Low cap guys - mini driver

[getitdaily]

Anyone near scratch keep a mini driver around for a driver swap out when you play in an event on a short, narrow course?

[mackepa]

That’s exactly what I use mine for. Most of the events I play in try to keep the course around 6500 yards. I didn’t really like my BRNR as a 3 wood replacement but I love my 11.5 set LOWER to 9.5 whenever we get on narrow courses. 
 

If we play anywhere more open I just leave it at home and bring my TSi3 driver. The Mini probably carry’s 8-10 yards short of my driver but the rollout is nuts when it’s firm. 

[getitdaily]

25 minutes ago, mackepa said:

That’s exactly what I use mine for. Most of the events I play in try to keep the course around 6500 yards. I didn’t really like my BRNR as a 3 wood replacement but I love my 11.5 set LOWER to 9.5 whenever we get on narrow courses. 
 

If we play anywhere more open I just leave it at home and bring my TSi3 driver. The Mini probably carry’s 8-10 yards short of my driver but the rollout is nuts when it’s firm. 

Thanks. That's exactly what I was thinking. I don't play often at 6500 and even then,not often that I need to take driver out. But I have a couple of events over the fall that it seems would be perfect...

 

13.5 lofted to 12.75, grass tee, low running fade.

[TLUBulldogGolf]

Haven't run into a course where I'd take driver completely out of the bag. I could see it as a 3 wood replacement maybe. 

[getitdaily]

2 minutes ago, TLUBulldogGolf said:

Haven't run into a course where I'd take driver completely out of the bag. I could see it as a 3 wood replacement maybe. 

Very rarely would it replace driver. But that would just about be the only need for it..a 2-3 times a year club...

[Tree Levino]

2 minutes ago, getitdaily said:

Very rarely would it replace driver. But that would just about be the only need for it..a 2-3 times a year club...

 

Had one, just didn't see the point in the end. It was hot and fun to hit off the deck but in actual situations where you're in light rough or hitting to an elevated green on a second shot it didn't inspire confidence. See: Tommy Fleetwood trying to hit it uphill into 18 at Canadian Open. It's pretty easy to hit a running stinger cut driver. 3w is waaay more versatile and the new ones are so long it's just unnecessary. I had Driver, Mini, 5w lofted down, 4h, 5-PW, 51, 55, 59 and still went back to Driver, 3w, 3h, 4-P, 51, 55, 59.

[TLUBulldogGolf]

8 minutes ago, getitdaily said:

Very rarely would it replace driver. But that would just about be the only need for it..a 2-3 times a year club...

 

I'd prefer the versatility of a 3 wood I think while still having driver for par 5s etc. Unless there is absolutely no room at all on this course in which case I'm likely backing off even further. 

Edited August 3, 2023 by TLUBulldogGolf

[cgallery]

I don't take driver out of the bag, just use the mini as my 3 wood replacement. I use the 13.5 head - friendlier profile and easy to draw

Edited August 3, 2023 by cgallery

[driveandputtmachine]

My 13.5 mini is for straight and draw holes and used as a 3 wood replacement.

 

I have thought about getting an 11.5 and lofting it all the way down to 9.5 and using it as a driver replacement, but it just isn't something I need right now as my driver is fine

[belh22]

Caddied for a great senior usga amateur champ and he had driver and a mini 11.5 in the bag. Couldn’t argue after that lol

[Auleran87]

Yeah I use an 11.5 and use it for long approaches on par 5's or when I need 10-15 yards less than driver or I need to work a draw. It's legit just a 3 wood that goes further but doesn't have as much height IMO

Edited August 4, 2023 by Auleran87

[Mike_Honcho]

strong 3W here over the mini driver.  it's very good off the tee and the deck.  

[getitdaily]

1 minute ago, Mike_Honcho said:

strong 3W here over the mini driver.  it's very good off the tee and the deck.  

Yeah, I could drop loft on 3w to 13.5 for a short course and add an 18* driving iron. That's the other option I'm looking at 

[Tree Levino]

2 hours ago, getitdaily said:

Yeah, I could drop loft on 3w to 13.5 for a short course and add an 18* driving iron. That's the other option I'm looking at 

 

If you can stomach hybrids the best option I've found is Driver, Lofted down 3+, 5w, 4H, 5-PW. 

[getitdaily]

4 minutes ago, Tree Levino said:

 

If you can stomach hybrids the best option I've found is Driver, Lofted down 3+, 5w, 4H, 5-PW. 

Thus very unique setup that would be used about 3 or 4 times a year, would be intended to pull driver since it just wouldn't be needed. 

