Anybody ever have Srs on JV teams taking away playing time from underclass men.

[tatertot]

3 hours ago, ThinkingPlus said:

You misunderstand.  The issue is seniors playing on the JV team not underclassmen playing on the varsity team.

I understand ... If underclassmen can compete on Varsity, why can't upperclassmen compete on JV?

[tatertot]

3 hours ago, Gsea said:

Maybe AJGA should have all the kids compete in one division no age brackets. HS ranges from 14-19 yrs old thats why there are Varsity, JV and freshman teams. Otherwise its all about everyone gets to participate. Compete against your age if you are that good.

This isn't AJGA ... no age groups in high school sports. All high schoolers are considered the same age. There are Varsity, JV and freshman teams to let as many kids as possible participate. The JV team isn't called the "junior and sophomore" team.

[tatertot]

12 minutes ago, ilikegolf26 said:

Welcome to the participation trophy era. 

If a senior is better than an underclassmen, they should get a spot on the JV team because they are better ... that's competition ... how is that a "participation trophy"? It's the opposite. Participation trophy is letting the underclassmen have the spot even though they don't deserve it.

 

Look at basketball ... you have 12 varsity players and 12 JV players. If one of my varsity players breaks his leg, I want my best JV player to take his spot. I don't want my best underclassmen to take his spot ... I want my best PLAYER to take his spot. That's what JV is for.

[Gsea]

1 minute ago, tatertot said:

If a senior is better than an underclassmen, they should get a spot on the JV team because they are better ... that's competition ... how is that a "participation trophy"? It's the opposite. Participation trophy is letting the underclassmen have the spot even though they don't deserve it.

 

Look at basketball ... you have 12 varsity players and 12 JV players. If one of my varsity players breaks his leg, I want my best JV player to take his spot. I don't want my best underclassmen to take his spot ... I want my best PLAYER to take his spot. That's what JV is for.

Ya have ur 18 yr old sr play on ur freshman bb team with 14 yr olds cuse thats where he falls talent wise lol. Sr can't make varsity suck it up. Spirit of competition lol

[Movingday]

17 minutes ago, Gsea said:

Ya have ur 18 yr old sr play on ur freshman bb team with 14 yr olds cuse thats where he falls talent wise lol. Sr can't make varsity suck it up. Spirit of competition lol

So you got cut and are lookin for people to back you up? If you want to be on the team, practice and get better 

[ilikegolf26]

26 minutes ago, tatertot said:

If a senior is better than an underclassmen, they should get a spot on the JV team because they are better ... that's competition ... how is that a "participation trophy"? It's the opposite. Participation trophy is letting the underclassmen have the spot even though they don't deserve it.

 

Look at basketball ... you have 12 varsity players and 12 JV players. If one of my varsity players breaks his leg, I want my best JV player to take his spot. I don't want my best underclassmen to take his spot ... I want my best PLAYER to take his spot. That's what JV is for.

JUNIOR VARSITY is and always has been a developmental level.  When I was in high school seniors weren’t even allowed to play at the JV level. If they weren’t good enough to play varsity then they didn’t get to just ride out their dead end high school career competing against freshman and sophomores. 

Edited September 15, 2021 by ilikegolf26

[Gsea]

25 minutes ago, Movingday said:

So you got cut and are lookin for people to back you up? If you want to be on the team, practice and get better 

idiot, yeah I'm a high school kid lmao. 

[Gsea]

25 minutes ago, ilikegolf26 said:

JUNIOR VARSITY is and always has been a developmental level.  When I was in high school seniors weren’t even allowed to play at the JV level. If they weren’t good enough to play varsity then they didn’t get to just ride out their dead end high school career competing against freshman and sophomores. 

100%, bet they get a participation certificate when they graduate

[Movingday]

4 minutes ago, Gsea said:

idiot, yeah I'm a high school kid lmao. 

Lol go back and look at the way you typed your post.

