Robert Garrigus

[resnor]

> @bladehunter said:

> > @MattyO1984 said:

> > > @resnor said:

> > > > @MattyO1984 said:

> > > > > @BearQ said:

> > > > > > @MattyO1984 said:

> > > > > > Each to there own I guess but smoking that rubbish at 41?! Come on man, grow up!

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > You realize it’s being used worldwide for several reasons right. Let me give you a few. Chronic pain, ptsd, anxiety, appetite loss, post surgery, anti inflam...list goes on. Doctors are actually prescribing it. Many thousands have avoided opioid usage when transition to the “rubbish”.

> > > > > Disappointing opinion. You can always go lawn bowling and play horse polo with the guys who made the rule tho

> > > >

> > > > Ha, I notice that you didn't include simply getting high as one of your brilliant reasons. I bet it does work a trick for those with appetite loss though. The diet after that packets of Doritos, Candy and Pizza right? How many thousands having ended transitioning into opioid usage after starting it?

> > >

> > > Pretty sure the research is showing that opioid Usage is going down in states with recreational marijuana. This idea that marijuana is a gateway drug is ridiculous, and it's amazing it's hung around this long.

> >

> > I don't find it ridiculous as I my day to day work involves discussions with a number of heroin addicts. Invariably, whenever discussion turns to their use of harder substances and how they came to use them, cannabis is what they first started with. Whilst it is not the case that one has to lead to the other, in the significant majority of the people I have dealt with over the last 10 years cannabis has come first.

>

>

> Lol. “But hey man. I didn’t do heroine so yea, not true. “

>

> But it’s clearly addictive if so many feel so strongly about it ? Yes ?

>

> How do we draw the line for recreational drugs ? I mean. Freedom ? Where does it start stop ? Is the line at weed. Or do we move it to pills without a script ? Or maybe on up to meth.? You can Make your own.

>

> Serious question. I know it Flames some up , but it’s the real discussion that has to be had.

>

>

>

 

Why does anyone care what someone puts in their body? I genuinely don't understand people's stance on these things.

 

[resnor]

> @bladehunter said:

> > @bodhi555 said:

> > > @bladehunter said:

> > > Question I don’t know the answer to.

> > >

> > > This hemp oil etc for pain. Is it as effective for pain etc as actual high producing pot ?

> > >

> > > It’s becoming huge apparently , my dog groomer is selling it for dogs with personality disorders etc. lol. Swear to god. Just wondered if it was same same minus the high ?

> >

> > Normal weed has 2 main ingredients, THC and CBD. THC is the one that gets you high, CBD is good for pain and other medical purposes. Chances are the oil for pain is CBD based, which you can buy legally in the shops in the UK now.

>

> Doesn’t that kill the medicinal purposes reasoning for legalization? Couldn’t you just make the oil readily available and leave the high out ?

>

 

 

No, it has to be medically legal so that you can grow it at all, I believe.

[resnor]

> @tbowles411 said:

> I just feel this: People have to pretend that this isn't addictive. It is, just like alcohol can be, though that's not illegal, but the misuse of it is. I've seen both damage the lives of people of my family. "Harmless" is a misnomer. Obviously it's an issue for Garrigus, and by all accounts, he's a nice dude. He can't handle it. This even goes deeper than that in many ways. DUI is a problem where it is legal. You smoke a couple and then jump behind the wheel and put yourself and others at risk because folks are convinced it won't hurt anyone.

 

 

It is not addictive like alcohol. You don't go through, for instance, delirium tremors if you stop smoking, like a drunk will if they give up booze. You don't go through detox when you stop using marijuana like you do with actual drugs.

 

There is so much misinformation out there, and it goes back decades to Reefer Madness.

[resnor]

> @bladehunter said:

> > @oiler45 said:

> > Exactly - I love it when drinkers lecture people on the evils of pot. If you drink booze or caffeine, in my opinion you have no basis to criticize marijuana. If you never drink or take any stimulant - fine - lecture away. And yes - you can smoke dope and not get stoned - a couple of tokes before bedtime or to unwind after work is NO different than a post-round beer or a dram of single malt.

>

>

> Lol. Caffeine? What schedule is that drug ? I used to drink 4-5 mountain dews a day. Maybe more in my early 20s. Plus coffee. I’d get so wired it was impossible to think. But I was trying to work 18 hours a day. One thanksgiving break it hit me how much I had to have that. Always had to have it on the house. I went over and poured it all out and told it to kiss my ****. Haven’t touched a soft drink with caffeine since. I will drink sprite sometimes.and I do still have coffee in the morning. My point. No way that caffeine has near the effect or hold on someone as any drug or alcohol. I didn’t even get a headache.

>

> Rediculous analogy that’s just reaching for the one paint brush that will paint 99.% of all people so you can complete the beheading of that straw man. Why not include people who eat eggs. Or milk drinkers ? Lol

>

>

>

 

First of all, it's ludicrous that marijuana is a schedule 1 drug. Look at some of the drugs it's supposedly worse than.

 

Alcohol is far more harmful in all aspects, physically, mentally, and socially than marijuana. It's funny watching people try to dictate what someone else should or should not use in their free time.

[resnor]

> @MattyO1984 said:

> > @resnor said:

> > > @MattyO1984 said:

> > > > @BearQ said:

> > > > > @MattyO1984 said:

> > > > > Each to there own I guess but smoking that rubbish at 41?! Come on man, grow up!

