,,,,,,,,,

 

Look at the difference in BALL SPEED. .8 and .3

 

For purposes of this particular discussion that is ALL that matters. 1MPH is worth roughly 2.5 yards in carry.

 

ALL the rest, ANY distance difference, is based on launch conditions. Get the same launch angle and spin rate and 2 drivers with the same ball speed will go the SAME distance.

 

And since the CT/COR is LIMITED and they're all right at the max, every player should be able to get their same max swing speed unless you believe there's something more aerodynamic that will make 4 MPH worth of SS difference. Good luck with that.

 

I actually swung the G400 3/5 mph faster than my TS2 on about 20 swings on a demo day. (and swinging the TS2 side by side).

You're kicking at an open door when you say that two identical launch conditions will have the same distance...

The point is that no two heads will produce the same launch conditions and spin, even with the same loft. Speed and COR are not the only factors.

If you had a swing robot swing all the drivers head with the same speed, same shaft, same loft and same ball, do you think that we will have a the exact same result?

Ball speed is not all that matters, it's the total distance that matters, otherwise anyone could get any driver, just get fitted for loft and a shaft and get the best result according to you and the OP.

Which is not the case.

 

Another example, get optimally fit for 5 different drivers and collect your data.

Would you put money on the table that between the first and the last, there will be <10 yards difference?

Unless your SS is < 100 mph, it's unlikely

[Steele47]

Eye catching thread title.

[nsxguy]

Check out the TXG video on YouTube that just came out this morning. The guy was 10 yards longer with a fitted F9 vs fitted TS3.

 

....And 16 yards between the G410 and the F9...

 

No one can say that Matt is not fitted properly....and not a good player with a repeatable swing...

 

His speed and length may exaggerate the spread between two heads but with a swing speed > 100/105 mph, we'd still see a close to 10 yards difference.

 

There definitely are differences between heads of the same year.

10 yards is not that big of a spread.

 

OY,,,,,,,,,,,,

 

Look at the difference in BALL SPEED. .8 and .3

 

For purposes of this particular discussion that is ALL that matters. 1MPH is worth roughly 2.5 yards in carry.

 

ALL the rest, ANY distance difference, is based on launch conditions. Get the same launch angle and spin rate and 2 drivers with the same ball speed will go the SAME distance.

 

And since the CT/COR is LIMITED and they're all right at the max, every player should be able to get their same max swing speed unless you believe there's something more aerodynamic that will make 4 MPH worth of SS difference. Good luck with that.

 

I actually swung the G400 3/5 mph faster than my TS2 on about 20 swings on a demo day. (and swinging the TS2 side by side).

You're kicking at an open door when you say that two identical launch conditions will have the same distance...

The point is that no two heads will produce the same launch conditions and spin, even with the same loft. Speed and COR are not the only factors.

If you had a swing robot swing all the drivers head with the same speed, same shaft, same loft and same ball, do you think that we will have a the exact same result?

Ball speed is not all that matters, it's the total distance that matters, otherwise anyone could get any driver, just get fitted for loft and a shaft and get the best result according to you and the OP.

Which is not the case.

 

Another example, get optimally fit for 5 different drivers and collect your data.

Would you put money on the table that between the first and the last, there will be <10 yards difference?

Unless your SS is < 100 mph, it's unlikely

 

You seem to be missing the point.

 

I never once suggested that a robot should "swing all the drivers head with the same speed, same shaft, same loft and same ball", and get the same results.

 

How would you account for the fact that you swung the Ping 3/5 mph faster ? Did you use the same shafts in each ? Did they swingweight the same ? Did you eat an energy bar in between ? What ?

 

While the heads definitely produce (some) different flight characteristics, the point is, since the heads will all provide virtually the same ball speed they will ALL go the same distance once you find the shaft that will provide the optimum combination of launch and spin.

 

For one head you might need a spinier shaft, for another head you might need a stiffer shaft, for another head you might need a higher launching shaft.

 

i.e. once you get all the numbers the "same" the ball will travel the same distance.

 

It'd take a lot of trial and error but are you suggesting you can't get the same launch and spin regardless of how many shafts you try ?

[300_Straight]

ALL the rest, ANY distance difference, is based on launch conditions. Get the same launch angle and spin rate and 2 drivers with the same ball speed will go the SAME distance.

True, but someone might be more comfortable looking down at / swinging a particular Driver over another. Having more confidence standing over the Driver is a big deal to how you release the club.

 

With that said, roughly all the Drivers on the market in the last few years should produce very similar numbers when fitted properly. And by fitted properly I mean the right head / shaft combo. Given different head weights, a particular shaft may work better in one head and not the other. But assuming all is equally fitted, the Drivers should be incredibly close on good strikes. Even on mishits, to be honest.

[Red4282]

Man some of u guys got way too much time on your hands...need some warmer weather and get out there and play! That being said most equipment in the last 5 years is so marginally close to each other. 10 yards is a bold claim which isnt likely happening. However in txgs latest video they showed how 1mph ball spead increase can mean up to 9 yards for a guy with high 170 ball speeds( handful of players i know...) so while it is POSSIBLE to gain ten, for most of us few yards is all we would likely see IF there were any gains at all.

[bobcat]

How do you measure success with a Driver vs How should it be measured?

 

- The first key to success is finding a driver that provides 'the highest AVERAGE driving distance', which is probably NOT the one you hit the longest on 'best hits'.

 

- The second criterion is finding a driver that enables you to 'increase the percentage of fairways hit'

 

These are the proper (2) ways to measure your success with any driver!... :yes:

 

Keep both those things in mind when driver shopping if indeed your ultimate goal is to play your best golf!

 

 

:golfer:

[nsxguy]

ALL the rest, ANY distance difference, is based on launch conditions. Get the same launch angle and spin rate and 2 drivers with the same ball speed will go the SAME distance.

True, but someone might be more comfortable looking down at / swinging a particular Driver over another. Having more confidence standing over the Driver is a big deal to how you release the club.

 

With that said, roughly all the Drivers on the market in the last few years should produce very similar numbers when fitted properly. And by fitted properly I mean the right head / shaft combo. Given different head weights, a particular shaft may work better in one head and not the other. But assuming all is equally fitted, the Drivers should be incredibly close on good strikes. Even on mishits, to be honest.

 

No argument.

 

Clearly player preferences have to do with the success or failure of their using a particular club.

 

And length, of course, isn't the sole reason for buying any club,,,,,,,,,,,,,