 

3w at 13.5

18* driving iron (for low running controlled tee shots) 

20 degree hybrid for 225 carry

 

Or

 

Mini at 12.75

3w at 15

20 degree hybrid

Edited August 4, 2023 by getitdaily

[RobotDoctor]

I prefer a smaller headed driver compared to a 460cc driver.  They seem to suit my eye much better, give be the ability to work the ball a little better, force me to hone my swing so that I make better contact (due to a smaller sweet spot).  The larger drivers have all but eliminated my ability to hit a controlled fade with consistency.  A draw is my normal shot pattern.  Also, larger drivers tend to go straighter than my TM 300 Mini (11.5° ).  I changed the loft on it by two settings lower so essentially I have a 10.2° driver.  I was gaming a 10° 440cc driver so the change is negligible.  One change I made from the standard shaft length that came with my 300 Mini was to change shafts to my standard driver length shaft.  So in a sense my 300 Mini is actually a driver replacement in a smaller package.  The design of the 300 Mini produces a slightly lower and more boring flight trajectory and is every bit as long as my former driver, or any I have gamed in many years.

 

The mini drivers with standard shafts are more like 2 woods and not meant to replace the driver.  Lower the loft and add a slightly longer shaft and if a golfer can handle a slightly heavier driver, in terms of swing weight, then a mini driver is indeed a driver replacement.  I am hitting the ball as long or longer and finding more fairways than with a standard driver.  Impact is more solid due to a tighter swing which probably results in the distance.  For those on the fence change your focus on the mini driver and convert it to a full blooded driver.  Best of luck and cheers!

[BirdieBob]

Stealth 2 Plus Rocket FW @12.8*...all I need off the tee on short 4s

[jadedennill]

I’ve just replaced my driver with the brnr 11.5. 120+ driver swing speed, so I’m not looking for distance. With that acceptance I’m just hitting the center of the face most of the time and that’s equating to a negligible difference in distance from where my driver was. I’m also hitting probably 50% more fwys a round and golf is fun again. I don’t see going back to a 45” driver for any reason in the future.

[RobotDoctor]

Too many people focus on distance instead of being in the fairway.   Even 10-15 yards shorter in the fairway means a much easier, and controlled shot into the green or layup compared to being in the first cut or plain old rough.  I suppose it matters more how far the average amateur hits a drive than how accurate a drive is because I rarely read on GolfWRX how many fairways a member hits or if they’re wanting to improve from 50% to 75% of their drives ending up in the fairways.  I generally read the average GolfWRX amateur and their quest to carry a ball 300 yards.  
 

When I was in my 20s I was a long hitter and was often paired with the same senior golfer at a muni in Wilmington, DE.  He would hit it 210-220 yards down the middle of the fairway and I would smoke a drive 80-90 yards past his.  As my ball was in the air he would often say, “Long and wrong.”  Those words stuck with me and still resonate today.  Except I’m now hitting 70%-75% of the fairways and the young bucks are now “Long and wrong.”. 😁

Edited August 5, 2023 by RobotDoctor

[Tree Levino]

9 hours ago, RobotDoctor said:

Too many people focus on distance instead of being in the fairway.   Even 10-15 yards shorter in the fairway means a much easier, and controlled shot into the green or layup compared to being in the first cut or plain old rough.  I suppose it matters more how far the average amateur hits a drive than how accurate a drive is because I rarely read on GolfWRX how many fairways a member hits or if they’re wanting to improve from 50% to 75% of their drives ending up in the fairways.  I generally read the average GolfWRX amateur and their quest to carry a ball 300 yards.  
 

When I was in my 20s I was a long hitter and was often paired with the same senior golfer at a muni in Wilmington, DE.  He would hit it 210-220 yards down the middle of the fairway and I would smoke a drive 80-90 yards past his.  As my ball was in the air he would often say, “Long and wrong.”  Those words stuck with me and still resonate today.  Except I’m now hitting 70%-75% of the fairways and the young bucks are now “Long and wrong.”. 😁

https://www.golfmonthly.com/features/why-hitting-a-3-wood-off-the-tee-isnt-worth-it#

 

“the average gain in fairways hit for golfers opting to put their trust in a 3-wood is 0.9%. For context, say there are 14 chances per round (assuming most courses have four par-3s), that equates to finding one extra fairway every eight rounds. For that, you're giving up 12 yards per shot.”