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > You realize it’s being used worldwide for several reasons right. Let me give you a few. Chronic pain, ptsd, anxiety, appetite loss, post surgery, anti inflam...list goes on. Doctors are actually prescribing it. Many thousands have avoided opioid usage when transition to the “rubbish”.

> > > > Disappointing opinion. You can always go lawn bowling and play horse polo with the guys who made the rule tho

> > >

> > > Ha, I notice that you didn't include simply getting high as one of your brilliant reasons. I bet it does work a trick for those with appetite loss though. The diet after that packets of Doritos, Candy and Pizza right? How many thousands having ended transitioning into opioid usage after starting it?

> >

> > Pretty sure the research is showing that opioid Usage is going down in states with recreational marijuana. This idea that marijuana is a gateway drug is ridiculous, and it's amazing it's hung around this long.

>

> I don't find it ridiculous as I my day to day work involves discussions with a number of heroin addicts. Invariably, whenever discussion turns to their use of harder substances and how they came to use them, cannabis is what they first started with. Whilst it is not the case that one has to lead to the other, in the significant majority of the people I have dealt with over the last 10 years cannabis has come first.

 

Before they used alcohol or tobacco? I mean, if we're using anecdotal evidence, I don't know anyone who's used marijuana or other drugs who didn't first start with drinking and most often smoking cigarettes.

[new2g0lf]

Steroids are legal, have many beneficial effects (if not abused) and a doctor can prescribe them but for some reason, they are frowned upon in sports.

[marmooskapaul]

 

> Guessing all the politics in this thread have been overlooked because the site has plenty of other things to worry about right now.

> This thread left the golf railroad tracks just about the time it started, lol.

>

> But interjecting a facially illegal and stupid hypothetical ("while not Apples to Apples" - pretty obviously not) into the subject is nothing more than begging for attention and trying to fan a few flames. Inappropriate and no excuse for it.

 

IDK...Although it hasn't all been about RG/Golf..it is e very topical subject that seems to involve people that golf..and visit this forum. I don't think it has gotten way off track at all. In discussions like this one...ideas and beliefs can form, change and evolve. Really think that is the best part of group forums when everybody stays civil...and I think this has been a civil conversation that involves golf.

[BNGL]

> @dropkicked said:

> > @BNGL said:

> >

> >

> > > @Roadking2003 said:

> > > > @BNGL said:

> > > > GolfWRX-The first place to come for debates on pot usage...pretty soon there will be cheech and snoop issues bongs on BST.

> > > > Regardless of where you fall on the spectrum it’s illegal according to PGA Tour policy, the players know that.

> > >

> > > That doesn't make it right. If the PGA tour banned Pepto Bismol would you think it's right?

> >

> > If the tour banned Pepto and a player was suspended for using it, would I think it’s right? Yes I would. The rules and regulations are pretty clear, and if one wishes to participate in an organizations competitions you’re subject to their rules and penalties.

>

> Just curious to know if you would agree with the PGA Tour rules if they banned all Ethnic Minorities from playing on tour?

> Ridiculous right?!

> Sometimes rules and regulations need to be updated as they become "dated".. As social norms change, it would be prudent to recognize them and hold discussions accordingly to address any gaps that may exist.

> While not Apples -Apples, a good example would be social media and how the Tour has adopted it as the medium of choice for a younger generation.

> #changeisgood

>

> I am curious to know what would happen to Pro's on the Canadian Tour?... especially those Canadians who participate. I can see legal challenges on the horizon..

 

Sure. If that’s the way they want to run their organization more power to them. Doesn’t make it right to individuals outside that organization or even in it, but if they want to run themselves as whites only and only those over 5’10” and under 207 lbs and can do it...that’s their prerogative.

My whole contention in this is that Robert was not treated unfairly per the application of the rule. He knew the rules, as does every other athlete that gets popped for violating substance abuse policies. (There’s some cases that the athlete legitimately may not know, I never reached the Tour my brother only reached AAA, my uncle and grandfather each had several major league stints, uncle by marriage played in the nfl it’s not hard to stay clean. every single one of us was told to check a list of banned substances before ever taking a product from high school through college and even at the major league level) May the rule be dated? I don’t know but I eagerly await the decision on this forum!

 

 

[bladehunter]

> @"Birdie Mac" said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > random article that showed up for my google feed thus morning. Pretty big uptick of emergency room visits cited here.

> > > >

> > > > https://gizmodo.com/why-increased-pot-use-in-colorado-is-sending-more-peopl-1833582402/amp

> > >

> > > Basically it complies with the old adage "too much of anything is bad" Also at least with weed no one dies of an overdose.

> > >

> > > The article also says:

> > > That said, it’s definitely true that most people who use cannabis will never go to the ER as a result. CHS in particular is thought to be incredibly rare, seemingly only happening in people who use cannabis heavily, and its frightening symptoms go away as soon as the person stops using cannabis.

> >

> >

> > Sure. Was simply illustrating that the “ it’s harmless and should be sold in every vending machine “ people are nuts.

> >

> Don't think anyone in this thread is saying that. I think the posters have been saying it's not as dangerous as we've been led to believe, and can actually be beneficially in alleviating some ailments. Having said that, I don't think the "it's harmless..." people are any more nuts than the "ban it at all costs because anyone that partakes is a loser" people.

>

>

 

 

Maybe so. And I really am not saying that at least In the past 2-3 pages anyone is. I think I’ve made a pretty solid in the middle point . And yet I’m sure I’m solidly placed in the “ anyone who partakes is a loser” box.

