Clubhouse Grille (*** NO LIV DISCUSSIONS ***) (*** NO POLITICS/RELIGION ***)

[scomac2002]

Thanks for posting these videos. 👍  The basic chipping setup and motion as described is what I've been trying to perfect for about 4 years now.  I'm a poor student.  I really liked the last video with the instructor talking about syncing up ball position with bottom of swing arc.  I'm going to spend a bit of time with that tomorrow and see if I can get that part of it sorted.

 

------------------

 

Changed my wedges for yesterday's game and went with a TM ATV SW and a low bounce Tom Watson LW.  Used both to good effect.  That still didn't prevent a total meltdown on the final two holes.  Seems to be my fate of late.  I was sitting at 31 in the middle of the fairway on 8 with 140 to the green.  It took a further 13 strokes to get home on 9, a longish par 3, that included a lefthanded shot from under a tree, a four-putt and a waterball off the tee on 9... 😖

[Divot License]

7 minutes ago, scomac2002 said:

Thanks for posting these videos. 👍  The basic chipping setup and motion as described is what I've been trying to perfect for about 4 years now.  I'm a poor student.  I really liked the last video with the instructor talking about syncing up ball position with bottom of swing arc.  I'm going to spend a bit of time with that tomorrow and see if I can get that part of it sorted.

 

------------------

 

Changed my wedges for yesterday's game and went with a TM ATV SW and a low bounce Tom Watson LW.  Used both to good effect.  That still didn't prevent a total meltdown on the final two holes.  Seems to be my fate of late.  I was sitting at 31 in the middle of the fairway on 8 with 140 to the green.  It took a further 13 strokes to get home on 9, a longish par 3, that included a lefthanded shot from under a tree, a four-putt and a waterball off the tee on 9... 😖

Glad you got as much from the video as I did.

 

It was an eye opening video for me, I think I subconsciously knew about the ball position relating to the arc of the swing and it's impact on shot type but I had never thought about it and made myself aware of it. Now when I want to play a floating chip shot and put the ball forward, open the face adn set up a little to the left my brain understands why my body is doing it rather than what it used to do and try to "correct" myself into a standard chipping method. 

 

I find this concept has allowed me to be more reactive to the shot I am trying to play and less focused on trying to create the set up for that shot. 

[scomac2002]

The confusing thing I find with the description as regards swing arc is that I'm definitely more of an outside in swinger due to a lack of flexibility and rotation as a result of age and injury.  I'm also quite flat I think which tends to lead to lower ball flight on full swings.  The other issue is releasing too quickly most likely from the OTT on the downswing.  Thinking that ball position should be further back, but not sure if that's really the case?

[BIG STU]

2 hours ago, scomac2002 said:

Thanks for posting these videos. 👍  The basic chipping setup and motion as described is what I've been trying to perfect for about 4 years now.  I'm a poor student.  I really liked the last video with the instructor talking about syncing up ball position with bottom of swing arc.  I'm going to spend a bit of time with that tomorrow and see if I can get that part of it sorted.

 

------------------

 

Changed my wedges for yesterday's game and went with a TM ATV SW and a low bounce Tom Watson LW.  Used both to good effect.  That still didn't prevent a total meltdown on the final two holes.  Seems to be my fate of late.  I was sitting at 31 in the middle of the fairway on 8 with 140 to the green.  It took a further 13 strokes to get home on 9, a longish par 3, that included a lefthanded shot from under a tree, a four-putt and a waterball off the tee on 9... 😖

IMHO and this is just speculation you may have had a lapse of concrentation the last two holes. If the weather is as hot and humid as it is here it could be a combo of mental fatigue along with the physical fatigue. I have had it happen quite a few times with me. Lately when I feel that happening I drink me a Pedialite and think. I also by then I am using the blue ice packs out of my cooler to cool off.  And I have had mental fatigue when the weather was cooler and good. I have always had a problem on the course of staying focused. Yeah I had brain farts on the course long before I was a senior

[scomac2002]

6 hours ago, BIG STU said:

IMHO and this is just speculation you may have had a lapse of concrentation the last two holes. If the weather is as hot and humid as it is here it could be a combo of mental fatigue along with the physical fatigue. I have had it happen quite a few times with me. Lately when I feel that happening I drink me a Pedialite and think. I also by then I am using the blue ice packs out of my cooler to cool off.  And I have had mental fatigue when the weather was cooler and good. I have always had a problem on the course of staying focused. Yeah I had brain farts on the course long before I was a senior

 I really do think I need a lesson.  Maybe I'll get around to it sometime this month as I seem to have a bit more time to do that and get in the necessary practice.  I'm sure I've picked up a whole host of bad habits since my injury.  I know that my ball striking is pretty ragged.

[billh17]

155 yard 6 iron, and this old man made the putt for a bird....we will not discuss the rest of the round !

Edited August 3, 2021 by billh17

[billh17]

Edited August 3, 2021 by billh17

[BIG STU]

7 minutes ago, scomac2002 said:

 I really do think I need a lesson.  Maybe I'll get around to it sometime this month as I seem to have a bit more time to do that and get in the necessary practice.  I'm sure I've picked up a whole host of bad habits since my injury.  I know that my ball striking is pretty ragged.

Depending on how bad your injury is you may have to make swing changes. I ended going through that myself. I am swinging shorter most of the time but I did pick up upper body strength. By me swinging shorter I balance better. I can still get the club back to parallel but I get off balance ( due to lower back nerve damage) and being tall 6' 2 " it will make me sway. But now if I want to pound one with the driver I will aim extreme right and pull hook it around. But I do not do that much because it will get my back to hurting and it will throw my timing off for the next shot. But in a nutshell you may have to make changes from what you once did. I also had to somewhat have a attitude change. I revamped some of my thinking. My attitude is now to keep it in the fairway and then do the best I can to hit the green if I miss my short game can save me. Most of the time now I practice my short game. If I do not go to the course I practice with whiffle balls around the yard. That is how I got back to using the 60* SW some in play. I was hitting it around the yard and got decent with it again and got my confidence back with it. On the top end I went back to an old V-Steel 3 wood and my old dependable V-Steel 7 wood. I pulled the 9 wood for now because I am swinging well and I tend to baloon it. But the 9 wood will stay for a cooler weather club and for possibly later on in life. Yeah I got where I can hit the blade Mac 4 iron great. I also perfected my little stinger with the 3 wood and it is more consistant than the 1 iron. Taught myself another little stinger shot. I can hit that M-6 off the deck with a little waist high stinger or I can ( on the tee) do a Laura Davies thing with making me a "tee" and hit a little head high stinger.  In fact I hit the little tee stinger when I absolutely know I need to cut a ball off the tee. Yep I had to psych myself out and make equipment changes too. But I did go back to my old thing of utlitizing one club for several shots. Actually by slowing myself down physically and not pounding a lot of balls helped me to rethink some things.

[BIG STU]

23 minutes ago, billh17 said:

Good Play man I will take 3 up a side from you. LOL I only hit my 5 iron about 155 now. 

[BIG STU]

Something I need to add above. My bud Bear and I were discussing this Saturday. He is 5 years older than me and he has a myrid of health problems but he is still a solid ball striker. His putting can be sketchy at times but he is still a good player. We have just started playing together again after my injury. He knows what I have been going through health wise. I had learned this last year when recovering I will not play this year if it is cooler than 50* because my back will not function at anything cooler. He feels the same way about things on his end. I may still chip and putt some but no drives etc. I have not tried vintage yet because I do not want a setback injury wise like I did in November when I strained my already weak back muscles because of me trying to hit it too hard in cool weather. I do have 2 sets of vintage already to go. More than likely start with my 54 Hogan Precisions because they have the old TT green label shafts which are a regular softer lighter shaft. 