You came to the internet to ask a “general question” hoping to hear the answers you wanted. It’s obvious either you or your child aren’t getting the playing time you want. The answer has nothing to do with who else is on the team. It’s simple. Get better. 
Maybe take the advice you gave in another thread and don’t come on the internet to talk crap about a coach. Sign up to be an assistant 

[tatertot]

1 hour ago, Gsea said:

Ya have ur 18 yr old sr play on ur freshman bb team with 14 yr olds cuse thats where he falls talent wise lol. Sr can't make varsity suck it up. Spirit of competition lol

Did I say "freshman" team? Are you capable of reading? 

 

If your freshman can't beat the senior, he doesn't deserve a spot on the JV team. Spirit of competition. This isn't junior golf.

[tatertot]

34 minutes ago, Gsea said:

100%, bet they get a participation certificate when they graduate

Dude, we get it ... your kid didn't make the team, you're bitter. You came asking for opinions, didn't like what you heard. Now you're lashing out. 

[Gsea]

28 minutes ago, Movingday said:

Lol go back and look at the way you typed your post.

You came to the internet to ask a “general question” hoping to hear the answers you wanted. It’s obvious either you or your child aren’t getting the playing time you want. The answer has nothing to do with who else is on the team. It’s simple. Get better. 
Maybe take the advice you gave in another thread and don’t come on the internet to talk crap about a coach. Sign up to be an assistant 

Nobody said anything about a coach, being an assistant doesn't change school policy and nobody got cut. 

[Gsea]

Just now, tatertot said:

Dude, we get it ... your kid didn't make the team, you're bitter. You came asking for opinions, didn't like what you heard. Now you're lashing out. 

kid is on the team they just got to carry the dead weight of a 18 yr old sr that feels good playing with 14/15 yr olds, dude

[tatertot]

1 hour ago, ilikegolf26 said:

JUNIOR VARSITY is and always has been a developmental level.  When I was in high school seniors weren’t even allowed to play at the JV level. If they weren’t good enough to play varsity then they didn’t get to just ride out their dead end high school career competing against freshman and sophomores. 

Obviously different schools use JV for different things ... my sons school has constant competition between the varsity and JV as players move up and down between the two teams.

[tatertot]

1 minute ago, Gsea said:

kid is on the team they just got to carry the dead weight of a 18 yr old sr that feels good playing with 14/15 yr olds, dude

It's high school ... age groups don't matter at this level. At college they don't differentiate between 18 years and 22 year olds - and older. There is no more "good for their age." You're either good enough or not. That 18 year old deserves his spot as much as the 14 year old. 

[heavy_hitter]

13 hours ago, tatertot said:

 

 

Look at basketball ... you have 12 varsity players and 12 JV players. If one of my varsity players breaks his leg, I want my best JV player to take his spot. I don't want my best underclassmen to take his spot ... I want my best PLAYER to take his spot. That's what JV is for.

This argument doesn't hold much weight.  If your BEST JV player is taking his place, why isn't that player on the Varsity Squad already?  I don't want my best JV player taking his place unless he is going to get burn.  I want my best JV player to continue competing on the JV level.

 

From a coaching standpoint, there is no reason to have a Senior on JV.  If he isn't good enough to be on the varsity squad, he should be cut.  Show me a coach that would put a Senior on JV and I will show you a coach that isn't a good coach.

 

@Gseahas a legitimate point.  Putting a Senior on JV is useless.

Edited September 15, 2021 by heavy_hitter

[Noles]

This is one of those topics where blanket rules or procedures are foolish.  Especially across different sports.  There are situations where playing a senior on JV make no sense and there are some rare occurrences where does.  Leave it up to the discretion of the coaching staff.