 

The problem with this topic is that compromise is rarely considered by both sides. You see it in the comparisons to caffeine , and over eating etc. when people think “ legalization “ they think wild Wild West freedom. They don’t just think decriminalization which would be the most common sense compromise. They want it to be socially acceptable too. And that isn’t going to happen in our lifetimes.

 

[bladehunter]

> @resnor said:

> > @CKalma said:

> > > @resnor said:

> > > > @MattyO1984 said:

> > > > > @BearQ said:

> > > > > > @MattyO1984 said:

> > > > > > Each to there own I guess but smoking that rubbish at 41?! Come on man, grow up!

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > You realize it’s being used worldwide for several reasons right. Let me give you a few. Chronic pain, ptsd, anxiety, appetite loss, post surgery, anti inflam...list goes on. Doctors are actually prescribing it. Many thousands have avoided opioid usage when transition to the “rubbish”.

> > > > > Disappointing opinion. You can always go lawn bowling and play horse polo with the guys who made the rule tho

> > > >

> > > > Ha, I notice that you didn't include simply getting high as one of your brilliant reasons. I bet it does work a trick for those with appetite loss though. The diet after that packets of Doritos, Candy and Pizza right? How many thousands having ended transitioning into opioid usage after starting it?

> > >

> > > Pretty sure the research is showing that opioid Usage is going down in states with recreational marijuana. This idea that marijuana is a gateway drug is ridiculous, and it's amazing it's hung around this long.

> >

> > The first sentence is not correct. Opioid usage has continued to increase every year. The idea that marijuana is a gateway drug comes from the fact that some people end up going to their pot dealer looking for a different or better high.

>

> Well, you're wrong. https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2018/04/02/598787768/opioid-use-lower-in-states-that-eased-marijuana-laws

>

 

 

Might want to read that article again. Here’s a quote after the numbered “estimates” are given.

 

“ because opioid use was rising nationwide during the study period , their estimate of reduced uses reflects a slowing of the increase , rather than an actual decline of opioid use in these states” Bradford says.

 

So it’s a guess on two fronts. A guess based on projected growth of users based on past growth. And a guess on why the growth didn’t meet the first guesses projected number ?!

 

To conclude that legal pot has taken down opioid use you need opioid users who say “ I’ve switched to pot because it’s legal “. Which won’t happen because people haven’t had trouble getting it to begin with. If someone wanted to trade opioids for pot it wouldn’t be hard to do and is much cheaper both legal and illegal.

[bladehunter]

> @resnor said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @MattyO1984 said:

> > > > @resnor said:

> > > > > @MattyO1984 said:

> > > > > > @BearQ said:

> > > > > > > @MattyO1984 said:

> > > > > > > Each to there own I guess but smoking that rubbish at 41?! Come on man, grow up!

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > You realize it’s being used worldwide for several reasons right. Let me give you a few. Chronic pain, ptsd, anxiety, appetite loss, post surgery, anti inflam...list goes on. Doctors are actually prescribing it. Many thousands have avoided opioid usage when transition to the “rubbish”.

> > > > > > Disappointing opinion. You can always go lawn bowling and play horse polo with the guys who made the rule tho

> > > > >

> > > > > Ha, I notice that you didn't include simply getting high as one of your brilliant reasons. I bet it does work a trick for those with appetite loss though. The diet after that packets of Doritos, Candy and Pizza right? How many thousands having ended transitioning into opioid usage after starting it?

> > > >

> > > > Pretty sure the research is showing that opioid Usage is going down in states with recreational marijuana. This idea that marijuana is a gateway drug is ridiculous, and it's amazing it's hung around this long.

> > >

> > > I don't find it ridiculous as I my day to day work involves discussions with a number of heroin addicts. Invariably, whenever discussion turns to their use of harder substances and how they came to use them, cannabis is what they first started with. Whilst it is not the case that one has to lead to the other, in the significant majority of the people I have dealt with over the last 10 years cannabis has come first.

> >

> >

> > Lol. “But hey man. I didn’t do heroine so yea, not true. “

> >

> > But it’s clearly addictive if so many feel so strongly about it ? Yes ?

> >

> > How do we draw the line for recreational drugs ? I mean. Freedom ? Where does it start stop ? Is the line at weed. Or do we move it to pills without a script ? Or maybe on up to meth.? You can Make your own.

> >

> > Serious question. I know it Flames some up , but it’s the real discussion that has to be had.

> >

> >

> >

>

> Why does anyone care what someone puts in their body? I genuinely don't understand people's stance on these things.

>

In a vacuum. Nobody cares what you do. In reality it spills over to other folks. And then that matters.

 

Said Without a lengthy list of people it effects unless you need them. ( cause I can name them ).

 

[Birdie Mac]

> @bladehunter said:

> > @"Birdie Mac" said:

> > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > random article that showed up for my google feed thus morning. Pretty big uptick of emergency room visits cited here.

> > > > >

> > > > > https://gizmodo.com/why-increased-pot-use-in-colorado-is-sending-more-peopl-1833582402/amp

> > > >

> > > > Basically it complies with the old adage "too much of anything is bad" Also at least with weed no one dies of an overdose.

> > > >

> > > > The article also says:

> > > > That said, it’s definitely true that most people who use cannabis will never go to the ER as a result. CHS in particular is thought to be incredibly rare, seemingly only happening in people who use cannabis heavily, and its frightening symptoms go away as soon as the person stops using cannabis.

> > >

> > >

> > > Sure. Was simply illustrating that the “ it’s harmless and should be sold in every vending machine “ people are nuts.

