LIV Tour Discussion Thread (*** NO POLITICS ***)

[notsohard]

53 minutes ago, leezer99 said:

No offense but who watches golf at all anymore? I have the pga tour on Thursday and Friday with no volume while I’m working. Saturday and Sunday I’m usually doing stuff. If there are guys I like that are in contention I’ll check the app periodically. But in no way is watching golf a priority. I’d rather be at the club playing. 

You have a point. LIV is accessible in your own time on their app. PGAT is interesting on Sundays. That's it. eg: as of now, if Dahmen starts climbing the ladder on Sunday, it will be worth watching. The rest is meh. 

[BlackDiamondPar5]

12 hours ago, CDM said:

 

What have they gotten wrong is the counter?  Everyone keeps talking golf and one day it will sink this is business.

 

I honestly don't like either now as noted prior but I do find it interesting how from a business side that PIF has played this. 

 

Risky...!!! It ls a hefty gamble ....like playing poker.  PGAT has $1000 in chips and PIF  has $10 Million.  PGAT has 4 of a kind....LIV hoping on the river to hit a straight flush....!  Yet seeming to stack the deck in favor.

 

Still TBD on a final deal but since LIV started. In the current 2.5-3.0 year process they sure seem to be closer to what they want.... 

 

1. No one on here said they would ever sign top players. Everyone said they would never last more than a year.  No LIV player would win a major as they are "washed" up....

 

2. One year after "We will NEVER talk to the PIF" Tv speach at the CAN Open by Jay.... we have the shocking  announcement of frame work deal that even the players had no knowledge of....which is sad honestly 

 

3. We have PGAT players openly stating they dont have trust for Jay.  He needs to "own" his actions.  Creating a bad image 

 

4. Jay telling everyone that the SSG deal was needed to keep the PGAT  moving as they could not survive the structure they set up fiscally.  More so the SSG deal WAS done with the PIF planned to be part of it.

 

LIV  response every time is what they have done wrong is "waste money".  That's really it ....though mainly about the $$$$$ spent there is a number of don't like the product.  

 

Does anyone really think PIF did not know what it would cost or time to get some form of what they wanted?

 

Hide sight is always 20/20 but it was crystal clear they were not going away. 

 

Jay ignored them and they used $$$$ to leverage it all and many can say they wasted the $$$$ but this is a corporate game.... not golf. 

 

I would advise if think that is wrong then take some college business classes.....this has been economics 101.

And yet liv has zero traction. Each time they throw money around it might, at best be a temporary bump. Just look at the numbers I've posted in the charts. Their claim of 4.5M viewers on Caffeine was an outright lie. I posted  that proof also. 

 

Again other than having a bottomless pit of money enabling liv to throw good money after bad, just what are they doing that's good? If there was something compelling there we'd see some growth. Yet despite all the FREE ways to view the product it's really getting nowhere. 

Edited Sunday at 03:56 AM by BlackDiamondPar5

[idrive]

4 hours ago, notsohard said:

You have a point. LIV is accessible in your own time on their app. PGAT is interesting on Sundays. That's it. eg: as of now, if Dahmen starts climbing the ladder on Sunday, it will be worth watching. The rest is meh. 

 

You left out "IMO". I certainly don't feel that way.

 

 

 

.

 

 

Edited Sunday at 07:23 AM by idrive

[CDM]

7 hours ago, Ghost of Snead said:

7 hours ago, Ghost of Snead said:

 

Generalize much ?  Statements like this stop me from taking anything in your post seriously. 

 

 

You have been in this thread since the start.  No generalization at all.

[fbjim]

Quote

 

The Tacoma News Tribune reported on Friday that Pierce County executive counsel Don Anderson confirmed that a marketing agency, Performance 54, that represents LIV Golf asked to have a meeting with Pierce officials, and that they are open to such a talk.

“LIV has its own issues, though, golf politics, world politics-wise. You have to be careful there,” Anderson told the News Tribune. “They throw a great party, though. Fifty-four golfers, 54 holes, shotgun start. You generate $5 million or so in concession and merchandise sales. From that aspect, they’re very attractive. If they follow up with their indirect inquiry, we’ll listen.”

 

 

I don't doubt that there's a chance this happens, but to me, this also reads like a "we are open to offers" to the USGA/PGAT. Given that a) Chambers was probably built, at least partially, to host majors, and b) the USGA just published a list of the next like, 50 major sites which didn't include Chambers, you can imagine them being miffed. 

 

One of the more frustrating rumors that constantly get brought up about PGAT golf in the PNW is that - by rumor, there's a political issue where one of the best attended Champions Tour events is in Snoqualmie, and apparently they don't want to give that up and compete with a PGAT event there. Even though, the fact that they have a well-attended Champions Tour event should be evidence that the region would support a professional golf event.  

