Thoughts on Playing in the UK

[El Gringo]

I would be very surprised if there are courses akin to Walton Heath, Pulborough or Woodhall Spa anywhere except perhaps in France, Germany, Netherlands or Belgium. To me Walton Heath stands out vigoursly so as close to a proper heathland course as there is. That said, I admire Woking a great deal and plan to play it again next month. Before then a downland like beauty by the name of Kington is scheduled next followed by a course I haven't seen yet, Llandrindod Wells. Everybody should play Kington, it's like a links in the sky...wonderful course.

 

Ciao

[duffer987]

> @"El Gringo" said:

> I would be very surprised if there are courses akin to Walton Heath, Pulborough or Woodhall Spa anywhere except perhaps in France, Germany, Netherlands or Belgium. To me Walton Heath stands out vigoursly so as close to a proper heathland course as there is. That said, I admire Woking a great deal and plan to play it again next month. Before then a downland like beauty by the name of Kington is scheduled next followed by a course I haven't seen yet, Llandrindod Wells. Everybody should play Kington, it's like a links in the sky...wonderful course.

>

> Ciao

 

Just played Walton Heath last week - great rough and tumble fun and a proper test as well and talk about your 'long views'.

Definitely like to get to the Dutch and French courses off the back of a work trip sometime...

Kington looks neat, but that'll have to wait until I make the hike out to Aberdovey.

 

Anyways for North Americans that are less England focused than Scotland/Ireland, I always thought combining Kent and Surrey would be the easiest way to get a fantastic 'tier 1' one-week sampler that is every bit the match for what you could find up North or across the Irish Sea; with RSG, Deal, Littlestone, (maybe even Rye) + SGH, Swinley, Walton Heath or Sunningdale, or... or... really spoilt for choice!

[El Gringo]

> @duffer987 said:

> > @"El Gringo" said:

> > I would be very surprised if there are courses akin to Walton Heath, Pulborough or Woodhall Spa anywhere except perhaps in France, Germany, Netherlands or Belgium. To me Walton Heath stands out vigoursly so as close to a proper heathland course as there is. That said, I admire Woking a great deal and plan to play it again next month. Before then a downland like beauty by the name of Kington is scheduled next followed by a course I haven't seen yet, Llandrindod Wells. Everybody should play Kington, it's like a links in the sky...wonderful course.

> >

> > Ciao

>

> Just played Walton Heath last week - great rough and tumble fun and a proper test as well and talk about your 'long views'.

> Definitely like to get to the Dutch and French courses off the back of a work trip sometime...

> Kington looks neat, but that'll have to wait until I make the hike out to Aberdovey.

>

> Anyways for North Americans that are less England focused than Scotland/Ireland, I always thought combining Kent and Surrey would be the easiest way to get a fantastic 'tier 1' one-week sampler that is every bit the match for what you could find up North or across the Irish Sea; with RSG, Deal, Littlestone, (maybe even Rye) + SGH, Swinley, Walton Heath or Sunningdale, or... or... really spoilt for choice!

 

I respect Walton Heath more than I love it! I generally play it a few times a year....thats enough. That said, its a course all golf nuts should see. I prefer the wee nine holer on the other side of the M25...Reigate Heath. Anyway, I reckon the best 10 Heathland/Moorland courses in the UK are

 

Ganton

Gleneagles Kings

Pulborough

St Georges Hill

Sunny New

Sunny Old

Swinley Forest

Walton Heath Old

Woking

Worplesdon

* I haven't seen Woodhall Spa with the new work. This course might grab a top 10 spot.

 

Take away Gleneagles and Ganton and that is a hell of a trip around London without ever sniffing a sea breeze!

 

Ciao

 

 

 

 

 

[Chanceman]

The other thing about English courses that I love is what I call The Quirk. You know, those weird oddball features that live in the memory. Mounds that obscure the green (eg Hesketh), deep depressions with no sand (Huntercombe), greens with 5 levels (Huntercombe) , brick walls blocking access to greens, greens long and thin like a caterpillar (Mildenhall), roads and walking tracks slicing across fairways, people walking dogs (Sunningdale), fields of open heather (Swinley), vertical drops, right angle greens, ricketty bridges, electrical fences, and plenty of others that I cant think of. Not to mention the various ruins and castles that inhabit UK courses here and there. In America, you sometimes see them designed in, but in the UK they are historical artifacts and no-one would attempt to change them.

[North Butte]

Here's one weird thing about my golf trips to UK, a personal idiosyncracy of my own.

 

I'm not talking about out-and-out rain bucketing down but your regulation "English weather" where it's somewhere in the neighborhood of 15C and alternating from moment to moment between mist, drizzle or a damp breeze with no actual precipitation. Back home, I'd play golf on a day like that if it was maybe my only chance to play golf all week or something. But really I'd just as soon wait for nicer weather. Yet when I step off the plane in England, it feel Just Right and I can't wait to collect my rental car and get to the golf course.

 

When I complain about a damp, drizzly day back home my wife always asks, "Do you only like weather like this when it costs you a thousand bucks for a plane ticket?".