[Fellaheen51]

16 hours ago, BIG STU said:

IMHO and this is just speculation you may have had a lapse of concrentation the last two holes. If the weather is as hot and humid as it is here it could be a combo of mental fatigue along with the physical fatigue. I have had it happen quite a few times with me. Lately when I feel that happening I drink me a Pedialite and think. I also by then I am using the blue ice packs out of my cooler to cool off.  And I have had mental fatigue when the weather was cooler and good. I have always had a problem on the course of staying focused. Yeah I had brain farts on the course long before I was a senior

 

Mental fatigue is a very real condition I seemingly face every round.  I call it "keeping my head in the game".  Beyond swing mechanics, executing the correct shot for the position, at its core golf is a brain game.  Often occurs about the 14th hole.  May be playing along pretty good, given the state of my abilities.  Then it a happens.  The hole where it seems I forget how to swing a golf club.  Execute a stupid shot(s).  And I begin to unravel.  And I feel myself wrestling with the head to get it back together. Nothing about my golf game is ingrained, automatic.  Have to be paying attention at all times to what I'm doing out there.  Otherwise, I get sloppy.  Beyond swing things, maintaining focus for the entire 18 holes is necessary to shoot consistently lower scores. 

 

Once I've got in a few early season rounds, the physical aspect is not really an issue. Call it getting into golf shape.  Primarily limbering up the lower back muscles.  When it's a hot weather day, yeah can be physically draining.   But only until I'm done.  Able to rebound quickly.  Mostly play in the early morning so avoiding the extreme heat of the day.  Given the option, I simply don't play when its 90*+ and humid.  Do not find any enjoyment playing golf in those conditions.  

 

Playing latter this morning with the Bud's group.  Will be a delightful day.  Sunny, temps in the low 70's.  Won't even work up a sweat.  High optimism for a quality outing.  Hope some of the chipping practice from the other day will transfer.  Maybe should take some ginkgo tablets to help with the 14th hole brain fade.  

[Divot License]

Coincidently I was watching this video last night (same guys who did the chipping video) and they were talking about how due to a dodgy back the player really struggled with the early tee times due to the colder temperatures. 

 

Also super interesting to hear what it was like inside the ropes at a major. 

 

 

[Fellaheen51]

9 hours ago, billh17 said:

155 yard 6 iron, and this old man made the putt for a bird....we will not discuss the rest of the round !

 

Ballin'. 

[Divot License]

4 minutes ago, Fellaheen51 said:

 

Mental fatigue is a very real condition I seemingly face every round.  I call it "keeping my head in the game".  Beyond swing mechanics, executing the correct shot for the position, at its core golf is a brain game.  Often occurs about the 14th hole.  May be playing along pretty good, given the state of my abilities.  Then it a happens.  The hole where it seems I forget how to swing a golf club.  Execute a stupid shot(s).  And I begin to unravel.  And I feel myself wrestling with the head to get it back together. Nothing about my golf game is ingrained, automatic.  Have to be paying attention at all times to what I'm doing out there.  Otherwise, I get sloppy.  Beyond swing things, maintaining focus for the entire 18 holes is necessary to shoot consistently lower scores. 

 

Once I've got in a few early season rounds, the physical aspect is not really an issue. Call it getting into golf shape.  Primarily limbering up the lower back muscles.  When it's a hot weather day, yeah can be physically draining.   But only until I'm done.  Able to rebound quickly.  Mostly play in the early morning so avoiding the extreme heat of the day.  Given the option, I simply don't play when its 90*+ and humid.  Do not find any enjoyment playing golf in those conditions.  

 

Playing latter this morning with the Bud's group.  Will be a delightful day.  Sunny, temps in the low 70's.  Won't even work up a sweat.  High optimism for a quality outing.  Hope some of the chipping practice from the other day will transfer.  Maybe should take some ginkgo tablets to help with the 14th hole brain fade.  

I'm not sure if it is mental fatigue or not but I am prone to a dip in my performance around the 7th to 10th hole on a round at my home course. I think that because it's an easier stretch of holes than the ones around it, and I'm settled into my round I relax a little and lose some focus and get caught out on 3 short par 4s, 2 of which if conditions are right I can drive. Only happens on my home course so I'm positive its a comfort thing and just me thinking "this is an easier stretch so I can relax"

[scomac2002]

The interesting thing about my meltdown the other day is that I've been playing the 8th pretty well this year.  Had a bird and several pars on what is the longest hole on the place.  With a good tee shot, you're in business.  Hit a dud and you pay.  I seem to either play that hole well or terribly and it depends a great deal on position off the tee.

