Power on the PGA Tour......

[gvogel]

> @Titleist99 said:

> > @gvogel said:

> > yes, brendon todd won back to back on two fairly short, fairly tight golf courses. thinking that the longer guys were handcuffed, and hitting fairway woods and irons. so, what's your point? he'll have a chance of competing at harbour town.

> >

> > of more import, brendon has defeated the driver yips for the time being.

> >

> > also, i see more than 140 players averaging over 300 yards. a 10% reduction would be a start.

>

> My point is long driving don't necessarily win tournaments....Long driving don't necessarily win tounaments..Brendon Todd is 220th in driving distance on the PGA Tour. People driving it 300 yards means nothing if you can't score. 140 Pros hitting 300 yards means nothing, just ask Brendon Todd. Maybe if they hit their drives in the proper place just maybe they'll win like Todd...

>

>

> The Pga tour can toughen these courses up if they wanted to.....but they don't want, the long ball sell tickets!

>

> No need to roll anything back....at the end of the tournament the lowest score wins!

 

long driving doesn't necessarily win tournaments.

[Titleist99]

> @gvogel said:

> > @Titleist99 said:

> > > @gvogel said:

> > > yes, brendon todd won back to back on two fairly short, fairly tight golf courses. thinking that the longer guys were handcuffed, and hitting fairway woods and irons. so, what's your point? he'll have a chance of competing at harbour town.

> > >

> > > of more import, brendon has defeated the driver yips for the time being.

> > >

> > > also, i see more than 140 players averaging over 300 yards. a 10% reduction would be a start.

> >

> > My point is long driving don't necessarily win tournaments....Long driving don't necessarily win tounaments..Brendon Todd is 220th in driving distance on the PGA Tour. People driving it 300 yards means nothing if you can't score. 140 Pros hitting 300 yards means nothing, just ask Brendon Todd. Maybe if they hit their drives in the proper place just maybe they'll win like Todd...

> >

> >

> > The Pga tour can toughen these courses up if they wanted to.....but they don't want, the long ball sell tickets!

> >

> > No need to roll anything back....at the end of the tournament the lowest score wins!

>

> long driving doesn't necessarily win tournaments.

 

 

That's when you know that a poster has nothing, they resort to being the grammar marshal on the tenth tee on a golf forum.....you should be embarrassed!!

Or is it feel embarrassed, Marshal?

[mahonie]

> @Titleist99 said:

> > @"Ashley Schaeffer" said:

> > If anything, these pros need this tech to keep up with the superhumans of yesteryear.

>

> LOL!...To further my point, have you noticed how firm and fast todays fairways are? Easily 20 yards of run....I rest my case!

 

I don’t think you realise how good Jack and Arnie were. Jack won 18 majors and was 2nd in 19...just reflect on that. In the top two in 37 majors and 56 top 5s overall. Tiger comes close with 33 top 5s but...

[LICC]

> @Titleist99 said:

> > @gvogel said:

> > yes, brendon todd won back to back on two fairly short, fairly tight golf courses. thinking that the longer guys were handcuffed, and hitting fairway woods and irons. so, what's your point? he'll have a chance of competing at harbour town.

> >

> > of more import, brendon has defeated the driver yips for the time being.

> >

> > also, i see more than 140 players averaging over 300 yards. a 10% reduction would be a start.

>

> My point is long driving don't necessarily win tournaments....Long driving don't necessarily win tounaments..Brendon Todd is 220th in driving distance on the PGA Tour. People driving it 300 yards means nothing if you can't score. 140 Pros hitting 300 yards means nothing, just ask Brendon Todd. Maybe if they hit their drives in the proper place just maybe they'll win like Todd...

>

>

> The Pga tour can toughen these courses up if they wanted to.....but they don't want, the long ball sell tickets!

>

> No need to roll anything back....at the end of the tournament the lowest score wins!

 

Todd won on a course that is over 7,000 yards and hitting it distances that 30 years ago would have been the longest driver on the Tour. This doesn't support your crazy assertion that classic 6,500 yard courses can be used for Tour events today.

[ckay]

Bethpage Black

[Titleist99]

> @LICC said:

> > @Titleist99 said:

> > > @gvogel said:

> > > yes, brendon todd won back to back on two fairly short, fairly tight golf courses. thinking that the longer guys were handcuffed, and hitting fairway woods and irons. so, what's your point? he'll have a chance of competing at harbour town.

> > >

> > > of more import, brendon has defeated the driver yips for the time being.

> > >

> > > also, i see more than 140 players averaging over 300 yards. a 10% reduction would be a start.

> >

> > My point is long driving don't necessarily win tournaments....Long driving don't necessarily win tounaments..Brendon Todd is 220th in driving distance on the PGA Tour. People driving it 300 yards means nothing if you can't score. 140 Pros hitting 300 yards means nothing, just ask Brendon Todd. Maybe if they hit their drives in the proper place just maybe they'll win like Todd...

> >

> >

> > The Pga tour can toughen these courses up if they wanted to.....but they don't want, the long ball sell tickets!

> >

> > No need to roll anything back....at the end of the tournament the lowest score wins!

>

> Todd won on a course that is over 7,000 yards and hitting it distances that 30 years ago would have been the longest driver on the Tour. This doesn't support your crazy assertion that classic 6,500 yard courses can be used for Tour events today.

 

LOL!>>>>Nor does it support your theory for the need of 8000 yard courses.....so please stop with the paranoia..

[Titleist99]

> @mahonie said:

> > @Titleist99 said:

> > > @"Ashley Schaeffer" said:

> > > If anything, these pros need this tech to keep up with the superhumans of yesteryear.

> >

> > LOL!...To further my point, have you noticed how firm and fast todays fairways are? Easily 20 yards of run....I rest my case!

>

> I don’t think you realise how good Jack and Arnie were. Jack won 18 majors and was 2nd in 19...just reflect on that. In the top two in 37 majors and 56 top 5s overall. Tiger comes close with 33 top 5s but...

 

If you think that I do not realize how good Jack and Arnie were, then you totally don't understand my position....I'll leave it right there.

[LICC]

> @Titleist99 said:

> > @LICC said:

> > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > yes, brendon todd won back to back on two fairly short, fairly tight golf courses. thinking that the longer guys were handcuffed, and hitting fairway woods and irons. so, what's your point? he'll have a chance of competing at harbour town.

> > > >

> > > > of more import, brendon has defeated the driver yips for the time being.

> > > >

> > > > also, i see more than 140 players averaging over 300 yards. a 10% reduction would be a start.

> > >

> > > My point is long driving don't necessarily win tournaments....Long driving don't necessarily win tounaments..Brendon Todd is 220th in driving distance on the PGA Tour. People driving it 300 yards means nothing if you can't score. 140 Pros hitting 300 yards means nothing, just ask Brendon Todd. Maybe if they hit their drives in the proper place just maybe they'll win like Todd...

> > >

> > >

> > > The Pga tour can toughen these courses up if they wanted to.....but they don't want, the long ball sell tickets!