[golfortennis]

> @SugarPenguin said:

> > @jonnymc44 said:

> > > @SugarPenguin said:

> > > I am British and a member at a very tricky Heathland course in the UK. In a few weeks time (if it ever stops raining) the fairways will be yellow, greens will be like concrete and the rough in the trees / gorse will be well above knee deep. Our course is tight and unforgiving off the tee and if you find yourself above the hole then any two putt is welcome. Its pretty brutal but a really true test and so beautifully frustrating and rewarding at the same time. I play off 8 and in our medals the CSS is usually a 2 over 74 and a couple under nett wins. If I go play other more 'American Style' open courses I tend to fair MUCH better.

> > >

> > > I know most people on here are from North America and I have always wondered how you guys who have played in the UK find the courses over here. So basically - what do you all think?

> > > Do you think its more difficult. easier, poor quality fairways?

> > > Interested in hearing your opinions / experiences and where you have played.

> >

> > Where do you play? Course must be pretty difficult for CSS of 74. You don't tend to see many of those unless they are really tough courses. I played at Southerness a few years ago, par 69, SSS 73- now that was tough! Our CSS tends to hover around 72, and for the first time I have ever seen it was 71 two weekends ago. I came in with a 64 nett off 8 and won Captain's Day.

> > Even from the courses I've played in UK, have never played in US, I can score significantly better when playing away than at my home course. I've shot +6 at Royal Birkdale, +3 at Notts Hollinwell, level par at Silloth to name a few. Greens tend to be bigger than at my home course, and fairways are a little wider. Silloth doesn't count as that probably the toughest driving course I've played as it was set up for an amateur championship a few years ago with incredibly narrow fairways and knee-high rough.

> > Maybe I just play a little more defensive having not played at the course before, which doesn't get me in as much trouble, or just relish the challenge and bring my top game.

>

> So I play at Worksop GC which is Lee Westwood's course he was a member at as a Junior (and Mark Foster). Pretty challenging. Love Birkdale I got round in +8, much easier test I felt.

>

> Good to hear some peoples experiences. We do not really have many caddies apart at the well known courses.

> Another thing is carts/buggies. I know its a big thing in the states but I dont feel like you have played a golf course until you have walked it.

 

Worksop.... I don't think he posts here anymore, but there was a chap who went by mat562 who was hilarious that I believe called those parts home as well.

[jvincent]

> @"North Butte" said:

> Here's one weird thing about my golf trips to UK, a personal idiosyncracy of my own.

>

> I'm not talking about out-and-out rain bucketing down but your regulation "English weather" where it's somewhere in the neighborhood of 15C and alternating from moment to moment between mist, drizzle or a damp breeze with no actual precipitation. Back home, I'd play golf on a day like that if it was maybe my only chance to play golf all week or something. But really I'd just as soon wait for nicer weather. Yet when I step off the plane in England, it feel Just Right and I can't wait to collect my rental car and get to the golf course.

>

> When I complain about a damp, drizzly day back home my wife always asks, "Do you only like weather like this when it costs you a thousand bucks for a plane ticket?".

 

Well, when you are in the UK on a trip you usually don't have many other options, so you have to play and if you embrace it, it makes it better than if you b**** and moan about it. Having the right rain gear is a must of course.

 

I actually like playing in those days at home. The course is usually quiet except for the die hards like me.

[duffer987]

> @"El Gringo" said:

> > @duffer987 said:

> > > @"El Gringo" said:

> > > I would be very surprised if there are courses akin to Walton Heath, Pulborough or Woodhall Spa anywhere except perhaps in France, Germany, Netherlands or Belgium. To me Walton Heath stands out vigoursly so as close to a proper heathland course as there is. That said, I admire Woking a great deal and plan to play it again next month. Before then a downland like beauty by the name of Kington is scheduled next followed by a course I haven't seen yet, Llandrindod Wells. Everybody should play Kington, it's like a links in the sky...wonderful course.

> > >

> > > Ciao

> >

> > Just played Walton Heath last week - great rough and tumble fun and a proper test as well and talk about your 'long views'.

> > Definitely like to get to the Dutch and French courses off the back of a work trip sometime...

> > Kington looks neat, but that'll have to wait until I make the hike out to Aberdovey.

> >

> > Anyways for North Americans that are less England focused than Scotland/Ireland, I always thought combining Kent and Surrey would be the easiest way to get a fantastic 'tier 1' one-week sampler that is every bit the match for what you could find up North or across the Irish Sea; with RSG, Deal, Littlestone, (maybe even Rye) + SGH, Swinley, Walton Heath or Sunningdale, or... or... really spoilt for choice!

>

> I respect Walton Heath more than I love it! I generally play it a few times a year....thats enough. That said, its a course all golf nuts should see. I prefer the wee nine holer on the other side of the M25...Reigate Heath. Anyway, I reckon the best 10 Heathland/Moorland courses in the UK are

>

> Ganton

> Gleneagles Kings

> Pulborough

> St Georges Hill

> Sunny New

> Sunny Old

> Swinley Forest

> Walton Heath Old

> Woking

> Worplesdon

> * I haven't seen Woodhall Spa with the new work. This course might grab a top 10 spot.

>

> Take away Gleneagles and Ganton and that is a **** of a trip around London without ever sniffing a sea breeze!