> > >

> > Don't think anyone in this thread is saying that. I think the posters have been saying it's not as dangerous as we've been led to believe, and can actually be beneficially in alleviating some ailments. Having said that, I don't think the "it's harmless..." people are any more nuts than the "ban it at all costs because anyone that partakes is a loser" people.

> >

> >

>

>

> Maybe so. And I really am not saying that at least In the past 2-3 pages anyone is. I think I’ve made a pretty solid in the middle point . And yet I’m sure I’m solidly placed in the “ anyone who partakes is a loser” box.

>

> The problem with this topic is that compromise is rarely considered by both sides. You see it in the comparisons to caffeine , and over eating etc. when people think “ legalization “ they think wild Wild West freedom. They don’t just think decriminalization which would be the most common sense compromise. They want it to be socially acceptable too. And that isn’t going to happen in our lifetimes.

>

+1. Too often people talk at each other rather than to each other. It takes a long time to turn a ship around, and it takes a long time to change hearts and minds about controversial topics.

 

 

[Roadking2003]

> @resnor said:

> > @MattyO1984 said:

> > > @resnor said:

> > > > @MattyO1984 said:

> > > > > @BearQ said:

> > > > > > @MattyO1984 said:

> > > > > > Each to there own I guess but smoking that rubbish at 41?! Come on man, grow up!

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > You realize it’s being used worldwide for several reasons right. Let me give you a few. Chronic pain, ptsd, anxiety, appetite loss, post surgery, anti inflam...list goes on. Doctors are actually prescribing it. Many thousands have avoided opioid usage when transition to the “rubbish”.

> > > > > Disappointing opinion. You can always go lawn bowling and play horse polo with the guys who made the rule tho

> > > >

> > > > Ha, I notice that you didn't include simply getting high as one of your brilliant reasons. I bet it does work a trick for those with appetite loss though. The diet after that packets of Doritos, Candy and Pizza right? How many thousands having ended transitioning into opioid usage after starting it?

> > >

> > > Pretty sure the research is showing that opioid Usage is going down in states with recreational marijuana. This idea that marijuana is a gateway drug is ridiculous, and it's amazing it's hung around this long.

> >

> > I don't find it ridiculous as I my day to day work involves discussions with a number of heroin addicts. Invariably, whenever discussion turns to their use of harder substances and how they came to use them, cannabis is what they first started with. Whilst it is not the case that one has to lead to the other, in the significant majority of the people I have dealt with over the last 10 years cannabis has come first.

>

> Before they used alcohol or tobacco? I mean, if we're using anecdotal evidence, I don't know anyone who's used marijuana or other drugs who didn't first start with drinking and most often smoking cigarettes.

 

I don't know anyone who uses marijuana that did not first start on milk.

[resnor]

> @bladehunter said:

> > @resnor said:

> > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > @MattyO1984 said:

> > > > > @resnor said:

> > > > > > @MattyO1984 said:

> > > > > > > @BearQ said:

> > > > > > > > @MattyO1984 said:

> > > > > > > > Each to there own I guess but smoking that rubbish at 41?! Come on man, grow up!

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > You realize it’s being used worldwide for several reasons right. Let me give you a few. Chronic pain, ptsd, anxiety, appetite loss, post surgery, anti inflam...list goes on. Doctors are actually prescribing it. Many thousands have avoided opioid usage when transition to the “rubbish”.

> > > > > > > Disappointing opinion. You can always go lawn bowling and play horse polo with the guys who made the rule tho

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Ha, I notice that you didn't include simply getting high as one of your brilliant reasons. I bet it does work a trick for those with appetite loss though. The diet after that packets of Doritos, Candy and Pizza right? How many thousands having ended transitioning into opioid usage after starting it?

> > > > >

> > > > > Pretty sure the research is showing that opioid Usage is going down in states with recreational marijuana. This idea that marijuana is a gateway drug is ridiculous, and it's amazing it's hung around this long.

> > > >

> > > > I don't find it ridiculous as I my day to day work involves discussions with a number of heroin addicts. Invariably, whenever discussion turns to their use of harder substances and how they came to use them, cannabis is what they first started with. Whilst it is not the case that one has to lead to the other, in the significant majority of the people I have dealt with over the last 10 years cannabis has come first.

> > >

> > >

> > > Lol. “But hey man. I didn’t do heroine so yea, not true. “

> > >

> > > But it’s clearly addictive if so many feel so strongly about it ? Yes ?

> > >

> > > How do we draw the line for recreational drugs ? I mean. Freedom ? Where does it start stop ? Is the line at weed. Or do we move it to pills without a script ? Or maybe on up to meth.? You can Make your own.

> > >

> > > Serious question. I know it Flames some up , but it’s the real discussion that has to be had.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> > Why does anyone care what someone puts in their body? I genuinely don't understand people's stance on these things.

> >

> In a vacuum. Nobody cares what you do. In reality it spills over to other folks. And then that matters.

>

> Said Without a lengthy list of people it effects unless you need them. ( cause I can name them ).

>

 

Look, if you think that marijuana is at all like drugs like heroin, meth, cocaine, etc, then we can never have a conversation. I feel that most of these arguments have this inherent problem. If you are chasing a high, then you will use drugs other than marijuana, regardless of it's legality, or the legality of other drugs. In reality, I see people in this thread who are very concerned with what someone else does, regardless of whether or not it affects them. Alcohol kills and harms millions of people every year, yet these she people aren't advocating for prohibition again. Drug usage of any at sort should not be a criminal activity.

 

[Roadking2003]

> @resnor said:

>

> Why does anyone care what someone puts in their body? I genuinely don't understand people's stance on these things.

