It just me or are a lot of pros switching to Nippon Iron Shafts?

[theadvocate_ivan]

Hi Mark,

 

Where does the modus 125 stiff fits in your matrix? Thanks!

 

post#2939

 

Modus / Rifle / DG / KBS

120 R / 105 R ssx1 / 125 R ssx1 / 4.0-4.5 / R200 / KBS Tour R

120 S ssx1 / 105R / 125 R / 4.5-5.0 / R300 / C-Taper Lite R

130 R / 120 S / 125 R hsx1 / 105R hsx1 / 105S ssx1 / 125 S ssx1 / 5.0-5.4 / S200 SSx1 / C-Taper Lite R HSx1, Tour V R

120 S hsx1 / 105 S / 125 S / 5.5 / S200 / S400 ssx1 & S300 ssx1 / C-Taper R, C-Taper Lite S SSX1, KBS Tour S

120 X /105 S hsx1 / 125 S hsx1 / 125 X ssx1 / 6.0-6.4 / S300 & S400 / S200 hsx1 / C-taper S+ / KBS Tour X

130 S / 105 X /125 X / 6.3-6.8 / S400 hsx1, X100, X200 ssx1 / Tour V S hsx1

120 TX / 105 X hsx1 / 125 X hsx1 / 6.5-7.0 / X100 hsx1, X200 / C-Taper X

130 X SSx1 / 7.0-7.1 / DG Tour X7 ssx1 / Tour V 120&125 X

130 X / 7.2+ / X300, DG Tour X7 / C-Taper 130 X

 

 

ssx1 = Soft Step 1 time hsx1 = Hard Step 1 time.

Thank you, Mark! Very helpful and informative matrix you have laid out for everyone! Cheers buddy!

[theadvocate_ivan]

Hi Mark,

 

Another question. Where does the 130 stiff softstepped once falls in? I read again the matrix and the prior one you posted and could not find it. Thanks again!

[Hot Rod 71]

Thanks for the matrix, Mark. I have question.

 

How are S300/400 in the same slot as Modus 120X, C-Taper S+, and KBS Tour X? I've played all four shafts and the S300/400 are not even close in terms of stiffness to the others.

 

According to the CPM chart the S300/400 are 5.8/6.1, PX 6.0 is 6.5, C-Taper S+ are 6.7, and KBS Tour X are 7.0.

 

This is by no means an inquisition or criticism. I'm looking for an education here. I know the CPM chart may not take all factors and measurements into account.

[pitchinwedge]

Thanks for the matrix, Mark. I have question.

 

How are S300/400 in the same slot as Modus 120X, C-Taper S+, and KBS Tour X? I've played all four shafts and the S300/400 are not even close in terms of stiffness to the others.

 

According to the CPM chart the S300/400 are 5.8/6.1, PX 6.0 is 6.5, C-Taper S+ are 6.7, and KBS Tour X are 7.0.

 

This is by no means an inquisition or criticism. I'm looking for an education here. I know the CPM chart may not take all factors and measurements into account.

 

Wondering about his myself. Obviously no big deal since the matrix is just an indicator of how Mark thinks the shafts might play. Anyways, I vaguely recall S300 = Rifle 5.5?

[markheardjr]

KBS Tour X are 7.0.

 

Go home, you're drunk. KBS Tours are NO WHERE NEAR 7.0. More like 6.0. Wet noodle spinny crap. And the list is based on my personal experience using these shafts. Mostly the S and X models, and then extrapolating. Main takeaways is 120X is softer feeling than most X and C Taper S+ feels stiffer than most S.

[markheardjr]

Hi Mark,

 

Another question. Where does the 130 stiff softstepped once falls in? I read again the matrix and the prior one you posted and could not find it. Thanks again!

 

I think 130S ssx1 would fall into this line: 120 X /105 S hsx1 / 125 S hsx1 / 125 X ssx1 / 6.0-6.4 / S300 & S400 / S200 hsx1 / C-taper S+ / KBS Tour X

 

Possibly the KBS Tour X could be ssx1 in this group but honestly IMO the original KBS Tour X was soft, high launch, spinny and somewhat light. I would never call it stiffer than 6.5.

