Ball fitting in store

[streak]

Anyone try a ball fitting at a Golf Galaxy or PGA Superstore?  Comments, pro, con ... ?  Thanks.

[grochol17]

1 hour ago, streak said:

Anyone try a ball fitting at a Golf Galaxy or PGA Superstore?  Comments, pro, con ... ?  Thanks.

 

I think fitting indoors is limited... you can get ball speed, spin, and launch angle, but unless they have some other system that they use (like the Ping Ballnamic), none of the info about flight total distance it particularly accurate since indoors distance and whatnot is calculated based on a single ball trajectory model built into the launch monitor.  Plus, you can't find out anything about how the ball is going to react on short game shots. 

 

At this point if I were going to look for a new ball to play, I'd either find a place that will do ball fitting with Ballnamic or I'd try to get on a high end launch monitor to get accurate numbers for (I think driver and 7 iron) and then do the Ballnamic fitting myself to see what they recommend as the best balls for me.  Then, grab some sleeves and head to the course.

[hammergolf]

1 hour ago, streak said:

Anyone try a ball fitting at a Golf Galaxy or PGA Superstore?  Comments, pro, con ... ?  Thanks.

The most important part of ball fitting is short game. However, that’s not to say a launch monitor can’t give you a few recommendations based on your delivery. From there I would take 3 or so recommendations then test them outside on a course to see what works best for you.

[streak]

OP here.  I've been an old school "can figure it out for myself" tester, with balls I know quickly what works and doesn't work for me.  To start this season I'd like to try to get some recommendations with tech input, haven't had a serious launch monitor session in years, but know my carry distances, general spin and trajectory tendency, short game reaction to most past years balls, feel preferences.  Sounds like I could go direct for a Ballnamic online fitting without launch monitor data?  But wondering if anyone has done a GG or PGASS in person fitting ...

https://www.golfgalaxy.com/s/golf-ball-fitting

https://www.pgatoursuperstore.com/lessons-services-fittings-ball/

 

[North Butte]

I think the basic construction of the ball and the manufacturer's marketing material can tell you about 99% as much about ball performance as what you'll find out by slapping a few shots into a net at a store. All it will do is give you spin numbers, basically. All brand name modern balls are going to have good ball speed, they differ mostly in spin, flight trajectory and sound (aka "feel") off the various clubs. 

 

What an in-store fitting is most likely to do is convince one ball is best because you happen to hit 3 or 4 really good shots in a row with it. When it reality its performance is within a couple percentage points one way or the other of similar construction, similar spec other models. 

[grochol17]

21 minutes ago, streak said:

OP here.  I've been an old school "can figure it out for myself" tester, with balls I know quickly what works and doesn't work for me.  To start this season I'd like to try to get some recommendations with tech input, haven't had a serious launch monitor session in years, but know my carry distances, general spin and trajectory tendency, short game reaction to most past years balls, feel preferences.  Sounds like I could go direct for a Ballnamic online fitting without launch monitor data?  But wondering if anyone has done a GG or PGASS in person fitting ...

https://www.golfgalaxy.com/s/golf-ball-fitting

https://www.pgatoursuperstore.com/lessons-services-fittings-ball/

 

 

Just out of curiosity... what do you play now and what are you looking to improve upon?

 

And yes, you can do Ballnamic without the data... they'll ask you some questions about your game and go from there.

Edited March 4 by grochol17

[bcflyguy1]

39 minutes ago, streak said:

OP here.  I've been an old school "can figure it out for myself" tester, with balls I know quickly what works and doesn't work for me.  To start this season I'd like to try to get some recommendations with tech input, haven't had a serious launch monitor session in years, but know my carry distances, general spin and trajectory tendency, short game reaction to most past years balls, feel preferences.  Sounds like I could go direct for a Ballnamic online fitting without launch monitor data?  But wondering if anyone has done a GG or PGASS in person fitting ...

https://www.golfgalaxy.com/s/golf-ball-fitting

https://www.pgatoursuperstore.com/lessons-services-fittings-ball/

 

Some thoughts, then some questions.