>

That is really the bottom line in this debate. Why do some people think they are God and should tell other people what they can eat, drink or smoke. There shouldn't be any debate about the benefits or harm from weed. The only legitimate debate is "should you tell other people how to live their lives?"

 

 

[resnor]

> @bladehunter said:

> > @resnor said:

> > > @CKalma said:

> > > > @resnor said:

> > > > > @MattyO1984 said:

> > > > > > @BearQ said:

> > > > > > > @MattyO1984 said:

> > > > > > > Each to there own I guess but smoking that rubbish at 41?! Come on man, grow up!

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > You realize it’s being used worldwide for several reasons right. Let me give you a few. Chronic pain, ptsd, anxiety, appetite loss, post surgery, anti inflam...list goes on. Doctors are actually prescribing it. Many thousands have avoided opioid usage when transition to the “rubbish”.

> > > > > > Disappointing opinion. You can always go lawn bowling and play horse polo with the guys who made the rule tho

> > > > >

> > > > > Ha, I notice that you didn't include simply getting high as one of your brilliant reasons. I bet it does work a trick for those with appetite loss though. The diet after that packets of Doritos, Candy and Pizza right? How many thousands having ended transitioning into opioid usage after starting it?

> > > >

> > > > Pretty sure the research is showing that opioid Usage is going down in states with recreational marijuana. This idea that marijuana is a gateway drug is ridiculous, and it's amazing it's hung around this long.

> > >

> > > The first sentence is not correct. Opioid usage has continued to increase every year. The idea that marijuana is a gateway drug comes from the fact that some people end up going to their pot dealer looking for a different or better high.

> >

> > Well, you're wrong. https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2018/04/02/598787768/opioid-use-lower-in-states-that-eased-marijuana-laws

> >

>

>

> Might want to read that article again. Here’s a quote after the numbered “estimates” are given.

>

> “ because opioid use was rising nationwide during the study period , their estimate of reduced uses reflects a slowing of the increase , rather than an actual decline of opioid use in these states” Bradford says.

>

> So it’s a guess on two fronts. A guess based on projected growth of users based on past growth. And a guess on why the growth didn’t meet the first guesses projected number ?!

>

> To conclude that legal pot has taken down opioid use you need opioid users who say “ I’ve switched to pot because it’s legal “. Which won’t happen because people haven’t had trouble getting it to begin with. If someone wanted to trade opioids for pot it wouldn’t be hard to do and is much cheaper both legal and illegal.

 

 

No. There is no question that the opiate use went down, projected or not. Opiates are often abused because people are prescribed them and they become hooked. Legal marijuana allows doctors to prescribe marijuana instead of opiates, and that alone can prevent much of the opioid abuse.

 

Also from those reports I mentioned earlier:

 

"Most opioid use disorder and overdose cases occurred in patients with legitimate prescriptions from health care professionals for pain management. Marijuana liberalization, therefore, may have benefited these patients by providing them with legal protection and access to marijuana as an alternative relief from their pain conditions,” the Kentucky and Emory team wrote. “The widespread public support will bring medical marijuana laws to more and more states for years to come, which may help decrease the use of prescription opioids in pain management and the adverse consequences, such as opioid use disorder and overdose.”

 

 

Those researchers also noted that “marijuana may help ease opioid withdrawal symptoms.”

 

“Thus, marijuana liberalization potentially reduced prescription opioid use on 2 fronts, serving as a substitute for opioid pain medications, and as a complement to opioid use disorder treatment,” the wrote. “The potential of adult-use marijuana laws to reduce the use and consequences of addictive opioids deserves consideration, especially in states that have been hit hard by the opioid epidemic.

[resnor]

> @Roadking2003 said:

> > @resnor said:

> >

> > Why does anyone care what someone puts in their body? I genuinely don't understand people's stance on these things.

> >

> That is really the bottom line in this debate. Why do some people think they are God and should tell other people what they can eat, drink or smoke. There shouldn't be any debate about the benefits or harm from weed. The only legitimate debate is "should you tell other people how to live their lives?"

>

>

 

Exactly. And just because someone else abuses something, doesn't mean it should be banned. Just because someone drinks 30 sodas a day and dies from diabetes related problems, doesn't mean that soda should be banned, and I, a healthy adult, be prevented from enjoying a Coke.

 

[BlackDiamondPar5]

> @resnor said:

> > @Roadking2003 said:

> > > @resnor said:

> > >

> > > Why does anyone care what someone puts in their body? I genuinely don't understand people's stance on these things.

> > >

> > That is really the bottom line in this debate. Why do some people think they are God and should tell other people what they can eat, drink or smoke. There shouldn't be any debate about the benefits or harm from weed. The only legitimate debate is "should you tell other people how to live their lives?"

> >

> >

>

> Exactly. And just because someone else abuses something, doesn't mean it should be banned. Just because someone drinks 30 sodas a day and dies from diabetes related problems, doesn't mean that soda should be banned, and I, a healthy adult, be prevented from enjoying a Coke.

>

 

Agree. The medical system is far more full of people who've eaten there way and rode the couch into a disability.

 

Then there's the whole scam with opiates being over prescribed and companies that kept resetting the "unusual use circuit breakers" in the name of greed that created the opiate crisis.

[MilkyButterCuts]

> @bladehunter said:

> > @"Birdie Mac" said:

> > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > random article that showed up for my google feed thus morning. Pretty big uptick of emergency room visits cited here.

> > > > >

> > > > > https://gizmodo.com/why-increased-pot-use-in-colorado-is-sending-more-peopl-1833582402/amp

> > > >

> > > > Basically it complies with the old adage "too much of anything is bad" Also at least with weed no one dies of an overdose.