>

> Ciao

>

>

>

>

>

 

I've only got a sample size of about 20 to this point, but with Sunningdale seemingly a given for 2 spots, for 8 more I'd have to go:

Delamere Forest | Ganton | Huntercombe | St. George's Hill | Swinley Forest | Walton Heath Old | West Sussex | Woodhall Spa ('old' version, not seen new)

 

Not played the W's, Delamere's neighbours, Holinwell's neighbours, Dorset ones, or Luffenham yet, they're all queued up for when time allows. Reigate Heath is well cool - it's really only the sameyness of 7 & 8 that lets it down IMHO. And I don't know why Golf England felt they needed to 'upgrade' what's already one of most highly regarded courses around, improved ease of maintenance or whatever fair enough, but beyond that; ugh.

[El Gringo]

> @duffer987 said:

> > @"El Gringo" said:

> > > @duffer987 said:

> > > > @"El Gringo" said:

> > > > I would be very surprised if there are courses akin to Walton Heath, Pulborough or Woodhall Spa anywhere except perhaps in France, Germany, Netherlands or Belgium. To me Walton Heath stands out vigoursly so as close to a proper heathland course as there is. That said, I admire Woking a great deal and plan to play it again next month. Before then a downland like beauty by the name of Kington is scheduled next followed by a course I haven't seen yet, Llandrindod Wells. Everybody should play Kington, it's like a links in the sky...wonderful course.

> > > >

> > > > Ciao

> > >

> > > Just played Walton Heath last week - great rough and tumble fun and a proper test as well and talk about your 'long views'.

> > > Definitely like to get to the Dutch and French courses off the back of a work trip sometime...

> > > Kington looks neat, but that'll have to wait until I make the hike out to Aberdovey.

> > >

> > > Anyways for North Americans that are less England focused than Scotland/Ireland, I always thought combining Kent and Surrey would be the easiest way to get a fantastic 'tier 1' one-week sampler that is every bit the match for what you could find up North or across the Irish Sea; with RSG, Deal, Littlestone, (maybe even Rye) + SGH, Swinley, Walton Heath or Sunningdale, or... or... really spoilt for choice!

> >

> > I respect Walton Heath more than I love it! I generally play it a few times a year....thats enough. That said, its a course all golf nuts should see. I prefer the wee nine holer on the other side of the M25...Reigate Heath. Anyway, I reckon the best 10 Heathland/Moorland courses in the UK are

> >

> > Ganton

> > Gleneagles Kings

> > Pulborough

> > St Georges Hill

> > Sunny New

> > Sunny Old

> > Swinley Forest

> > Walton Heath Old

> > Woking

> > Worplesdon

> > * I haven't seen Woodhall Spa with the new work. This course might grab a top 10 spot.

> >

> > Take away Gleneagles and Ganton and that is a **** of a trip around London without ever sniffing a sea breeze!

> >

> > Ciao

 

> I've only got a sample size of about 20 to this point, but with Sunningdale seemingly a given for 2 spots, for 8 more I'd have to go:

> Delamere Forest | Ganton | Huntercombe | St. George's Hill | Swinley Forest | Walton Heath Old | West Sussex | Woodhall Spa ('old' version, not seen new)

>

> Not played the W's, Delamere's neighbours, Holinwell's neighbours, Dorset ones, or Luffenham yet, they're all queued up for when time allows. Reigate Heath is well cool - it's really only the sameyness of 7 & 8 that lets it down IMHO. And I don't know why Golf England felt they needed to 'upgrade' what's already one of most highly regarded courses around, improved ease of maintenance or whatever fair enough, but beyond that; ugh.

 

Woodhall Spa had lost its way. Some very cool bunkers were filled in because the fairways had become so narrow. Essentially, Woodhall became a course where hitting strips of fairways between bunkers was the end all and be all of the design. Angles? Forget about that...they are buried in rough. I also expect agronomy was big reason to clear trees. No sun and wind means poor quality turf.

 

Ciao

[Chanceman]

The Berkshire Red and Blue courses? I have wondered how they compare to the Ws and the Ss.

[Schley]

Played Woodhall Spa last month and I heard it is much improved. It is still tight IMO, but our caddie was telling us how lucky we were they took out some trees in the places we were playing from. The greens were pretty small and although not very long, you can't just bang driver as it has hazards and pinching fairways. Could still use the chainsaw to a couple hundred more trees IMO.

Under the radar 9 holer is Royal Worlington and Newmarket which was pretty splendid as well.

[jonnymc44]

Really enjoyed playing Notts, Ganton and Fixby Hall (Huddersfield) pretty recently. Delamere Forest is up there for me too. I've heard Moortown isn't to be missed. Held the first ever Ryder Cup on English soil for any golf historians.

 

Edit: Great Britain and Ireland (not Europe at this point) beat USA 7-5.

[scott_Donald]

Interesting - I am Scottish currently in Houston with a home links course in Aberdeen, Scotland.

 

My home course in Scotland in the summer I hit 7-11 two irons from the tee(wind dependent), In Houston I hit mainly driver. Playing a course on Sunday here in Houston and I think I will hit one 2 iron the entire round. Certainly accuracy defence vs length defence.