> > >

> > > No need to roll anything back....at the end of the tournament the lowest score wins!

> >

> > Todd won on a course that is over 7,000 yards and hitting it distances that 30 years ago would have been the longest driver on the Tour. This doesn't support your crazy assertion that classic 6,500 yard courses can be used for Tour events today.

>

> LOL!>>>>Nor does it support your theory for the need of 8000 yard courses.....so please stop with the paranoia..

 

Given that he shot -20, 7000 yards didn't seem to be any big challenge.

[Shilgy]

> @LICC said:

> > @Titleist99 said:

> > > @LICC said:

> > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > yes, brendon todd won back to back on two fairly short, fairly tight golf courses. thinking that the longer guys were handcuffed, and hitting fairway woods and irons. so, what's your point? he'll have a chance of competing at harbour town.

> > > > >

> > > > > of more import, brendon has defeated the driver yips for the time being.

> > > > >

> > > > > also, i see more than 140 players averaging over 300 yards. a 10% reduction would be a start.

> > > >

> > > > My point is long driving don't necessarily win tournaments....Long driving don't necessarily win tounaments..Brendon Todd is 220th in driving distance on the PGA Tour. People driving it 300 yards means nothing if you can't score. 140 Pros hitting 300 yards means nothing, just ask Brendon Todd. Maybe if they hit their drives in the proper place just maybe they'll win like Todd...

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > The Pga tour can toughen these courses up if they wanted to.....but they don't want, the long ball sell tickets!

> > > >

> > > > No need to roll anything back....at the end of the tournament the lowest score wins!

> > >

> > > Todd won on a course that is over 7,000 yards and hitting it distances that 30 years ago would have been the longest driver on the Tour. This doesn't support your crazy assertion that classic 6,500 yard courses can be used for Tour events today.

> >

> > LOL!>>>>Nor does it support your theory for the need of 8000 yard courses.....so please stop with the paranoia..

>

> Given that he shot -20, 7000 yards didn't seem to be any big challenge.

 

-20 is too low? What would be a “perfect” winning number in your opinion?

[Titleist99]

> @LICC said:

> > @Titleist99 said:

> > > @LICC said:

> > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > yes, brendon todd won back to back on two fairly short, fairly tight golf courses. thinking that the longer guys were handcuffed, and hitting fairway woods and irons. so, what's your point? he'll have a chance of competing at harbour town.

> > > > >

> > > > > of more import, brendon has defeated the driver yips for the time being.

> > > > >

> > > > > also, i see more than 140 players averaging over 300 yards. a 10% reduction would be a start.

> > > >

> > > > My point is long driving don't necessarily win tournaments....Long driving don't necessarily win tounaments..Brendon Todd is 220th in driving distance on the PGA Tour. People driving it 300 yards means nothing if you can't score. 140 Pros hitting 300 yards means nothing, just ask Brendon Todd. Maybe if they hit their drives in the proper place just maybe they'll win like Todd...

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > The Pga tour can toughen these courses up if they wanted to.....but they don't want, the long ball sell tickets!

> > > >

> > > > No need to roll anything back....at the end of the tournament the lowest score wins!

> > >

> > > Todd won on a course that is over 7,000 yards and hitting it distances that 30 years ago would have been the longest driver on the Tour. This doesn't support your crazy assertion that classic 6,500 yard courses can be used for Tour events today.

> >

> > LOL!>>>>Nor does it support your theory for the need of 8000 yard courses.....so please stop with the paranoia..

>

> Given that he shot -20, 7000 yards didn't seem to be any big challenge.

 

LOL! >>>>This coming from a high-handicapper.....I'm sure that you would have shot atleast -10 on that easy course.....LOL!

[mahonie]

> @Titleist99 said:

> > @LICC said:

> > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > > yes, brendon todd won back to back on two fairly short, fairly tight golf courses. thinking that the longer guys were handcuffed, and hitting fairway woods and irons. so, what's your point? he'll have a chance of competing at harbour town.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > of more import, brendon has defeated the driver yips for the time being.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > also, i see more than 140 players averaging over 300 yards. a 10% reduction would be a start.

> > > > >

> > > > > My point is long driving don't necessarily win tournaments....Long driving don't necessarily win tounaments..Brendon Todd is 220th in driving distance on the PGA Tour. People driving it 300 yards means nothing if you can't score. 140 Pros hitting 300 yards means nothing, just ask Brendon Todd. Maybe if they hit their drives in the proper place just maybe they'll win like Todd...

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > The Pga tour can toughen these courses up if they wanted to.....but they don't want, the long ball sell tickets!

> > > > >

> > > > > No need to roll anything back....at the end of the tournament the lowest score wins!

> > > >

> > > > Todd won on a course that is over 7,000 yards and hitting it distances that 30 years ago would have been the longest driver on the Tour. This doesn't support your crazy assertion that classic 6,500 yard courses can be used for Tour events today.

> > >

> > > LOL!>>>>Nor does it support your theory for the need of 8000 yard courses.....so please stop with the paranoia..

> >

> > Given that he shot -20, 7000 yards didn't seem to be any big challenge.

>

> LOL! >>>>This coming from a high-handicapper.....I'm sure that you would have shot atleast -10 on that easy course.....LOL!

 

To score -20, a Pro must be on top of his game for 4 consecutive rounds if he is +5 handicap. When a journeyman does it, doesn’t that just show that something seems a bit wrong with the game overall? Either the courses are too easy or the equipment is making the game too easy for journeyman pros where shooting par should be the name of the game.

[oikos1]

It's become painfully obvious the "roll it back" supporters have little respect for the quality of current players or current state of the game.

[Titleist99]

> @mahonie said:

> > @Titleist99 said:

> > > @LICC said:

> > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > > > yes, brendon todd won back to back on two fairly short, fairly tight golf courses. thinking that the longer guys were handcuffed, and hitting fairway woods and irons. so, what's your point? he'll have a chance of competing at harbour town.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > of more import, brendon has defeated the driver yips for the time being.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > also, i see more than 140 players averaging over 300 yards. a 10% reduction would be a start.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > My point is long driving don't necessarily win tournaments....Long driving don't necessarily win tounaments..Brendon Todd is 220th in driving distance on the PGA Tour. People driving it 300 yards means nothing if you can't score. 140 Pros hitting 300 yards means nothing, just ask Brendon Todd. Maybe if they hit their drives in the proper place just maybe they'll win like Todd...

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > The Pga tour can toughen these courses up if they wanted to.....but they don't want, the long ball sell tickets!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > No need to roll anything back....at the end of the tournament the lowest score wins!

> > > > >

> > > > > Todd won on a course that is over 7,000 yards and hitting it distances that 30 years ago would have been the longest driver on the Tour. This doesn't support your crazy assertion that classic 6,500 yard courses can be used for Tour events today.

> > > >

> > > > LOL!>>>>Nor does it support your theory for the need of 8000 yard courses.....so please stop with the paranoia..

> > >

> > > Given that he shot -20, 7000 yards didn't seem to be any big challenge.

