Calculating Net Double Bogey????

[swh0507]

You are over complicating it by trying to calculate the net double bogey during the round, don't worry about it until after the round.

Step 1 - Calculate course handicap (16)

Step 2 - Determine holes where you get a stroke (1-16 hardest holes)

Step 3 - Play golf, write down your gross score for every hole.

Step 4 - If you are playing stroke play, you can take your 16 strokes off at the end gross score (95 - 16 = 79 net score) Compare to buddies, lowest score wins.

Step 5 - If match play, write your gross score down per hole, and lower down on scorecard write your net score (Gross - minus number of strokes you get on THAT hole). Do the same for opponent. Low Net score wins hole, tie is split etc. whatever format you are playing.

Step 6 - AFTER your round, enter your gross score for handicap purposes. If you had no holes greater than double bogey, enter your gross score.

Any holes greater than double bogey you need to determine if you need an adjustment. HC holes 1 - 16, you must adjust anything greater than Triple bogey down to triple bogey. HC holes 17-18 you adjust anything greater than double down to double bogey. You then enter your gross score minus the amount of strokes you had to adjust. So if you shot 95 with a quad on HC hole 1, you have to adjust that to triple, so you would POST a 94.

[MontrealMike]

What happens if I Triple on 1-16? Is my gross adjusted to Double?

[MontrealMike]

I think we're getting there. What happens if I triple any holes between 1-16? Would that get adjusted to a double?

[swh0507]

Lets be clear, we are talking HC holes 1-16 not actual holes 1 - 16. And again, this is for AFTER the round when posting the score for handicap tracking. A triple would stay a triple since that is the max score you can take on those holes. (Par + HC strokes for that hole + double bogey = Max hole score allowed for posting)

[MontrealMike]

Has this ever been a humbling experience for me. Final question of the night. 17th hole and I have zero HC strokes for this hole. Par 4 and I triple it. Par + double bogey?

[swh0507]

Yes, AFTER your round for HC posting purposes. Don't be that guy who is in the sandtrap hitting 6 and picks up since he can't "post more than 6" I hate that. (unless it is time saving purposes, but then ONLY if you are out of position to group ahead)

You got it

 

 

[MontrealMike]

Next is to enroll in high school math. Thanks to you all!

[rogolf]

Net double bogey for any hole = par + 2 + any handicap strokes you receive on that hole.

[Augster]

NDB breaks down like this.

Everyone (that isn’t better than scratch) can take a double bogey. Meaning they post a 5 for a par 3, a 6 for a par 4, and a 7 for a par 5.

The only time NDB adds in is when you shoot a triple or worse on a hole.

In your example, on a par 4, where you get a shot, and you shoot a triple(7), you post 7 for that hole.

A player doesn’t even need to think about NDB until they make a triple or worse. The same as single digit caps have been doing with ESC for years.

[Shilgy]

I just entered this thread and was about to post the same. Mike from Montreal is overthinking this. Rogolf nailed the easy explanation.

 

For handicap purposes you can post up to a net double bogey. Which is par + 2 strokes(which is a double bogey) plus however many strokes your handicap gives you on that hole.

[WarEagleGolf]

Not trying to jack this thread, but also don't want the "search for that" comment. I'm a good player, understand how ESC "worked", and play alot. We don't play net games, BUT I do want to make sure I know my Max score to have the most accurate cap for tournament play.

Course is rated 74.4/137/72 - from the app. I'm a 4 index, now a 7 CH for these tees on this course.

I can take NDB + 1 on holes rated 1-7 on this course, right? Asked my pro and he just said "net double bogey". Pissed me off. Because that isn't really what it is.

Normal tees we play are 75.4/142/73. Same same question applies, but how do I calc the 73? And note I'm a 8 CH for these tees? Is 73 now par? Or does the 8 take care of that for me?

[ThinkingPlus]

Your pro was correct. Your max postable hole score is net double bogey. In your first example, on the #1 - #7 stroke index holes your max postable score would be a gross triple. All other holes, your max postable score would be a gross double bogey. Those max scores are all net double bogey. In your 2nd example I have you with the same CH of 7 unless your index is slightly higher than 4. Are you really a 4.1 or 4.2 maybe?

[jvincent]

@WarEagleGolf
On the #1 to 7 handicap holes your "net" par is par + 1 so your max score is "net par" plus double. You did the math correctly, but used the terms slightly incorrectly. For the tees where your CH is 8 and par is 73 you still adjust score based on net par for each hole.

Confusion of the relevant terms has been a common theme in this thread. Hopefully the following will help clear things up.
Gross score = the actual number of strokes you made on a hole.
Net score = gross score minus any handicap strokes on the hole.
Net par = par plus any handicap strokes.
Net Double Bogey = Net par + 2.
So it's important to not that you don't always post your net score on a hole. If your net score is greater than net double bogey then you only record the NDB score for handicapping purposes.

[WarEagleGolf]

Touche..... Over thinking, just like so many of the other new rules.