In Scotland I use both my 46* and 60* equally to chip, pitch, bump and run but here I use my 60* 75 percent of the time.

To me the weather is the biggest factor in the Uk, if it is not a 10mph wind on my home course then that just feels weird, seems to be hardly any wind here in the trees in windy Texas!

The greens are generally quicker here due to the lack of open spaces and wind, I tend to putt better on faster greens, on the slower links greens you certainly have to allow for less break.

When I was getting fit for a putter at Artisan, John said you have a lovely firm green here to putt on I replied, when I walked on to this I felt like it was very soft compared to home. I very rarely have to repair a pitch mark in Scotland but here its every green I hit in regulation.

I hate playing golf in a cart, to me I struggle to get a feel of the shot and loose rhythm but at this time of year it is far too hot to walk! I was walking in February and March but not since April. I walked 18 rounds in a month at home in May.

 

I enjoy playing in the heat in Houston but not going to lie I much prefer golfing at home but I am very spoilt and lucky to be able to just wonder down and play such a great links course - I have 6 weeks at home from August and already looking forward to playing it, The Old Course and Turnberry.

 

 

 

[Chanceman]

I have played Sunningdale, Swinley, Walton Heath and Woking, so my south of London rota for 2 weeks of bliss would be :

Berkshire Red/Blue

St Georges Hill,

Worplesdon,

Hankley Common,

Pulborough,

Liphook,

Tandridge,

Royal Ashdown,

The Addington,

And finish with a trip to Royal Blackheath purely for the history.

Or have I missed something? Being Aussie, not interested in playing New Zealand!

 

[duffer987]

Pulborough young man! Pulborough! Unless you consider that too far South.

In my limited experience West Sussex is my second fave between St. George's Hill and Swinley.

Reigate Heath is a cracking course and easy to fit in if you've got 60-90 mins.

[milesgiles]

> @"El Gringo" said:

> > @duffer987 said:

> > > @"El Gringo" said:

> > > I would be very surprised if there are courses akin to Walton Heath, Pulborough or Woodhall Spa anywhere except perhaps in France, Germany, Netherlands or Belgium. To me Walton Heath stands out vigoursly so as close to a proper heathland course as there is. That said, I admire Woking a great deal and plan to play it again next month. Before then a downland like beauty by the name of Kington is scheduled next followed by a course I haven't seen yet, Llandrindod Wells. Everybody should play Kington, it's like a links in the sky...wonderful course.

> > >

> > > Ciao

> >

> > Just played Walton Heath last week - great rough and tumble fun and a proper test as well and talk about your 'long views'.

> > Definitely like to get to the Dutch and French courses off the back of a work trip sometime...

> > Kington looks neat, but that'll have to wait until I make the hike out to Aberdovey.

> >

> > Anyways for North Americans that are less England focused than Scotland/Ireland, I always thought combining Kent and Surrey would be the easiest way to get a fantastic 'tier 1' one-week sampler that is every bit the match for what you could find up North or across the Irish Sea; with RSG, Deal, Littlestone, (maybe even Rye) + SGH, Swinley, Walton Heath or Sunningdale, or... or... really spoilt for choice!

>

> I respect Walton Heath more than I love it! I generally play it a few times a year....thats enough. That said, its a course all golf nuts should see. I prefer the wee nine holer on the other side of the M25...Reigate Heath. Anyway, I reckon the best 10 Heathland/Moorland courses in the UK are

>

> Ganton

> Gleneagles Kings

> Pulborough

> St Georges Hill

> Sunny New

> Sunny Old

> Swinley Forest

> Walton Heath Old

> Woking

> Worplesdon

> * I haven't seen Woodhall Spa with the new work. This course might grab a top 10 spot.

>

> Take away Gleneagles and Ganton and that is a **** of a trip around London without ever sniffing a sea breeze!

>

> Ciao

>

>

>

>

>

No love for Notts? Perhaps you aren’t counting it as Heathland? Loved Woking but I’d put it half a level above..

 

[El Gringo]

> @milesgiles said:

> > @"El Gringo" said:

> > > @duffer987 said:

> > > > @"El Gringo" said:

> > > > I would be very surprised if there are courses akin to Walton Heath, Pulborough or Woodhall Spa anywhere except perhaps in France, Germany, Netherlands or Belgium. To me Walton Heath stands out vigoursly so as close to a proper heathland course as there is. That said, I admire Woking a great deal and plan to play it again next month. Before then a downland like beauty by the name of Kington is scheduled next followed by a course I haven't seen yet, Llandrindod Wells. Everybody should play Kington, it's like a links in the sky...wonderful course.

> > > >

> > > > Ciao

> > >

> > > Just played Walton Heath last week - great rough and tumble fun and a proper test as well and talk about your 'long views'.

> > > Definitely like to get to the Dutch and French courses off the back of a work trip sometime...

> > > Kington looks neat, but that'll have to wait until I make the hike out to Aberdovey.

> > >

> > > Anyways for North Americans that are less England focused than Scotland/Ireland, I always thought combining Kent and Surrey would be the easiest way to get a fantastic 'tier 1' one-week sampler that is every bit the match for what you could find up North or across the Irish Sea; with RSG, Deal, Littlestone, (maybe even Rye) + SGH, Swinley, Walton Heath or Sunningdale, or... or... really spoilt for choice!