[ob1soccer]

i owned kbs tour, i agree with mark, they are probably between 5.5 and 6.0. definitely drunk

[Harob11]

So for the hardest of swingers looking to get the lowest spin and launch, the non prototype (not interested in looking for a modus proto) Modus choice would be _____________?

Thanks!

[stage1350]

Super Peening Blue X

if you have to have Modus, 120-TX

If you are willing to look for protos, C-10 is lowest launch, then 2S14

[markheardjr]

So for the hardest of swingers looking to get the lowest spin and launch, the non prototype (not interested in looking for a modus proto) Modus choice would be _____________?

Thanks!

 

Agree with Stage, Super Peening Blue X is the beefiest non-prototype Nippon shaft ever IMO. Feels heavy, hangs with any swing, knocks off spin, launches low. 125X is the same profile, but 5g lighter and a hair softer. IMO this is low/mid launch&spin for most. 130X is for beasts like Sergio Garcia, that want a little higher launch and softer feel than PX 7.0+. Key here is that the Tour130X IMO is a SPIN KILLER. So if you generate a ton of spin, and launch kind of low, ballooning shots, Tour130 might get your launch up and your spin down. Tour120TX is for very fast yet very smooth swings that want a lower flight and a softer feel. This is better for people that already hit it high launch and low spin but need a touch more spin IMO. Help keep the ball carrying and will lower the launch angle a touch for the early/mid releasers. Not sure this is for a former baseball player with forearms the size of most peoples thighs. Think of a wiry youngin with wide arc, rubber band spine and 120+ mph driver speeds.

[BearQ]

So for the hardest of swingers looking to get the lowest spin and launch, the non prototype (not interested in looking for a modus proto) Modus choice would be _____________?

Thanks!

 

Agree with Stage, Super Peening Blue X is the beefiest non-prototype Nippon shaft ever IMO. Feels heavy, hangs with any swing, knocks off spin, launches low. 125X is the same profile, but 5g lighter and a hair softer. IMO this is low/mid launch&spin for most. 130X is for beasts like Sergio Garcia, that want a little higher launch and softer feel than PX 7.0+. Key here is that the Tour130X IMO is a SPIN KILLER. So if you generate a ton of spin, and launch kind of low, ballooning shots, Tour130 might get your launch up and your spin down. Tour120TX is for very fast yet very smooth swings that want a lower flight and a softer feel. This is better for people that already hit it high launch and low spin but need a touch more spin IMO. Help keep the ball carrying and will lower the launch angle a touch for the early/mid releasers. Not sure this is for a former baseball player with forearms the size of most peoples thighs. Think of a wiry youngin with wide arc, rubber band spine and 120+ mph driver speeds.

 

Hey mark. Wondering if your qualms with the SPB are just individual. Ps I'm referencing some of your other SPB posts. I've heard it being very smooth in comparison to X100 or C taper. Some swear by it as their go to lifetime shaft even guys with modest SS numbers. It's got quite the cult following. Haven't really heard any bad things about the shaft from anyone. I've heard many complain about distance loss with the 125's.

 

You think maybe your transition just didn't suit the SPB? At 129 raw, it shouldn't feel too heavy compared to other shafts in the same category. Is it super tip heavy perhaps?

 

Thoughts? Awesome insight from you as always.

[Goldenchang]

So for the hardest of swingers looking to get the lowest spin and launch, the non prototype (not interested in looking for a modus proto) Modus choice would be _____________?

Thanks!

 

Agree with Stage, Super Peening Blue X is the beefiest non-prototype Nippon shaft ever IMO. Feels heavy, hangs with any swing, knocks off spin, launches low. 125X is the same profile, but 5g lighter and a hair softer. IMO this is low/mid launch&spin for most. 130X is for beasts like Sergio Garcia, that want a little higher launch and softer feel than PX 7.0+. Key here is that the Tour130X IMO is a SPIN KILLER. So if you generate a ton of spin, and launch kind of low, ballooning shots, Tour130 might get your launch up and your spin down. Tour120TX is for very fast yet very smooth swings that want a lower flight and a softer feel. This is better for people that already hit it high launch and low spin but need a touch more spin IMO. Help keep the ball carrying and will lower the launch angle a touch for the early/mid releasers. Not sure this is for a former baseball player with forearms the size of most peoples thighs. Think of a wiry youngin with wide arc, rubber band spine and 120+ mph driver speeds.