> >

> > LOL! >>>>This coming from a high-handicapper.....I'm sure that you would have shot atleast -10 on that easy course.....LOL!

>

> To score -20, a Pro must be on top of his game for 4 consecutive rounds if he is +5 handicap. When a journeyman does it, doesn’t that just show that something seems a bit wrong with the game overall? Either the courses are too easy or the equipment is making the game too easy for journeyman pros where shooting par should be the name of the game.

 

I can't believe that this golfwrx board is saying that golf is to easy but that is a subject for another time. PGATOUR scoring is all in course setup. It is not random, the tour want to see birdies fest at some events and others not so much. The U.S. Open is setup to be harder.

 

There is not a big difference between #1 player and the #100TH player in the world. It's called parody...

 

[gvogel]

> @Titleist99 said:

> > @gvogel said:

> > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > yes, brendon todd won back to back on two fairly short, fairly tight golf courses. thinking that the longer guys were handcuffed, and hitting fairway woods and irons. so, what's your point? he'll have a chance of competing at harbour town.

> > > >

> > > > of more import, brendon has defeated the driver yips for the time being.

> > > >

> > > > also, i see more than 140 players averaging over 300 yards. a 10% reduction would be a start.

> > >

> > > My point is long driving don't necessarily win tournaments....Long driving don't necessarily win tounaments..Brendon Todd is 220th in driving distance on the PGA Tour. People driving it 300 yards means nothing if you can't score. 140 Pros hitting 300 yards means nothing, just ask Brendon Todd. Maybe if they hit their drives in the proper place just maybe they'll win like Todd...

> > >

> > >

> > > The Pga tour can toughen these courses up if they wanted to.....but they don't want, the long ball sell tickets!

> > >

> > > No need to roll anything back....at the end of the tournament the lowest score wins!

> >

> > long driving doesn't necessarily win tournaments.

>

>

> That's when you know that a poster has nothing, they resort to being the grammar marshal on the tenth tee on a golf forum.....you should be embarrassed!!

> Or is it feel embarrassed, Marshal?

 

i'll accept the criticism, and i would still do it again.

[gvogel]

> @oikos1 said:

> It's become painfully obvious the "roll it back" supporters have little respect for the quality of current players or current state of the game.

 

 

not so. i am a huge fan of many of today's superstars.

[Titleist99]

> @gvogel said:

> > @Titleist99 said:

> > > @gvogel said:

> > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > yes, brendon todd won back to back on two fairly short, fairly tight golf courses. thinking that the longer guys were handcuffed, and hitting fairway woods and irons. so, what's your point? he'll have a chance of competing at harbour town.

> > > > >

> > > > > of more import, brendon has defeated the driver yips for the time being.

> > > > >

> > > > > also, i see more than 140 players averaging over 300 yards. a 10% reduction would be a start.

> > > >

> > > > My point is long driving don't necessarily win tournaments....Long driving don't necessarily win tounaments..Brendon Todd is 220th in driving distance on the PGA Tour. People driving it 300 yards means nothing if you can't score. 140 Pros hitting 300 yards means nothing, just ask Brendon Todd. Maybe if they hit their drives in the proper place just maybe they'll win like Todd...

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > The Pga tour can toughen these courses up if they wanted to.....but they don't want, the long ball sell tickets!

> > > >

> > > > No need to roll anything back....at the end of the tournament the lowest score wins!

> > >

> > > long driving doesn't necessarily win tournaments.

> >

> >

> > That's when you know that a poster has nothing, they resort to being the grammar marshal on the tenth tee on a golf forum.....you should be embarrassed!!

> > Or is it feel embarrassed, Marshal?

>

> i'll accept the criticism, and i would still do it again.

 

No shame what so ever.. Must be with the roll back crowd.

[BNGL]

> @Titleist99 said:

> > @mahonie said:

> > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > > > > yes, brendon todd won back to back on two fairly short, fairly tight golf courses. thinking that the longer guys were handcuffed, and hitting fairway woods and irons. so, what's your point? he'll have a chance of competing at harbour town.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > of more import, brendon has defeated the driver yips for the time being.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > also, i see more than 140 players averaging over 300 yards. a 10% reduction would be a start.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > My point is long driving don't necessarily win tournaments....Long driving don't necessarily win tounaments..Brendon Todd is 220th in driving distance on the PGA Tour. People driving it 300 yards means nothing if you can't score. 140 Pros hitting 300 yards means nothing, just ask Brendon Todd. Maybe if they hit their drives in the proper place just maybe they'll win like Todd...

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > The Pga tour can toughen these courses up if they wanted to.....but they don't want, the long ball sell tickets!

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > No need to roll anything back....at the end of the tournament the lowest score wins!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Todd won on a course that is over 7,000 yards and hitting it distances that 30 years ago would have been the longest driver on the Tour. This doesn't support your crazy assertion that classic 6,500 yard courses can be used for Tour events today.

> > > > >

> > > > > LOL!>>>>Nor does it support your theory for the need of 8000 yard courses.....so please stop with the paranoia..

> > > >

> > > > Given that he shot -20, 7000 yards didn't seem to be any big challenge.

> > >

> > > LOL! >>>>This coming from a high-handicapper.....I'm sure that you would have shot atleast -10 on that easy course.....LOL!

> >

> > To score -20, a Pro must be on top of his game for 4 consecutive rounds if he is +5 handicap. When a journeyman does it, doesn’t that just show that something seems a bit wrong with the game overall? Either the courses are too easy or the equipment is making the game too easy for journeyman pros where shooting par should be the name of the game.

>

> I can't believe that this golfwrx board is saying that golf is to easy but that is a subject for another time. PGATOUR scoring is all in course setup. It is not random, the tour want to see birdies fest at some events and others not so much. The U.S. Open is setup to be harder.

>

> There is not a big difference between #1 player and the #100TH player in the world. It's called parody...

>

 

Lest you’re being facetious, there’s a gigantic difference between Brooks Koepka (1 WGR) and Joel Dahmen (100 WGR). If you wanna go between 1 and 11 no difference sure, between 63 and 64 it’s a coin flip, but 1 to 100 is a pretty large discrepancy. Joel’s a great player...but he ain’t close to the best in the world.

 

Ps when you call someone out for being the, “grammar police” understand the difference between the homonyms parody and parity. You make a parody of proper grammar in your posts, while Joel Dahmen feigns parity with Brooks Koepka.

[Titleist99]

> @oikos1 said:

> It's become painfully obvious the "roll it back" supporters have little respect for the quality of current players or current state of the game.

 

Agreed, they seem to think that you can go to Dicks sporting goods and buy distance for $600 a driver...…..no practice necessary......LOL!

[LICC]

> @Titleist99 said:

> > @LICC said:

> > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > > yes, brendon todd won back to back on two fairly short, fairly tight golf courses. thinking that the longer guys were handcuffed, and hitting fairway woods and irons. so, what's your point? he'll have a chance of competing at harbour town.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > of more import, brendon has defeated the driver yips for the time being.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > also, i see more than 140 players averaging over 300 yards. a 10% reduction would be a start.