> >

> > I respect Walton Heath more than I love it! I generally play it a few times a year....thats enough. That said, its a course all golf nuts should see. I prefer the wee nine holer on the other side of the M25...Reigate Heath. Anyway, I reckon the best 10 Heathland/Moorland courses in the UK are

> >

> > Ganton

> > Gleneagles Kings

> > Pulborough

> > St Georges Hill

> > Sunny New

> > Sunny Old

> > Swinley Forest

> > Walton Heath Old

> > Woking

> > Worplesdon

> > * I haven't seen Woodhall Spa with the new work. This course might grab a top 10 spot.

> >

> > Take away Gleneagles and Ganton and that is a **** of a trip around London without ever sniffing a sea breeze!

> >

> > Ciao

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> No love for Notts? Perhaps you aren’t counting it as Heathland? Loved Woking but I’d put it half a level above..

>

 

> @milesgiles said:

> > @"El Gringo" said:

> > > @duffer987 said:

> > > > @"El Gringo" said:

> > > > I would be very surprised if there are courses akin to Walton Heath, Pulborough or Woodhall Spa anywhere except perhaps in France, Germany, Netherlands or Belgium. To me Walton Heath stands out vigoursly so as close to a proper heathland course as there is. That said, I admire Woking a great deal and plan to play it again next month. Before then a downland like beauty by the name of Kington is scheduled next followed by a course I haven't seen yet, Llandrindod Wells. Everybody should play Kington, it's like a links in the sky...wonderful course.

> > > >

> > > > Ciao

> > >

> > > Just played Walton Heath last week - great rough and tumble fun and a proper test as well and talk about your 'long views'.

> > > Definitely like to get to the Dutch and French courses off the back of a work trip sometime...

> > > Kington looks neat, but that'll have to wait until I make the hike out to Aberdovey.

> > >

> > > Anyways for North Americans that are less England focused than Scotland/Ireland, I always thought combining Kent and Surrey would be the easiest way to get a fantastic 'tier 1' one-week sampler that is every bit the match for what you could find up North or across the Irish Sea; with RSG, Deal, Littlestone, (maybe even Rye) + SGH, Swinley, Walton Heath or Sunningdale, or... or... really spoilt for choice!

> >

> > I respect Walton Heath more than I love it! I generally play it a few times a year....thats enough. That said, its a course all golf nuts should see. I prefer the wee nine holer on the other side of the M25...Reigate Heath. Anyway, I reckon the best 10 Heathland/Moorland courses in the UK are

> >

> > Ganton

> > Gleneagles Kings

> > Pulborough

> > St Georges Hill

> > Sunny New

> > Sunny Old

> > Swinley Forest

> > Walton Heath Old

> > Woking

> > Worplesdon

> > * I haven't seen Woodhall Spa with the new work. This course might grab a top 10 spot.

> >

> > Take away Gleneagles and Ganton and that is a **** of a trip around London without ever sniffing a sea breeze!

> >

> > Ciao

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> No love for Notts? Perhaps you aren’t counting it as Heathland? Loved Woking but I’d put it half a level above..

>

MG

 

The top 10 heathland/moorland courses in GB&I is a tough nut so one could easily go top 15 and the list wouldn't suffer for quality. Notts is a very good course highlighted by the holes on and around the hill with the back nine being excellent. I think for me, the greens aren't quite good enough to rate it top 10 heathland. For instance, Woking's greens are far more interesting and I think generally the bunker placement is more provocative. Notts has a strong culture of playing the 6900 yard tees. For me this means many driving bunkers are not in play. I would like to play the forward tees a few times to get a better sense of the course which better suits driving the ball 225 yards. That said, I sense Notts is garnering more attention and rightfuly so. The tree clearance and improved agronomy is a big step forward.

 

Ciao

[milesgiles]

> @"El Gringo" said:

> > @milesgiles said:

> > > @"El Gringo" said:

> > > > @duffer987 said:

> > > > > @"El Gringo" said:

> > > > > I would be very surprised if there are courses akin to Walton Heath, Pulborough or Woodhall Spa anywhere except perhaps in France, Germany, Netherlands or Belgium. To me Walton Heath stands out vigoursly so as close to a proper heathland course as there is. That said, I admire Woking a great deal and plan to play it again next month. Before then a downland like beauty by the name of Kington is scheduled next followed by a course I haven't seen yet, Llandrindod Wells. Everybody should play Kington, it's like a links in the sky...wonderful course.

> > > > >

> > > > > Ciao

> > > >

> > > > Just played Walton Heath last week - great rough and tumble fun and a proper test as well and talk about your 'long views'.

> > > > Definitely like to get to the Dutch and French courses off the back of a work trip sometime...

> > > > Kington looks neat, but that'll have to wait until I make the hike out to Aberdovey.

