Classic wedge designs you would like to see again?

[RookieBlue7]

Auld Golf Classic II.

[professor_doom]

Grew up playing an old 485 SW. Forgot where it came from--probably was one of my father's old clubs.. It was already worn when I got it, and I played it all through high school until the grooves finally wore out. Absolutely the best SW I have ever had.

Late 50s wilson Dyna-Power(ed) wedges are something else. Crenshaw was still packing what I believe is a '58 Dyna wedge in his '95 Masters win. Pics here: http://www.golfwrx.com/forums/topic/160781-vintage-masters-witb-shots/ . I have a '90s reproduction of that wedge that plays very well, although it's no 485. Always wanted to try out an actual 50s version.

Best lob wedge I ever owned was a Cobra Greg Norman I picked up in a golf course pro-shop's used bin for five bucks. Some punk stole it at a driving range 4 months later. Always wanted to try a full set of those irons. The 588 LW I carried for years was always my least favorite club (except the 3-wood--never have found one I like. The enormous sole on it meant occasionally blading a shot or catching it thin and sending a 30-yard pitch on a 7-iron trajectory. I rarely found it worth the risk. Today, I just carry a 2-iron instead of a lob wedge.

As pitching/gap wedges go, the best I've ever encountered was what a Mac with the pro-pel 1 shaft. Came out of their custom department, with a "Custom" stamp and the logo of some country club in Kansas City on it. I gave it to my brother, who uses it as a gap wedge with a set of early 90s Mizuno blades. Says he wouldn't last a day without it, and adds it feels softer than the Mizunos.

I never understood the appeal of the Ping wedges, as I've found them to be next to worthless out of the sand. Tried switching to one in high school, and I felt like Duval on 17 at the 2000 British Open for the few rounds the experiment lasted. Different strokes for different folks, I suppose. Numerous additional strokes in my case.

[KJ25]

Personally I like Vokeys a lot but keep going back to my old Ping Eye 2s. Lately been bagging the Eye 2+ sand and Lob. They are quite forgiving for a wedge and spin rate is terrific. If you can deal with the unique looks they are hard to beat for overall performance.

[LYG]

Those Snake Eyes a poster 3 or 4 posts above were great.

They were heavy (D5 or D6) and had an S400 shaft...and were just balanced awesome. Had great feel to them.

[dalehead]

[quote name='LYG' timestamp='1295318018' post='2904518']
Those Snake Eyes a poster 3 or 4 posts above were great.

They were heavy (D5 or D6) and had an S400 shaft...and were just balanced awesome. Had great feel to them.
[/quote]

Another vote for the Snake Eyes #11 56 degree. The original Ernie Vandersen production, not what is currently offered by Golf Smith.

[knh555]

I have Hogan K-Grind Special 56 and 62 wedges from around 1990 or so that still have some life in them. I really love the bounce and feel I have the relief that I need int he right places to play a variety of shots. I still hit that 56 better out of the sand than my Carnoustie and Ping wedges.

Does anyone know what the K in "K-Grind" is? Tom Kite, perhaps?

[Texsport]

I've got at least 1 copy of every wedge mentioned in my club bins. I agree that the original Ernie Vaderson Snake Eyes were the highest quality and great wedges.I once tried to negotiate a distributor contract for his wedges in Japan, so I've got some of the very first products he made.

Overall, of course, different favorite wedges reflect slightly different playing techniques and playing conditions.

For instance,the Trusty Rusty wedges had really soft shafts and huge bounce angles, designed for playing Phil Rodgers' style pitch, sand, and lob shots.

I believe that the new groove rules have caused all the wedge manufacturers to retool and that has reduced the assortment of wedges available at retail. the economy has also played a huge part in this.

As to favorites, I think, (1) you've got to match your technique to the wedge, and (2) a study of grinds used by great wedge players is a good starting point.

Texsport

[dalehead]

[quote name='knh555' timestamp='1297266197' post='2962733']
Does anyone know what the K in "K-Grind" is? Tom Kite, perhaps?
[/quote]

Yes

[nitram]

[quote name='justaman5' timestamp='1239312607' post='1617677']
1986 ping eye 2 becu sand wedge with real square grooves and a 57.5 degrees of loft
[/quote]

ABSOLUTELY !!!