> > > > >

> > > > > My point is long driving don't necessarily win tournaments....Long driving don't necessarily win tounaments..Brendon Todd is 220th in driving distance on the PGA Tour. People driving it 300 yards means nothing if you can't score. 140 Pros hitting 300 yards means nothing, just ask Brendon Todd. Maybe if they hit their drives in the proper place just maybe they'll win like Todd...

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > The Pga tour can toughen these courses up if they wanted to.....but they don't want, the long ball sell tickets!

> > > > >

> > > > > No need to roll anything back....at the end of the tournament the lowest score wins!

> > > >

> > > > Todd won on a course that is over 7,000 yards and hitting it distances that 30 years ago would have been the longest driver on the Tour. This doesn't support your crazy assertion that classic 6,500 yard courses can be used for Tour events today.

> > >

> > > LOL!>>>>Nor does it support your theory for the need of 8000 yard courses.....so please stop with the paranoia..

> >

> > Given that he shot -20, 7000 yards didn't seem to be any big challenge.

>

> LOL! >>>>This coming from a high-handicapper.....I'm sure that you would have shot atleast -10 on that easy course.....LOL!

 

To paraphrase someone here : That's when you know that a poster has nothing, they resort to brainless personal insults on the tenth tee on a golf forum.....you should be embarrassed!!

[bladehunter]

> @Golfjack said:

> Another problem is if you made the ball fly shorter, female and junior golfers (who can't yet stripe it 300 yards) will struggle. You wouldn't be able to move the tee far enough up. You could make regular handicappers play from the red tee or gold tee, but then what about them? You would need new tee boxes, and for seniors as well.

 

This is the part that interests me a lot.

And it’s the part that gives me pause .

 

But I come up with this question. What did they do before pro v1 and 460cc? The vast majority of courses were built before then. So tees are same.

[Titleist99]

> @LICC said:

> > @Titleist99 said:

> > > @LICC said:

> > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > > > yes, brendon todd won back to back on two fairly short, fairly tight golf courses. thinking that the longer guys were handcuffed, and hitting fairway woods and irons. so, what's your point? he'll have a chance of competing at harbour town.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > of more import, brendon has defeated the driver yips for the time being.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > also, i see more than 140 players averaging over 300 yards. a 10% reduction would be a start.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > My point is long driving don't necessarily win tournaments....Long driving don't necessarily win tounaments..Brendon Todd is 220th in driving distance on the PGA Tour. People driving it 300 yards means nothing if you can't score. 140 Pros hitting 300 yards means nothing, just ask Brendon Todd. Maybe if they hit their drives in the proper place just maybe they'll win like Todd...

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > The Pga tour can toughen these courses up if they wanted to.....but they don't want, the long ball sell tickets!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > No need to roll anything back....at the end of the tournament the lowest score wins!

> > > > >

> > > > > Todd won on a course that is over 7,000 yards and hitting it distances that 30 years ago would have been the longest driver on the Tour. This doesn't support your crazy assertion that classic 6,500 yard courses can be used for Tour events today.

> > > >

> > > > LOL!>>>>Nor does it support your theory for the need of 8000 yard courses.....so please stop with the paranoia..

> > >

> > > Given that he shot -20, 7000 yards didn't seem to be any big challenge.

> >

> > LOL! >>>>This coming from a high-handicapper.....I'm sure that you would have shot atleast -10 on that easy course.....LOL!

>

> To paraphrase someone here : That's when you know that a poster has nothing, they resort to brainless personal insults on the tenth tee on a golf forum.....you should be embarrassed!!

 

Insult!! I think not....That was a compliment. Stop the paranoia!

[ThinkingPlus]

> @bladehunter said:

> > @Golfjack said:

> > Another problem is if you made the ball fly shorter, female and junior golfers (who can't yet stripe it 300 yards) will struggle. You wouldn't be able to move the tee far enough up. You could make regular handicappers play from the red tee or gold tee, but then what about them? You would need new tee boxes, and for seniors as well.

>

> This is the part that interests me a lot.

> And it’s the part that gives me pause .

>

> But I come up with this question. What did they do before pro v1 and 460cc? The vast majority of courses were built before then. So tees are same.

 

Fewer women and juniors played. While playing effectively longer, the courses were easier in some respects because greens were slower. Slower greens on average are easier to chip to and putt on. Bunkers, on average, were shallower. Greens, on average, were flatter. Green complexes have become harder to combat how "easy" the game has gotten because of the technological advancements. This is also why handicaps haven't gone down as expected with all the new technology. Just my opinion so no one should start looking for my data, stats, proof, etc... .

[Shilgy]

> @BNGL said:

> > @Titleist99 said:

> > > @mahonie said:

> > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > > > > > yes, brendon todd won back to back on two fairly short, fairly tight golf courses. thinking that the longer guys were handcuffed, and hitting fairway woods and irons. so, what's your point? he'll have a chance of competing at harbour town.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > of more import, brendon has defeated the driver yips for the time being.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > also, i see more than 140 players averaging over 300 yards. a 10% reduction would be a start.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > My point is long driving don't necessarily win tournaments....Long driving don't necessarily win tounaments..Brendon Todd is 220th in driving distance on the PGA Tour. People driving it 300 yards means nothing if you can't score. 140 Pros hitting 300 yards means nothing, just ask Brendon Todd. Maybe if they hit their drives in the proper place just maybe they'll win like Todd...

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > The Pga tour can toughen these courses up if they wanted to.....but they don't want, the long ball sell tickets!

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > No need to roll anything back....at the end of the tournament the lowest score wins!

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Todd won on a course that is over 7,000 yards and hitting it distances that 30 years ago would have been the longest driver on the Tour. This doesn't support your crazy assertion that classic 6,500 yard courses can be used for Tour events today.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > LOL!>>>>Nor does it support your theory for the need of 8000 yard courses.....so please stop with the paranoia..

> > > > >

> > > > > Given that he shot -20, 7000 yards didn't seem to be any big challenge.

> > > >

> > > > LOL! >>>>This coming from a high-handicapper.....I'm sure that you would have shot atleast -10 on that easy course.....LOL!

> > >

> > > To score -20, a Pro must be on top of his game for 4 consecutive rounds if he is +5 handicap. When a journeyman does it, doesn’t that just show that something seems a bit wrong with the game overall? Either the courses are too easy or the equipment is making the game too easy for journeyman pros where shooting par should be the name of the game.

> >

> > I can't believe that this golfwrx board is saying that golf is to easy but that is a subject for another time. PGATOUR scoring is all in course setup. It is not random, the tour want to see birdies fest at some events and others not so much. The U.S. Open is setup to be harder.

> >

> > There is not a big difference between #1 player and the #100TH player in the world. It's called parody...

> >

>

> Lest you’re being facetious, there’s a gigantic difference between Brooks Koepka (1 WGR) and Joel Dahmen (100 WGR). If you wanna go between 1 and 11 no difference sure, between 63 and 64 it’s a coin flip, but 1 to 100 is a pretty large discrepancy. Joel’s a great player...but he ain’t close to the best in the world.