 

Hey mark. Wondering if your qualms with the SPB are just individual. Ps I'm referencing some of your other SPB posts. I've heard it being very smooth in comparison to X100 or C taper. Some swear by it as their go to lifetime shaft even guys with modest SS numbers. It's got quite the cult following. Haven't really heard any bad things about the shaft from anyone. I've heard many complain about distance loss with the 125's.

 

You think maybe your transition just didn't suit the SPB? At 129 raw, it shouldn't feel too heavy compared to other shafts in the same category. Is it super tip heavy perhaps?

 

Thoughts? Awesome insight from you as always.

 

I definitely saw some distance loss with the 125x. But then again, my time with them coincided with a pivot driven experiment.

 

SPB in X felt so solid AND had a real nicely balanced feel.

[NRJyzr]

So for the hardest of swingers looking to get the lowest spin and launch, the non prototype (not interested in looking for a modus proto) Modus choice would be _____________?

Thanks!

 

Agree with Stage, Super Peening Blue X is the beefiest non-prototype Nippon shaft ever IMO. Feels heavy, hangs with any swing, knocks off spin, launches low. 125X is the same profile, but 5g lighter and a hair softer. IMO this is low/mid launch&spin for most. 130X is for beasts like Sergio Garcia, that want a little higher launch and softer feel than PX 7.0+. Key here is that the Tour130X IMO is a SPIN KILLER. So if you generate a ton of spin, and launch kind of low, ballooning shots, Tour130 might get your launch up and your spin down. Tour120TX is for very fast yet very smooth swings that want a lower flight and a softer feel. This is better for people that already hit it high launch and low spin but need a touch more spin IMO. Help keep the ball carrying and will lower the launch angle a touch for the early/mid releasers. Not sure this is for a former baseball player with forearms the size of most peoples thighs. Think of a wiry youngin with wide arc, rubber band spine and 120+ mph driver speeds.

 

Hey mark. Wondering if your qualms with the SPB are just individual. Ps I'm referencing some of your other SPB posts. I've heard it being very smooth in comparison to X100 or C taper. Some swear by it as their go to lifetime shaft even guys with modest SS numbers. It's got quite the cult following. Haven't really heard any bad things about the shaft from anyone. I've heard many complain about distance loss with the 125's.

 

You think maybe your transition just didn't suit the SPB? At 129 raw, it shouldn't feel too heavy compared to other shafts in the same category. Is it super tip heavy perhaps?

 

Thoughts? Awesome insight from you as always.

 

 

SPB shafts are a couple inches shorter for each discreet length. As example, the wedge shafts are 35", while the Modus 105/120/125/130 wedge shafts are all 37", 2" longer. DG is the same. Some KBS models are even a half inch longer than that.

 

That makes the SPB heavier in their installation, less of the shaft is trimmed and "lost"

[SmoothStroker81]

is it correct to say that folks are seeing more distance from the 120X and less from the 125X? If so, how much?

[markheardjr]

So for the hardest of swingers looking to get the lowest spin and launch, the non prototype (not interested in looking for a modus proto) Modus choice would be _____________?

Thanks!

 

Agree with Stage, Super Peening Blue X is the beefiest non-prototype Nippon shaft ever IMO. Feels heavy, hangs with any swing, knocks off spin, launches low. 125X is the same profile, but 5g lighter and a hair softer. IMO this is low/mid launch&spin for most. 130X is for beasts like Sergio Garcia, that want a little higher launch and softer feel than PX 7.0+. Key here is that the Tour130X IMO is a SPIN KILLER. So if you generate a ton of spin, and launch kind of low, ballooning shots, Tour130 might get your launch up and your spin down. Tour120TX is for very fast yet very smooth swings that want a lower flight and a softer feel. This is better for people that already hit it high launch and low spin but need a touch more spin IMO. Help keep the ball carrying and will lower the launch angle a touch for the early/mid releasers. Not sure this is for a former baseball player with forearms the size of most peoples thighs. Think of a wiry youngin with wide arc, rubber band spine and 120+ mph driver speeds.

 

Hey mark. Wondering if your qualms with the SPB are just individual. Ps I'm referencing some of your other SPB posts. I've heard it being very smooth in comparison to X100 or C taper. Some swear by it as their go to lifetime shaft even guys with modest SS numbers. It's got quite the cult following. Haven't really heard any bad things about the shaft from anyone. I've heard many complain about distance loss with the 125's.