[pueblo]

[size="3"][color="#0000ff"]PW...Hogan BH-5 Offset 46.5*
GW...Maruman M-ProSeries 49*
SW...still auditioning
LW....Feel 64*

I'd like to test drive an old Wilson SW...F-17 or F-51.[/color][/size]

[Ogre41]

So what is the advantage of the round head shape vs the teardrop favored today? I have an old R20 that I threw in my retro bag and I am curious at what the selling points of that wedge were. I haven't hit it yet (kind of chicken s to hit the retro bag) so I haven't a clue. As to a wedge I am partial too, I like my 54 degree Iwedge out of the fairway, but that thing is triflin out of the sand. For sand, my favorite was a Tour Edge MB 5612. I used it one summer and my bunker play was the best it's ever been (so was the rest of my play though, I don't play as much as I did then). Niether is classic, but I haven't I don't remember ever seeing anything other than a teardrop shape since I started playing.

[Staffer]

[quote name='knh555' timestamp='1297266197' post='2962733']
I have Hogan K-Grind Special 56 and 62 wedges from around 1990 or so that still have some life in them. I really love the bounce and feel I have the relief that I need int he right places to play a variety of shots. I still hit that 56 better out of the sand than my Carnoustie and Ping wedges.

Does anyone know what the K in "K-Grind" is? Tom Kite, perhaps?
[/quote]

I retired my K-grind Special 56 this year. It was great from bunker, but I could never hit good full shots with it. Same thing with Eye 2 SW, great from sand, and magnificent for lob shots, but just could not get any consistency with full shots. Now I play 588 53 and CG 14 56, and they are both great for full shots, but the 56 has not proven itself from the bunker for me yet.

[majic]

I think what we see today are the sale of clubs that are used on tour. the great shapes of the past are still useable today. they are just not made because people want what the pro's play. i have designed many wedges for myself and for Maxfli, Walter Hagen and other golf companies. The current HotBlade products in the UK i designed. I always loved the classic shapes and worked around these shapes and took input from tour players to get the shape, bounce and shaft right.
Until the public will take the time to find the wedge that suits their personal style of wedge play and most importantly their visual look we will only get the same shapes that the Tour plays. Tad

[wholejobs]

I think you can't beat the vintage shaped wedges especially from the sand. The more modern clubs seem to be designed more for fairway / chipping than for sand play... its so much easier playing a sand shot with an older club than with a modern variant (for us mortals at least!).
My vintage bag has 59 Dynas and the SW is great. The dual wedge is a nice short game club and provides a good combination IMHO

[TheDarkOne]

[quote name='majic' timestamp='1300853520' post='3079843']
I think what we see today are the sale of clubs that are used on tour. the great shapes of the past are still useable today. they are just not made because people want what the pro's play. i have designed many wedges for myself and for Maxfli, Walter Hagen and other golf companies. The current HotBlade products in the UK i designed. I always loved the classic shapes and worked around these shapes and took input from tour players to get the shape, bounce and shaft right.
Until the public will take the time to find the wedge that suits their personal style of wedge play and most importantly their visual look we will only get the same shapes that the Tour plays. Tad
[/quote]

Tad,
What was/is your favorite wedge material. Carbon, Stainless, BeCu, BeNi, Bronze etc?

[majic]

My favorite material to work in was carbon steel. You can weld it to add material, grind it and finish it many different ways. The double duty wedges were great clubs and we must remember the lofts of these clubs were 50-53 degrees back then. Nice. Straight leading edges with clever sole designs. Great for short shots off the fairway and around the green. One of the very best was made in the Hogan custom shop for their staff. Older sand wedges had nice rounded leading edges. Easy to play from sand. They also had good bounce. Our friend. Most people don't buy a wedge with enough bounce so when they get in the sand they can struggle. Players should think about their club lofts from the 9 iron down. If you are playing with a utility or hybrid in the long iron why do you need strong lofted irons. To me the 5 iron should be 28 and then go 4 degrees down ending with a 48 degree PW. Now you can pick real good wedges that are spaced for the course or courses you play the most. You should pick what is best for you not what the tour player is using. Search out wedges that can provide you the best scoring opportunities.
Tad

[TheDarkOne]

Thanks for the reply Tad and thanks for taking time to post here.
Since you brought it up, I have to ask, did you ever meet Hogan and if so what was that like?
I still have a set of 52,56,60 BeCu Hogan SI wedges that I drag out every now and then. Love them. You are correct, the old wedges were better for sand play and I miss the day of the 48 degree PW.
If you do have time, I would love to also hear your thoughts on cavity back lob wedges, this has always puzzled me.

