Heard Grayhawk is for sale - may go private ... anyone have info?

[Qwiklap]

I am a white tee card holder at GH - and play most of my rounds there.  I moved to North Scottsdale (Windgate Ranch neighborhood) in 2021.  I am currently on the waitlist to join DC Ranch as a golf member (full equity) - but the current price of that member is more than 2x what it was when I joined the list. 

 

I was playing GH a few weeks ago - and a black tee member I was paired with told me that the club is up for sale.  I later saw in Nextdoor that someone posted that at least one of the bidders intends to take the Raptor course private (and potentially using the land that Talon sits on to develop more homes (which generated a lot of howling).  The posts on Nextdoor make clear that the club is for sale - so that is confirmed.

 

Anyone actually in the know as to what is going on? 

 

I really want to join a nice family oriented club here - as mykids love to play, and I want the whole family get use of the facilities (and good daily fee courses basically have no interest in juniors playing).  I will give GH credit though for running a great  PGA Jr League program.

 

CT

[DarylP]

With the state of the private golf market in Scottsdale right now I think it makes perfect sense to turn Grayhawk private, or at least 1 course private and keep 1 public. Sellling 350 memberships at $200k each would sell quickly and generate $70M. I don’t think the city would ever approve turning Talon into homes. The residents of that neighborhood would revolt. Too much bad pr for the city. 

[Qwiklap]

Don't think I would do $200k (I go ahead and pay up for DC Ranch at that point), but if it is was $150k or less, and the dues were reasonable (and they had a plan to make it a real CC), I would be very interested. 

[Pepperturbo]

I have played both courses many times.  Selling those two courses as a package, in this market is difficult, may have to split them apart and sell each.  Taking one of the courses private may work, but I see a huge problem with zoning and even greater problem getting local resident support for RE developing the other course. 

[canonlbp430]

You know you’re in a golf bubble if Grayhawk turns private and is getting people to join for $150k. 

[Qwiklap]

54 minutes ago, canonlbp430 said:

You know you’re in a golf bubble if Grayhawk turns private and is getting people to join for $150k. 

true - and sad

 

Although new courses in the PHX valley will be next to impossible due to water.  Supply is capped.

[Soloman1]

Sorry, but I don’t agree that the city wouldn’t approve of rezoning.

 

The city of Scottsdale is owned and operated lock, stock and barrel by real estate development and contractors. No way anyone would stand in the way of more property taxes and more houses to build and sell. They don’t give a rat’s butt about residents “revolting.”

 

The new chip fab plants in the area will bring in a lot of people to the area.

Edited March 12 by Soloman1

[puttnforthe8]

8 minutes ago, Soloman1 said:

Sorry, but I don’t agree that the city wouldn’t approve of rezoning.

 

The city of Scottsdale is owned and operated lock, stock and barrel by real estate development and contractors. No way anyone would stand in the way of more property taxes and more houses to build and sell. They don’t give a rat’s butt about residents “revolting.”

 

The new chip fab plants in the area will bring in a lot of people to the area.

There's no "chip fab plants in the area" - they are/will be 30-40 miles away at least.

[Soloman1]

It’s only a 20-25 minute drive to the $40 billion TSMC fab plants under construction.

 

 

Edited March 12 by Soloman1

[puttnforthe8]

17 minutes ago, Soloman1 said:

It’s only a 20-25 minute drive to the $40 billion TSMC fab plants under construction.

 

 

 

lol. maybe on a perfect traffic day/time.

 

Regardless - very very few, if any, TSMC folks are not driving to join Grayhawk or other.  

[Phreddy]

I know very little about the PHX area, but I believe there are a couple 36 holes courses in Tucson that are private and where course A is member only on odd days and course B is member only on even days.  The additional revenue from allowing public play on the alternate course keeps dues "down."

[puttnforthe8]

51 minutes ago, Phreddy said:

I know very little about the PHX area, but I believe there are a couple 36 holes courses in Tucson that are private and where course A is member only on odd days and course B is member only on even days.  The additional revenue from allowing public play on the alternate course keeps dues "down."

Boulders up in Carefree does that.

[grm24]

Regardless of what a property is currently used for they are ALL for sale if the right offer is made for it.

[Bonneville85308]

9 hours ago, Soloman1 said:

It’s only a 20-25 minute drive to the $40 billion TSMC fab plants under construction.

 

 

 

The typical employee at the new TSMC facility isn't going to be able to afford a 6-figure private club initiation anyway, and isn't going to be buying a house in north Scottsdale.

[Soloman1]

OK, my bad. Those engineering and HQ jobs are only paying $150K - $195K.

[DrSchteeve]

$200k isn’t remotely in the ballpark to afford a $150k initiation. 

[puttnforthe8]

6 hours ago, Soloman1 said:

OK, my bad. Those engineering and HQ jobs are only paying $150K - $195K.

 

LOL.  There are not many of those for the new facility.  On top of that very few people play; and they certainly are not joining a private.  

[Soloman1]

They’ll get about $3.9 million for their San Jose house before they move. 🙂

 

 

 

[puttnforthe8]

21 minutes ago, Soloman1 said:

They’ll get about $3.9 million for their San Jose house before they move. 🙂

 

 

 

 

 

TSMC has no facilities in CA.  All factories are in Taiwain/Other.  The AZ facility is the first TSMC US factory

[Soloman1]

 

They are only hiring current employees? I learn something new every day.