>

> Ps when you call someone out for being the, “grammar police” understand the difference between the homonyms parody and parity. You make a parody of proper grammar in your posts, while Joel Dahmen feigns parity with Brooks Koepka.

 

> @BNGL said:

> > @Titleist99 said:

> > > @mahonie said:

> > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > > > > > yes, brendon todd won back to back on two fairly short, fairly tight golf courses. thinking that the longer guys were handcuffed, and hitting fairway woods and irons. so, what's your point? he'll have a chance of competing at harbour town.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > of more import, brendon has defeated the driver yips for the time being.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > also, i see more than 140 players averaging over 300 yards. a 10% reduction would be a start.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > My point is long driving don't necessarily win tournaments....Long driving don't necessarily win tounaments..Brendon Todd is 220th in driving distance on the PGA Tour. People driving it 300 yards means nothing if you can't score. 140 Pros hitting 300 yards means nothing, just ask Brendon Todd. Maybe if they hit their drives in the proper place just maybe they'll win like Todd...

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > The Pga tour can toughen these courses up if they wanted to.....but they don't want, the long ball sell tickets!

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > No need to roll anything back....at the end of the tournament the lowest score wins!

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Todd won on a course that is over 7,000 yards and hitting it distances that 30 years ago would have been the longest driver on the Tour. This doesn't support your crazy assertion that classic 6,500 yard courses can be used for Tour events today.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > LOL!>>>>Nor does it support your theory for the need of 8000 yard courses.....so please stop with the paranoia..

> > > > >

> > > > > Given that he shot -20, 7000 yards didn't seem to be any big challenge.

> > > >

> > > > LOL! >>>>This coming from a high-handicapper.....I'm sure that you would have shot atleast -10 on that easy course.....LOL!

> > >

> > > To score -20, a Pro must be on top of his game for 4 consecutive rounds if he is +5 handicap. When a journeyman does it, doesn’t that just show that something seems a bit wrong with the game overall? Either the courses are too easy or the equipment is making the game too easy for journeyman pros where shooting par should be the name of the game.

> >

> > I can't believe that this golfwrx board is saying that golf is to easy but that is a subject for another time. PGATOUR scoring is all in course setup. It is not random, the tour want to see birdies fest at some events and others not so much. The U.S. Open is setup to be harder.

> >

> > There is not a big difference between #1 player and the #100TH player in the world. It's called parody...

> >

>

> Lest you’re being facetious, there’s a gigantic difference between Brooks Koepka (1 WGR) and Joel Dahmen (100 WGR). If you wanna go between 1 and 11 no difference sure, between 63 and 64 it’s a coin flip, but 1 to 100 is a pretty large discrepancy. Joel’s a great player...but he ain’t close to the best in the world.

>

> Ps when you call someone out for being the, “grammar police” understand the difference between the homonyms parody and parity. You make a parody of proper grammar in your posts, while Joel Dahmen feigns parity with Brooks Koepka.

 

Less than one stroke per round scoring average between #6 and #100 last season. Any given week that is nothing.

[Shilgy]

> @mahonie said:

> > @Titleist99 said:

> > > @LICC said:

> > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > > > yes, brendon todd won back to back on two fairly short, fairly tight golf courses. thinking that the longer guys were handcuffed, and hitting fairway woods and irons. so, what's your point? he'll have a chance of competing at harbour town.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > of more import, brendon has defeated the driver yips for the time being.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > also, i see more than 140 players averaging over 300 yards. a 10% reduction would be a start.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > My point is long driving don't necessarily win tournaments....Long driving don't necessarily win tounaments..Brendon Todd is 220th in driving distance on the PGA Tour. People driving it 300 yards means nothing if you can't score. 140 Pros hitting 300 yards means nothing, just ask Brendon Todd. Maybe if they hit their drives in the proper place just maybe they'll win like Todd...

> > > > > >

> > > > > >

> > > > > > The Pga tour can toughen these courses up if they wanted to.....but they don't want, the long ball sell tickets!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > No need to roll anything back....at the end of the tournament the lowest score wins!

> > > > >

> > > > > Todd won on a course that is over 7,000 yards and hitting it distances that 30 years ago would have been the longest driver on the Tour. This doesn't support your crazy assertion that classic 6,500 yard courses can be used for Tour events today.

> > > >

> > > > LOL!>>>>Nor does it support your theory for the need of 8000 yard courses.....so please stop with the paranoia..

> > >

> > > Given that he shot -20, 7000 yards didn't seem to be any big challenge.

> >

> > LOL! >>>>This coming from a high-handicapper.....I'm sure that you would have shot atleast -10 on that easy course.....LOL!

>

> To score -20, a Pro must be on top of his game for 4 consecutive rounds if he is +5 handicap. When a journeyman does it, doesn’t that just show that something seems a bit wrong with the game overall? Either the courses are too easy or the equipment is making the game too easy for journeyman pros where shooting par should be the name of the game.

 

Why should “shooting par be the name of the game” at the highest level? It never has been and to get those scores week in and week out would be the result of hideously tricked up courses.

 

We have members at my club, as do most clubs, that are in the +3 to +5 handicap range. Shouldn’t the pros be allowed to show the public just why they are better than the local club hotshot?

[straightshot7]

> @Titleist99 said:

> > @LICC said:

> > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > @"Ashley Schaeffer" said:

> > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > @"Ashley Schaeffer" said:

> > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > @"Ashley Schaeffer" said:

> > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @"Ashley Schaeffer" said:

> > > > > > > > > > > Interesting concept. I can't think of a single golf course that is too short to host a competition where the lowest number of strokes wins.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > When in fact most all of the tour golf courses are insufficient in length to test the world's best players.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > I'm taking this as well-known courses that wouldn't be able to provide a decent challenge for a PGA Tour event. Just looking at the Golf Digest Top 200 US:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Cypress Point

> > > > > > > > > Fishers Island

> > > > > > > > > Crystal Downs

> > > > > > > > > Pacific Dunes

> > > > > > > > > Camargo

> > > > > > > > > Maidstone

> > > > > > > > > Essex County

> > > > > > > > > Myopia

> > > > > > > > > Montecito

> > > > > > > > > Pasatiempo

> > > > > > > > > The Creek

> > > > > > > > > Eastward Ho!

> > > > > > > > > St. Louis

> > > > > > > > > Fox Chapel

> > > > > > > > > Fairfield

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Interesting. I think every course on that list is long enough to host a stroke play event.

> > > > > > > > Pasatiempo, at 6500 yards, hosts the Western with top DI players who bomb it. I played it the week before the tournament this year, and it was playing tough. I think only 13 players in the field were under par after three rounds. -3 got you a T7.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Big difference when it comes to the Tour. 6 par-4s under 400 yards. A par-5 at only 500 yards. Half these guys would be at 5-under every round on these holes alone.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Ha! I'll go out on a limb and guess you've never played it. First, 6500 yards on the West Coast (the actual coast) isn't equivalent to 6500 yards on the East Coast. Not even close. Second, there's a bit more to the course than the length. If it had the room to host a PGA Tour event, I would bet my house that it wouldn't be the lowest winning score relative to par on tour.