[majic]

Well i never did meet Hogan. It would have been a pleasure. i did get to have a conversation with Byron Nelson and i met a lot of the players from the 60's on. A good question as to why you would make a cavity back "L" wedge. The only reason is to make a club a little bigger in size or to keep the look of set. All backs having a cavity look.
I will say this that i will always be fascinated by iron design. Tad

[Staffer]

[quote name='majic' timestamp='1300931645' post='3082661']
Well i never did meet Hogan. It would have been a pleasure. i did get to have a conversation with Byron Nelson and i met a lot of the players from the 60's on. A good question as to why you would make a cavity back "L" wedge. The only reason is to make a club a little bigger in size or to keep the look of set. All backs having a cavity look.
I will say this that i will always be fascinated by iron design. Tad
[/quote]


If you have to choose a favorite design that is not your own, which would it be?

[majic]

The Wilson Fluid Feel wedges were great and they also made a double duty. I have a few of the Wilson Sand Wedges with "fluid feel" and one that my friend Pat Lindsey won the sand save category on tour one year. Tad

[tagnut69]

I have a Titleist by Acushnet sand wegde in my bag at the moment

[Mitchell]

One of my favorite wedges of all time is the Maxfli Tad Moore "master designer" 57* in chromed carbon steel.

[golfbum9]

[quote name='maroonandwhite' timestamp='1160359452' post='303108']
It seems like all of today's popular wedge designs are converging on a single head shape. Where did variety go? I've been club obsessed for years, and I truly miss all the great wedges that have come and gone over the years. Heck, I've yet to find a replacement for the late 60's Wilson R-90 in my bag-- I would be lost without it around the greens! I'd like to hear what all of the other club gurus out there think are the best wedge head designs ever. Here are my top 5:

1) Late 60's Wilson R-90
2) 60-61 Wilson Staff Dyna-Powered
3) MacGregor Double-Duty 11 Iron (Tommy Armour)
4) Early 70's Hogan Sure-Out
5) The original Cobra "Rusty" (Okay, that's not really old, but that was a great head)

Agree/disagree? What's missing?
[/quote]


Good list. I haven't read the whole thread, but would add the 1958 Dyna-Powered Staff Sand Wedge (Best of all the Wilsons in my opinion).

Golden Ram BeCu and forged carbon Tom Watson wedges are also fantastic.

The Cleveland 485 (mentioned) and I'd include the 691 and black melonite 588.
Or the Vokey 400 series and Special Grinds as well- paticularly the 60·P

... this list should include the Ping Eye2

[xgolfx]

[quote name='golfbum9' timestamp='1318347830' post='3657185']
[quote name='maroonandwhite' timestamp='1160359452' post='303108']
It seems like all of today's popular wedge designs are converging on a single head shape. Where did variety go? I've been club obsessed for years, and I truly miss all the great wedges that have come and gone over the years. Heck, I've yet to find a replacement for the late 60's Wilson R-90 in my bag-- I would be lost without it around the greens! I'd like to hear what all of the other club gurus out there think are the best wedge head designs ever. Here are my top 5:

1) Late 60's Wilson R-90
2) 60-61 Wilson Staff Dyna-Powered
3) MacGregor Double-Duty 11 Iron (Tommy Armour)
4) Early 70's Hogan Sure-Out
5) The original Cobra "Rusty" (Okay, that's not really old, but that was a great head)

Agree/disagree? What's missing?
[/quote]


Good list. I haven't read the whole thread, but would add the 1958 Dyna-Powered Staff Sand Wedge (Best of all the Wilsons in my opinion).

Golden Ram BeCu and forged carbon Tom Watson wedges are also fantastic.

The Cleveland 485 (mentioned) and I'd include the 691 and black melonite 588.
Or the Vokey 400 series and Special Grinds as well- paticularly the 60·P

... this list should include the Ping Eye2
[/quote]

[xgolfx]

[quote name='golfbum9' timestamp='1318347830' post='3657185']
[quote name='maroonandwhite' timestamp='1160359452' post='303108']
It seems like all of today's popular wedge designs are converging on a single head shape. Where did variety go? I've been club obsessed for years, and I truly miss all the great wedges that have come and gone over the years. Heck, I've yet to find a replacement for the late 60's Wilson R-90 in my bag-- I would be lost without it around the greens! I'd like to hear what all of the other club gurus out there think are the best wedge head designs ever. Here are my top 5:

1) Late 60's Wilson R-90
2) 60-61 Wilson Staff Dyna-Powered
3) MacGregor Double-Duty 11 Iron (Tommy Armour)
4) Early 70's Hogan Sure-Out
5) The original Cobra "Rusty" (Okay, that's not really old, but that was a great head)

Agree/disagree? What's missing?
[/quote]


Good list. I haven't read the whole thread, but would add the 1958 Dyna-Powered Staff Sand Wedge (Best of all the Wilsons in my opinion).