[bazinky]

I had always thought that the sports where the JV was strictly for the development of underclassmen were those where a lack of physical maturity could make it difficult or dangerous for underclassmen to complete (such as in football). Sports like golf and tennis don't have that same issue. I was a tennis player growing up, and we had a really strong cohort of players in my freshman class. I was a nationally ranked junior and played #1 singles and doubles as a freshman, plus we we had two other sectionally ranked players in my grade, as well as several state ranked players. Our entire staring line-up my freshman year was either a freshman or a sophomore, and we won both our district and region and almost won the state title.  

 

That's admittedly an extreme example, but I would hate to have the upperclassmen who don't have the skill or ability to compete beyond the high school level not to have the chance to continue playing just because of their age. It's the job of the coaches to understand what players need to be on the JV team, and who needs to be getting playing time. Upperclassmen also need to understand that they may lose out on playing time to a younger player who is not presently as good as they are if the coach thinks it is in the best long-term interest of the team or program.

 

[weavej1]

I think it comes down to what your high school golf program “is”.  Is it an annual contender for states? Trying to grow a competitive win at all costs.  In a case like that, there is no need to groom a senior on the JV, you would want to narrow your focus and attention on developing the next year.   
 

or is your program a place to grow young men in hopes of giving them a good high school experience enjoying the game of golf in a team/competitive  environment.

 

 

Either is fine w me.

 

Check out The Long Green Line documentary.

Edited September 15, 2021 by weavej1

[wobgon]

Since the OP has stated all the things that did not lead to his question, i am curious what the situation was that did lead to his question.

[Gsea]

2 hours ago, bazinky said:

Upperclassmen also need to understand that they may lose out on playing time to a younger player who is not presently as good as they are if the coach thinks it is in the best long-term interest of the team or program.

truth

[Gsea]

57 minutes ago, wobgon said:

Since the OP has stated all the things that did not lead to his question, i am curious what the situation was that did lead to his question.

short version, our state has eight players play per match take the 5 best scores. So the school has 17 players show up for try-outs. First year coach only puts 8 on Varsity (seniors and jrs) all else on JV. Says he won't cut just one. As far as who plays matches on JV its mostly subjective they may get one 9 in a week rest of practice is 2 hrs of range, chipping, and putting social hour. It is what it is, live and learn. As a side bar this school use 2 have a great program up until about 8 yrs ago when the AD retired and the new hire turn out to b a horses .... Anyway the 2 coaches quit they hire some teacher who had no experience and probably couldn't break 90. had some complaints against him they fired him last year. Jrs from last year actually didn't tryout this year because of him. So they hire is teacher buddy with no exp etc and this is what we got.

FYI jv team is all freshman and sophomores and the lone eagle senior.

[RmoorePE]

This has been a good thread so far. I mean with golf it really doesn't make sense to worry over the age of a JV player. Every week is a competition and golf is a sport where you can have a bad streak, or a hot streak it is coaches job to ride that out. If a senior is scoring the same as the rest of the JV kids, he is not dead weight. 

 

In other sports most seniors are not going to accept being put on JV and will quit. Those that are willing to play on JV just want to play and it is the coaches job to make sure that they don't hinder a younger players development. I don't think that states should have rules about it, as some school districts will get turn outs that are too small to field full teams, and so flexibility is needed. I have seen coaches round up a couple of seniors who never played basketball outside of PE just to fill out a JV squad and have a season. 

 

Football in most states does not allow Srs on JV, for injury purposes, but football teams have lots of room so it is no big deal.

 

Last year in my home town the boys basketball team cut 4 seniors, kids who had been in the program since middle school, 2 of them had varsity minutes as juniors. The JV and C teams were full, and they could not find a place for them, as a big crop of Jrs had more talent. Made sense. Caused a big stir for the coach though.

 

Last night I got to watch some of our local golf boys play in their match. I ran into the coach as he was driving from group to group. He told me that his #1 through #4 (all seniors) from the first two matches were moved to JV and what they call "practice squad" (kids hoping to play onto JV or V) as they were pencil whippers. One of them quit as a result, but golf is great that way there is no where to hide. They also won their first match of the year because of coach realizing he had some bad apples.