 

You think maybe your transition just didn't suit the SPB? At 129 raw, it shouldn't feel too heavy compared to other shafts in the same category. Is it super tip heavy perhaps?

 

Thoughts? Awesome insight from you as always.

I'm not meaning to come across as negative against the SPB. I would play the shaft over DG X100 or DGS400. And I do tend to like heavier shafts, more so back 8 years ago when SPB was in its prime. I played the shaft several times, to me, it is a slightly stiffer and heavier 125. For most that means a little less distance, and many report 125 being less distance already. I don't think i've seen that but I've read it a few times. My one criticism was it feels heavy, I sometimes call it "wet" and it felt a bit muted. I assume from a stiffer/heavier midsection, not as much pop. I found myself playing a lot more 3/4 shots, punches, knock downs with SPB. I got stuck a lot with the weight and feel on fuller swings.

 

SPB is still smoother feel than Ctaper or X100. I don't feel the clunk shake of Ctaper or the snap/thump of DG. It's smooth, but heavy smooth. If you want heavy, strong, controllable without boardiness, SPB is phenomenal.

 

Tour125 is SPB lite. Same profile, 5g softer. bit more kick. In between a SPO and a SPB IMO. I like it. Compared to a tour120 its going to feel heavier, probably spin a touch more. Tour120 is DGish. Tour125 is KBS Tour-ish. Tour120 softens the DG butt section for an ultra lux feel, and then beefs up mid/tip sections for lower spin. Tour125 firms up the butt for firmer feel than DG, but softens the middle for a bit more kick. Tour120 is for early/mid release. Tour125 is for mid/late release. IMO a golfer probably isn't going to like both. People that _should_ use Tour120 may see lower distance in Tour125. But vice versa, if you _should_ be in tour125, tour120 may lower distance for you. Depends on the golfer. Have to try them. And distance isn't everything. If spin and accuracy are on point, just tweak lofts strong if that is the issue or lengthen or add SW, whatever if you need to. But I'd rather hit one extra club and be closer to the pin than one less club and be all over the place. (I use tour125 and throw darts. I use tour120 and I hook to the pacific ocean. 3y shorter in 125 is not the deal breaker.)

[BearQ]

Thanks for the replies guys

[Afraid2goLow]

Sorry for not wanting to go through 113 pages but if im currently gaming some Project X 6.0 flighted and hit my 7 iron 160 should i go with the Pro Modus 120 in stiff or in xtra stiff.

[BearQ]

Sorry for not wanting to go through 113 pages but if im currently gaming some Project X 6.0 flighted and hit my 7 iron 160 should i go with the Pro Modus 120 in stiff or in xtra stiff.

 

px 6.0 flighted plays VERY different from 120. You'd have to see if it suited you at all. Flex is irrelevant before you try the profile.

[ob1soccer]

how about steelfiber 110 stiff, is that similiar to 120x

[Afraid2goLow]

Sorry for not wanting to go through 113 pages but if im currently gaming some Project X 6.0 flighted and hit my 7 iron 160 should i go with the Pro Modus 120 in stiff or in xtra stiff.

 

px 6.0 flighted plays VERY different from 120. You'd have to see if it suited you at all. Flex is irrelevant before you try the profile.

 

That is why i want to try it so badly, i found a great deal on a set and found conflicting info on whether i should get stiff or extra stiff, my swing is more sweep than it is steep and current 7 iron (35*) goes 160. Any advice would be appreciated.

[BearQ]

Sorry for not wanting to go through 113 pages but if im currently gaming some Project X 6.0 flighted and hit my 7 iron 160 should i go with the Pro Modus 120 in stiff or in xtra stiff.

 

px 6.0 flighted plays VERY different from 120. You'd have to see if it suited you at all. Flex is irrelevant before you try the profile.

 

That is why i want to try it so badly, i found a great deal on a set and found conflicting info on whether i should get stiff or extra stiff, my swing is more sweep than it is steep and current 7 iron (35*) goes 160. Any advice would be appreciated.

 

If you are set on buying the set without trying. 120X is very playable, no form of harshness. You should be okay.