Golden Ram BeCu and forged carbon Tom Watson wedges are also fantastic.

The Cleveland 485 (mentioned) and I'd include the 691 and black melonite 588.
Or the Vokey 400 series and Special Grinds as well- paticularly the 60·P

... this list should include the Ping Eye2
[/quote]

[xgolfx]

Has anyone ever seen an r90 STAINLESS STEEL WITH THE ORIGINAL GRIP? I have one in my attic along with a few other wedges. I


Charley Penna

[DColton]

im a young guy in his teens, probably on the wrong side of town asking my question here
but recently ive been very interested in karstens designs of the ping eye2 wedges
ive gotten over the funky look, but i was hoping to get some insight on this thread, i would love to game 3 of these as they are stated as "the best bunker wedges" by one of my favourite modern players on tour today, hunter mahan

i would love to game a 48*, 52* and 56* eye2 for consistency in my wedges but they only make them in a 54 and 60
i understand that there was no need back in the day as all the lofts are crazy jacked up nowadays, but i would love to game these and i wouldnt want just one in my bag

is there any design flaws that karsten discovered that didnt allow him to make any lower lofts?

EDIT: I want "modernized lofted" eye2 wedges bad!

[super20dan]

believe it or not my fav is from northwestern-yes northwestern! called tour choise -gary player . womens said nancy l opez very thin sole with little bounce. a true players wedge. bought one new for my wife back in late 80,s and searched for years for the mens model. very sim to the ram tom watson troon grind. best wedge desighn i have ever seen -for better players who allready know how to get out of sand. kind of odd it was by northwestern-the hackers budget club of yesterday-but this a great wedge. i have almost every wedge mentioned so far and love the old wilsons too- i have the rare double duty and triple duty fluid feel staffs of the late 50,s. one must play these to appreciate them. they have much less bounce than the sand model. i agree the snake eyes 11 is great too. they are still very common to find used here in jax fla as they were made here

[xgolfx]

[quote name='super20dan' timestamp='1318460742' post='3664983']
believe it or not my fav is from northwestern-yes northwestern! called tour choise -gary player . womens said nancy l opez very thin sole with little bounce. a true players wedge. bought one new for my wife back in late 80,s and searched for years for the mens model. very sim to the ram tom watson troon grind. best wedge desighn i have ever seen -for better players who allready know how to get out of sand. kind of odd it was by northwestern-the hackers budget club of yesterday-but this a great wedge. i have almost every wedge mentioned so far and love the old wilsons too- i have the rare double duty and triple duty fluid feel staffs of the late 50,s. one must play these to appreciate them. they have much less bounce than the sand model. i agree the snake eyes 11 is great too. they are still very common to find used here in jax fla as they were made here
[/quote]


I must be confused. It seems the folks on this thread refer to the R90. Remake. I have a stainless steel r 90 with


the now illegal reminder leather grip made in the late 1930s or possibly up to ww2

It is one of the heaviest sand clubs I have used. In fact, I almost wore out the stamp on the sole. When I get into my attic, I will post pix

Charley Penna

[rex235]

Any Wilson SW...

From the Gene Sarazen models, S20s, R90s, with "Dot Punch" faces, to the first W/S Dynapowers, both black and red button "Fluid Feel" models from '57-75, and the "Arnold Palmer" Wilson SW.

Even the Wilson R61 "Sandy Andy", and Walter Hagen Haig Ultra "Sand Iron" have their followings.

The '58 W/S Dynapower is the shape by which modern forged wedges are compared with...

The '71 Dynapower (buttonback) SW is the only club in the whole series which doesn't have "Dynapower" stamped on it.

The PING Eye 2 SW made it's impact with the Majors won by Tway, Calcavecchia and Azinger.
Of course, Phil Mickelson revived that controversy a short time ago.

Attaching his name to those Cobra "Trusty Rusty" SWs was the best thing that happened to Phil Rodgers.

And Hoganistas will swear by the "Sure Out" "Fifty three" and those KGrinds.

Did Larry Mize make his shot at the '87 Masters Playoff with a MacGregor Muirfield SW, or a PowerBilt SW?