> > > >

> > > > The article also says:

> > > > That said, it’s definitely true that most people who use cannabis will never go to the ER as a result. CHS in particular is thought to be incredibly rare, seemingly only happening in people who use cannabis heavily, and its frightening symptoms go away as soon as the person stops using cannabis.

> > >

> > >

> > > Sure. Was simply illustrating that the “ it’s harmless and should be sold in every vending machine “ people are nuts.

> > >

> > Don't think anyone in this thread is saying that. I think the posters have been saying it's not as dangerous as we've been led to believe, and can actually be beneficially in alleviating some ailments. Having said that, I don't think the "it's harmless..." people are any more nuts than the "ban it at all costs because anyone that partakes is a loser" people.

> >

> >

>

>

> Maybe so. And I really am not saying that at least In the past 2-3 pages anyone is. I think I’ve made a pretty solid in the middle point . And yet I’m sure I’m solidly placed in the “ anyone who partakes is a loser” box.

>

> The problem with this topic is that compromise is rarely considered by both sides. You see it in the comparisons to caffeine , and over eating etc. when people think “ legalization “ they think wild Wild West freedom. They don’t just think decriminalization which would be the most common sense compromise. They want it to be socially acceptable too. **And that isn’t going to happen in our lifetimes. **

>

 

Very, very debatable. As the younger generation moves up it is very likely it will, along with Religion fading away as well.

[MilkyButterCuts]

> @MilkyButterCuts said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @"Birdie Mac" said:

> > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > @BlackDiamondPar5 said:

> > > > > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > > > random article that showed up for my google feed thus morning. Pretty big uptick of emergency room visits cited here.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > https://gizmodo.com/why-increased-pot-use-in-colorado-is-sending-more-peopl-1833582402/amp

> > > > >

> > > > > Basically it complies with the old adage "too much of anything is bad" Also at least with weed no one dies of an overdose.

> > > > >

> > > > > The article also says:

> > > > > That said, it’s definitely true that most people who use cannabis will never go to the ER as a result. CHS in particular is thought to be incredibly rare, seemingly only happening in people who use cannabis heavily, and its frightening symptoms go away as soon as the person stops using cannabis.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Sure. Was simply illustrating that the “ it’s harmless and should be sold in every vending machine “ people are nuts.

> > > >

> > > Don't think anyone in this thread is saying that. I think the posters have been saying it's not as dangerous as we've been led to believe, and can actually be beneficially in alleviating some ailments. Having said that, I don't think the "it's harmless..." people are any more nuts than the "ban it at all costs because anyone that partakes is a loser" people.

> > >

> > >

> >

> >

> > Maybe so. And I really am not saying that at least In the past 2-3 pages anyone is. I think I’ve made a pretty solid in the middle point . And yet I’m sure I’m solidly placed in the “ anyone who partakes is a loser” box.

> >

> > The problem with this topic is that compromise is rarely considered by both sides. You see it in the comparisons to caffeine , and over eating etc. when people think “ legalization “ they think wild Wild West freedom. They don’t just think decriminalization which would be the most common sense compromise. They want it to be socially acceptable too. **And that isn’t going to happen in our lifetimes. **

> >

>

> Very, very debatable. As the younger generation moves up it is very likely it will, along with Religion fading away as well, IMHO.

 

 

[MilkyButterCuts]

uh oh, tried to edit and have no clue what just happened.

[bladehunter]

> @resnor said:

> > @bladehunter said:

> > > @resnor said:

> > > > @CKalma said:

> > > > > @resnor said:

> > > > > > @MattyO1984 said:

> > > > > > > @BearQ said:

> > > > > > > > @MattyO1984 said:

> > > > > > > > Each to there own I guess but smoking that rubbish at 41?! Come on man, grow up!

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > You realize it’s being used worldwide for several reasons right. Let me give you a few. Chronic pain, ptsd, anxiety, appetite loss, post surgery, anti inflam...list goes on. Doctors are actually prescribing it. Many thousands have avoided opioid usage when transition to the “rubbish”.

> > > > > > > Disappointing opinion. You can always go lawn bowling and play horse polo with the guys who made the rule tho

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Ha, I notice that you didn't include simply getting high as one of your brilliant reasons. I bet it does work a trick for those with appetite loss though. The diet after that packets of Doritos, Candy and Pizza right? How many thousands having ended transitioning into opioid usage after starting it?

> > > > >

> > > > > Pretty sure the research is showing that opioid Usage is going down in states with recreational marijuana. This idea that marijuana is a gateway drug is ridiculous, and it's amazing it's hung around this long.

> > > >

> > > > The first sentence is not correct. Opioid usage has continued to increase every year. The idea that marijuana is a gateway drug comes from the fact that some people end up going to their pot dealer looking for a different or better high.

> > >

> > > Well, you're wrong. https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2018/04/02/598787768/opioid-use-lower-in-states-that-eased-marijuana-laws

> > >

> >

> >

> > Might want to read that article again. Here’s a quote after the numbered “estimates” are given.

> >

> > “ because opioid use was rising nationwide during the study period , their estimate of reduced uses reflects a slowing of the increase , rather than an actual decline of opioid use in these states” Bradford says.

> >

> > So it’s a guess on two fronts. A guess based on projected growth of users based on past growth. And a guess on why the growth didn’t meet the first guesses projected number ?!