 

If you were nearly guaranteed to hit the fairway by clubbing down then sure, but I read a quote from a pro who was making uncommitted “safety swings” and added a good amount of distance by going more full tilt. He said “I’d rather be long and in the crap than short and in the crap”. I feel like a lot of ams need to swing harder and take driver. Also that 12 yards matters big time for GIR % and proximity to hole. 

https://shotscope.com/blog/stats/approach-shots-average-proximity/

 

 

[doctor220]

17 hours ago, jadedennill said:

I’ve just replaced my driver with the brnr 11.5. 120+ driver swing speed, so I’m not looking for distance. With that acceptance I’m just hitting the center of the face most of the time and that’s equating to a negligible difference in distance from where my driver was. I’m also hitting probably 50% more fwys a round and golf is fun again. I don’t see going back to a 45” driver for any reason in the future.

50% more fairways ? Sounds like your prior driver fit was really bad or weird swing issue. That is a huge change 

[doctor220]

11 hours ago, RobotDoctor said:

Too many people focus on distance instead of being in the fairway.   Even 10-15 yards shorter in the fairway means a much easier, and controlled shot into the green or layup compared to being in the first cut or plain old rough.  I suppose it matters more how far the average amateur hits a drive than how accurate a drive is because I rarely read on GolfWRX how many fairways a member hits or if they’re wanting to improve from 50% to 75% of their drives ending up in the fairways.  I generally read the average GolfWRX amateur and their quest to carry a ball 300 yards.  
 

When I was in my 20s I was a long hitter and was often paired with the same senior golfer at a muni in Wilmington, DE.  He would hit it 210-220 yards down the middle of the fairway and I would smoke a drive 80-90 yards past his.  As my ball was in the air he would often say, “Long and wrong.”  Those words stuck with me and still resonate today.  Except I’m now hitting 70%-75% of the fairways and the young bucks are now “Long and wrong.”. 😁

The opposite is true actually, far too many people place too much emphasis on hitting the fairway and not enough on hit it as far as reasonably possible while keeping the ball in play. Data is very clear on this. 
 

mini drivers are mainly useless clubs imo and hence why they see almost no play on tour. Modern 3 woods go plenty far enough for times a player wants less than driver and are far more versatile . Would never take out my driver or 3 wood for a mini driver 

[Hoyoymac]

Just put together a Tour Edge C723 13 degree 3 wood with a Diamana Thump F75 stiff shaft and it is has been plenty long and incredibly accurate off the tee.  If I absolutely have to hit a fairway it will be put into action.

 

Right now it is filling the gap between my 8 degree driver and my 16.5 degree 4 wood.  It is my 15th club at the moment.

 

I could definitely see leaving the driver in the car when playing a set of tees forward or in some of the tournaments where I would be playing from tees forward of where I normally play. 

[RobotDoctor]

1 hour ago, doctor220 said:

The opposite is true actually, far too many people place too much emphasis on hitting the fairway and not enough on hit it as far as reasonably possible while keeping the ball in play. Data is very clear on this. 
 

mini drivers are mainly useless clubs imo and hence why they see almost no play on tour. Modern 3 woods go plenty far enough for times a player wants less than driver and are far more versatile . Would never take out my driver or 3 wood for a mini driver 

What data?  If it is marketing data it is skewed to selling the current models.  I agree most golfers need additional distance.  However, most golfers go about attaining distance the wrong way.  Swinging harder isn't the answer and that is the tendency most amateurs take.  Solid contact is what should be the goal and most golfers flail at the ball thinking swinging out of their shoes is the answer.  Long-ish and wrong is what I see from most golfers I play with.  They try to be Dustin Johnson/Rory McIlroy/Tiger Woods and end up something else. 

 

I definitely agree with you with regard to the mini driver and the tour.  I don't think the swing of the average golfer can be compared to that of a tour player's swing.  That includes most, or all, members here on GolfWRX.  For those who think they have the same swing most likely isn't even close.  Most golfers here don't hit thousands of balls a week or month.  The reality is most golfers here may not hit balls more than once a week.  Most golfers here have never been coached or had their swings analyzed with high speed cameras.  Most golfers don't take lessons and some of those that do expect instant gratification not realizing the lesson is a building block that will take time and effort to hone in before it makes a difference.  Go back to hitting hundreds and thousands of balls.  Most golfers here play a casual round with little or nothing at stake.  Their game isn't one that can hold up in competition (mine included for several years).  This is not a dig at the general membership but a comment based in reality.  For many of us life, priorities and responsibilities get in the way.