 

I used to really enjoy the 9th when I could drive the green with regularity.  Haven't been able to do that in over 4 years.  It's a very tough tee shot with a tree protecting the left side about 50 yd off the tee.  If you're trying to cut the ball into the green that tree will catch many a tee ball.  I've tried laying up which is probably the correct play because it takes the tree and the pond out of play, but I need to get good with a LW for the 2nd shot from the tight fairway.  The SW isn't working from there based on my recent results and from what I remember about last year's play.

[nitram]

 

3 hours ago, Fellaheen51 said:

 

Mental fatigue is a very real condition I seemingly face every round.  I call it "keeping my head in the game".  Beyond swing mechanics, executing the correct shot for the position, at its core golf is a brain game.  Often occurs about the 14th hole.  May be playing along pretty good, given the state of my abilities.  Then it a happens.  The hole where it seems I forget how to swing a golf club.  Execute a stupid shot(s).  And I begin to unravel.  And I feel myself wrestling with the head to get it back together. Nothing about my golf game is ingrained, automatic.  Have to be paying attention at all times to what I'm doing out there.  Otherwise, I get sloppy.  Beyond swing things, maintaining focus for the entire 18 holes is necessary to shoot consistently lower scores. 

 

Once I've got in a few early season rounds, the physical aspect is not really an issue. Call it getting into golf shape.  Primarily limbering up the lower back muscles.  When it's a hot weather day, yeah can be physically draining.   But only until I'm done.  Able to rebound quickly.  Mostly play in the early morning so avoiding the extreme heat of the day.  Given the option, I simply don't play when its 90*+ and humid.  Do not find any enjoyment playing golf in those conditions.  

 

Playing latter this morning with the Bud's group.  Will be a delightful day.  Sunny, temps in the low 70's.  Won't even work up a sweat.  High optimism for a quality outing.  Hope some of the chipping practice from the other day will transfer.  Maybe should take some ginkgo tablets to help with the 14th hole brain fade.  

 

A dozen or so years ago this stuff was the rage on GolfWRX and supposedly helped you keep your focus through the whole round. I've never tried it because I've been told on more than one occasion from people who "love"me that I have the attention span of a 4-year old at Toys-r-us.

Edited August 4, 2021 by nitram

[billh17]

14 hours ago, BIG STU said:

Good Play man I will take 3 up a side from you. LOL I only hit my 5 iron about 155 now. 

Stu, That was the best shot i had all afternoon. and i managed to muddle thru with an 85...lol

Like you have been discussing, i had to make swing changes after my health issues, and a big adjustment of my attitude also. Now, I honestly am super happy to be able to play, pain free, not nearly the distance anymore, but also like you i worked on my short game. It doesn't even resemble yours but it is better than i have ever had before. Guess it comes with age and Father Time saying change or quit !

[scomac2002]

Interesting round today.  Started off pull-hooking everything, even irons.  At some point I began to reroute the downswing in tighter to my body (at least that was the sensation) and that had an instantly positive effect of straightening out the ballflight and increasing launch.  Took about 4 and  a half holes to get that much sorted.  We'll see if there's any staying power to it.

 

Used some of the techniques described in the videos from yesterday and had some very pleasing results chipping and pitching.  The last couple of outings have been an improvement in that area.  We'll see if it sticks!

 

Saw my old instructor who I took lessons from many years ago.  He was teaching today, so I have decided to book a lesson or two with him in the near future if for no other reason than to have a set of eyes watch me that knows what they're doing.  Things are looking up!🙂

[BIG STU]

6 hours ago, nitram said:

 

 

A dozen or so years ago this stuff was the rage on GolfWRX and supposedly helped you keep your focus through the whole round. I've never tried it because I've been told on more than one occasion from people who "love"me that I have the attention span of a 4-year old at Toys-r-us.

