Is the Golf Swing nothing more than a Baseball Swing...bent over..??

2

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  • golftechgolftech Members Posts: 413 ✭✭
    Sam Byrd told me this nearly 40 years ago. He made the conversion from the Yankees with Ruth and Gehrig to the Tour with Hogan and Nelson.
  • FireballerFireballer Members Posts: 386 ✭✭
    I think theyre so similar that I take my practice swings just like this to feel proper release just before the shot.



  • OrangeGravyOrangeGravy WAMembers Posts: 1,165 ✭✭
    Jeff Evans wrote:

    Parzinski wrote on Feb 21 2009, 10:44 PM:
    Hogan

    [media=]



    Ted Williams

    [media=]





    Looking at the clip of Hogan demonstrating his move...looks a lot like Williams...except in right handed...



    Is the golf swing the same as a baseball swing...with a little more bend at the waist?




    Similar in many ways. I have worked with batting instructors that say take the handle to the ball or hands to the ball let the barrel follow. I shared the Pure Ball Striker with Chili Davis at the 2008 FBR Open and I wanted to talk baseball he wanted to talk golf anyway Chili supports these concepts hands to the ball.



    Mr. Hogan was a big fan of Ted and observed Mr. Williams hitting motion for many years and noticed the similarities.



    Also, many local softball and baseball teams use the Pure Ball Striker. One fellow in a softball tournament went 26 for 28 in home runs.




    It's most often referred to keeping your hands inside the baseball. You definitely don't cast the barrel. That's something you hear dad coaches in little league tell kids
  • ShipwreckShipwreck Members Posts: 3,728 ✭✭
    I’ve played scrambles with a couple former pro and semi pro ball players. Baseball players naturally understand the golf swing as the mechanics are very similar. One guy I played with, former catcher, could hit a 3w further than I have ever seen. Couldn’t hit a straight driver to save his families life and had no touch, but his mechanics were fairly sound.

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  • bogeyprobogeypro The Original Bogeypro ClubWRX Posts: 3,230 ClubWRX
    The similarities are really the same with any hitting or throwing motion - starts from the ground up. The release in baseball is NOT similar to golf. You do no cast the bat through the hitting zone as previously stated.
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  • Petunia SprinklePetunia Sprinkle Future King of France Unregistered Posts: 5,362 ✭✭
    This is an interesting video touching on the subject (though, I suspect its creator is potentially a disgruntled fruitcake)...



    [media]



    Imagine how much the baseball swing would change were a bat shaped like a 2-by-4 with a round handle.
  • flog2flog2 Members Posts: 2,161
    just the same! bat/ball, club/ball....same end result, smash it as hard as feck and as straight as feck
  • Quick BucketQuick Bucket Members Posts: 191
    Many similarities between the two.

    RPantello wrote:

    eak185 wrote:


    If the 2 were the same, then why wasn't Hogan batting clean up for the Yankees? Great golfers can't hit a baseball to nearly the same capacity as a golf ball.




    Because one is stationary and the other is coming at 95+MPH. I think the OP was referencing the actual swing itself similar to hitting a baseball off a tee.




    The golf ball is not stationary.
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  • bladehunterbladehunter Today was a good day.... Members Posts: 25,868 ✭✭
    IH82BOGEY wrote:


    This may sound silly at first but in the golf swing the ball is in the way as the club head travels in an arc from inside to online then back to inside. You dont try to hit at the ball as the club is on the target line for just a fraction of a second. In baseball you are trying to drive the ball forward on the target line back from where it came from. I learned to play baseball years before I learned golf and have had to retrain my mind to keep from swinging down the line and flipping at the golf ball in an effort to drive it at the target line. I think the body movements are similar except way more ponounced and down the line in baseball.




    very true in the release.. You absolutely flip at or before impact with a baseball bat.. if your right hand didnt pass over your left you hit weak flairs to 1st base all day... with a proper release in golf you flip the sameway and shes heading 40 yards left of left.. Lots of similarities...But not same same
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  • Petunia SprinklePetunia Sprinkle Future King of France Unregistered Posts: 5,362 ✭✭


    Many similarities between the two.


    RPantello wrote:

    eak185 wrote:


    If the 2 were the same, then why wasn't Hogan batting clean up for the Yankees? Great golfers can't hit a baseball to nearly the same capacity as a golf ball.




    Because one is stationary and the other is coming at 95+MPH. I think the OP was referencing the actual swing itself similar to hitting a baseball off a tee.




    The golf ball is not stationary.