> >

> > To conclude that legal pot has taken down opioid use you need opioid users who say “ I’ve switched to pot because it’s legal “. Which won’t happen because people haven’t had trouble getting it to begin with. If someone wanted to trade opioids for pot it wouldn’t be hard to do and is much cheaper both legal and illegal.

>

>

> No. There is no question that the opiate use went down, projected or not. Opiates are often abused because people are prescribed them and they become hooked. Legal marijuana allows doctors to prescribe marijuana instead of opiates, and that alone can prevent much of the opioid abuse.

>

> Also from those reports I mentioned earlier:

>

> "Most opioid use disorder and overdose cases occurred in patients with legitimate prescriptions from health care professionals for pain management. Marijuana liberalization, therefore, may have benefited these patients by providing them with legal protection and access to marijuana as an alternative relief from their pain conditions,” the Kentucky and Emory team wrote. “The widespread public support will bring medical marijuana laws to more and more states for years to come, which may help decrease the use of prescription opioids in pain management and the adverse consequences, such as opioid use disorder and overdose.”

>

>

> Those researchers also noted that “marijuana may help ease opioid withdrawal symptoms.”

>

> “Thus, marijuana liberalization potentially reduced prescription opioid use on 2 fronts, serving as a substitute for opioid pain medications, and as a complement to opioid use disorder treatment,” the wrote. “The potential of adult-use marijuana laws to reduce the use and consequences of addictive opioids deserves consideration, especially in states that have been hit hard by the opioid epidemic.

 

There is no data that supports that theory. Not even the made up projections that article quotes does.

 

Look. On that front your preaching to the choir. I know opioid and meth / heroin etc users . How many can you name that swap down to pot ? Lol. None.

 

The only possibility is that prescribed opioid newbie who isn’t hooked yet and finds pain help through medical pot use. How rare is that person since opioids get their hoooks in so quickly?

 

 

Now I’ll agree if we are talking new patients.

People who aren’t opioid dependent .

 

But that’s also why I made the point that the medical use should be able to be accomplished minus the high. No ? If the medical use doesn’t automatically include the high then it can be . The oils are advertised as being capable of this. So why is it needed to be legal past that ?

 

 

 

[Ferguson]

> @MilkyButterCuts said:

> uh oh, tried to edit and have no clue what just happened.

 

See what drugs do???

[MilkyButterCuts]

> @Ferguson said:

> > @MilkyButterCuts said:

> > uh oh, tried to edit and have no clue what just happened.

>

> See what drugs do???

 

In that case, the WRX staff must be absolutely cranked.

[Birdie Mac]

> @Ferguson said:

> > @MilkyButterCuts said:

> > uh oh, tried to edit and have no clue what just happened.

>

> See what drugs do???

:D

 

 

[bladehunter]

> @resnor said:

> > @Roadking2003 said:

> > > @resnor said:

> > >

> > > Why does anyone care what someone puts in their body? I genuinely don't understand people's stance on these things.

> > >

> > That is really the bottom line in this debate. Why do some people think they are God and should tell other people what they can eat, drink or smoke. There shouldn't be any debate about the benefits or harm from weed. The only legitimate debate is "should you tell other people how to live their lives?"

> >

> >

>

> Exactly. And just because someone else abuses something, doesn't mean it should be banned. Just because someone drinks 30 sodas a day and dies from diabetes related problems, doesn't mean that soda should be banned, and I, a healthy adult, be prevented from enjoying a Coke.

>

 

 

No reported deaths from drinking coke and driving.

 

No second hand coke.

 

Nobody worried about their kid going to his pals house and him getting into some “ legal Coca-Cola “ brownie stash that his friends mom has for her back pain. Just a sample of things non coke drinkers don’t have to really worry about like non pot users do after it’s legal and the stigma is gone.

 

 

 

 

[marmooskapaul]

The problem with using THC for pain..is that it gets you high. I don't like that buzz..with Vicodin you at least know what buzz your going to get..so to speak. I'm talking short term pain as in acute arthritis or gout flare ups. I think a lot of people may benefit from THC...but you have to live with the side effects also. Getting high for some people is all over the place and not enjoyable...just saying.

Doing it for fun..which I think is what RG was doing..is fine with me, but I'm not his employer or make the rules. Maybe the PGA could just test players who wanted to play in the Olympics...cause I don't think RG is on that list...lol....leave the rest of the players off the WADA testing list.

 

[resnor]

> @bladehunter said:

> > @resnor said:

> > > @bladehunter said:

> > > > @resnor said:

> > > > > @CKalma said:

> > > > > > @resnor said:

> > > > > > > @MattyO1984 said:

> > > > > > > > @BearQ said:

> > > > > > > > > @MattyO1984 said:

> > > > > > > > > Each to there own I guess but smoking that rubbish at 41?! Come on man, grow up!

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > You realize it’s being used worldwide for several reasons right. Let me give you a few. Chronic pain, ptsd, anxiety, appetite loss, post surgery, anti inflam...list goes on. Doctors are actually prescribing it. Many thousands have avoided opioid usage when transition to the “rubbish”.

> > > > > > > > Disappointing opinion. You can always go lawn bowling and play horse polo with the guys who made the rule tho

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Ha, I notice that you didn't include simply getting high as one of your brilliant reasons. I bet it does work a trick for those with appetite loss though. The diet after that packets of Doritos, Candy and Pizza right? How many thousands having ended transitioning into opioid usage after starting it?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Pretty sure the research is showing that opioid Usage is going down in states with recreational marijuana. This idea that marijuana is a gateway drug is ridiculous, and it's amazing it's hung around this long.