I use Pedelyte myself the little packs put in a bottle of water. One thing about using that or similar products. You can get a sugar rush and then get down. What I do is drink some on the first round usually one bottle spaced out between holes. If I am thirsty I drink regular water. On the back side I do the same thing. I read an article on this some weeks ago

And yes I also have the attention span of a 4 year old myself

[BIG STU]

9 hours ago, scomac2002 said:

The interesting thing about my meltdown the other day is that I've been playing the 8th pretty well this year.  Had a bird and several pars on what is the longest hole on the place.  With a good tee shot, you're in business.  Hit a dud and you pay.  I seem to either play that hole well or terribly and it depends a great deal on position off the tee.

 

I used to really enjoy the 9th when I could drive the green with regularity.  Haven't been able to do that in over 4 years.  It's a very tough tee shot with a tree protecting the left side about 50 yd off the tee.  If you're trying to cut the ball into the green that tree will catch many a tee ball.  I've tried laying up which is probably the correct play because it takes the tree and the pond out of play, but I need to get good with a LW for the 2nd shot from the tight fairway.  The SW isn't working from there based on my recent results and from what I remember about last year's play.

Lay it back some more to YOUR optimal wedge distance with the corresponding club. For example for me the range is around 100 yds with the 56 now and 115 or so with the PW. That way you are going full bore with a wedge and not trying to guide it or flight the distance. Remember everyones wedge distance is different and everyone has a pet wedge that they have all the confidence in the world in. Try to adjust your strengths to your game 

Edited August 4, 2021 by BIG STU

[Soloman1]

10 minutes ago, BIG STU said:

Remember everyones wedge distance is different and everyone has a pet wedge that they have all the confidence in the world in. Try to adjust your strengths to your game 

 

Absolutely.

 

For example, I never try to hit a 56° more than 60 yards. I could, but I don't want to. I can hit a 52° precisely 85 yards and prefer use my PW for distances above that. You hit your wedges farther than me, and I hit my other irons farther than you.

 

But it's the number of strokes on the card, no matter how you do it.

[billh17]

love the discussions in our little part of this site. Always done in an informative way with none

of us on ego trips. Good information the last couple days. Some i already had heard, but a lot is new and interesting !   The game and knowledge you guys have is very much one of the reasons our grille is

attracting new folks. The wedge discussion i find very pertinent to my current game, or lack there of !

Thanks again !

[Conrad1953]

1 hour ago, billh17 said:

love the discussions in our little part of this site. Always done in an informative way with none

of us on ego trips. Good information the last couple days. Some i already had heard, but a lot is new and interesting !   The game and knowledge you guys have is very much one of the reasons our grille is

attracting new folks. The wedge discussion i find very pertinent to my current game, or lack there of !

Thanks again !

 

+1

 

As Stu likes to say; there is no single way to get things done in this game and thus different

things will work for different people. I figure that I lose most of my shots on and around the

greens so if what I'm doing is not working in one aspect or another then it's good to hear

what others are doing that might work for me too. I want to play and score better just like

everyone else and am grateful for the camaraderie that we have here in the Grille.

[BIG STU]

15 hours ago, Soloman1 said:

 

Absolutely.

 

For example, I never try to hit a 56° more than 60 yards. I could, but I don't want to. I can hit a 52° precisely 85 yards and prefer use my PW for distances above that. You hit your wedges farther than me, and I hit my other irons farther than you.

 

But it's the number of strokes on the card, no matter how you do it.

Correct--- Me if I try to hit a wedge too far I will baloon it if not lay the sod over the ball or both. Yep I can hit a chunky monkey with the best of them it will go higher than it goes distance wise. 

[BIG STU]

8 hours ago, Conrad1953 said:

 

+1

 

As Stu likes to say; there is no single way to get things done in this game and thus different

things will work for different people. I figure that I lose most of my shots on and around the

greens so if what I'm doing is not working in one aspect or another then it's good to hear

what others are doing that might work for me too. I want to play and score better just like

everyone else and am grateful for the camaraderie that we have here in the Grille.