    Is that one of those metaphors where you imagine the club is in a state of stillness while it is the ball that moves? (I suppose you yell “ohmmmmm” instead of “fore!”, too, yeah?)
  • bogeyprobogeypro The Original Bogeypro ClubWRX Posts: 3,230 ClubWRX
    Bunch of non baseball players in here. lol



    Golf swing is more closely related to Tennis back hand than baseball. Baseball teaches knuckles to the pitcher and palms facing sky and ground through impact. Tennis has that same flat left wrist and release like golf.



    Many baseball hitters prefer a bent left arm to keep the hands closer in to the body. Golf teaches a wider arc with hands farther from you at the top.







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  • Petunia SprinklePetunia Sprinkle Future King of France Unregistered Posts: 5,362 ✭✭
    bogeypro wrote:


    Bunch of non baseball players in here. lol



    Golf swing is more closely related to Tennis back hand than baseball. Baseball teaches knuckles to the pitcher and palms facing sky and ground through impact. Tennis has that same flat left wrist and release like golf.



    Many baseball hitters prefer a bent left arm to keep the hands closer in to the body. Golf teaches a wider arc with hands farther from you at the top.




    Playing with a fairly strong grip (a more common sight these days) is similar.
  • bogeyprobogeypro The Original Bogeypro ClubWRX Posts: 3,230 ClubWRX
    edited May 17, 2018 #45

    bogeypro wrote:


    Bunch of non baseball players in here. lol



    Golf swing is more closely related to Tennis back hand than baseball. Baseball teaches knuckles to the pitcher and palms facing sky and ground through impact. Tennis has that same flat left wrist and release like golf.



    Many baseball hitters prefer a bent left arm to keep the hands closer in to the body. Golf teaches a wider arc with hands farther from you at the top.




    Playing with a fairly strong grip (a more common sight these days) is similar.




    I’m talking more of a chop down a tree with an axe type of move. That would pretty extreme, even for someone like Tommy Gainey.
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  • sigep1967sigep1967 Members Posts: 144

    IH82BOGEY wrote:


    This may sound silly at first but in the golf swing the ball is in the way as the club head travels in an arc from inside to online then back to inside. You dont try to hit at the ball as the club is on the target line for just a fraction of a second. In baseball you are trying to drive the ball forward on the target line back from where it came from. I learned to play baseball years before I learned golf and have had to retrain my mind to keep from swinging down the line and flipping at the golf ball in an effort to drive it at the target line. I think the body movements are similar except way more ponounced and down the line in baseball.




    very true in the release.. You absolutely flip at or before impact with a baseball bat.. if your right hand didnt pass over your left you hit weak flairs to 1st base all day... with a proper release in golf you flip the sameway and shes heading 40 yards left of left.. Lots of similarities...But not same same









    You need to look at some slow motion base ball swings. We call that rolling over the pitch and it goes nowhere.
  • double_ddouble_d Members Posts: 322 ✭✭
    edited May 17, 2018 #47
    eak185 wrote:


    If the 2 were the same, then why wasn't Hogan batting clean up for the Yankees? Great golfers can't hit a baseball to nearly the same capacity as a golf ball.




    Because hitting a stationary ball vs. hitting major league pitching isn't even in the same ballpark, no pun intended.



    I was a div. I college baseball player and I think the swings are very similar. Power came easy, putting however, does not.
  • bladehunterbladehunter Today was a good day.... Members Posts: 25,868 ✭✭
    edited May 17, 2018 #48
    sigep1967 wrote:


    IH82BOGEY wrote:


    This may sound silly at first but in the golf swing the ball is in the way as the club head travels in an arc from inside to online then back to inside. You dont try to hit at the ball as the club is on the target line for just a fraction of a second. In baseball you are trying to drive the ball forward on the target line back from where it came from. I learned to play baseball years before I learned golf and have had to retrain my mind to keep from swinging down the line and flipping at the golf ball in an effort to drive it at the target line. I think the body movements are similar except way more ponounced and down the line in baseball.




    very true in the release.. You absolutely flip at or before impact with a baseball bat.. if your right hand didnt pass over your left you hit weak flairs to 1st base all day... with a proper release in golf you flip the sameway and shes heading 40 yards left of left.. Lots of similarities...But not same same









    You need to look at some slow motion base ball swings. We call that rolling over the pitch and it goes nowhere.