> > > > >

> > > > > The first sentence is not correct. Opioid usage has continued to increase every year. The idea that marijuana is a gateway drug comes from the fact that some people end up going to their pot dealer looking for a different or better high.

> > > >

> > > > Well, you're wrong. https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2018/04/02/598787768/opioid-use-lower-in-states-that-eased-marijuana-laws

> > > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Might want to read that article again. Here’s a quote after the numbered “estimates” are given.

> > >

> > > “ because opioid use was rising nationwide during the study period , their estimate of reduced uses reflects a slowing of the increase , rather than an actual decline of opioid use in these states” Bradford says.

> > >

> > > So it’s a guess on two fronts. A guess based on projected growth of users based on past growth. And a guess on why the growth didn’t meet the first guesses projected number ?!

> > >

> > > To conclude that legal pot has taken down opioid use you need opioid users who say “ I’ve switched to pot because it’s legal “. Which won’t happen because people haven’t had trouble getting it to begin with. If someone wanted to trade opioids for pot it wouldn’t be hard to do and is much cheaper both legal and illegal.

> >

> >

> > No. There is no question that the opiate use went down, projected or not. Opiates are often abused because people are prescribed them and they become hooked. Legal marijuana allows doctors to prescribe marijuana instead of opiates, and that alone can prevent much of the opioid abuse.

> >

> > Also from those reports I mentioned earlier:

> >

> > "Most opioid use disorder and overdose cases occurred in patients with legitimate prescriptions from health care professionals for pain management. Marijuana liberalization, therefore, may have benefited these patients by providing them with legal protection and access to marijuana as an alternative relief from their pain conditions,” the Kentucky and Emory team wrote. “The widespread public support will bring medical marijuana laws to more and more states for years to come, which may help decrease the use of prescription opioids in pain management and the adverse consequences, such as opioid use disorder and overdose.”

> >

> >

> > Those researchers also noted that “marijuana may help ease opioid withdrawal symptoms.”

> >

> > “Thus, marijuana liberalization potentially reduced prescription opioid use on 2 fronts, serving as a substitute for opioid pain medications, and as a complement to opioid use disorder treatment,” the wrote. “The potential of adult-use marijuana laws to reduce the use and consequences of addictive opioids deserves consideration, especially in states that have been hit hard by the opioid epidemic.

>

> There is no data that supports that theory. Not even the made up projections that article quotes does.

>

> Look. On that front your preaching to the choir. I know opioid and meth / heroin etc users . How many can you name that swap down to pot ? Lol. None.

>

> The only possibility is that prescribed opioid newbie who isn’t hooked yet and finds pain help through medical pot use. How rare is that person since opioids get their hoooks in so quickly?

>

>

> Now I’ll agree if we are talking new patients.

> People who aren’t opioid dependent .

>

> But that’s also why I made the point that the medical use should be able to be accomplished minus the high. No ? If the medical use doesn’t automatically include the high then it can be . The oils are advertised as being capable of this. So why is it needed to be legal past that ?

>

>

>

 

It's not like that. CBD has certain benefits, while the THC also does. If you are looking for pain relief, stimulate hunger, other such things, you need the THC. If you're looking to fight seizures, for instance, CBD will be effective, but not THC. So medical marijuana is not as simple as you seen to think it should be.

 

And you can draw whatever conclusions your want from that article, but the fact is, despite what you're saying, the researchers ARE stating that legalized marijuana is correlating to drop in opioid use.

 

[resnor]

> @bladehunter said:

> > @resnor said:

> > > @Roadking2003 said:

> > > > @resnor said:

> > > >

> > > > Why does anyone care what someone puts in their body? I genuinely don't understand people's stance on these things.

> > > >

> > > That is really the bottom line in this debate. Why do some people think they are God and should tell other people what they can eat, drink or smoke. There shouldn't be any debate about the benefits or harm from weed. The only legitimate debate is "should you tell other people how to live their lives?"

> > >

> > >

> >

> > Exactly. And just because someone else abuses something, doesn't mean it should be banned. Just because someone drinks 30 sodas a day and dies from diabetes related problems, doesn't mean that soda should be banned, and I, a healthy adult, be prevented from enjoying a Coke.

> >

>

>

> No reported deaths from drinking coke and driving.

>

> No second hand coke.

>

> Nobody worried about their kid going to his pals house and him getting into some “ legal Coca-Cola “ brownie stash that his friends mom has for her back pain. Just a sample of things non coke drinkers don’t have to really worry about like non pot users do after it’s legal and the stigma is gone.

>

>

>

>

 

 

So clearly I was NOT staying that Coke and marijuana are the same, so stop with the strawman argument. I'm giving an example using the logic that is being displayed. Also, I would bet large amounts of money that yes, there have been deaths from drinking soda while driving. It's illegal, technically, in many states to drink anything while driving that requires you to tip a bottle.

 

What if your kid is obese, and is going to his friends house who's mother is also obese, and getting tons of soda from her? Why should there be a stigma associated with marijuana? Just saying, I find the arguments against marijuana to be lacking any actual logic, and generally based on misinformation.

[MilkyButterCuts]

I'm not a big fan of weed. I have used it quite a bit in the past and no longer do because I become a lazy, unmotivated piece of s***. However, I do support it being legalized. Mainly because it doesn't have the potential to do the harm alcohol can. If you'd like to sit on a couch and binge eat junk food I could give a fck less. For people like me who struggle with alcohol, I think it would be beneficial to have a legal alternative to "take the edge off". I know that doesnt sound good.... but everyone has a vice, everyone needs some sort of escape. That's why we all play golf, right?