> > > > >

> > > > > I think you are really stretching on that one! These guys hit it really far and dial in their wedges really close on either coast. Whether it would be the lowest score to par on the whole Tour or not isn't the deciding factor. Whether it has enough length to provide enough of a challenge to be a respectable PGA Tour event is the question.

> > > >

> > > > Yeah, maybe. Still, I think it would hold up just fine because it's a great design. It's wild to see certain classic courses still be able to challenge elite level players, and others have to resort to massive changes.

> > > > A Sunday pin on #16 at Pasatiempo would be incredible to watch. At 387, it would be iron-wedge, for sure, but that's not the challenge of the hole. If you'd ever tried to clip one off that downslope a precise distance, or be facing almost certain three-putt, you'd know what I'm talking about. Mackenzie's favorite hole on his favorite US course.

> > > >

> >

> > > >

> > >

> > > Nice Post......you get the gist of the thread. Just putting that out there because the thread wreckers are coming....LOL!

> >

> > Meaning what? I thought @"Ashley Schaeffer" and I had a good discussion on this with good points raised by both of us. Of course, my facts and analysis may counter your view, so let your freakout begin ... LOL!

>

> Totally different discussion.....I simply asked for the names of the venues that a major tournament can't be played due to the power game PGA TOUR and explain why? That shouldn't be to hard for anyone with average intelligence......

 

Haven't most (if not all) of the marquee courses in the world already been lengthened to match the modern state of the game at the highest level?

 

So your question sort of ignores the fact that the courses have already compensated for the increased power.

[James the Hogan Fan]

> @bladehunter said:

> > @Golfjack said:

> > Another problem is if you made the ball fly shorter, female and junior golfers (who can't yet stripe it 300 yards) will struggle. You wouldn't be able to move the tee far enough up. You could make regular handicappers play from the red tee or gold tee, but then what about them? You would need new tee boxes, and for seniors as well.

>

> This is the part that interests me a lot.

> And it’s the part that gives me pause .

>

> But I come up with this question. What did they do before pro v1 and 460cc? The vast majority of courses were built before then. So tees are same.

 

What did anyone do? What entitles a player to distance anyway? High school baseball bats have been constantly reigned in and reigned in some more, and no one seems to mind. (beyond an annual need to buy new bats)

 

If you mandated persimmon I'd probably move up a tee and my cap would jump 5-6 shots until I had practiced it back down again. Maybe I'm just a diehard. (not maybe)

 

I don't think it really matters in the end for me, I'll find a way to keep on golfing regardless. Even if it's that Japanese Park Golf variant.

[mahonie]

> @Shilgy said:

> > @mahonie said:

> > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > > > > yes, brendon todd won back to back on two fairly short, fairly tight golf courses. thinking that the longer guys were handcuffed, and hitting fairway woods and irons. so, what's your point? he'll have a chance of competing at harbour town.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > of more import, brendon has defeated the driver yips for the time being.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > also, i see more than 140 players averaging over 300 yards. a 10% reduction would be a start.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > My point is long driving don't necessarily win tournaments....Long driving don't necessarily win tounaments..Brendon Todd is 220th in driving distance on the PGA Tour. People driving it 300 yards means nothing if you can't score. 140 Pros hitting 300 yards means nothing, just ask Brendon Todd. Maybe if they hit their drives in the proper place just maybe they'll win like Todd...

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > The Pga tour can toughen these courses up if they wanted to.....but they don't want, the long ball sell tickets!

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > No need to roll anything back....at the end of the tournament the lowest score wins!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Todd won on a course that is over 7,000 yards and hitting it distances that 30 years ago would have been the longest driver on the Tour. This doesn't support your crazy assertion that classic 6,500 yard courses can be used for Tour events today.

> > > > >

> > > > > LOL!>>>>Nor does it support your theory for the need of 8000 yard courses.....so please stop with the paranoia..

> > > >

> > > > Given that he shot -20, 7000 yards didn't seem to be any big challenge.

> > >

> > > LOL! >>>>This coming from a high-handicapper.....I'm sure that you would have shot atleast -10 on that easy course.....LOL!

> >

> > To score -20, a Pro must be on top of his game for 4 consecutive rounds if he is +5 handicap. When a journeyman does it, doesn’t that just show that something seems a bit wrong with the game overall? Either the courses are too easy or the equipment is making the game too easy for journeyman pros where shooting par should be the name of the game.

>

> Why should “shooting par be the name of the game” at the highest level? It never has been and to get those scores week in and week out would be the result of hideously tricked up courses.

>

> We have members at my club, as do most clubs, that are in the +3 to +5 handicap range. Shouldn’t the pros be allowed to show the public just why they are better than the local club hotshot?

 

I’ve just read up on how par is calculated by the USGA Course Rating System and I can now understand how scores of -20 are posted nearly every week. If I’ve got it right, a scratch golfer should be able to shoot par on any rated course. The USGA use standardised shot lengths to calculate par using a drive of 250 yards for a scratch golfer. As the length off the tee is obviously much more than that on Tour, if I was a pro and not regularly shooting -5 to -8 per round I would to be honest be a bit disappointed in myself!

 

So yes you are correct that the courses would need to be tricked up to reflect a par score as it is on the card, but taking the above into account and knowing that par is based on 250 yard drives, I won’t feel hood-winked when I see those low scores that are being posted on the PGA Tour because par for the majority of PGA Tour venues is more likely to be around 67 to 69.

[BNGL]

> @Shilgy said:

> > @BNGL said:

> > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > @mahonie said:

> > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > > > > > > yes, brendon todd won back to back on two fairly short, fairly tight golf courses. thinking that the longer guys were handcuffed, and hitting fairway woods and irons. so, what's your point? he'll have a chance of competing at harbour town.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > of more import, brendon has defeated the driver yips for the time being.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > also, i see more than 140 players averaging over 300 yards. a 10% reduction would be a start.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > My point is long driving don't necessarily win tournaments....Long driving don't necessarily win tounaments..Brendon Todd is 220th in driving distance on the PGA Tour. People driving it 300 yards means nothing if you can't score. 140 Pros hitting 300 yards means nothing, just ask Brendon Todd. Maybe if they hit their drives in the proper place just maybe they'll win like Todd...

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > The Pga tour can toughen these courses up if they wanted to.....but they don't want, the long ball sell tickets!

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > No need to roll anything back....at the end of the tournament the lowest score wins!

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Todd won on a course that is over 7,000 yards and hitting it distances that 30 years ago would have been the longest driver on the Tour. This doesn't support your crazy assertion that classic 6,500 yard courses can be used for Tour events today.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > LOL!>>>>Nor does it support your theory for the need of 8000 yard courses.....so please stop with the paranoia..

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Given that he shot -20, 7000 yards didn't seem to be any big challenge.