    What took you so long ? Lol



    Think of the finish position for a correct baseball swing vs a golf swing. Now my view maybe more skewed as I am an upright player in golf. My finish is high unless im trying to hit a left running left hook. In baseball you finish around behind you. If you swing a golf club that way and release the hands it can’t help but be left of left. Also. If you hold on to the bat and do not release ( think check swing ) how can it not go to 1st base ? Maybe 2nd. In baseball you certainly should be thinking hit it with he right hand no ? In golf it’s not that way unless you intend to hit a hard draw. Orhave a super fast lower half that can clear and stay ahead of the hands. In golf the release is somewhere inbetween for Control . Driver maybe being the exception. I have to release that pretty hard to square it up.



    I agree the moves and outcomes are similar. But can’t say they are same same. Surely you aren’t saying baseball players don’t fully extend and release the trail hand ?
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  • Petunia SprinklePetunia Sprinkle Future King of France Unregistered Posts: 5,362 ✭✭
    bogeypro wrote:


    bogeypro wrote:


    Bunch of non baseball players in here. lol



    Golf swing is more closely related to Tennis back hand than baseball. Baseball teaches knuckles to the pitcher and palms facing sky and ground through impact. Tennis has that same flat left wrist and release like golf.



    Many baseball hitters prefer a bent left arm to keep the hands closer in to the body. Golf teaches a wider arc with hands farther from you at the top.




    Playing with a fairly strong grip (a more common sight these days) is similar.




    I’m talking more of a chop down a tree with an axe type of move. That would pretty extreme, even for someone like Tommy Gainey.




    Another fine move.
  • double_ddouble_d Members Posts: 322 ✭✭
    edited May 17, 2018 #50

    IH82BOGEY wrote:


    This may sound silly at first but in the golf swing the ball is in the way as the club head travels in an arc from inside to online then back to inside. You dont try to hit at the ball as the club is on the target line for just a fraction of a second. In baseball you are trying to drive the ball forward on the target line back from where it came from. I learned to play baseball years before I learned golf and have had to retrain my mind to keep from swinging down the line and flipping at the golf ball in an effort to drive it at the target line. I think the body movements are similar except way more ponounced and down the line in baseball.




    very true in the release.. You absolutely flip at or before impact with a baseball bat.. if your right hand didnt pass over your left you hit weak flairs to 1st base all day... with a proper release in golf you flip the sameway and shes heading 40 yards left of left.. Lots of similarities...But not same same




    >>You absolutely flip at or before impact with a baseball bat.. <<



    Yes, if you want to hit into a double play. That's called rolling over the ball.



    https://www.youtube....h?v=nx5WHCfSwEM





    Edit: I see someone else already referenced the term "rolling over the ball as well"
  • deadsolid...shankdeadsolid...shank ClubWRX Posts: 14,671 ClubWRX

    Jeff Evans wrote:

    Parzinski wrote on Feb 21 2009, 10:44 PM:
    Hogan

    [media=]



    Ted Williams

    [media=]





    Looking at the clip of Hogan demonstrating his move...looks a lot like Williams...except in right handed...



    Is the golf swing the same as a baseball swing...with a little more bend at the waist?




    Similar in many ways. I have worked with batting instructors that say take the handle to the ball or hands to the ball let the barrel follow. I shared the Pure Ball Striker with Chili Davis at the 2008 FBR Open and I wanted to talk baseball he wanted to talk golf anyway Chili supports these concepts hands to the ball.



    Mr. Hogan was a big fan of Ted and observed Mr. Williams hitting motion for many years and noticed the similarities.



    Also, many local softball and baseball teams use the Pure Ball Striker. One fellow in a softball tournament went 26 for 28 in home runs.




    It's most often referred to keeping your hands inside the baseball. You definitely don't cast the barrel. That's something you hear dad coaches in little league tell kids




    The only "casting of the barrel" that I've seen (from good players) is when they're completely fooled by an off speed pitch and just flip the hands and barrel in an attempt to make contact and foul it off.
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  • bogeyprobogeypro The Original Bogeypro ClubWRX Posts: 3,230 ClubWRX
    edited May 17, 2018 #52

    sigep1967 wrote:


    IH82BOGEY wrote:


    This may sound silly at first but in the golf swing the ball is in the way as the club head travels in an arc from inside to online then back to inside. You dont try to hit at the ball as the club is on the target line for just a fraction of a second. In baseball you are trying to drive the ball forward on the target line back from where it came from. I learned to play baseball years before I learned golf and have had to retrain my mind to keep from swinging down the line and flipping at the golf ball in an effort to drive it at the target line. I think the body movements are similar except way more ponounced and down the line in baseball.




    very true in the release.. You absolutely flip at or before impact with a baseball bat.. if your right hand didnt pass over your left you hit weak flairs to 1st base all day... with a proper release in golf you flip the sameway and shes heading 40 yards left of left.. Lots of similarities...But not same same









    You need to look at some slow motion base ball swings. We call that rolling over the pitch and it goes nowhere.