I will add this. For the short game it does not necessarly have to be a wedge. I know guys that are just as effective with the 8 and 9 irons and not bumping or running either. One guy I know plays 5 or 6 hybrids and he is deadly any time around the green with his 40* hybrid. He can fly one in high and make it check up or he can bump and run it. This guy was pretty consistant shooting his age ( 78 at the time) from the super senior ( over 70) tees. He never took up the game until he moved here at age 65. Basically he is self taught. Have not seen him since they closed my former home course. But in a nutshell you have to find and practice what works for you there is no one etched in stone way to properly play this game. IMHO the short game is a stroke saver and will take pressure off the longer approach game. 

[Divot License]

16 hours ago, BIG STU said:

Lay it back some more to YOUR optimal wedge distance with the corresponding club. For example for me the range is around 100 yds with the 56 now and 115 or so with the PW. That way you are going full bore with a wedge and not trying to guide it or flight the distance. Remember everyones wedge distance is different and everyone has a pet wedge that they have all the confidence in the world in. Try to adjust your strengths to your game 

Interestingly I've never been the lay up to a full wedge guy, I've always layed up to about 80 yards as that is a comfortable shorter wedge swing for me.

 

I've always preferred that to the full wedge shot in, maybe due to living in England when in the winter the ground is so wet that laying the sod over a ball is very easy and then in the summer the ground is so hard the club can bounce with no control. 

 

Easier to control that strike on a controlled swing rather than a full swing.  

[Divot License]

18 hours ago, scomac2002 said:

Saw my old instructor who I took lessons from many years ago.  He was teaching today, so I have decided to book a lesson or two with him in the near future if for no other reason than to have a set of eyes watch me that knows what they're doing.  Things are looking up!🙂

Took the daughter up the range last night for her usual weekly practice. 

 

Bumped into my old touring partner who I used to car pool and hotel roomshare with. Was good to have a quick catch up,  he was "giving a lesson" to someone (not supposed to be done on store ranges) but left him to it as didn't want to be rude. He popped over when he had finished to see how the daughter was doing.  

[Divot License]

9 hours ago, Conrad1953 said:

As Stu likes to say; there is no single way to get things done in this game and thus different

things will work for different people.

This is so true and one of the reasons I rarely post in the I&A section as too many seem locked in on their opinion of what is and isn't correct. 

 

What works for one in the swing doesn't work for the other and that is fine, doesn't mean it's right or wrong. 

 

I personally struggle feel like my right arm separates from my upper chest on the backswing, it does and gets in a great spot at the top but I feel like from shoulder to elbow is connected to the side of my chest from address to the top of the swing. I've tried to feel like I do all the "popular" ideas currently of separation, width, high hands etc and I can do it fine however, I can't constantly time the downswing from there or make consistent solid contact on the ball. 

[BIG STU]

26 minutes ago, Divot License said:

Interestingly I've never been the lay up to a full wedge guy, I've always layed up to about 80 yards as that is a comfortable shorter wedge swing for me.

 

I've always preferred that to the full wedge shot in, maybe due to living in England when in the winter the ground is so wet that laying the sod over a ball is very easy and then in the summer the ground is so hard the club can bounce with no control. 

 

Easier to control that strike on a controlled swing rather than a full swing.  

See? exactly what I was talking about using a gameplan and swing that works for you.

 

[BIG STU]

13 minutes ago, Divot License said:

This is so true and one of the reasons I rarely post in the I&A section as too many seem locked in on their opinion of what is and isn't correct. 

 

What works for one in the swing doesn't work for the other and that is fine, doesn't mean it's right or wrong. 

 

I personally struggle feel like my right arm separates from my upper chest on the backswing, it does and gets in a great spot at the top but I feel like from shoulder to elbow is connected to the side of my chest from address to the top of the swing. I've tried to feel like I do all the "popular" ideas currently of separation, width, high hands etc and I can do it fine however, I can't constantly time the downswing from there or make consistent solid contact on the ball. 

I do not read or post in I&A period--- Growing up with my old man running a course I have seen all kinds of different swings and methods especially on weekends and holidays being a starter on the 1st tee sometimes. Being around hustlers and the Mini Tours I have seen all kinds of swings and methods. That goes for equipment choices too. I developed my opinion at an early age about the golf swing one of the reasons I never wanted to teach when I was a class A. Equipment was always my thing anyhow.