> > > > >

> > > > > LOL! >>>>This coming from a high-handicapper.....I'm sure that you would have shot atleast -10 on that easy course.....LOL!

> > > >

> > > > To score -20, a Pro must be on top of his game for 4 consecutive rounds if he is +5 handicap. When a journeyman does it, doesn’t that just show that something seems a bit wrong with the game overall? Either the courses are too easy or the equipment is making the game too easy for journeyman pros where shooting par should be the name of the game.

> > >

> > > I can't believe that this golfwrx board is saying that golf is to easy but that is a subject for another time. PGATOUR scoring is all in course setup. It is not random, the tour want to see birdies fest at some events and others not so much. The U.S. Open is setup to be harder.

> > >

> > > There is not a big difference between #1 player and the #100TH player in the world. It's called parody...

> > >

> >

> > Lest you’re being facetious, there’s a gigantic difference between Brooks Koepka (1 WGR) and Joel Dahmen (100 WGR). If you wanna go between 1 and 11 no difference sure, between 63 and 64 it’s a coin flip, but 1 to 100 is a pretty large discrepancy. Joel’s a great player...but he ain’t close to the best in the world.

> >

> > Ps when you call someone out for being the, “grammar police” understand the difference between the homonyms parody and parity. You make a parody of proper grammar in your posts, while Joel Dahmen feigns parity with Brooks Koepka.

>

> > @BNGL said:

> > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > @mahonie said:

> > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > > > > > > yes, brendon todd won back to back on two fairly short, fairly tight golf courses. thinking that the longer guys were handcuffed, and hitting fairway woods and irons. so, what's your point? he'll have a chance of competing at harbour town.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > of more import, brendon has defeated the driver yips for the time being.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > also, i see more than 140 players averaging over 300 yards. a 10% reduction would be a start.

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > My point is long driving don't necessarily win tournaments....Long driving don't necessarily win tounaments..Brendon Todd is 220th in driving distance on the PGA Tour. People driving it 300 yards means nothing if you can't score. 140 Pros hitting 300 yards means nothing, just ask Brendon Todd. Maybe if they hit their drives in the proper place just maybe they'll win like Todd...

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > The Pga tour can toughen these courses up if they wanted to.....but they don't want, the long ball sell tickets!

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > No need to roll anything back....at the end of the tournament the lowest score wins!

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Todd won on a course that is over 7,000 yards and hitting it distances that 30 years ago would have been the longest driver on the Tour. This doesn't support your crazy assertion that classic 6,500 yard courses can be used for Tour events today.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > LOL!>>>>Nor does it support your theory for the need of 8000 yard courses.....so please stop with the paranoia..

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Given that he shot -20, 7000 yards didn't seem to be any big challenge.

> > > > >

> > > > > LOL! >>>>This coming from a high-handicapper.....I'm sure that you would have shot atleast -10 on that easy course.....LOL!

> > > >

> > > > To score -20, a Pro must be on top of his game for 4 consecutive rounds if he is +5 handicap. When a journeyman does it, doesn’t that just show that something seems a bit wrong with the game overall? Either the courses are too easy or the equipment is making the game too easy for journeyman pros where shooting par should be the name of the game.

> > >

> > > I can't believe that this golfwrx board is saying that golf is to easy but that is a subject for another time. PGATOUR scoring is all in course setup. It is not random, the tour want to see birdies fest at some events and others not so much. The U.S. Open is setup to be harder.

> > >

> > > There is not a big difference between #1 player and the #100TH player in the world. It's called parody...

> > >

> >

> > Lest you’re being facetious, there’s a gigantic difference between Brooks Koepka (1 WGR) and Joel Dahmen (100 WGR). If you wanna go between 1 and 11 no difference sure, between 63 and 64 it’s a coin flip, but 1 to 100 is a pretty large discrepancy. Joel’s a great player...but he ain’t close to the best in the world.

> >

> > Ps when you call someone out for being the, “grammar police” understand the difference between the homonyms parody and parity. You make a parody of proper grammar in your posts, while Joel Dahmen feigns parity with Brooks Koepka.

>

> Less than one stroke per round scoring average between #6 and #100 last season. Any given week that is nothing.

 

Eh I can’t argue with stroke average, as I said Joel’s a great player, but he’s not close to number one in the world. I knew someone would bring up stroke average and the numbers are what they are, but I know a lot of rank and file guys (maybe Joel isn’t in that category depends on your definition of rank and file). I’ve also played with Rory, played a few with DJ, hit balls next to Tiger, even played with Brooks before he was on Tour (minor league golf tour). Now I don’t know anything about Joel, I’m not I could point him out without a placard on the range, but if I were to play 18 with Rory and Joel, I could almost guarantee you that I’d find a half shot difference between them. Which might not seem like a lot, but that’s a lot (to me) at the professional level. It’s hard to understand because you can’t really quantify 1/2 shots on the card. But it does add up over a tournament and a season.

 

Now for a week can anyone win? Yeah sure I’ll grant you that (but I’d still ride with a top 10 player all being equal), over two weeks to a month? Not as much. Over a season? No way in hell am I picking Joel Dahmen over a top 10 player assuming each is healthy. Now that doesn’t mean that if DJ and Rory show up next year at the Puerto Rico Open that they’ll automatically be 1-2. I’m sort of rambling but I guess to conclude, no one who’s rational outside of Joel and his mother is going to pick him against Brooks in a tournament.

 

Not picking on Joel he just happens be too 100, which is a fantastic achievement he’s obviously a great player, all I’m trying to highlight is the discrepancy between 1-100 or 6-100 in this case. I’d defense Joel going the other way too, 100-250 etc. but when the WGR difference is 99 generally there’s a difference in quality of play (I say generally because I’m not sure how rankings are tabulated, events over a two year stretch over strength of field so maybe someone just played good events but...). And if you wanna say between 1-15, or 30-33, 85-100 there’s not much difference that way, I just don’t accept nor agree with 1-100 being the same. I wish I could put into concrete terms the differences but I don’t know how.

[Golfjack]

> @BNGL said:

> > @Shilgy said:

> > > @BNGL said:

> > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > @mahonie said:

> > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > > > > > > > yes, brendon todd won back to back on two fairly short, fairly tight golf courses. thinking that the longer guys were handcuffed, and hitting fairway woods and irons. so, what's your point? he'll have a chance of competing at harbour town.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > of more import, brendon has defeated the driver yips for the time being.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > also, i see more than 140 players averaging over 300 yards. a 10% reduction would be a start.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > My point is long driving don't necessarily win tournaments....Long driving don't necessarily win tounaments..Brendon Todd is 220th in driving distance on the PGA Tour. People driving it 300 yards means nothing if you can't score. 140 Pros hitting 300 yards means nothing, just ask Brendon Todd. Maybe if they hit their drives in the proper place just maybe they'll win like Todd...

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > The Pga tour can toughen these courses up if they wanted to.....but they don't want, the long ball sell tickets!

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > No need to roll anything back....at the end of the tournament the lowest score wins!