[Harob11]

I had an interesting day at the range today. I pitted an Epon Personal 2 (6 iron) shafted with a Modus 120 TX flex up against a Miura MB-5003 (6 iron) shafted with a Nippon Super Peening Blue X flex. Both installed straight in, no tipping, etc. No wind, flat ground, distances marked off with a Leupold rangefinder.

 

I've always loved the SPB. Super smooth, low launch, low spin and I've always liked the Modus 120 TX but like others, I feel they launch a little high.

I've been working out really hard for about 6 weeks and I was really swinging fast today, faster than I've ben able to in about 10 years (I'm 36 now) and I was pretty shocked by the distance I was getting. I'm reluctant to even say on here because everyone thinks everyone else is full of s#&t but I was consistently 250 yards with the 6 iron. Shameless plug aside, what was really interesting is that the SPB really started to balloon at very high swing speeds whereas the Modus didn't balloon at all! The Modus just produced high soaring knuckleballs that carried forever and in fact, the SPB ended up launching higher than the Modus because of the ballooning effect. I was pretty blown away as I've never seen any ballooning out of a SPB before. Like I said, I was consistently 250 yards with the Personal 2/Modus combo and about 220 yards with the Miura/SPB combo. The Personal 2 might be a tad stronger lofted but I don't think it's overly significant. How significant is the difference between an x flex SPB and a TX Modus 120 when it comes to spin I'm not sure but my guess is not 30 yards worth. It was definitely an interesting find.

 

The one area the SPB outshone the Modus was in perceived kick and feel. They really do feel great, even on non pured strikes.

So my advice to anyone out there who can really swing it fast is to check out the Modus 120 TX even ahead of the SPB. I think you'll be pleasantly surprised. I even tested these with both a steep and flat swing. Same result.

 

Finally, if anyone is looking for blades, the Personal 2 is absolutely out of this world. It's the most playable blade I've ever hit by a mile. Dead straight. Great feel (not as good as the 302), unbelievably straight and forgiving for a blade and obviously long, too. I'm a 10 capper and I had absolutely no problem with it.

 

Anyway guys, hope this helps and feel free to chime in!

 

Rob.

[Afraid2goLow]

If you are set on buying the set without trying. 120X is very playable, no form of harshness. You should be okay.

 

its a really good deal at a local golf store which is closing sadly, if it doesnt work i have a spare set of PX shafts i can use or i can sell the clubs on ebay and should return my cost and maybe grab 50-100 in profit. However its just the stiff and not extra stiff but most likely going to pick them up this weekend and give them a try.

[Goldenchang]

I had an interesting day at the range today. I pitted an Epon Personal 2 (6 iron) shafted with a Modus 120 TX flex up against a Miura MB-5003 (6 iron) shafted with a Nippon Super Peening Blue X flex. Both installed straight in, no tipping, etc. No wind, flat ground, distances marked off with a Leupold rangefinder.

 

I've always loved the SPB. Super smooth, low launch, low spin and I've always liked the Modus 120 TX but like others, I feel they launch a little high.

I've been working out really hard for about 6 weeks and I was really swinging fast today, faster than I've ben able to in about 10 years (I'm 36 now) and I was pretty shocked by the distance I was getting. I'm reluctant to even say on here because everyone thinks everyone else is full of s#&t but I was consistently 250 yards with the 6 iron. Shameless plug aside, what was really interesting is that the SPB really started to balloon at very high swing speeds whereas the Modus didn't balloon at all! The Modus just produced high soaring knuckleballs that carried forever and in fact, the SPB ended up launching higher than the Modus because of the ballooning effect. I was pretty blown away as I've never seen any ballooning out of a SPB before. Like I said, I was consistently 250 yards with the Personal 2/Modus combo and about 220 yards with the Miura/SPB combo. The Personal 2 might be a tad stronger lofted but I don't think it's overly significant. How significant is the difference between an x flex SPB and a TX Modus 120 when it comes to spin I'm not sure but my guess is not 30 yards worth. It was definitely an interesting find.

 

The one area the SPB outshone the Modus was in perceived kick and feel. They really do feel great, even on non pured strikes.

So my advice to anyone out there who can really swing it fast is to check out the Modus 120 TX even ahead of the SPB. I think you'll be pleasantly surprised. I even tested these with both a steep and flat swing. Same result.

