Pro Golf’s Top-5 Greatest Over Achievers....

[MUNIGRIT]

I play golf with Paul a couple times a year and take lessons from him from time to time. He is a great dude. Those 2 started the ASU power house of college golf I believe.

[chigolfer1]

nt

[chigolfer1]

Don't know the criteria for "overachiever" but I'll play anyway.

Overachiever: Zach Johnson

Underachiever AND Overachiever: Steve Stricker

[Forged4ever]

Ok, I’ll bite....

 

1) Zack Johnson~ Nuff said above me⬆️

2) Bubba~ Yea, Bubba. Ya may think that I’m crazy cuz most look at overachievers as lackin in some physical way, either within themselves or with their game, and Bubba may be one of THE most physically gifted Players to ever Play for Pay. However, it’s the intangibles that didn’t just stack the table against him, they stacked a warehouse full of tables against him. Forget his personal/psychological traits that make his chosen occupation one of THE most horrendous career choices that he could’ve made(If ya know a competent shrink, ask em if ya doubt me?). Then, he’s NEVER had a single golf lesson, though there’s no one on earth that could teach, work on or repair that swing so it’s just as well, cuz he already has enough head issues and “paralysis by analysis,” which soooo many Tour Boys suffer from, is the last thing the Bubster needs. My final reason for including Bubba in my list is prior to hitting The Show, he had never won a SINGLE professional event before reaching the PGA Tour. Not in Local events, not on the mini-tours & not on the Nationwide Tour. Back in 2005, he finished 21st on the Nationwide Tour money list, which at the time promoted its top 20 players to The Show. However, because No. 1-ranked Jason Gore had already claimed his card through his Play on the Big Tour, the Nationwide extended the offer to the 21st player, which was Bubba. If you can’t appreciate a Tour Player having won his very first Professional Tournament on the PGA Tour, ask your local Class A, who odds are, has won at least a local open tourney, what the odds are of that happening or that individual succeeding at the Super Star level. Yea, yea, yea, I know all about “late bloomers.” This is different

3) Mark Wilson~ 5’8”, a buck fourty, 275 ave with a gale behind him(He’s the ONLY Tour Boy that I’ve EVER outdriven on their average balls) and FIVE Tour Victories!! Are you friggin kidding me??? The flip side is that he’s a super nice guy and success couldn’t have come to a more deserving individual

4) Ian~ C’mon, anyone who was a negative capper as a Pro, lied his *ss off on his app, then beat balls & Played until he was a Plus, then beat more balls & Played more golf to be competitive in local Tourneys, then beat more balls & Played more golf to Play at the elite level and then he becomes one of THE finest Ryder Cuppers to Tee it up for the Euros is an overachiever to me

5) Robert Rock~ He was just this side of Ian as an Instructor at a golf center, couldn’t make cuts in Local Tourneys that had cuts, then beat balls, Played golf and won those, got a few invites into Euro Tour events, Played well enough to keep Playin then he won two, defeating Rory by a shot with a birdie on 18 in one of em. . He was competitive for a few rounds in the US Open at Congressional, after arriving at the 11 1/2 hour.

 

Thanks to all for responding

RP

Edited March 2, 2021 by Forged4ever

[ChrisL52188]

The greatest over-achiever is pretty obvious... Jack Nicklaus? Or did he underachieved? Which is scary to comprehend.

[MUNIGRIT]

John Brodie

 

Mark "beer man" Johnson

[Forged4ever]

While I most certainly wouldn’t say that he underachieved, there are those that would point to his 19 runner-ups in Majors and chirp something about a less than 50% “closing” rate, though one would have to look into that number “19” much closer to see if he indeed did “give” any of those away, ala Norman at Augusta, which I highly doubt that he did, lolol.

I also wouldn’t classify him as an underachiever and in fact, most that I have spoken to who saw him Play as an amateur in Ohio called him a “Prodigy.”

While not in the class of Tiger, he took up the game at age 10yo, shot a 51 from the mens’ tees at Sciota Country Club, site of many USGA events, one month later, under the tutelage of lifelong Teacher & Mentor, Jack Grout, and he Played every stroke down and in.

Six years later, Jack won the Ohio Open, defeating both the Top Ams AND Pros in the state to gain the victory and then three years later he defeated Charlie Coe in one of the Epic US Amateur Finals Matches, 1-up.

His encore??

He repeated as US Am Champion the following year.