Really can't do your due dilligence in a ball fitting without hitting short game shots off various lies with real turf.

Ballnamic wouldn't be a bad idea.

What ball do you play now?
What about your ball makes it your choice?
If you could improve anything about your current ball, what would it be?
When in between clubs, are you more comfortable taking the longer and bunting it or taking the shorter and squishing it?
When deviating from your stock iron or wedge, are you more comfortable taking spin off a shot or hitting a ripping fizzer?

Edited March 4 by bcflyguy1

[streak]

3 minutes ago, grochol17 said:

 

Just out of curiosity... what do you play now and what are you looking to improve upon?

 

And yes, you can do Ballnamic without the data... they'll ask you some questions about your game and go from there.

General profile: probably no more than 90mph driver ss, "normal" conditions driver carry & roll 230 max, 7i carry ~145, higher than average launch and spin, short game like moderate check and predictable release, softer feel preference.

 

Since it came out I've kept going back to Callaway Chrome Soft models.  ProV1 is good, in windier conditions will switch between ProV1 and ProV1x with great results.  Two generations ago AVX was best for overall distance but not reliable stopping on green with long clubs, didn't try last generation.  TM TP5 and TP5x spin too much off driver, TM Tour Response ok.  Most urethane cover balls are fine greenside.

 

Ideal ball profile: flattish lower trajectory off driver with some release and roll; similar off longer fairway clubs without much release when landing on green; predictable greenside performance I expect from a urethane ball; softer to medium feel; decent durability.  Planning to try sleeves of new AVX, Chrome Tour, Chrome Soft.

 

Thoughts ... ?

 

 

[streak]

20 minutes ago, bcflyguy1 said:

Some thoughts, then some questions.

Really can't do your due dilligence in a ball fitting without hitting short game shots off various lies with real turf.

Ballnamic wouldn't be a bad idea.

What ball do you play now?
What about your ball makes it your choice?
If you could improve anything about your current ball, what would it be?
When in between clubs, are you more comfortable taking the longer and bunting it or taking the shorter and squishing it?
When deviating from your stock iron or wedge, are you more comfortable taking spin off a shot or hitting a ripping fizzer?

See previous reply, plus ...

In between clubs I prefer trying to hit the shorter very solid.

Easier for me to take spin off but can add some when needed.

 

[bcflyguy1]

@streakFrom what I can gather here, Chrome Tour would be the first option I'd want you to go play followed by CTX.

[hammergolf]

1 hour ago, streak said:

OP here.  I've been an old school "can figure it out for myself" tester, with balls I know quickly what works and doesn't work for me.  To start this season I'd like to try to get some recommendations with tech input, haven't had a serious launch monitor session in years, but know my carry distances, general spin and trajectory tendency, short game reaction to most past years balls, feel preferences.  Sounds like I could go direct for a Ballnamic online fitting without launch monitor data?  But wondering if anyone has done a GG or PGASS in person fitting ...

https://www.golfgalaxy.com/s/golf-ball-fitting

https://www.pgatoursuperstore.com/lessons-services-fittings-ball/

 

I’m a big fan of the Balnamic app since it’s completely data based and objective. You can do it with or without data, however if you can use your launch monitor data you may get a slightly more accurate recommendations. 

[grochol17]

51 minutes ago, streak said:

General profile: probably no more than 90mph driver ss, "normal" conditions driver carry & roll 230 max, 7i carry ~145, higher than average launch and spin, short game like moderate check and predictable release, softer feel preference.

 

Since it came out I've kept going back to Callaway Chrome Soft models.  ProV1 is good, in windier conditions will switch between ProV1 and ProV1x with great results.  Two generations ago AVX was best for overall distance but not reliable stopping on green with long clubs, didn't try last generation.  TM TP5 and TP5x spin too much off driver, TM Tour Response ok.  Most urethane cover balls are fine greenside.

