Why are we so quick to penalize distance?

[Lincoln_Arcadia]

That’s not unusual, but I’ve been paired many times with 300+ drivers of the ball.

More often with ones who barely hit 200.

[Titleist99]

Top golf is strictly entertainment. To make it anything else is curious to me.... I would rather learn how to hit a golf ball there than a scramble of any sort. To me it's like having a few friend over hitting into a simulator. What's amazing to me is, how does that software know which circle your ball end up in....???

[Lincoln_Arcadia]

Right, we have the same issue it seems? Seniors are only driving 260 and it’s killing our pace of play. How does your course deal with this? Must be costly putting in forward tees for those Champions tour player?

[Titleist99]

Agreed!!!!.......LOL! At most courses the Pro can't hit it over 300 yards...I currently know of no course adding yardage because the youngster are hitting it to far.....that's just a talking point that Jack N. has been spewing for forty years.

[klebs01]

Happens on a weekly basis for me but I tend to play with sub 40 single handicaps.

[klebs01]

I find that hard to believe. Courses all over are doing it. My old club did it and more opportunities are always being discussed. My current club has recently. The newest being putting a new tee for #10 on the practice green to take the tee from 435 to 455 because the bunker at 250 was no longer in play for younger members and the hole was just driver sand wedge. Now it’s 270 to carry so it’s in play with wind hurting but still not normally for most guys I play with.

[Titleist99]

I believe you.....for my own reference, which clubs would that be that's lengthening tees?

[klebs01]

A lot of clubs in the Milwaukee area have. North hills, Ozaukee, Wisconsin club, U club. Heck, even the muni I grew up on has added more tees. Oh, Lac la Belle was just rebuilt and acquired more land to expand.

[chippa13]

This might be that new math talking but I'm pretty sure 270 isn't 300.

[klebs01]

Exactly. Even at 270 most guys I play with just fly it over the bunker. Hence not in play. At least with the extra yards it’s a POW-9 iron vs sw.

[miamistomp]

I live next to a pretty nice and busy golf course that gets both locals and tourists ( when we had them ) and i am out there playing or walking near there quite a bit

The only guys I have seen hit over 250 carry straight were a few low digit guys and players from Nova university team

I see a lot of big slices that provides me with a couple dozen pro v1 s a month when I walk my dog past the fence line

[Titleist99]

So, they put in a new tee because a few youngster was flying a bunker located in the 250yard range. Seem like a waste of resources to me....

[klebs01]

Wasn’t my decision and not as bad as it sounds. Practice green was getting redone anyways so they just took out two trees, had a level spot in the green and added a step. It’s a cooler tee shot hitting off the green and the new patio is overlooking the tee.

[oikos1]

So, if the bunker is in play for the members and past it isn't, why not narrow the fairway after the bunker and grow the rough, thereby making a 270 carry of the bunker and in the fairway an exceptional shot. Miss and it's tough to get on in two, lay up behind the bunker and it's a 5 iron or so in. That seems like exactly what the "roll it backers" want to see.

[OrangeGravy]

I'll add that Golf doesn't need to be more like Top golf. Some people would prefer it were more like Top golf.

[klebs01]

Narrowing the fairway is a lot more expensive than adding a tee, it would make the hole a lot harder for bad golfers. The rough is already kept about as high as it can be while balancing water, ability to find balls, old and weak members ability to play out, and pace of play. The fairway is 30 yards wide how narrow would you make it? Willing to ruin a great golden age course and make it so tricked up only a few people can play it?

[gvogel]

Not this roll backer. I think that the risk/reward of hitting a good drive is one of the great aspects of golf. You seen to continually advocate high rough in the hitting zone for the longest players. I think that makes golf boring for them; not fun.

But I also think that if the equipment is rolled back, even if only rolled back for elite players, that same risk/reward aspect of golf can be retained on a smaller footprint.

[Lincoln_Arcadia]

Just finished a round with two players who talked each other up thinking they were driving 250-270, but my shots were consistently past theirs by 10-20 yards, and I was hitting a bit shorter than my usual that day.

It was a terrible round with our group falling far behind. They insisted on playing the blue tees, and there was only one time one of them hit our fairway, judging by the people behind us, more of the same. We had to wait a couple times for people to clear our fairways while attempting to get back into theirs.

I likely could have hit two sleeves and not changed our pace, but there were already too many balls laying around our fairways and greens.

That’s the normal 6000 yard public course where I frequent.

Private near me is really not much different except the volume of people is much less and the greens run faster. These tracks haven’t really expanded at all for a century or more? Land is incredibly expensive.

Trump and Riviera are already pretty long, but I know very little about them?

Most men will still attempt the carry and end up killing the pace with their searches and recovery shots.

Lay up with a 5i? Yes, another 15 minutes behind pace.

[Titleist99]

You lost me when you put the code phrase "tricked up" in there. The rollback traditionalist think that making a golf course harder is tricked up.....I'm all for saving water on the fairways and saving fuel by putting the mowers up.

[Shilgy]

So I guy could ask should we go to whiffle balls and play on par 3 courses? How much of a roll back is needed? All of this because a relative handful of guys are too long for some people’s taste?

[ThinkingPlus]

Pre-balata is needed if the "great" courses are to remain playable per the fast, firm must hit fairways to score paradigm of playing golf. Anything less and bomb and gouge will still be the best way to score as it has been for the last 75 years or so. Now bomb and gouge wasn't proven statistically until 5 years ago or so, but I suspect many pros down through the years knew without proof. The only thing that slowed down a bomb and gouge approach in the balata era was the fragility of the wound balata balls. Gouging balls out of the rough does have some risk of mishits which could cut a balata cover. Also swinging full tilt repeatedly could damage the wound core making the ball out-of-round.

[Titleist99]

 

The rollbackers claim that the long drivers are making classic courses obsolete. I find that laughable though. It's also said that the R&A should take a look at that....well, currently over in Europe they're playing a couple of tournaments on a course about 6800 yards (British Masters) and a Challenge tour event about 6500 yards (Euram Bank Open). Somehow a champion will be crowned and a trophy and check will be passed out.

As always the player with the lowest amount of strokes will be declared the winner....... Yes, R&A take a look at that! Golf is just fine.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

the

[klebs01]

How narrow do you want the fairway? 20y? 10y? Just have it end at some point? 6 inch rough on a course with 20+ handicaps?These things are tricked up.

[Titleist99]

The question is why would you call any narrowing or growing rough or add a water penalty area or a strategic bunker tricked up... obviously it work, just ask Jack N.

[Soloman1]

You could/can replace a damaged ball rendered unusable, so I don't remember any fear of slashing a balata out of the rough and more than slashing one out today. A well struck driver put the ball out of round anyway. Some of the shorter courses are far more strategic than a typical US TPC course. TPC-style courses are open, long and boring. You just beat it all day long.

The biggest differences today are:

A. The ball and Driver technology have combined so you can swing as hard as you want/can and the ball goes straight.

B. See A.

[oikos1]

The rough and narrow fairway wouldn't be in play for the 20+ caps. Unless they really suck. They still play short of the bunker, then hit over the rough and narrow fairway. This isn't that difficult of a concept.

[Titleist99]

LOL!......I think some posters just pluck things out of the air ......I think he knew that we're talking about tournament golf.

[klebs01]

It absolutely is in play for the 20+ cap when they hit a bad drive and are trying to advance their ball down the fairway.

[klebs01]

I know the the thread started as tournament golf. My point is that the distance issue is not a big deal there. It’s a big deal in recreational golf.

[oikos1]

Ha. That sounds like special pleading. They hit a bad drive. Deal with it.