> > > >

> > > > Anyways for North Americans that are less England focused than Scotland/Ireland, I always thought combining Kent and Surrey would be the easiest way to get a fantastic 'tier 1' one-week sampler that is every bit the match for what you could find up North or across the Irish Sea; with RSG, Deal, Littlestone, (maybe even Rye) + SGH, Swinley, Walton Heath or Sunningdale, or... or... really spoilt for choice!

> > >

> > > I respect Walton Heath more than I love it! I generally play it a few times a year....thats enough. That said, its a course all golf nuts should see. I prefer the wee nine holer on the other side of the M25...Reigate Heath. Anyway, I reckon the best 10 Heathland/Moorland courses in the UK are

> > >

> > > Ganton

> > > Gleneagles Kings

> > > Pulborough

> > > St Georges Hill

> > > Sunny New

> > > Sunny Old

> > > Swinley Forest

> > > Walton Heath Old

> > > Woking

> > > Worplesdon

> > > * I haven't seen Woodhall Spa with the new work. This course might grab a top 10 spot.

> > >

> > > Take away Gleneagles and Ganton and that is a **** of a trip around London without ever sniffing a sea breeze!

> > >

> > > Ciao

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > No love for Notts? Perhaps you aren’t counting it as Heathland? Loved Woking but I’d put it half a level above..

> >

>

> > @milesgiles said:

> > > @"El Gringo" said:

> > > > @duffer987 said:

> > > > > @"El Gringo" said:

> > > > > I would be very surprised if there are courses akin to Walton Heath, Pulborough or Woodhall Spa anywhere except perhaps in France, Germany, Netherlands or Belgium. To me Walton Heath stands out vigoursly so as close to a proper heathland course as there is. That said, I admire Woking a great deal and plan to play it again next month. Before then a downland like beauty by the name of Kington is scheduled next followed by a course I haven't seen yet, Llandrindod Wells. Everybody should play Kington, it's like a links in the sky...wonderful course.

> > > > >

> > > > > Ciao

> > > >

> > > > Just played Walton Heath last week - great rough and tumble fun and a proper test as well and talk about your 'long views'.

> > > > Definitely like to get to the Dutch and French courses off the back of a work trip sometime...

> > > > Kington looks neat, but that'll have to wait until I make the hike out to Aberdovey.

> > > >

> > > > Anyways for North Americans that are less England focused than Scotland/Ireland, I always thought combining Kent and Surrey would be the easiest way to get a fantastic 'tier 1' one-week sampler that is every bit the match for what you could find up North or across the Irish Sea; with RSG, Deal, Littlestone, (maybe even Rye) + SGH, Swinley, Walton Heath or Sunningdale, or... or... really spoilt for choice!

> > >

> > > I respect Walton Heath more than I love it! I generally play it a few times a year....thats enough. That said, its a course all golf nuts should see. I prefer the wee nine holer on the other side of the M25...Reigate Heath. Anyway, I reckon the best 10 Heathland/Moorland courses in the UK are

> > >

> > > Ganton

> > > Gleneagles Kings

> > > Pulborough

> > > St Georges Hill

> > > Sunny New

> > > Sunny Old

> > > Swinley Forest

> > > Walton Heath Old

> > > Woking

> > > Worplesdon

> > > * I haven't seen Woodhall Spa with the new work. This course might grab a top 10 spot.

> > >

> > > Take away Gleneagles and Ganton and that is a **** of a trip around London without ever sniffing a sea breeze!

> > >

> > > Ciao

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > No love for Notts? Perhaps you aren’t counting it as Heathland? Loved Woking but I’d put it half a level above..

> >

> MG

>

> The top 10 heathland/moorland courses in GB&I is a tough nut so one could easily go top 15 and the list wouldn't suffer for quality. Notts is a very good course highlighted by the holes on and around the hill with the back nine being excellent. I think for me, the greens aren't quite good enough to rate it top 10 heathland. For instance, Woking's greens are far more interesting and I think generally the bunker placement is more provocative. Notts has a strong culture of playing the 6900 yard tees. For me this means many driving bunkers are not in play. I would like to play the forward tees a few times to get a better sense of the course which better suits driving the ball 225 yards. That said, I sense Notts is garnering more attention and rightfuly so. The tree clearance and improved agronomy is a big step forward.

>

> Ciao

 

 

[milesgiles]

^think I did play from the tips both times and barely noticed a fairway bunker past the first so you have a point..but there’s so much to love there especially in May as you drive in through the gorse, it’s an absolute picture. The course just gets better as you go round and the front nine isn’t exactly chopped liver. Woking lacks a good first and last hole by comparison. Notts is my favourite inland (lots I haven’t played in Surrey though..)

I’m also a lover of Ferndown.. tons of character makes up for the odd weak hole on the course ..

[El Gringo]

MG

 

I will take Woking's first and last over Notts' any day. Not that any of the holes are great. The blind handshake go for it green is of more interest than the bland offering at Notts. I also like the idea of a chance to birdie 18 rather than be faced with a ball breaker. I guess it comes down to preference so any list can't be taken too seriously. Being a person always on the look out for different courses I prefer favourites lists. Best lists tend to throw up the same ole courses.

 

Ciao

[act0fgod]

I find people tend to enjoy what they don't have. It amazes me how many folks from the UK and Ireland I've met on flat boring FL courses and they love it. Similarly, I've played the budget links courses in Scottland, Wales, and Ireland and I love it.