 

Ideal ball profile: flattish lower trajectory off driver with some release and roll; similar off longer fairway clubs without much release when landing on green; predictable greenside performance I expect from a urethane ball; softer to medium feel; decent durability.  Planning to try sleeves of new AVX, Chrome Tour, Chrome Soft.

 

Thoughts ... ?

 

 

 

I'm probably not the best at offering suggestions since I've only been playing the AVX and Pro V1 recently.  But, from what you describe, it sounds like the AVX is a great ball for you to try.  I found the 2022 version to have greenside spin that was pretty close to the Pro V1 and, my limited testing of the 2024 suggests that it is pretty similar to the 2022.  I've read good things on here about the new Callaway balls, but I think they are all higher trajectory than the AVX.

 

Side note... I'm not sure if Ballnamic has all of the newest balls in their database yet, since they don't publish a list of what exactly what they've tested so far.

[streak]

5 minutes ago, grochol17 said:

 

I'm probably not the best at offering suggestions since I've only been playing the AVX and Pro V1 recently.  But, from what you describe, it sounds like the AVX is a great ball for you to try.  I found the 2022 version to have greenside spin that was pretty close to the Pro V1 and, my limited testing of the 2024 suggests that it is pretty similar to the 2022.  I've read good things on here about the new Callaway balls, but I think they are all higher trajectory than the AVX.

 

Side note... I'm not sure if Ballnamic has all of the newest balls in their database yet, since they don't publish a list of what exactly what they've tested so far.

I'm planning on trying a sleeve of the new AVX, it will be a winner for me if a) continues to have improved roll out off driver for me, b) greenside performance is similar to most any urethane cover ball, don't know if the new construction will make any noticeable difference, and most importantly c) long clubs from fairway will reliably stop within a reasonable distance when landing on green as opposed to once in a while jumping off the back side, at my swing speed I am using hybrids and fairway metals frequently to reach longer par fours, and I am pretty good in that 165 to 195 range in hitting a green surface more often than not.

[Lobby]

1 hour ago, streak said:

General profile: probably no more than 90mph driver ss, "normal" conditions driver carry & roll 230 max, 7i carry ~145, higher than average launch and spin, short game like moderate check and predictable release, softer feel preference.

 

Since it came out I've kept going back to Callaway Chrome Soft models.  ProV1 is good, in windier conditions will switch between ProV1 and ProV1x with great results.  Two generations ago AVX was best for overall distance but not reliable stopping on green with long clubs, didn't try last generation.  TM TP5 and TP5x spin too much off driver, TM Tour Response ok.  Most urethane cover balls are fine greenside.

 

Ideal ball profile: flattish lower trajectory off driver with some release and roll; similar off longer fairway clubs without much release when landing on green; predictable greenside performance I expect from a urethane ball; softer to medium feel; decent durability.  Planning to try sleeves of new AVX, Chrome Tour, Chrome Soft.

 

Thoughts ... ?

 

 

The real shame about this is all the $ you (and we) spend on experimentation 

 

Of course, the ball manufacturers change the balls every year to keep us in that experimentation cycle

[phizzy30]

3 hours ago, streak said:

General profile: probably no more than 90mph driver ss, "normal" conditions driver carry & roll 230 max, 7i carry ~145, higher than average launch and spin, short game like moderate check and predictable release, softer feel preference.

 

Since it came out I've kept going back to Callaway Chrome Soft models.  ProV1 is good, in windier conditions will switch between ProV1 and ProV1x with great results.  Two generations ago AVX was best for overall distance but not reliable stopping on green with long clubs, didn't try last generation.  TM TP5 and TP5x spin too much off driver, TM Tour Response ok.  Most urethane cover balls are fine greenside.

 

Ideal ball profile: flattish lower trajectory off driver with some release and roll; similar off longer fairway clubs without much release when landing on green; predictable greenside performance I expect from a urethane ball; softer to medium feel; decent durability.  Planning to try sleeves of new AVX, Chrome Tour, Chrome Soft.

 

Thoughts ... ?

 

 

Try Chrome Tour.  It's lower launching and lower spinning with adequate green side spin.  I was amazed by how much they improved upon it compared to the Chrome Soft line. 