    What took you so long ? Lol



    Think of the finish position for a correct baseball swing vs a golf swing. Now my view maybe more skewed as I am an upright player in golf. My finish is high unless im trying to hit a left running left hook. In baseball you finish around behind you. If you swing a golf club that way and release the hands it can’t help but be left of left. Also. If you hold on to the bat and do not release ( think check swing ) how can it not go to 1st base ? Maybe 2nd. In baseball you certainly should be thinking hit it with he right hand no ? In golf it’s not that way unless you intend to hit a hard draw. Orhave a super fast lower half that can clear and stay ahead of the hands. In golf the release is somewhere inbetween for Control . Driver maybe being the exception. I have to release that pretty hard to square it up.



    I agree the moves and outcomes are similar. But can’t say they are same same. Surely you aren’t saying baseball players don’t fully extend and release the trail hand ?




    In baseball you try to hit the ball out front, so yes you do hold off the release (compared to golf). If you hit the ball as it’s crossing the plate (you swinging late or slow), you’ll hit down first base line or the dugout. To hit it left, you hit it more out front. You aren’t trying to control a face angle like in golf. It’s more about the angle and direction of the bat. Add to that, the amount of shoulder tilt based on the angle of the pitch.
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  • dapdap Members Posts: 2,557 ✭✭
    Hogan never described the golf swing as being similar to a baseball swing. He said if there was any motion in sports that it resembles is the old two handed basketball pass, from the right side of the body. Page 100 in 5 Lessons.
  • bladehunterbladehunter Today was a good day.... Members Posts: 25,868 ✭✭
    edited May 17, 2018 #54
    double_d wrote:


    IH82BOGEY wrote:


    This may sound silly at first but in the golf swing the ball is in the way as the club head travels in an arc from inside to online then back to inside. You dont try to hit at the ball as the club is on the target line for just a fraction of a second. In baseball you are trying to drive the ball forward on the target line back from where it came from. I learned to play baseball years before I learned golf and have had to retrain my mind to keep from swinging down the line and flipping at the golf ball in an effort to drive it at the target line. I think the body movements are similar except way more ponounced and down the line in baseball.




    very true in the release.. You absolutely flip at or before impact with a baseball bat.. if your right hand didnt pass over your left you hit weak flairs to 1st base all day... with a proper release in golf you flip the sameway and shes heading 40 yards left of left.. Lots of similarities...But not same same




    >>You absolutely flip at or before impact with a baseball bat.. <<



    Yes, if you want to hit into a double play. That's called rolling over the ball.



    https://www.youtube....h?v=nx5WHCfSwEM





    Edit: I see someone else already referenced the term "rolling over the ball as well"






    maybe i should say ..."feel vs real" folks.. im sure it happens post impact... but to me it feels like during ... point was the feeling of releasing a baseball swing isnt same as a golf swing , exception being driver ...maybe.







    edit... not sure why i posted to begin with.... Ill concede... SURE guys hitting a golf ball is EXACTLY like hitting a baseball ....lol...Thats why so many ex baseball players are great golfers..( score not power) .. funny thing is the only ones i can think of are ex pitchers.... and none of them can hit a lick... hmmmm
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  • AtraynAtrayn ClubWRX Posts: 2,053 ✭✭
    Similar if you compare it to a professional swing. Problem is, most people do not know how to make a proper baseball swing.
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  • sigep1967sigep1967 Members Posts: 144
    Atrayn wrote:


    Similar if you compare it to a professional swing. Problem is, most people do not know how to make a proper baseball swing.






    YES. hitting a low outside pitch correctly is almost exactly the same as the golf swing. Now if I could just figure out how to do it correctly everytime lol
  • Quick BucketQuick Bucket Members Posts: 191



    Many similarities between the two.


    RPantello wrote:

    eak185 wrote:


    If the 2 were the same, then why wasn't Hogan batting clean up for the Yankees? Great golfers can't hit a baseball to nearly the same capacity as a golf ball.




    Because one is stationary and the other is coming at 95+MPH. I think the OP was referencing the actual swing itself similar to hitting a baseball off a tee.




    The golf ball is not stationary.




    Is that one of those metaphors where you imagine the club is in a state of stillness while it is the ball that moves? (I suppose you yell "ohmmmmm" instead of "fore!", too, yeah?)