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Todd won on a course that is over 7,000 yards and hitting it distances that 30 years ago would have been the longest driver on the Tour. This doesn't support your crazy assertion that classic 6,500 yard courses can be used for Tour events today.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > LOL!>>>>Nor does it support your theory for the need of 8000 yard courses.....so please stop with the paranoia..

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Given that he shot -20, 7000 yards didn't seem to be any big challenge.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > LOL! >>>>This coming from a high-handicapper.....I'm sure that you would have shot atleast -10 on that easy course.....LOL!

> > > > >

> > > > > To score -20, a Pro must be on top of his game for 4 consecutive rounds if he is +5 handicap. When a journeyman does it, doesn’t that just show that something seems a bit wrong with the game overall? Either the courses are too easy or the equipment is making the game too easy for journeyman pros where shooting par should be the name of the game.

> > > >

> > > > I can't believe that this golfwrx board is saying that golf is to easy but that is a subject for another time. PGATOUR scoring is all in course setup. It is not random, the tour want to see birdies fest at some events and others not so much. The U.S. Open is setup to be harder.

> > > >

> > > > There is not a big difference between #1 player and the #100TH player in the world. It's called parody...

> > > >

> > >

> > > Lest you’re being facetious, there’s a gigantic difference between Brooks Koepka (1 WGR) and Joel Dahmen (100 WGR). If you wanna go between 1 and 11 no difference sure, between 63 and 64 it’s a coin flip, but 1 to 100 is a pretty large discrepancy. Joel’s a great player...but he ain’t close to the best in the world.

> > >

> > > Ps when you call someone out for being the, “grammar police” understand the difference between the homonyms parody and parity. You make a parody of proper grammar in your posts, while Joel Dahmen feigns parity with Brooks Koepka.

> >

> > > @BNGL said:

> > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > @mahonie said:

> > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > > @LICC said:

> > > > > > > > > > @Titleist99 said:

> > > > > > > > > > > @gvogel said:

> > > > > > > > > > > yes, brendon todd won back to back on two fairly short, fairly tight golf courses. thinking that the longer guys were handcuffed, and hitting fairway woods and irons. so, what's your point? he'll have a chance of competing at harbour town.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > of more import, brendon has defeated the driver yips for the time being.

> > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > also, i see more than 140 players averaging over 300 yards. a 10% reduction would be a start.

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > My point is long driving don't necessarily win tournaments....Long driving don't necessarily win tounaments..Brendon Todd is 220th in driving distance on the PGA Tour. People driving it 300 yards means nothing if you can't score. 140 Pros hitting 300 yards means nothing, just ask Brendon Todd. Maybe if they hit their drives in the proper place just maybe they'll win like Todd...

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > The Pga tour can toughen these courses up if they wanted to.....but they don't want, the long ball sell tickets!

> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > No need to roll anything back....at the end of the tournament the lowest score wins!

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Todd won on a course that is over 7,000 yards and hitting it distances that 30 years ago would have been the longest driver on the Tour. This doesn't support your crazy assertion that classic 6,500 yard courses can be used for Tour events today.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > LOL!>>>>Nor does it support your theory for the need of 8000 yard courses.....so please stop with the paranoia..

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Given that he shot -20, 7000 yards didn't seem to be any big challenge.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > LOL! >>>>This coming from a high-handicapper.....I'm sure that you would have shot atleast -10 on that easy course.....LOL!

> > > > >

> > > > > To score -20, a Pro must be on top of his game for 4 consecutive rounds if he is +5 handicap. When a journeyman does it, doesn’t that just show that something seems a bit wrong with the game overall? Either the courses are too easy or the equipment is making the game too easy for journeyman pros where shooting par should be the name of the game.

> > > >

> > > > I can't believe that this golfwrx board is saying that golf is to easy but that is a subject for another time. PGATOUR scoring is all in course setup. It is not random, the tour want to see birdies fest at some events and others not so much. The U.S. Open is setup to be harder.

> > > >

> > > > There is not a big difference between #1 player and the #100TH player in the world. It's called parody...

> > > >

> > >

> > > Lest you’re being facetious, there’s a gigantic difference between Brooks Koepka (1 WGR) and Joel Dahmen (100 WGR). If you wanna go between 1 and 11 no difference sure, between 63 and 64 it’s a coin flip, but 1 to 100 is a pretty large discrepancy. Joel’s a great player...but he ain’t close to the best in the world.

> > >

> > > Ps when you call someone out for being the, “grammar police” understand the difference between the homonyms parody and parity. You make a parody of proper grammar in your posts, while Joel Dahmen feigns parity with Brooks Koepka.

> >

> > Less than one stroke per round scoring average between #6 and #100 last season. Any given week that is nothing.

>

> Eh I can’t argue with stroke average, as I said Joel’s a great player, but he’s not close to number one in the world. I knew someone would bring up stroke average and the numbers are what they are, but I know a lot of rank and file guys (maybe Joel isn’t in that category depends on your definition of rank and file). I’ve also played with Rory, played a few with DJ, hit balls next to Tiger, even played with Brooks before he was on Tour (minor league golf tour). Now I don’t know anything about Joel, I’m not I could point him out without a placard on the range, but if I were to play 18 with Rory and Joel, I could almost guarantee you that I’d find a half shot difference between them. Which might not seem like a lot, but that’s a lot (to me) at the professional level. It’s hard to understand because you can’t really quantify 1/2 shots on the card. But it does add up over a tournament and a season.

>

> Now for a week can anyone win? Yeah sure I’ll grant you that (but I’d still ride with a top 10 player all being equal), over two weeks to a month? Not as much. Over a season? No way in **** am I picking Joel Dahmen over a top 10 player assuming each is healthy. Now that doesn’t mean that if DJ and Rory show up next year at the Puerto Rico Open that they’ll automatically be 1-2. I’m sort of rambling but I guess to conclude, no one who’s rational outside of Joel and his mother is going to pick him against Brooks in a tournament.

>

> Not picking on Joel he just happens be too 100, which is a fantastic achievement he’s obviously a great player, all I’m trying to highlight is the discrepancy between 1-100 or 6-100 in this case. I’d defense Joel going the other way too, 100-250 etc. but when the WGR difference is 99 generally there’s a difference in quality of play (I say generally because I’m not sure how rankings are tabulated, events over a two year stretch over strength of field so maybe someone just played good events but...). And if you wanna say between 1-15, or 30-33, 85-100 there’s not much difference that way, I just don’t accept nor agree with 1-100 being the same. I wish I could put into concrete terms the differences but I don’t know how.

 

Yup that's true. For pro's, the difference is tiny. You can't take an average number then say oh that week means nothing. Actually even half a stroke is 2 strokes over 4 rounds. That could be the difference between making the cut often and not for some players, and keeping the tour card or not. 1/2 stroke is huge. Look at the top SG guys, they are only 1.something SG. Top 1 can exceed two but that's probably a multiple winning year.

[c7015]

I think it's easy to blame the visible tech in the game like ball and driver but during that same revolution, we also have tech like trackman and physical tech (ice baths, blood spinning) that also contribute that might be less visible.