 

I played with a fellow and his daughter at Borth in Wales. They couldn't understand why I was playing their course. I had a Pebble Beach logo bag and the daughter was infatuated with Pebble. I asked her if she would rather play one round at Pebble or a couple of years at her home course, as the prices were comparable for each. She said the round at Pebble.

[milesgiles]

^so true.. I’m in Herts, which is 90% parkland. If I never see another parkland course I’d die happy lol

Every year I knock off some reasonable price links courses. That’s my retirement ideal, there is a half dozen areas in England and Wales alone with at least a handful of top notch links courses within a few miles of each other. Partly, at least, because I live as far from the sea as it’s possible to get at the moment. But I do think you get a different course every day of the week on the coast, depending on the wind..

[jonnymc44]

I'm lucky to live only 40mins drive to the likes of Royal Lytham, Royal Birkdale and a whole host of lesser known links courses along that coast. I play on a moorland course, with some holes having some similarities to links when it becomes firm and fast, but the turf is completely different. Drive a few miles in the opposite direction and there are heathland and parkland courses aplenty like Delamere Forest and Prestbury. Love the variation of courses in such a short distance from each other. I feel your pain, @milesgiles re: parkland. I couldn't deal with all the trees!

[scott_Donald]

> @act0fgod said:

> I find people tend to enjoy what they don't have. It amazes me how many folks from the UK and Ireland I've met on flat boring FL courses and they love it. Similarly, I've played the budget links courses in Scottland, Wales, and Ireland and I love it.

>

> I played with a fellow and his daughter at Borth in Wales. They couldn't understand why I was playing their course. I had a Pebble Beach logo bag and the daughter was infatuated with Pebble. I asked her if she would rather play one round at Pebble or a couple of years at her home course, as the prices were comparable for each. She said the round at Pebble.

 

I play in Houston weekly and am a member in Scotland, I miss my home course in Scotland, best thing about home. I prefer the weather certainly here in Houston. Only course I have played here in Texas that I can relate to my home course is Austin Country Club(still best inland course I have ever played) but again that is not easy to get on to play! I really like a public course here in Houston but its almost in good condition again after Harvey Scottish golf is amazing, its cheap and high quality if you are lucky enough to be a member of a good club, I am and I am already looking to 6 weeks golfing at home in August.

 

[duffer987]

> @scott_Donald said:

> > @act0fgod said:

> > I find people tend to enjoy what they don't have. It amazes me how many folks from the UK and Ireland I've met on flat boring FL courses and they love it. Similarly, I've played the budget links courses in Scottland, Wales, and Ireland and I love it.

> >

> > I played with a fellow and his daughter at Borth in Wales. They couldn't understand why I was playing their course. I had a Pebble Beach logo bag and the daughter was infatuated with Pebble. I asked her if she would rather play one round at Pebble or a couple of years at her home course, as the prices were comparable for each. She said the round at Pebble.

>

> I play in Houston weekly and am a member in Scotland, I miss my home course in Scotland, best thing about home. I prefer the weather certainly here in Houston. Only course I have played here in Texas that I can relate to my home course is Austin Country Club(still best inland course I have ever played) but again that is not easy to get on to play! I really like a public course here in Houston but its almost in good condition again after Harvey Scottish golf is amazing, its cheap and high quality if you are lucky enough to be a member of a good club, I am and I am already looking to 6 weeks golfing at home in August.

>

 

By relate you mean being a well regarded private club?

Didn't play it while there, I but on the face of it I don't see a lot of similarities between it and links golf - unless you catch it when the wind is up you could at least match that aspect.

[scott_Donald]

> @duffer987 said:

> > @scott_Donald said:

> > > @act0fgod said:

> > > I find people tend to enjoy what they don't have. It amazes me how many folks from the UK and Ireland I've met on flat boring FL courses and they love it. Similarly, I've played the budget links courses in Scottland, Wales, and Ireland and I love it.

> > >

> > > I played with a fellow and his daughter at Borth in Wales. They couldn't understand why I was playing their course. I had a Pebble Beach logo bag and the daughter was infatuated with Pebble. I asked her if she would rather play one round at Pebble or a couple of years at her home course, as the prices were comparable for each. She said the round at Pebble.

> >

> > I play in Houston weekly and am a member in Scotland, I miss my home course in Scotland, best thing about home. I prefer the weather certainly here in Houston. Only course I have played here in Texas that I can relate to my home course is Austin Country Club(still best inland course I have ever played) but again that is not easy to get on to play! I really like a public course here in Houston but its almost in good condition again after Harvey Scottish golf is amazing, its cheap and high quality if you are lucky enough to be a member of a good club, I am and I am already looking to 6 weeks golfing at home in August.

> >

>

> By relate you mean being a well regarded private club?

> Didn't play it while there, I but on the face of it I don't see a lot of similarities between it and links golf - unless you catch it when the wind is up you could at least match that aspect.

 

I am not one to care about the club itself more the course.

 

To me Austin country club is a gorgeous course that is fair if you hit the ball well and it was in awesome condition(played the week after WGC). It has the same feels as my Royal Aberdeen, same length wish, just a fun simple layout. It is the only course I have played here that has made me think it was as good as RA.