Edited March 4 by phizzy30

[vvictoryy]

Once you start playing a more premium ball (pro v1, chrome tour, etc), how big of a difference is there tangibly in the performance? And is it still true that we should fit from green to tee?

[Jeff58]

47 minutes ago, victorjckim said:

Once you start playing a more premium ball (pro v1, chrome tour, etc), how big of a difference is there tangibly in the performance? And is it still true that we should fit from green to tee?

The predominant ball characteristic is compression. The result of changing compression is predominantly to change trajectory. Trajectory is a combination of launch angle and spin. Lower compression launches higher and spins less.

 

At the extremes of compression, there is a much greater range of performance. The Chrome Soft, AVX, and BRX are quite different on the low end, and the V1x, -V1x, 2019 TP5X, 2021 TP5X on the high end are good examples. In the Standard Tour (V1) range, there really is not a lot the manufacturers can do to differentiate them without negative consequences. The result has been the justified popularity of the Vice Pro, Maxfli Tour, and similar.

 

For fitting, the best balls for chipping tend to be surlyn models or range balls, since their launch angle advantage more than makes up for the lack of spin. In the distance range where stopping power is the most important factor between models, the high compression models, the V1x being the classic example, are inevitably superior.

 

If you follow the “traditional approach”, you should use last year’s Chrome Soft, because it feels better for putting and chipping. That its actual performance may be compromised is irrelevant. If the above is true, why would manufacturers prescribe this approach? Because feel is something that a customer can easily understand and differentiate. Balls are all the same size and weight, and mostly white. As with car sales, the salesperson’s key role is to have the customer focus down to a particular unit.

[cgasucks]

Indoor ball fitting is like playing Need For Speed or Gran Turismo in order to test drive a car before you buy it.  It isn't the same, especially on the short game.

Edited March 5 by cgasucks

[grochol17]

1 hour ago, victorjckim said:

Once you start playing a more premium ball (pro v1, chrome tour, etc), how big of a difference is there tangibly in the performance? And is it still true that we should fit from green to tee?

 

The argument for fitting from green to tee is that everyone has specific shots that they like to hit around the green.  You need your ball to perform well in those shots and there's a limit to how much you can change your wedge set up to affect those shots.  For example, if you like to hit low spinners, but try to play with a Pinnacle, swapping out shafts or changing wedge design isn't going to suddenly make the Pinnacle spin. 

 

Once you find the ball that works for you around the green, if you find that something is a little bit off on tee shots, you might able able to tweak your driver set up a bit to compensate... if the ball is spinning to much, maybe you can go to a low spin head, or loft down, change shafts etc.  Is this guaranteed to work for everyone?  No.  But, the additional degrees of freedom with the driver is why some people like to fit that last.

 

To your last question about difference in performance, it depends on your game.  If you deliver the club to the ball somewhat consistently, then you might see a difference between balls in terms of spin and flight.  For example, I hit the ball high with lots of spin and can definitely tell a difference between the Pro V1x and AVX, with the AVX flying lower with less spin.  I don't see a ton of difference between the Pro V1 and AVX, with the Pro V1 flying a tiny bit higher and with a bit more spin.  Around the greens I can see some differences in spin, but they are all somewhat similar.  If, on the other hand, someone is very inconsistent in their contact, they might have a hard differentiating between golf balls since their variance in impact conditions would probably override any differences between balls.

[phizzy30]

2 hours ago, victorjckim said:

Once you start playing a more premium ball (pro v1, chrome tour, etc), how big of a difference is there tangibly in the performance? And is it still true that we should fit from green to tee?

You start seeing a bigger difference in performance for tour balls the better ball striker you are, IMO.  The popular thing to do is to fit from green to tee, however, it's really an individual thing.  I have to play a firm ball.  It also has to fit my launch window for driver and irons with enough spin.  I can always adjust for more or less roll out around the greens depending on the ball.   