***Later Edit: 06/19/20, 7:00am: The above statement is incorrect, as verified by @Darth Putter Jack did not win consecutive US Ams, as he won in 1959 and again in 1961. That doesn’t change my opinion that he was not an underachiever.  I just spoke to an individual who I mentioned had seen him Play as an am, and this Gent actually competed against him in HS, and what he remembers the most, aside from his scores, was his prodigious length off the tee, how far he put it past the other “kids” and how high and far that he hit a 1 & 2i, when most of the other HS kids didn’t ever take em outa their bag, much less try to hit em. He literally laughed at me when I asked “would you say that he was an underachiever," lol

Thanx @Darth Putter for the correction~ RP II

So, within a decade of pickin up his first stick, Jack was the Top Am in the land, if not the world.

When Jack started Playin for Pay, the question was not “if,” it was only “how many,” lol?

Great question Chris

Fairways & Greens 4ever My Friend⛳️
RP
 

Edited February 26, 2021 by Forged4ever

[ChrisL52188]

Sam Snead, after reading lot of material on him, I think he underachieved... Why did he struggle with putting in his later years? I mean, he perhaps the finest swing ever.

[nitram]

Geoff Ogilvy

Todd Hamilton

Ben Curtis

Danny Willett

Rich Beem

Not necessarily in that order

 

[Darth Putter]

for the record Jack's 19 runner ups

 

#1 1960 US Open: This might be the one that most got away. Then again, he was the 20 year old reigning US Amateur Champion. He had the lead after a birdie at #9, but his putter went cold on the back 9. He 3 putted from ten feet on #13 and then 3 putted again on #14. Ben Hogan said after the round that" I played 36 holes today with a kid that should have won this Open by ten shots."

#2 1964 Masters: Jack started the day 9 back of Arnie and shot 67 to tie for second in Palmer's last major win.

#3 1964 British Open: Jack started the day in second 7 shots behind Tony Lema and finished 5 back with a 68. (In the 1963 British Open he bogeyed #17 and #18 to miss the playoff by 1)

#4 1964 PGA: Yep 3 in a year, not even Greg Norman could do that. Started 6 back in his home town of Columbus, shot 64 and still lost by 3 to Bobby Nichols.

#5 1965 PGA: started 2 back and lost by 2 to Dave Marr

#6 1967 British Open: started 3 back of Roberto DeVincenzo and lost by 2

#7 1968 US Open: He started the final round in third 7 back of leader Bert Yancey and 6 behind Lee Trevino. He shot 67, but still lost by four.

#8 1968 British Open: started 4 back of Billy Casper and lost to Gary Player by 2

#9 1971 Masters: He started tied for the lead with Charles Coody after 3 rounds. They were passed by Johnny Miller but he bogeyed 2 out of the last 3 holes. Jack was tied for the lead until he bogeyed 12. He parred in and lost by 2 to Coody when he made birdies at #15 and #16. Jack missed a 5 footer for birdie at #13, hit a loose chip at #15 from over the green to leave a long birdie putt, then hit it far short of the flag at #16, but there was no miracle putt this time.

#10 1971 US Open: Jack started the final day 2 behind of amateur Jim Simons and 2 ahead of Lee Trevino. After a double bogey at #5 dropped him to even par and one behind, he parred every hole in. Trevino missed an 8 footer at #18 to finish at even. Jack missed a 15 footer at #18 to win. In the playoff Jack made a double bogey on #3 to fall two back and while he did cut the deficit to one shot three times, he never caught Lee.

#11 1972 British Open: Jack started the final round 6 back of Lee Trevino in his bid to own all four majors at once. (not win four in a row) Lee was -6 after holing a couple of chips at #16 and #18. Jack charged into a three way tie with a chip in of his own, but a bogey at #16 left him in at 279. Lee's memorable chip in at #17 for par saved his one shot victory with a total of 278.

#12 1974 PGA: The last loss to Trevino. Jack started one behind, but spent most of the back 9 two shots back of Lee. Trevino's only 3 putt of the tournament on #17 reduced the lead to one, but Jack failed to catch him. Richard can tell you everything you want to know about the 62 year old that tied for third.

#13 `1976 British Open: He started the final round 5 behind Seve. He caught him with a 69, but finished 6 back of Johnny Miller. (he had a better shot in 1975 when he missed the playoff by one)

#14 1977 Masters: He started the final round at -4 and 3 behind Tom Watson and Ben Crenshaw. He charged and was tied with Tom Watson as he approached his ball in the 18th fairway at -11. Watson makes birdie at #17 as Jack walks up to his ball. Jack then hits one of the worst irons of his entire career as he chunks it into the front bunker. He makes bogey and winds up 2 back.

#15 1977 British Open: Jack throws a 65-66 at Tom Watson and he responds with a 65-65. Jack finishes 10 shots ahead of third on a Hall of Fame littered leaderboard.

#16 1979 British Open: Jack's seventh and final runner up in this Championship. He started 3 back of Hale Irwin and 1 behind Seve. An early bogey left him adrift of the leaders and only his steady play on the difficult back side left him in second. He finished 3 behind Seve.