...yeah, 4.1.

 

 

[Colin L]

Mike

I've just caught up with this thread. I see you have now been given the easy to understand definition of a net double bogey. If only you had been given that at the start!

To repeat. Net Double Bogey at any hole is Par + 2 strokes + any handicap strokes you get for that hole. You need to know how many strokes you get for a particular course and at which holes you get them.

For example, say you get a handicap stroke at a Par 4 hole, your NDB for that hole is 7 ( 4+2+1).

Say you get 2 handicap strokes at a Par 5 hole, your NDB for that hole is 9 (5+2+2).

A player who is receiving fewer than 18 handicap strokes will get no handicap strokes at some holes.

Say he gets no handicap stroke at a Par 4, his NDB for that hole is 6 (4+2+0).

 

It really is that easy. Know the par of the hole you are playing. Add on 2 strokes. Know whether you have a handicap stroke or strokes at that hole and add them on if you do. That's your NDB for that hole.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Augster]

Great addition rogolf! I’m using that from now on. Very simple and a person really can’t screw it up. If they do, well, the world needs ditch diggers too.

Postable score on a hole is par+2+any handicap strokes.

Great thinking!

[Tocgolfer]

Go out and play as normal and if you post Your score at the end of the day let the magic of WHS work out your score for the day if you’re playing stroke. If you are playing stableford or par you just have to know where you are allocated shots on holes and pick up when you can’t score.

[Colin L]

That's the usual definition which has been carried on into the WHS. I expect it will be in the USGA rule book.

I remarked in another forum that CONGU areas probably had to accommodate the biggest changes with the WHS, but this is a very familiar definition as Net Double Bogey has been our maximum score for handicapping purposes for a long time. We also play quite a lot of Stableford and so knowing when to pick up is almost automatic.

It can also be defined as the lowest net score that does not earn a Stableford point, but I don't find that one as helpful.

 

 

[BlackDiamondPar5]

This thread is example of precisely why the USGA abandoned a par plus handicap strokes for ESC in 1993. Now we're repeating history and it's not gonna be good.

[dpb5031]

Once you know your course handicap, it's as simple as this:

You can post a max of double bogey on any that you do not get a stroke.

You can post a max of triple bogey on any hole that you do get a stroke.

If you happen to be higher than an 18 HC, there will be holes where you will be getting 2 strokes. Your max score for posting will be a quadruple bogey on those holes.

Remember, these adjustments are for posting purposes only and have no bearing on whatever format under which you may be competing.

[Colin L]

Be of good cheer. We have been using it for years and it's just not a problem.

[dpb5031]

Agreed. I don't see it as complicated or confusing in the least.

Seems that those who are struggling with it conceptually don't really understand golf handicapping in general.

[OldFrog75]

Except this time the entire world is doing it this way. Some are already familiar with it.

[Shilgy]

Maybe I am recalling it incorrectly but par had nothing to do with the old ESC. Wasn’t You could only take as many doubles as you handicap? So a 3 handicap could take bogeys and up to 3 doubles...

Funny thing is the system we just moved away from included double bogey rather than a raw number as well. Single digit players could only take a double bogey. Not a raw number like 7 for those that were 10-19 handicaps.

 

Why is it so difficult for folks to understand NDB? Are there really folks out there that do not know what a par is? Do they know when they make a net par? Or net birdie? Do they know that a double bogey is two over par? If they know what a net par is then they should know that a net double is 2 strokes more than that.

 

This is the prior to 1993 chart- personally I liked this method.

 

Course Handicap

Limitation on Hole Score

 

Plus or Scratch

Limit of one over par on any hole.

 

1 through 18

Limit of two over par on number of holes equal to Course Handicap.  Limit of one over par on balance of holes.

 

19 through 36

Limit of three over par on as many holes as course handicap exceeds 18 strokes.  Limit of two over par on balance of holes.

 

37 through 54

Limit of four over par on as many holes as the Course Handicap exceeds 36 strokes.  Limit of three over par on balance of holes.

 

 

[nsxguy]

"Maybe I am recalling it incorrectly but par had nothing to do with the old ESC. Wasn’t You could only take as many doubles as you handicap? So a 3 handicap could take bogeys and up to 3 doubles..."

I don't recall that "limitation".

 

[Sawgrass]

Old ESC only related to par for 9 course handicap players or those with fewer strokes. For them, a double bogey was the max postable score, however many triples or worse they made. The rest of us dealt with a single maximum score irrespective of par.

[Shilgy]

But I was referring to the pre 1993 version. The original ESC. Every handicap level had maximums related to par. As noted in post #54.

[Shilgy]

Unfortunately it did not copy paste as a chart but the limits noted were the original system.

[Sawgrass]

Ahh, I see. To me "old" ESC ended 12/31/19. The one you referred to must now be called "net double old."

[Seamus_McDuff]

I think there were a few years when the max for a single digit was 6. They later changed it to double-bogey.