 

For those who aren't fans of the Mini driver concept what difference does it make?  If one isn't going to try one or haven't tried one what data are they adding here?  Opinion, ego, or both?  For those who have tried it and it isn't their cup of tea then that is some experience other's can take from.  With regard to the 3 wood, I definitely agree with your assessment.  For those who have a great large head driver game and can carry a 3 wood adequate distance that is a huge advantage.  For those who struggle with hitting a driver the Mini might be worth a shot.  As for purchasing one without demo'ing one I am not sure I would do that.  If the opportunity comes to demo a Mini along with their current driver I would suggest that.  That is what I did before I ordered mine.  I had the demo mini for a week and had two or three practice sessions with it before putting it in play.  That was a benefit I had living across the street from the course and knowing the staff who ran it.  I played two rounds with both, hitting both on every tee and for me the accuracy was much better with the Mini while the standard stiff shaft produced distances slightly less than my large headed driver (about 5 yards on average).  With my set up I can hit my 300 Mini farther than my 3 wood, probably 20-30 yards farther.  Then again my set up isn't how the Mini drivers are sold as.  It is morphed as a true driver replacement and my personal data, from a decade of gaming 440/460cc drivers proves this.  With my less than perfect ball strike with the 300 Mini I am as far as a well struck drive with my old driver (tour issue TM M3 440cc 9.5° - actual was 9.9°).  At best with a perfectly well struck ball with my TM M3 I was maybe 5-yards farther compared to the same type of strike with my 300 Mini but those strikes were fewer and father in between.  No idea why but I had less confidence with the TM M3 driver than I do with my 300 Mini, or even my old Titleist 905S driver.  Keep in mind I LOVED my TM M3 driver and it was the best 440cc+ driver I ever hit balls with, by far.  I am one who prefers a smaller headed driver with the modern benefits of design and the Mini drivers suit my preference to a T.  I will gladly trade the occasional 5 yards distance gain for a significantly more accurate driver any day that ends with a "Y".  Cheers!

 

Edited August 5, 2023 by RobotDoctor

[RobotDoctor]

2 hours ago, Tree Levino said:

https://www.golfmonthly.com/features/why-hitting-a-3-wood-off-the-tee-isnt-worth-it#

 

“the average gain in fairways hit for golfers opting to put their trust in a 3-wood is 0.9%. For context, say there are 14 chances per round (assuming most courses have four par-3s), that equates to finding one extra fairway every eight rounds. For that, you're giving up 12 yards per shot.”

 

If you were nearly guaranteed to hit the fairway by clubbing down then sure, but I read a quote from a pro who was making uncommitted “safety swings” and added a good amount of distance by going more full tilt. He said “I’d rather be long and in the crap than short and in the crap”. I feel like a lot of ams need to swing harder and take driver. Also that 12 yards matters big time for GIR % and proximity to hole. 

https://shotscope.com/blog/stats/approach-shots-average-proximity/

 

 

Agreed.  Keep in mind that professional golfers can hit recovery shots out of rough significantly better than the average amateur.  A definite advantage of a professional caliber swing. 

 

My personal data found I hit around 6 or 7 fairways with my TM M3 driver over two seasons (approximately 50-60 rounds) at my former home course in Fort Collins, CO.  It is a parkland type of course with narrowish fairways and lots of trees encroaching the fairways.  Missing a fairway by as little as 5 feet could mean being stymied by a mature tree requiring a punch recovery shot.  With my 300 Mini, over the course of the 2021 season (maybe 25 rounds, and an additional 15 rounds in 2022 before I moved) I averaged 11 fairways a round on the same course.  Hitting 4-5 more fairways a round was significant for my game.  Now in Florida, with most courses having wider fairways (but little to no rough) I am hitting fairways but have to be careful where I aim as balls tend to run off into junk.

[jll62]

I've been playing with a mini driver most of this summer instead of 3w. The 3w is primarily a tee shot club for me, used once or twice a round (at most) in situations where I need to stay short of a hazard/obstacle. I wanted to try optimizing the club for that shot. The larger, more forgiving head is fantastic off the tee and goes a much more consistent distance than a 3w (both carry and total). Feels like point and shoot and is exactly what I was looking for.

 

I don't know if I'll keep it in the bag long term because I do occasionally miss a 3w on approaches into long par 5s, but it has absolutely made 3w tee shots easier.

Edited August 5, 2023 by jll62

[Tree Levino]

1 hour ago, RobotDoctor said:

What data?  If it is marketing data it is skewed to selling the current models.  I agree most golfers need additional distance.  However, most golfers go about attaining distance the wrong way.  Swinging harder isn't the answer and that is the tendency most amateurs take.  Solid contact is what should be the goal and most golfers flail at the ball thinking swinging out of their shoes is the answer.  Long-ish and wrong is what I see from most golfers I play with.  They try to be Dustin Johnson/Rory McIlroy/Tiger Woods and end up something else. 