#17 1981 Masters: Jack lead by four shots after 36 holes and lost? It happened! He started the final round 1 back of Tom Watson, but no one other than Johnny Miller really played well and Watson won by 2. Tiger Woods also was up four shots after 36 holes in the 2009 PGA and lost.

#18 1982 US Open: Jack started the final round 3 back of Tom Watson and Bill Rogers. He bogeyed the first and then made par at the easy second., then reeled off 5 straight birdies. He bogeyed #8 and really tossed one away at #11. A birdie at #15 got him back to -4 and that's where he finished. Tom Watson had an up and down back 9 with two birdies and bogeys and was tied as he stepped to the tee at #17. The rest is history.

#19 1983 PGA: Jack started the final round 6 back of Hal Sutton. He was 7 back at the turn. Sutton choked away a 6 shot lead to Calvin Peete at the Anheuser Busch only two weeks before. And he started to come unglued again. Hal made three bogeys as the lead slipped to just one shot. But he parred the last four and won by one shot. At that point Hal Sutton was 25 with wins in the US Amateur, the TPC that March and the PGA. Hal was the 1983 leading money winner and Player of the Year. Jack Nicklaus said after the tournament, "I have the feeling this is the first of many." Hal Sutton won 14 times on the PGA Tour, even beating peak Tiger in the 2000 TPC, but he never won another major.

 

Jack was 10 out of 12 when leading or tied for the lead after 54 holes. He lost only the 1971 Masters and 1977 British Open. When he lead after 54 holes he was a perfect 8 for 8.

 

 

minor nitpick Jack did not win two US Amateurs in a row, he won in 1959 and 1961

[Forged4ever]

Thanks for the correction

 

All the Best,

RP

Edited February 26, 2021 by Forged4ever

[smashdn]

Lots of guys struggle with putting in their later years. Hogan, Langer until he found the broomstick.

[Forged4ever]

Sam was a basket case, lolol

 

Then he was convinced that both the USGA and PGA were out to force him into retirement cuz of their rules changes in 1968 banning his croquet putting style, which he had used successfully through the 60’s.

 

Tom Watson is another All-Timer who’s putting stroke did not age as gracefully as his swing, arguably costing him a Major at 59yo.

 

On an unrelated note though this pic of Sam shows something that always impressed me and that is that while he never lifted a weight, he did work the farm and fields when younger and as this pic shows, he had larger and thicker than average biceps and forearms. Obviously hitting millions of balls will do that for the forearms however it was his thick biceps that stood out to me. Prior to his first stroke, he was thick through the chest also. I had just never seen another man with those kind of “pipes” who had never done any weight work or body weight exercises to obtain that size and definition. The Snead Boys came from an incredible gene pool, haha.

 

Cheers

RP

Edited February 26, 2021 by Forged4ever

[smashdn]

I'll have to agree with the USGA, straddling the line is not a proper golf stroke.

[Body_Visions]

Worst looking mess I have ever seen.

 

Makes my long putter look normal.

 

But, you cant let someone use a method for years, then call it lilegal.

 

Since you you seem to know Mr. Snead, do you think there is any truth to the persistent rumors that had it been Hogan, or someone else doing that, it would have been allowed.

 

Furthrmore, was it Bobby Jones, and “Augusta” that was behind it, and if so, why?

 

 

 

 

[Darth Putter]

Yep, Bobby Jones saw it at The Masters and got it outlawed.

Sam Snead's desperate measures on the greens

 

 

[MUNIGRIT]

Why is straddling a line considered illegal? Just like long putters if people want to do it let them. If it's such an advantage everyone will do it.

[Forged4ever]

Hi BV, I hope all’s well?

 

While I cannot speak to what might have been allowed had it been Hogan, Palmer or even a Gary Player, I can speak to Dey and Jones’ feelings towards Sam.

 

Regarding Sam’s feelings on if it were someone else, I only heard him jokingly say that had it been Hogan or Palmer, they’d have let it slide, though these were light hearted moments versus in other situations when I knew that there was underlying animosity or negative feelings, I didn’t detect that in his tone when this subject came up regarding other Players.

 

However, the tone was different regarding Jones and Joseph C. Dey, Exec Dir of the USGA. Neither of them cared for Sam or his personality and in Jones’ words, his sometimes “bawdy blue” jokes and sense of humor while at Augusta, especially at the Champions’ Dinner, and there was no love lost from Sam’s corner, going back to the 1939 US Open final round pairings, which Dey normally didn’t insert himself into, though he did that year, and for only the first 4 groups(2 man pairings). That’s a story for another day.