 

Gsea sounds like you have an inexperienced coach. Maybe you should volunteer your time instead of bitching about it on the internet?😁

[heavy_hitter]

5 minutes ago, Gsea said:

short version, our state has eight players play per match take the 5 best scores. So the school has 17 players show up for try-outs. First year coach only puts 8 on Varsity (seniors and jrs) all else on JV. Says he won't cut just one. As far as who plays matches on JV its mostly subjective they may get one 9 in a week rest of practice is 2 hrs of range, chipping, and putting social hour. It is what it is, live and learn. As a side bar this school use 2 have a great program up until about 8 yrs ago when the AD retired and the new hire turn out to b a horses .... Anyway the 2 coaches quit they hire some teacher who had no experience and probably couldn't break 90. had some complaints against him they fired him last year. Jrs from last year actually didn't tryout this year because of him. So they hire is teacher buddy with no exp etc and this is what we got.

FYI jv team is all freshman and sophomores and the lone eagle senior.

So without even knowing what he has, he put all the Juniors and Seniors on Varsity?  The 9th and 10th graders have no shot to play on the varsity squad?  

 

17 is entirely too many to have on a golf roster for High School.  Personal feeling is there is no reason to have a JV team for HS golf as it is a complete waste of time.  If I know my kid isn't going to play on varsity, there is no reason to play.  There are too many other Junior Tours to even need to worry about it.  Sounds like a hot mess to me with a coach that has no idea what he is doing.  

[Gsea]

5 minutes ago, RmoorePE said:

Gsea sounds like you have an inexperienced coach. Maybe you should volunteer your time instead of bitching about it on the internet?😁

Been a coach for over 20yrs and I am a firm believer fathers shouldn't coach their kids. No matter how unbiased you think you can be bias will sneak in its human nature.

Wasn't bitchin just asked a question and got responses that were more dissertation in nature than yes or no. Like I said live and learn. 

[Gsea]

Oh and there are def pencil whippers, coaches won't admit it but I followed their first match. And no I won't approach that subject with the coach. Its his business to deal with it not mine.

Edited September 15, 2021 by Gsea

[TripleBogeysrbetter]

High school golf over the different parts of the country isn't the same.

 

Our District and Region teams have Teams A-C.  Our High school only has one team (1 boy / 1 girl) with about 20 kids each.  Last year a freshman beat out 5 Seniors.

There is no JV unless you are playing Football, basketball, FH, LAX, etc.

[Mr. Grumpy]

13 hours ago, heavy_hitter said:

 Show me a coach that would put a Senior on JV and I will show you a coach that isn't a good coach.

 

@Gseahas a legitimate point.  Putting a Senior on JV is useless.

Ha. I've done it, and will do it again. I highly doubt that you could decipher every scenario pertaining to this situation in coaching. You said this to support your personal belief and to keep puffing wind in Gsea's sails. 

[Gsea]

10 hours ago, heavy_hitter said:

So without even knowing what he has, he put all the Juniors and Seniors on Varsity?  The 9th and 10th graders have no shot to play on the varsity squad?  

 

17 is entirely too many to have on a golf roster for High School.  Personal feeling is there is no reason to have a JV team for HS golf as it is a complete waste of time.  If I know my kid isn't going to play on varsity, there is no reason to play.  There are too many other Junior Tours to even need to worry about it.  Sounds like a hot mess to me with a coach that has no idea what he is doing.  

No we have jv matches in our division the schools are big enough. so jv teams play other jv teams usually 3 or 4 school meets.

[Gsea]

28 minutes ago, Mr. Grumpy said:

Ha. I've done it, and will do it again. I highly doubt that you could decipher every scenario pertaining to this situation in coaching. You said this to support your personal belief and to keep puffing wind in Gsea's sails. 

Don't need wind in my sails. I have a mind of my own and the last thing that will influence it is an internet forum. Also thought you didn't have a JV team