 

I definitely agree with you with regard to the mini driver and the tour.  I don't think the swing of the average golfer can be compared to that of a tour player's swing.  That includes most, or all, members here on GolfWRX.  For those who think they have the same swing most likely isn't even close.  Most golfers here don't hit thousands of balls a week or month.  The reality is most golfers here may not hit balls more than once a week.  Most golfers here have never been coached or had their swings analyzed with high speed cameras.  Most golfers don't take lessons and some of those that do expect instant gratification not realizing the lesson is a building block that will take time and effort to hone in before it makes a difference.  Go back to hitting hundreds and thousands of balls.  Most golfers here play a casual round with little or nothing at stake.  Their game isn't one that can hold up in competition (mine included for several years).  This is not a dig at the general membership but a comment based in reality.  For many of us life, priorities and responsibilities get in the way.

 

For those who aren't fans of the Mini driver concept what difference does it make?  If one isn't going to try one or haven't tried one what data are they adding here?  Opinion, ego, or both?  For those who have tried it and it isn't their cup of tea then that is some experience other's can take from.  With regard to the 3 wood, I definitely agree with your assessment.  For those who have a great large head driver game and can carry a 3 wood adequate distance that is a huge advantage.  For those who struggle with hitting a driver the Mini might be worth a shot.  As for purchasing one without demo'ing one I am not sure I would do that.  If the opportunity comes to demo a Mini along with their current driver I would suggest that.  That is what I did before I ordered mine.  I had the demo mini for a week and had two or three practice sessions with it before putting it in play.  That was a benefit I had living across the street from the course and knowing the staff who ran it.  I played two rounds with both, hitting both on every tee and for me the accuracy was much better with the Mini while the standard stiff shaft produced distances slightly less than my large headed driver (about 5 yards on average).  With my set up I can hit my 300 Mini farther than my 3 wood, probably 20-30 yards farther.  Then again my set up isn't how the Mini drivers are sold as.  It is morphed as a true driver replacement and my personal data, from a decade of gaming 440/460cc drivers proves this.  With my less than perfect ball strike with the 300 Mini I am as far as a well struck drive with my old driver (tour issue TM M3 440cc 9.5° - actual was 9.9°).  At best with a perfectly well struck ball with my TM M3 I was maybe 5-yards farther compared to the same type of strike with my 300 Mini but those strikes were fewer and father in between.  No idea why but I had less confidence with the TM M3 driver than I do with my 300 Mini, or even my old Titleist 905S driver.  Keep in mind I LOVED my TM M3 driver and it was the best 440cc+ driver I ever hit balls with, by far.  I am one who prefers a smaller headed driver with the modern benefits of design and the Mini drivers suit my preference to a T.  I will gladly trade the occasional 5 yards distance gain for a significantly more accurate driver any day that ends with a "Y".  Cheers!

 

The data posted above isn’t from manufacturers it’s from shotscope data granted it’s talking about using 3w instead of driver but I’d still argue the “clubbing down” idea hinders most golfers rather than helps. Your driver must’ve been ill fit. You shouldn’t be super crooked with any club it’s about how far you want to hit it. Might be holes with run outs etc that a mini driver works well on.  Also for links hitting low running bullets off the deck into par 5s etc. 

[AdExec]

still have a pretty big gap between 4 iron and 5 wood, but I love the top end of my bag with this set up. I can hit a high cut 5 wood in the 230 range when needed. 
 

46” Stealth 2+ 9 with TR Black 5x 

mid height fades 
 

Brnr mini 13.5 @ 12.75 with Red TR 6x

Mid height draws and surprisingly good off the deck for 250ish carry and a hot runner 
 

stealth 2+ 18 with TR Red 7x and weight all the way back 

work this one both ways 

[jadedennill]

6 hours ago, doctor220 said:

50% more fairways ? Sounds like your prior driver fit was really bad or weird swing issue. That is a huge change 

I was mishitting my driver so often and at those speeds, mishits are obviously much more errant. Just hitting the middle of the face has made all the difference. 

[hoselrocker]

Question for the lower cap guys gaming the mini - what  shaft combo have you found works the best? 

Length, weight, brand?

 

I'm a mid handicapper and I love my 300 mini which has been a game changer for me. I currently have a Ventus red 7S 3 wood shaft, but I was wondering what else you guys find works. I don't have any numbers, but it seems like the red spins a touch much for my swing. I really like the feeling of the ventus shafts though and would lean towards them. The OG shaft was very unstable and it was night and day when I swapped them around. 

Thanks