 

However, it was Jones who really lit the fire? under the USGA’s *ss and it was due to Sam’s T10 finish in the 1967 Masters, his best finish since the early 1960’s, 1961-1962, I forget exactly, using his croquet putting style, all the hoopla around his “new” putting style, and Jones’ belief that while this style was fine for a croquet field, there was no place for it on the greens of Augusta.

 

The USGA wasted lil time “discussing” and passing the rule change(16-1e), which took effect the following calendar year, January 1, 1968, as Jones made it clear that he did not want that “spectacle” of Sam and his putting style at Augusta in 1968.

 

I’m not getting into it any more than that however I will say that while Jones had an amazing AMATEUR career, he NEVER faced the pressures of Playing for the roof over his head(if ya don’t think that there’s a HUGE difference, as any Pro that ya know if it woulda been easier for them to take their run at The Show with NO financial pressures, with all costs covered and a salary to boot) the car(s) in his garage or the clothes on his wife’s or children’s backs, and when, as a 23yo kid, he was deciding on whether to leave the safety and security of his daddy’s law firm, salary and getting to Play the game for fun, he just happened to get b*tch slapped all over two golf courses across 72 holes, by a humiliating defeat of 12&11 at the sticks of Sir Walter. Jones may have been a spoiled entitled cherry?, but he wasn’t a moron?

 

Ole Jonesy remained an amateur??

 

Regarding Sam, he was an outsider and to the “blue blood white shoes” like Dey and Jones, he was an interloper and the unwanted guest that while they had to tolerate his attendance to the party, they didn’t have to make his stay a pleasant experience for him

 

Thanks for responding BV

RP

Edited February 26, 2021 by Forged4ever

[PZero]

Add Webb Simpson.

[MUNIGRIT]

Webb has consistently won at every level and always been one of the best players. He is right where his amateur and college career should project into the pros.

[golfandfishing]

Guy grew up with access to everything you could want in golf, won a ton as a junior golfer, played D1 golf very successfully, won several big boy amateur events and won on tour quickly. His history skews more to “can’t miss” than overachiever. He’s right where he should be really.

[mizuno player]

Fred. Not Couples. Funk. Overachieved.

Fred Funk:

He didn't make the tour until his 30's. ( I think he had his card a couple times via q school but didn't keep it). Won some good tournaments including a Players. Made a boat load of money.

To do what he did later in his career and not hitting the ball out of his shadow. He did good.

[MUNIGRIT]

Exactly. I know why people say that because of his unique action that you wouldn't teach someone but works great for him. Like you said he has constantly played at a high level his whole career and on tour it has panned out how it should when you play like he does as an amateur and college player.

[Forged4ever]

Great call Mizzy!!

 

You’re not kidding about his shadow however he hit nothing but ropes!!!

 

Plus, he’s so friggin nice & approachable. I got to Play with him in the 36-hole Charity event that I’ve spoken of elsewhere, and I mentioned to him how much the members/fans appreciated him walking up the rough with them(they’re were no ropes, and the fans more or less just walked with the Players though most stayed in the rough) and he smiled and sincerely said that he was just glad that he had people who cared enough to follow him with Vijay, Ernie, Freddie, D III and Justin Leonard in the field, lol. I could’ve Played with either D Love or Justin and I chose Fred and it’s one of the 4-5 most pleasurable rounds that I’ve ever Played.

 

A Gentleman’s Gentleman??

 

Say well Bro?

RP

[mocokid]

RIchard, Yeah and to think he did it with that cheap @ss putter in the picture, I mean that's a sporting goods store SS blue ridge putter. and yes Sam was ripped and he's what 50+ in that pic?

[smashdn]

I don't mean this to be a smart a, but because it is. The powers that be made it illegal in the rules. Perhaps optics, perhaps so that putting stayed consistent with the other strokes made in the course of playing the hole.

[smashdn]

There was a post on facebook (by pga tour I think) talking about his unique swing. I guess I am missing it. What is the odd or unique move? Looked to be ever so slightly under his backswing plane on the downswing. It all looked good to me.

[Ferguson]

The Ultimate Achiever, overtly: A W Tillinghast

 

With a name like Tillinghast, he's got to be good.

 

 

 

 

[mizuno player]

Fred was always approachable. When the tour had the event in MD I don't know how he got any practice done .... Everyone knew him and wanted to talk and he did.

Lucky you, be er had an opportunity to play with him.

 

Hope you're well. ( The fam too)

[MUNIGRIT]

Fanning club open, cup wrist at the top.which forces him to have what many call a flip release and he does have one of the highest closure rates on tour. It is why hit hits a lot of hosel fades for a touring pro. That being said he makes it work for him and is super talented and won his whole lif e at all levels. He is far from an underachiver.