 

Finally, if anyone is looking for blades, the Personal 2 is absolutely out of this world. It's the most playable blade I've ever hit by a mile. Dead straight. Great feel (not as good as the 302), unbelievably straight and forgiving for a blade and obviously long, too. I'm a 10 capper and I had absolutely no problem with it.

 

Anyway guys, hope this helps and feel free to chime in!

 

Rob.

 

Jealous

[nodoubles22]

Revisiting this thread makes me want to get a backup set of the 130 Xs. Those things have transformed my iron game. The slight boost in launch finally means I have proper carry gaps in my long irons. They used to be way too close together. Now to find something that gets the driver launch up a bit but handles the SS...

[markheardjr]

Revisiting this thread makes me want to get a backup set of the 130 Xs. Those things have transformed my iron game. The slight boost in launch finally means I have proper carry gaps in my long irons. They used to be way too close together. Now to find something that gets the driver launch up a bit but handles the SS...

I have backups for backups for my 125X. I have a straight in, a hardstepped and another one too. Also ORA X's and 2S14 S's. Oddly i launch the irons fairly high and the driver pretty low. So I've been playing with putting the ball further back in my stance. May have to tweak lofts strong too. Only use 3 wedges and i feel if I tweak lofts I'll need to lose my 4i/7W option and go with another wedge. Which i don't really want to do. Currently use 46/52/56 think I may have have to switch 4-PW 2° strong and switch wedges to 44/48/52/56 to get gaping correct. Although I'm moving to Florida and I may need to switch it up to add a 60° too. Didn't need one on Kikiyu/Po in Cali, can flop and stop the 56 just fine here.

 

I feel ya on the driver swing. M1 is so low launching. I really have to tee that thing high and swing way up on the ball. I really hope the next composite one we saw pics of will launch higher.

[Bogey_Fly_By]

Revisiting this thread makes me want to get a backup set of the 130 Xs. Those things have transformed my iron game. The slight boost in launch finally means I have proper carry gaps in my long irons. They used to be way too close together. Now to find something that gets the driver launch up a bit but handles the SS...

I have backups for backups for my 125X. I have a straight in, a hardstepped and another one too. Also ORA X's and 2S14 S's. Oddly i launch the irons fairly high and the driver pretty low. So I've been playing with putting the ball further back in my stance. May have to tweak lofts strong too. Only use 3 wedges and i feel if I tweak lofts I'll need to lose my 4i/7W option and go with another wedge. Which i don't really want to do. Currently use 46/52/56 think I may have have to switch 4-PW 2° strong and switch wedges to 44/48/52/56 to get gaping correct. Although I'm moving to Florida and I may need to switch it up to add a 60° too. Didn't need one on Kikiyu/Po in Cali, can flop and stop the 56 just fine here.

 

I feel ya on the driver swing. M1 is so low launching. I really have to tee that thing high and swing way up on the ball. I really hope the next composite one we saw pics of will launch higher.

 

I will take the Ora's if you ever sell them. I have been on the lookout for those forever.

[Hot Rod 71]

KBS Tour X are 7.0.

 

Go home, you're drunk. KBS Tours are NO WHERE NEAR 7.0. More like 6.0. Wet noodle spinny crap. And the list is based on my personal experience using these shafts. Mostly the S and X models, and then extrapolating. Main takeaways is 120X is softer feeling than most X and C Taper S+ feels stiffer than most S.

 

Easy there big fella. I wasn't pissing in your corn flakes, I'm just relaying what I read in this table put together by Howard Jones. You can find the sticky thread here http://www.golfwrx.c...d-shaft-chart/.

 

 

[Rogtsaamokin66]

Great amount of info here, almost melting my mind. Have Nippons in my Bstone J15 wedges and love them. Playing DG Pro in my CB and looking to pick up a set in nippons. Undecided on HS 120S or right into 120x. Will the HS play a little softer, I assume then the X?? Also have been looking for 2 125 wedge shafts if anyone has a couple.

[MJisGOAT]

Any modus users convert to dg amt?

 

​I'm inquiring due to distance loss with the modus 125. Latest trackman results show I'm spinning my 7 iron in excess of 8k. Thinking of testing the modus 120 or dg amt to get more optimal spin rates. The KBS tour v brought the spin down to low 7k, but didn't get a chance to try that shaft in current iron heads.