[vvictoryy]

12 hours ago, grochol17 said:

 

The argument for fitting from green to tee is that everyone has specific shots that they like to hit around the green.  You need your ball to perform well in those shots and there's a limit to how much you can change your wedge set up to affect those shots.  For example, if you like to hit low spinners, but try to play with a Pinnacle, swapping out shafts or changing wedge design isn't going to suddenly make the Pinnacle spin. 

 

Once you find the ball that works for you around the green, if you find that something is a little bit off on tee shots, you might able able to tweak your driver set up a bit to compensate... if the ball is spinning to much, maybe you can go to a low spin head, or loft down, change shafts etc.  Is this guaranteed to work for everyone?  No.  But, the additional degrees of freedom with the driver is why some people like to fit that last.

 

To your last question about difference in performance, it depends on your game.  If you deliver the club to the ball somewhat consistently, then you might see a difference between balls in terms of spin and flight.  For example, I hit the ball high with lots of spin and can definitely tell a difference between the Pro V1x and AVX, with the AVX flying lower with less spin.  I don't see a ton of difference between the Pro V1 and AVX, with the Pro V1 flying a tiny bit higher and with a bit more spin.  Around the greens I can see some differences in spin, but they are all somewhat similar.  If, on the other hand, someone is very inconsistent in their contact, they might have a hard differentiating between golf balls since their variance in impact conditions would probably override any differences between balls.

Can I ask what ball you play? I generally tend to also hit the ball pretty high (especially driver) and with a moderate amount of spin. I’ve played the vice pro plus for almost a year but just picked up some chrome tour X to try (after a Callaway driver fitting the other day). The fitter was saying that they spin just that bit extra on the greens vs. his previous choice of ball in the chrome soft x ls. I’ve tried the AVX balls only once but can’t remember much in detail besides them launching lower.

[vvictoryy]

10 hours ago, phizzy30 said:

You start seeing a bigger difference in performance for tour balls the better ball striker you are, IMO.  The popular thing to do is to fit from green to tee, however, it's really an individual thing.  I have to play a firm ball.  It also has to fit my launch window for driver and irons with enough spin.  I can always adjust for more or less roll out around the greens depending on the ball.   

By adjusting does that mean changing the types of shots you play around the greens?

[phizzy30]

4 hours ago, victorjckim said:

By adjusting does that mean changing the types of shots you play around the greens?

Either changing the type of shot or landing the ball shorter to allow for more roll out. 

[phizzy30]

5 hours ago, victorjckim said:

Can I ask what ball you play? I generally tend to also hit the ball pretty high (especially driver) and with a moderate amount of spin. I’ve played the vice pro plus for almost a year but just picked up some chrome tour X to try (after a Callaway driver fitting the other day). The fitter was saying that they spin just that bit extra on the greens vs. his previous choice of ball in the chrome soft x ls. I’ve tried the AVX balls only once but can’t remember much in detail besides them launching lower.

Vice Pro Plus is in my rotation of balls I play.  They tend to launch on the lower side and are low spin comparatively speaking to other tour balls, IMO.  Reminds me of the '19 TP5x.  CTX is a really good ball but do spin more than Pro Plus especially around the greens.  Have you tried the new TP5x?  It launches higher than Pro Plus but spins less than the CTX.  I found it to be a good tweener between the two balls.  It's what I'm currently playing.  Oh and welcome to the forum, fellow Korean.    

Edited March 6 by phizzy30

[grochol17]

8 hours ago, victorjckim said:

Can I ask what ball you play? I generally tend to also hit the ball pretty high (especially driver) and with a moderate amount of spin. I’ve played the vice pro plus for almost a year but just picked up some chrome tour X to try (after a Callaway driver fitting the other day). The fitter was saying that they spin just that bit extra on the greens vs. his previous choice of ball in the chrome soft x ls. I’ve tried the AVX balls only once but can’t remember much in detail besides them launching lower.