[puttnforthe8]

5 hours ago, Soloman1 said:

 

They are only hiring current employees? I learn something new every day.

 

5 hours ago, Soloman1 said:

 

They are only hiring current employees? I learn something new every day.

Actually - they are for quite a few roles; many jobs are folks coming from Taiwan.  

 

But that was not your supposition - you said they were coming from San Jose.  Which is not the case.  No one is coming from SJ.  There are no chip factories in the US.   This is a chip factory with the majority of jobs being technicians and support; hence the wages are not that significant.

 

Edited March 13 by puttnforthe8

[hackeraz]

On 3/12/2023 at 5:36 AM, Bonneville85308 said:

 

The typical employee at the new TSMC facility isn't going to be able to afford a 6-figure private club initiation anyway, and isn't going to be buying a house in north Scottsdale.

Friend just took a group of five out house shopping last weekend. They are all engineers coming in from Taiwan to spend a 2 year contract term at the new plant. They are looking to all live together in something very close to the plant, they certainly aren't shopping in North Scottsdale. 

[Soloman1]

Of course they wouldn’t look there. These folks from Taiwan here to train staff are buying a house? Wow. I would have thought that they would be renting. What the heck was I thinking? I’m so stupid.

 

OK, let’s check the ouija board so far:

 

We know that the plan to sell GH and take it private is set… a definite, perhaps maybe.

 

We know that $200K initiation is set. Or is it $150K? Or is it $100K?

 

We know that TSMC needs to change their website because it has 4 pages of engineering and management positions for the new HQ, not located north of 101 on I17 near the fab site now that we know only low-paying jobs will be open.

 

We know that no one has been moving from California to the PHX area, so it would be crazy to think that TSMC might move some of the hundreds of R&D and design people from San Jose to AZ to be closer to the fab plant with more affordable housing, less taxes, etc. Crazy talk.

 

In all my years in engineering, engineering management and factory management, I never wanted to be near the factories. Crazy talk.

 

 

 

.

 

 

[puttnforthe8]

19 minutes ago, Soloman1 said:

 

In all my years in engineering, engineering management and factory management, I never wanted to be near the factories. Crazy talk.

 

 

Maybe you should go get a job there - since you got it all figured out with all your years of.......

 

I can put in a good word for you-Since they are one of my accounts.  All your experience can definitely be used in the foup wash area.   Please send a resume.

[vallygolf]

My surrounding neighborhoods are full of "plant employees and executives" of every kind.  I live 15 mins away in Gilbert.  I can without reservation say that Grayhawk is in no danger of being overrun by any of them.  Conservatively I know 200 people that work at the plants.  0 of them play golf enough to join a club, or would even consider laying 150K to join a club.   Empirical I know, but that is just a bad take.  

[Soloman1]

Sometimes a little humor is OK. Mine is more self-deprecating. At least one person understood the SJ house humor. You can laugh and insult me all you want. Sometimes it comes back to bite you in business.

 

I’ll let you have the last word, and I trust you will. It seems to be important.

[puttnforthe8]

17 minutes ago, Soloman1 said:

Sometimes a little humor is OK. Mine is more self-deprecating. At least one person understood the SJ house humor. You can laugh and insult me all you want. Sometimes it comes back to bite you in business.

 

I’ll let you have the last word, and I trust you will. It seems to be important.

Yeah...I will take the last word:  Because nobody "insulted" you!  I guess stating facts is now considered an insult.  Apologies your feelings were so badly injured.

[ryder2015]

Lets get back to the topic. I have also heard it was for sale and the number is 110mil. There is certainly demand for more private golf in Scottsdale as there are still 5-year waitlist at quite a few nice clubs. I just don't know that the numbers work. 2 courses you could go 400 members. Probably in the range of 150k initiation. (less than half of DC ranch) but there is no pool or tennis. If you could sell all 400 that's 60m return. Charge 2k a month in dues 800k in income for operations per month. The problem with that is you are somewhat limited how far you can go.

If they get $1500 per 4some divided by that 800k that would work out to 18 tee times a day to equal the private monthly income. Add on top weddings, events, public dining. I think staying public is a pretty safe bet for GH.

[cbbaron]

Heard a rumor Troon is making a bid and go through with the hotel that was being planned for there 

[cbbaron]

4 hours ago, ryder2015 said:

Lets get back to the topic. I have also heard it was for sale and the number is 110mil. There is certainly demand for more private golf in Scottsdale as there are still 5-year waitlist at quite a few nice clubs. I just don't know that the numbers work. 2 courses you could go 400 members. Probably in the range of 150k initiation. (less than half of DC ranch) but there is no pool or tennis. If you could sell all 400 that's 60m return. Charge 2k a month in dues 800k in income for operations per month. The problem with that is you are somewhat limited how far you can go.

If they get $1500 per 4some divided by that 800k that would work out to 18 tee times a day to equal the private monthly income. Add on top weddings, events, public dining. I think staying public is a pretty safe bet for GH.

I heard once the revenue they get from the beverage carts would blow your mind