    Are you one of those who actually believes our sun arcs across the sky.
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  • Petunia SprinklePetunia Sprinkle Future King of France Unregistered Posts: 5,362 ✭✭




    Many similarities between the two.


    RPantello wrote:

    eak185 wrote:


    If the 2 were the same, then why wasn't Hogan batting clean up for the Yankees? Great golfers can't hit a baseball to nearly the same capacity as a golf ball.




    Because one is stationary and the other is coming at 95+MPH. I think the OP was referencing the actual swing itself similar to hitting a baseball off a tee.




    The golf ball is not stationary.




    Is that one of those metaphors where you imagine the club is in a state of stillness while it is the ball that moves? (I suppose you yell "ohmmmmm" instead of "fore!", too, yeah?)




    Are you one of those who actually believes our sun arcs across the sky.




    Are you one of those people who plays a lot of rounds by himself?
  • Quick BucketQuick Bucket Members Posts: 191
    No, I have a regular threesome- me, myself, and I.
    "Every battle is won before it's ever fought." -Sun Tzu
  • MountainGoatMountainGoat Mid-MarylandMembers Posts: 1,670 ✭✭
    edited May 18, 2018 #60
    bogeypro wrote:


    Bunch of non baseball players in here. lol



    Golf swing is more closely related to Tennis back hand than baseball. Baseball teaches knuckles to the pitcher and palms facing sky and ground through impact. Tennis has that same flat left wrist and release like golf.



    Many baseball hitters prefer a bent left arm to keep the hands closer in to the body. Golf teaches a wider arc with hands farther from you at the top.




    Yes, and this is what makes the golf swing so spectacularly difficult. You're being asked to hit a flat backhand down-the-line with your non-dominant arm. It takes strength and coordination that most people just don't have. Small wonder everyone comes over the top.
    Post edited by Unknown User on
  • OrangeGravyOrangeGravy WAMembers Posts: 1,165 ✭✭
    bogeypro wrote:


    sigep1967 wrote:


    IH82BOGEY wrote:


    This may sound silly at first but in the golf swing the ball is in the way as the club head travels in an arc from inside to online then back to inside. You dont try to hit at the ball as the club is on the target line for just a fraction of a second. In baseball you are trying to drive the ball forward on the target line back from where it came from. I learned to play baseball years before I learned golf and have had to retrain my mind to keep from swinging down the line and flipping at the golf ball in an effort to drive it at the target line. I think the body movements are similar except way more ponounced and down the line in baseball.




    very true in the release.. You absolutely flip at or before impact with a baseball bat.. if your right hand didnt pass over your left you hit weak flairs to 1st base all day... with a proper release in golf you flip the sameway and shes heading 40 yards left of left.. Lots of similarities...But not same same









    You need to look at some slow motion base ball swings. We call that rolling over the pitch and it goes nowhere.







    What took you so long ? Lol



    Think of the finish position for a correct baseball swing vs a golf swing. Now my view maybe more skewed as I am an upright player in golf. My finish is high unless im trying to hit a left running left hook. In baseball you finish around behind you. If you swing a golf club that way and release the hands it can't help but be left of left. Also. If you hold on to the bat and do not release ( think check swing ) how can it not go to 1st base ? Maybe 2nd. In baseball you certainly should be thinking hit it with he right hand no ? In golf it's not that way unless you intend to hit a hard draw. Orhave a super fast lower half that can clear and stay ahead of the hands. In golf the release is somewhere inbetween for Control . Driver maybe being the exception. I have to release that pretty hard to square it up.



    I agree the moves and outcomes are similar. But can't say they are same same. Surely you aren't saying baseball players don't fully extend and release the trail hand ?




    In baseball you try to hit the ball out front, so yes you do hold off the release (compared to golf). If you hit the ball as it's crossing the plate (you swinging late or slow), you'll hit down first base line or the dugout. To hit it left, you hit it more out front. You aren't trying to control a face angle like in golf. It's more about the angle and direction of the bat. Add to that, the amount of shoulder tilt based on the angle of the pitch.




    And the only way to do that and keep if fair is to have your hands inside the ball (think lag). If you flip at the ball out front it's hooked foul all day long. If you're real savvy you can hit an inside pitch up the middle or the other way keeping your hands inside the ball. Your hips also have to open in order to give your hands room to stay inside of an inside pitch.



    If you flip the barrel your gonna roll over all day and hit week ground balls. Half of which will be broken bats (if you're using wood) from cap shots. The right wrist roll over happens post contact.

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