 

I have not played any of the massive US courses.

 

My membership fees compared to a similar club in the US are at a minimal fraction of the cost. We are lucky all the visitors subsidise our fees.

 

 

[Lancj1]

> @duffer987 said:

 

> IMHO those aren't 2nd tier/3rd tier... those are very much 1st tier, just not as well known.

> And they are all easily accessible, assuming their comps calendar is clear and it's on a visitor day, I've had no problems playing those (except Prestbury not got there yet).

> Would think 2nd/3rd tier would be say Sherwood Forest, Coxmoor, and Worksop vs 1st tier Holinwell - to use examples mentioned above.

 

Brit here. My personal view is that there 3 types of course in the UK

 

1. Private clubs - regardless of links or not they have been around 100 years, are quite expensive, have lots of Jags and Bentleys on the car park, the captain is called Mr Captain and always wears a red tuxedo on the course, the pro has been there 40 years and no-one has ever seen him hit a ball, they may still have a joining fee and your socks had better be knee length.

 

2. Open clubs - Built on the back of the Ryder cup 85/Faldo/Seve boom. Light green in color, bigger and wide open, turn up and join and pay your membership monthly, does weddings and christenings, often empty, been in receivership twice in recent years, owners desperate to sell to a building company but its on greenbelt, pro hopes to pass his PGA exam soon but often seen practicing, captain is called Alan and wears adidas, used fords on the car park

 

3. Municipals. - Turn up, play, pay if you want, avoid the beer cans and condoms in some bunkers, avoid the teens selling drugs in the trees around the 16th, council can't afford a green keeper, pro is a 14 handicap lad in Nike, captain is called Big Mick and is currently on bail for money laundering, wears jeans and a vest, stolen cars on car park.

[El Gringo]

> @Lancj1 said:

> > @duffer987 said:

>

> > IMHO those aren't 2nd tier/3rd tier... those are very much 1st tier, just not as well known.

> > And they are all easily accessible, assuming their comps calendar is clear and it's on a visitor day, I've had no problems playing those (except Prestbury not got there yet).

> > Would think 2nd/3rd tier would be say Sherwood Forest, Coxmoor, and Worksop vs 1st tier Holinwell - to use examples mentioned above.

>

> Brit here. My personal view is that there 3 types of course in the UK

>

> 1. Private clubs - regardless of links or not they have been around 100 years, are quite expensive, have lots of Jags and Bentleys on the car park, the captain is called Mr Captain and always wears a red tuxedo on the course, the pro has been there 40 years and no-one has ever seen him hit a ball, they may still have a joining fee and your socks had better be knee length.

>

> 2. Open clubs - Built on the back of the Ryder cup 85/Faldo/Seve boom. Light green in color, bigger and wide open, turn up and join and pay your membership monthly, does weddings and christenings, often empty, been in receivership twice in recent years, owners desperate to sell to a building company but its on greenbelt, pro hopes to pass his PGA exam soon but often seen practicing, captain is called Alan and wears adidas, used fords on the car park

>

> 3. Municipals. - Turn up, play, pay if you want, avoid the beer cans and condoms in some bunkers, avoid the teens selling drugs in the trees around the 16th, council can't afford a green keeper, pro is a 14 handicap lad in Nike, captain is called Big Mick and is currently on bail for money laundering, wears jeans and a vest, stolen cars on car park.

 

Very funny...would be more so if not for the many multitudes who believe it to be true!

 

Ciao

[tiderider]

> @scott_Donald said:

> > @act0fgod said:

> > I find people tend to enjoy what they don't have. It amazes me how many folks from the UK and Ireland I've met on flat boring FL courses and they love it. Similarly, I've played the budget links courses in Scottland, Wales, and Ireland and I love it.

> >

> > I played with a fellow and his daughter at Borth in Wales. They couldn't understand why I was playing their course. I had a Pebble Beach logo bag and the daughter was infatuated with Pebble. I asked her if she would rather play one round at Pebble or a couple of years at her home course, as the prices were comparable for each. She said the round at Pebble.

>

> I play in Houston weekly and am a member in Scotland, I miss my home course in Scotland, best thing about home. I prefer the weather certainly here in Houston. Only course I have played here in Texas that I can relate to my home course is Austin Country Club(still best inland course I have ever played) but again that is not easy to get on to play! I really like a public course here in Houston but its almost in good condition again after Harvey Scottish golf is amazing, its cheap and high quality if you are lucky enough to be a member of a good club, I am and I am already looking to 6 weeks golfing at home in August.

>

 

you preferring it right now? ... it's HOT ...

[scott_Donald]

> @tiderider said:

> you preferring it right now? ... it's HOT ...

 

Back in Scotland now for 7 weeks, will play a few holes tonight then have a comp tomorrow.

 

I played 2 times last week in Houston - Friday over 100 and was fine in a buggy. the previous Sunday was mid 90s and felt nice and cool to normal. I wouldnt golf without a buggy and about 6 litres of water a round!

 

Looking forward to walking again though.

 

I get back in time for Memorial to open so will certainly try hard to get on that on my return.