 

 

Edited Sunday at 07:11 AM by fbjim

[CDM]

3 hours ago, BlackDiamondPar5 said:

And yet liv has zero traction. Each time they throw money around it might, at best be a temporary bump. Just look at the numbers I've posted in the charts. Their claim of 4.5M viewers on Caffeine was an outright lie. I posted  that proof also. 

 

Again other than having a bottomless pit of money enabling liv to throw good money after bad, just what are they doing that's good? If there was something compelling there we'd see some growth. Yet despite all the FREE ways to view the product it's really getting nowhere. 

 

Hahahaha right to the money aspect again.  

 

Why so hung up on view count?  Like that matters at this point.  The money spent is "leverage" and based on how it has gone so far it seems to be working.

 

Still TBD if it will ultimately work but to date is has from what we see / hear.  Sure could go away if no deal but that is business.

 

As to views for top pro golf, minus Majors...it is pretty boring to watch currently.  The numbers are down across the board.

[bscinstnct]

8 hours ago, notsohard said:

You have a point. LIV is accessible in your own time on their app. PGAT is interesting on Sundays. That's it. eg: as of now, if Dahmen starts climbing the ladder on Sunday, it will be worth watching. The rest is meh. 

 

While a big deal is being made out of “big names” and impact on ratings, it’s the 

 

Silent Majority 

 

of golf fans that are keeping the ship steady. 
 

We forget that, while there is a contingent of fans that watches when “big names” are if the field, there is a far larger/large majority of fans who tune in for other reasons. 
 

Those fans and those “reasons” are what LIV has made such a miscalculation on. 
 

I admit that I’m far more inclined to watch golf when big names are in the field. But if a harken back to when I was a kid, I’d watch sports in a much more “holistic” way. 
 

Obviously, there’s a lot more to a sports audience than just the flash of a few big names 

 

https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2024/06/copa-america-ratings-nascar-f1-olympic-trials-pga-tour/

[fowlerscousin]

Michael block to play in liv feeder event this fall. Dufner made a similar commitment last year and then backed out.

[Rapidcat]

Just now, fowlerscousin said:

Michael block to play in liv feeder event this fall. Dufner made a similar commitment last year and then backed out.

 

Duffner played in the LIV Q school event (can't remember it's official name) for qualification for this season's LIV.

 

He didn't qualify but he did play - I watched him.

[Shilgy]

7 hours ago, CDM said:

 

Hahahaha right to the money aspect again.  

 

Why so hung up on view count?  Like that matters at this point.  The money spent is "leverage" and based on how it has gone so far it seems to be working.

 

Still TBD if it will ultimately work but to date is has from what we see / hear.  Sure could go away if no deal but that is business.

 

As to views for top pro golf, minus Majors...it is pretty boring to watch currently.  The numbers are down across the board.

Possibly maybe because the PIF stated mission is to make a positive return.

 

Recent investments in NEOM and LIV certainly seem to contradict that.

[Cactus Jack]

3 hours ago, bscinstnct said:

 

While a big deal is being made out of “big names” and impact on ratings, it’s the 

 

Silent Majority 

 

of golf fans that are keeping the ship steady. 
 

We forget that, while there is a contingent of fans that watches when “big names” are if the field, there is a far larger/large majority of fans who tune in for other reasons. 
 

Those fans and those “reasons” are what LIV has made such a miscalculation on. 
 

I admit that I’m far more inclined to watch golf when big names are in the field. But if a harken back to when I was a kid, I’d watch sports in a much more “holistic” way. 
 

Obviously, there’s a lot more to a sports audience than just the flash of a few big names 

 

https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2024/06/copa-america-ratings-nascar-f1-olympic-trials-pga-tour/

[Ghost of Snead]

8 hours ago, CDM said:

 

Hahahaha right to the money aspect again.  

 

Why so hung up on view count?  Like that matters at this point.  The money spent is "leverage" and based on how it has gone so far it seems to be working.

 

Still TBD if it will ultimately work but to date is has from what we see / hear.  Sure could go away if no deal but that is business.

 

As to views for top pro golf, minus Majors...it is pretty boring to watch currently.  The numbers are down across the board.

 

And the ESPY for biggest LIV shill goes to ....

[Cactus Jack]

25 minutes ago, Shilgy said:

Possibly maybe because the PIF stated mission is to make a positive return.

 

Recent investments in NEOM and LIV certainly seem to contradict that.

 

Wrong. Go read. 

[BlackDiamondPar5]

8 hours ago, CDM said:

 

Hahahaha right to the money aspect again.  

 

Why so hung up on view count?  Like that matters at this point.  The money spent is "leverage" and based on how it has gone so far it seems to be working.