 

I've been switching back and forth between the '22 AVX and Pro V1 (both in yellow).  The AVX is a tiny bit better fit for me because of the lower ball flight, but I was having trouble finding them near me so I ended up playing the V1 some, too.  For me, they are pretty similar.  Generally the AVX flies a bit lower and has a tiny bit less spin, but it isn't much... like on a 3/4 wedge the V1 will hit, take one hop and stop, while the AVX would hit, take one hop and roll one foot.  Distances on my irons were identical.  I haven't had the chance to do too much with the '24 AVX, but in my limited testing it seems pretty similar to the '22, so I'll give them a go when the weather improves. 

[vvictoryy]

7 hours ago, phizzy30 said:

Vice Pro Plus is in my rotation of balls I play.  They tend to launch on the lower side and are low spin comparatively speaking to other tour balls, IMO.  Reminds me of the '19 TP5x.  CTX is a really good ball but do spin more than Pro Plus especially around the greens.  Have you tried the new TP5x?  It launches higher than Pro Plus but spins less than the CTX.  I found it to be a good tweener between the two balls.  It's what I'm currently playing.  Oh and welcome to the forum, fellow Korean.    

I need to try the 24 TP5x! I just recently tried the TP5 but the 21 version, first time trying a TP5 of any kind. Felt like it killed my distance vs. the pro plus and I didn’t notice a big enough difference on the greens. I was about to ask how you knew I was Korean but I forgot that was my username  😂

[vvictoryy]

4 hours ago, grochol17 said:

 

I've been switching back and forth between the '22 AVX and Pro V1 (both in yellow).  The AVX is a tiny bit better fit for me because of the lower ball flight, but I was having trouble finding them near me so I ended up playing the V1 some, too.  For me, they are pretty similar.  Generally the AVX flies a bit lower and has a tiny bit less spin, but it isn't much... like on a 3/4 wedge the V1 will hit, take one hop and stop, while the AVX would hit, take one hop and roll one foot.  Distances on my irons were identical.  I haven't had the chance to do too much with the '24 AVX, but in my limited testing it seems pretty similar to the '22, so I'll give them a go when the weather improves. 

Idk if you’ve mentioned it but how is the AVX off the tee? More specifically interested in its distance compared to pro v1 and also vs. something harder like a vice pro plus or a Bridgestone B X.

[grochol17]

42 minutes ago, victorjckim said:

Idk if you’ve mentioned it but how is the AVX off the tee? More specifically interested in its distance compared to pro v1 and also vs. something harder like a vice pro plus or a Bridgestone B X.

 

When I did a Titleist ball fitting, the key thing that we figured out is that I hit the ball high, with a lot of spin, and I end up with a steep landing angle.  The AVX should help out with that because of it's lower spin and flatter ball flight.  I say should because I've never had the chance to hit the AVX on trackman outdoors, so I don't know for sure what happens.  To my eye, the AVX definitely flies a bit lower, but when it comes to total distance with the driver, I can't really tell a difference between the AVX and Pro V1.  This is based on on-course yardages, which can be affected by a bunch of factors other than just the ball, so it isn't the most rigorous test.  But, it isn't like I was clearly seeing 10 yards difference one way or the other.

[vvictoryy]

4 hours ago, grochol17 said:

 

When I did a Titleist ball fitting, the key thing that we figured out is that I hit the ball high, with a lot of spin, and I end up with a steep landing angle.  The AVX should help out with that because of it's lower spin and flatter ball flight.  I say should because I've never had the chance to hit the AVX on trackman outdoors, so I don't know for sure what happens.  To my eye, the AVX definitely flies a bit lower, but when it comes to total distance with the driver, I can't really tell a difference between the AVX and Pro V1.  This is based on on-course yardages, which can be affected by a bunch of factors other than just the ball, so it isn't the most rigorous test.  But, it isn't like I was clearly seeing 10 yards difference one way or the other.

That's gpod to know! Might have to give the AVX a shot (or some other similar low launching low spinning ball) just to see how it does.

[Fairways_and_Greens]

I’m lucky enough to have a GC3. My spin numbers with irons are different on course than off a mat. Beyond aerodynamics, it’s something to consider with irons and mats.