Power on the PGA Tour......

[smashdn]

I'd offer up adding spin back to the ball while reducing the distance it can be hit.

I still think in my heart of hearts that if the ball companies can make a multi-layer ball where the innermost layers provide the most oomph and are really only activated by persons who can really compress and smash the ball, that they can make a ball that does not generate speed and therefore distance with an inner layer material that is only compressed by those capable of swinging fast and hard. If they can make balls that perform well at most swing speeds they are sure capable of making balls that perform poorly at higher swing speeds. Sort of a point of diminishing returns type of ball.

I hear the contrarians now though, "The pros will just swing slower." Which is fine. That is what they had to do with persimmon and balata to control it. We survived.

 

But none of this will ever happen. And that is fine too. I will play my game and you all will play yours. I may tune in to watch The Masters and The Open but I doubt I watch many of the regular tour stop events unless there is a real compelling storyline because the play on the course simply does not carry the mail for me any longer.

[bscinstnct]

I'm surprised most don't agree with just making smaller driver heads as a possible solution. Make is more of a risk/reward to swing out of your shoes off the tee. I be this would bring average drives down 5 yards or maybe even 10?

 

Pluse, you don't mess with the rest of the bag, iron distances, and how short game is played.

[farmer]

I went to a lot of tournaments back in the day because I had family close to several. So. Those guys back in the '70's were not just bunting the ball around. They went at it hard, they hit it hard and out of the middle. After seeing them on tv, it was a great surprise to see Gene Littler and Sam Snead in person, as example. Courses in those days were not as groomed out as they are today. Fairways were cut at 1/2 inch, and they were watered so they would look good on the little screen. I remember Hale Irwin howling in Atlanta because the fairways were accidentally cut at 5/8 for one round. A high spin ball to cut back distance might work, but the flip side is that those balls were easier to play out of the rough because they were high spin, and a skilled player could darn near do trick shots around the green. Without a paradigm shift in how golf is viewed and marketed, there is just going to be a few who are good enough to over power a few courses. If we want see scoring rolled back, go Pine Valley on the bunkers or as Jack did at Muirfield when they were coarsely raked.

[gvogel]

Brandon Todd is up to 294.5 this year.

[Titleist99]

How dare you suggest toughening up a golf course on this thread. Traditionalist say go straight to rolling back equipment....

 

Todays PGATOUR fairways looks like my home course GREENS.......Touring pros hit the down slope and the ball roll an extra thirty yards....

[Titleist99]

Not according to the PGATOUR...….They got him at 283 off the tee and 276 all drives.....

[smashdn]

His premise was based upon rolling scoring back. I, at least, don't care if scoring is rolled back one bit. The how you get to that score is what I am concerned about. A great shot to get in position to save bogey is the same as a great shot to set up birdie for me. A great shot is a great shot.

 

It would actually be preferable if scoring stayed the same but the equipment had less of a role in the scoring. Then you could really say these guys are good.

[Titleist99]

Lets take the John Deere classic:

1988...….261...…...Blainacallister

 

1998...….263...…..Steve Jones

 

1999...…..261...………..J L Lewis

 

2010...…..258...……….Steve Stricker

 

2017...…...266...…….Bryan Deshambeau

 

2018...…...257...…...Micheal kim

 

Scores basically the same IMO.

 

 

[Titleist99]

Some of us feel  that it takes a lot of talent to swing those big head drivers as fast as Sebastian Munoz and still maintain balance and accuracy....

[LICC]

What was the course yardage in 1988 and what is it today?

[Titleist99]

I don't know You tell me, then tell me how that affect this conversation and then we'll debate the relevance....

[LICC]

You don't understand how lengthening the course changes its scoring difficulty?

[mahonie]

Just out of interest what was the first driver you played?

[smashdn]

@Titleist99

Did you not read what you quoted from me? I don't really care about the scoring so much. Most courses have adjusted and added length to keep up with the scoring.

Per wiki they didn't start playing it at Deere Run until 2000 so you got that going for you too I guess. The previous course tips out currently at ~6850 yards. I have no idea if they added yardage since 1999.

[Titleist99]

My only point was that the scoring was the same throughout the years......I was not concerned about the yardage of the course.

[bladehunter]

but you must agree that it would take MORE talent to swing a smaller one with same results ?! Right ?

[Titleist99]

I have approx. 15 drivers...….oldest is a Stan Thompson with a set of rc-30 irons.1 set of Hogan equalizers and about 3 sets that  I've made....4 persimmon drivers that you have to hit on the screws..

[Titleist99]

No!...…..It would take more practice.

[mahonie]

That didn’t answer my question...

[Titleist99]

Stan Thompson.....donated to me to play in a scramble along with used bag. Even harder to hit with a cracked insert...

[gvogel]

Unicorn man. Made his own persimmon drivers. No use arguing with Unicorn Man.

[Titleist99]

A young kid starting out trying to hit persimmon clubs will quickly give up the game...IMO.

[bigred90gt]

They get 30-40 yards on a flat fairway. Give them a downslope and it’s easy 60+.

[mahonie]

You obviously have no idea...how do you think people learned to play the game for 300+ years...kids included? One of the greatest feelings in golf is a crisply struck persimmon...one of the main reasons I stuck at the game when I was a kid starting out in fact. Modern drivers in comparison feel a bit:

[Titleist99]

You say 'People have learn how to play with persimmon clubs for 300 years".....That's pretty hard to do since they were invented

around 1890-1900. I have some persimmons i could sell you, seeing as you say "I have no idea".....

[oikos1]

Hilarious that some in this thread don't think the pros would be able to hit smaller headed drivers.

[Titleist99]

Todays touring pros would hit persimmons clubs better than past player because of the million dollar purse that they give out every week.....IMO

Practice.....practice!

[bladehunter]

lol. Practice doesn’t make talent. Besides. They claim to practice or play 10 hours a day now. How would you practice more?

[bladehunter]

Lol. Then how did the game survive the 60s- to 1995ish?

 

I have a kid whos 11 playing a set of MP 33 with L flex graphite built for him , he hasn’t complained yet. And furthermore I bought him a set of ping i25 after he out grew his moxie ping set. The wider the sole the worse he hit it. I am the same. So on a hunch I built him a pw and once I had the lie and swing weight ( ported head) correct he started hitting it high and straight again. He now plays that to a 7 iron. And goes up to a 5 hybrid after that.

 

 

[Titleist99]

Point #1.....Persimmons are to time consuming as far as repairs go....I have two with cracked inserts as we speak.

Point #2.....It cost to much to repair....you need to replace the insert and the four screws along with a grip change.

Point #3......Those things have the sweet spot of a dime.