 

Still TBD if it will ultimately work but to date is has from what we see / hear.  Sure could go away if no deal but that is business.

 

As to views for top pro golf, minus Majors...it is pretty boring to watch currently.  The numbers are down across the board.

You're not answering the question. Again, what's LIV goals and what have they done successfully toward achieving those goals? 

 

As for the numbers, 30% of pgat viewing is now done via streaming that is not counted in the ratings process. Regardless they haven't gone to LIV.

 

There have been many close tournaments and even me, a person that watches little golf, has been tuning in on Sunday afternoon. PGAT is looking good right now. 

Edited Sunday at 03:42 PM by BlackDiamondPar5

[bscinstnct]

6 minutes ago, Cactus Jack said:

 

 

Sure but wherever viewers have gone 

 

they haven’t gone to LIV ; )

 

Thats the insidious thing about liv, just takes guys and puts them in a vacuum for no one to see. 
 

Pure destruction of value to the sport for fans. Just a money transfer to make a handful of golfers rich at the expense of golf fans smh

 

 

 

 

[subrew]

Oh yeah, another page talking about TV ratings.  

[Shilgy]

51 minutes ago, Cactus Jack said:

 

Wrong. Go read. 

Why don’t you tell us then?  Did they go into golf thinking it would be this poorly accepted?  Did they release grandiose plans for the Line and then already announce it would be scaled back due to costs?

[bscinstnct]

1 hour ago, Shilgy said:

Why don’t you tell us then?  Did they go into golf thinking it would be this poorly accepted?  Did they release grandiose plans for the Line and then already announce it would be scaled back due to costs?

 

You just don’t get it 

 

No matter what, SA wins 

 

Just ask DJ 🤣

 

Here’s a guy we all used to love to see in the field. 
 

Now?

 

Nobody heard of him. 
 

Thats #winning 

[fowlerscousin]

Richard bland about to win liv golfs 3rd major this year

[Shilgy]

1 hour ago, fowlerscousin said:

Richard bland about to win liv golfs 3rd major this year

lol…LIV supporters now counting old guy tour wins as “majors”.🤣 

[ThinkingPlus]

27 minutes ago, Shilgy said:

lol…LIV supporters now counting old guy tour wins as “majors”.🤣 

It's also paid for optimism.  Bland is 3 back with 8 to play so he has a chance, but not real likely.

[BlackDiamondPar5]

2 minutes ago, ThinkingPlus said:

It's also paid for optimism.  Bland is 3 back with 8 to play so he has a chance, but not real likely.

I'll throw a bet on him. That'll turn him into a bogey machine 😂

[Titleist99]

29 minutes ago, Shilgy said:

lol…LIV supporters now counting old guy tour wins as “majors”.🤣 

Next, they'll be calling for Bland to be the #1 player in golf......

 

And if not the OWGR is meaningless.... 🤣

[notsohard]

17 hours ago, idrive said:

 

You left out "IMO". I certainly don't feel that way.

 

 

 

.

 

 

My bad.

[dcmidnight]

5 hours ago, subrew said:

Oh yeah, another page talking about TV ratings.  

 

LIV fans keep brining up ratings or making smart-a comments about ratings - then when you get proven wildly wrong its like oh wait, we dont want to talk about ratings lol.

 

Not even a week ago it was oh what do you think, the WNBA will outdraw LIV with a game between two losing teams? Oh right, it was the highest rated game in WNBA history.

 

But whatever.

[jimecherry]

6 hours ago, Shilgy said:

Possibly maybe because the PIF stated mission is to make a positive return.

 

Recent investments in NEOM and LIV certainly seem to contradict that.

i can think of 5 pif funded projects that have failed in the last 5 years and several of them were bigger investments than liv will ever be

[Shilgy]

14 minutes ago, jimecherry said:

i can think of 5 pif funded projects that have failed in the last 5 years and several of them were bigger investments than liv will ever be

Might be why I mentioned Neom.  Were any of your five bigger projects than that?🤔

[jimecherry]

14 minutes ago, Shilgy said:

Might be why I mentioned Neom.  Were any of your five bigger projects than that?🤔

neom's not really an investment its more a money pit like abu dahbi's man made islands. what i'm referring to are pif's foreign investments in companies that were over optimistic at best.

[Shilgy]

3 minutes ago, jimecherry said:

neom's not really an investment its more a money pit like abu dahbi's man made islands. what i'm referring to are pif's foreign investments in companies that were over optimistic at best.

I would think…but then I’m not them…..that with the oil income being a somewhat finite resource and demand will, eventually, drop the money pit would be considered a very poor use of the fund.

[fowlerscousin]

Great take by the best golf teacher in the game

https://x.com/HankHaney/status/1807562161641693575