Pete Cowen : "Worlds BEST golf coach TRANSFORMS my game in 25 MINUTES!!"

[i*windows]

Absolutely brilliant video with maybe the best coach alive, Pete Cowen. (It's not me in the video, just the title 😉 )

 

 

[EagleAteBirdie]

Watched it yesterday.  Great insight from one of the best coaches in the game and shows that even good players can still have a lot to work on.  He looked very uncomfortable during that lesson and it was amusing that the last swing of the video, where he stays behind to practice, he reverts back to his old swing.  Golf is hard.

[i*windows]

22 minutes ago, EagleAteBirdie said:

... He looked very uncomfortable during that lesson ...

Pete Cowen reminds be of that school teacher that everyone was scared of 🙂

Edited March 25, 2022 by i*windows

[Wasted_Talent]

I don't quite understand the hand position he was talking about.  

[MK7Golf21]

Ironically, I was watching a golf tip from Rory yesterday and he was talking about the drill the twist the towel in opposite directions that Pete mentions in this lesson. Rory was working with Pete around the time of the video.

 

It looks like when he was talking about loading the lead shoulder for the fade he was trying to get him to get the lead arm higher and more in front to just swing down for the out to in path and for the draw is was less high and a little deeper to just swing down from the inside, right? It's hard to tell what they are doing because the video is taken face on.

[KD1]

I logged on specifically to see if anyone was talking about this video yet, lol.

 

I couldn't quite follow some of what he was talking about.

 

1) The opposing forces in the grip. To be clear, he suggests you should apply force in your grip such that the inside of your wrists would rotate closer together?? How much force/tensions are we talking about here? Adding any tension at the wrists is the opposite of what I've always heard but of course I'm open to what ever he's preaching...

 

2) When he keeps talking about your should and shoulder muscles he's referring to the triceps, right?

 

I had 'aha moment' #7,105 at the range a couple days ago that specifically involved my lead triceps and then I saw this video. I figure I need to ask questions before I get too excited because I'm a real sucker for confirmation bias.

[airjammer]

@moehogan should be all over this thread 

[aenemated]

Oh man, this is brilliant stuff. 

 

"Is it drawing?"

"Yes."

"Is it a good shot?"

"Yes."

"Mmhm."

 

Outstanding. 

Edited March 25, 2022 by aenemated

[badboggs]

I've never understood the fascination teachers seem to have with gravity acting on the club.  From a force point of view gravity most certainly has very little impact on a golf swing.  Granted I'm only about 10% through the video but I've always wondered about that.  I've heard Malaska say the same kind of thing.  I'm no biometrics expert but I'd guess gravity is almost a negligible contribution to a golf swing dynamics.  Am I way off here?

[MK7Golf21]

6 minutes ago, badboggs said:

I've never understood the fascination teachers seem to have with gravity acting on the club.  From a force point of view gravity most certainly has very little impact on a golf swing.  Granted I'm only about 10% through the video but I've always wondered about that.  I've heard Malaska say the same kind of thing.  I'm no biometrics expert but I'd guess gravity is almost a negligible contribution to a golf swing dynamics.  Am I way off here?

 

I agree on gravity but I think it has more to do with the club being in position to swing on the path you want easily, like you you want to hit a fade and have the club way behind you it takes more effort and some manipulation to swing out to in or you just hit a hold off fade from in to out path. 

 

 

[badboggs]

100% agree.  I think his best point is that at impact it is too late.  You have to be in the right position for your body halfway down or you will never deliver the club correctly.

 

Too much of teaching like this is not based in any reality.  All this talk of forces and angles.  It is just a way for teachers to feel important and condescending in my opinion.  If you don't have some way to measure the forces they are just talking out their @$$.  It is certainly a hard way to learn.  Clearly the student has no real idea what the hell Pete is saying and is just agreeing.  It would be like someone teaching you astrology and you are just saying ya, ya ya but really you have no idea what the hell they are talking about.  

 

My favorite is when they watch the student his a shot poorly and say something like you just didn't go down enough or you used your rotation not your angle.  WTH is up with that style of teaching?

[jholz]

21 minutes ago, badboggs said:

Too much of teaching like this is not based in any reality.

 

Anytime I read a statement like "world's best golf coach" or "transformed my game in 25 minutes" you know it's going to be about as worthwhile as watching a Jack Hamm infomercial.

 

For anyone who's interested, I've got a case of snake oil in my garage I'd let go for a reasonable price.

[MK7Golf21]

22 minutes ago, badboggs said:

100% agree.  I think his best point is that at impact it is too late.  You have to be in the right position for your body halfway down or you will never deliver the club correctly.

 

Too much of teaching like this is not based in any reality.  All this talk of forces and angles.  It is just a way for teachers to feel important and condescending in my opinion.  If you don't have some way to measure the forces they are just talking out their @$$.  It is certainly a hard way to learn.  Clearly the student has no real idea what the hell Pete is saying and is just agreeing.  It would be like someone teaching you astrology and you are just saying ya, ya ya but really you have no idea what the hell they are talking about.  

 

My favorite is when they watch the student his a shot poorly and say something like you just didn't go down enough or you used your rotation not your angle.  WTH is up with that style of teaching?

 

Cowen has always kind of talked in riddles about the golf swing. I thought what he taught this guy was pretty solid though, I could see what he taught him clearing up his ball striking, could do without the riddle talk but that is just his style.

 

his downward release is just a more neutral release without having a weak holdoff release from the inside to prevent lefts or a strong rolling over release that can cause shots to go left. 

[Hawkeye77]

Stumbled on it last night - really good. 

[jonsnow]

6 hours ago, i*windows said:

Pete Cowen reminds be of that school teacher that everyone was scared of 🙂

He has that no nonsense vibe, David Gilmore of Pink Floyd fame does too.

[stickfish]

Anyone who manages to connect David Gilmour with golf gets a 👍from

me anytime.

<><

[Chunkitgood]

Am I crazy or does Cowan just square the club with his hips?

 

This sort of instruction would be lost on anybody who does not have good body motion to start with, that is, most everybody.

 

His idea of the grip reminds me of how I was taught in kenjutsu.  I think the guy who taught at Riviera said the same.

 

When he talks about gravity, I think he means a sense of balance in which. He club feels like it is not going in one direction or another he means

[Chunkitgood]

Sorry that was Eddie Merrins at Bel-air.

[Notashank]

I watched it 3 times and have no idea what he means. 

[jonsnow]

57 minutes ago, stickfish said:

Anyone who manages to connect David Gilmour with golf gets a 👍from

me anytime.

<><

Wish spellcheck hadn’t caused me to misspell his name. Watched a documentary on Chuck Leavell this week and David Gilmour turned up

in it. The man just has a powerful presence. As does Pete Cowen.

[gentles]

Some definite no turn cast concepts in the discussion about the release I thought too 

[moehogan]

6 hours ago, airjammer said:

@moehogan should be all over this thread 

Really good stuff about face control. Opposing Hands Rule!

Edited March 25, 2022 by moehogan

[CasualLie]

3 hours ago, jholz said:

 

Anytime I read a statement like "world's best golf coach" or "transformed my game in 25 minutes" you know it's going to be about as worthwhile as watching a Jack Hamm infomercial.

 

For anyone who's interested, I've got a case of snake oil in my garage I'd let go for a reasonable price.

 

It has to be tour issue snake oil or it will never fly at golfwrx.

 

I'm curious who was the origin of golf instruction in the UK.  I've met four instructors over the years that love that wind up diagonally from the ground up and unwind the club down like a spiral staircase.  Is weird, never seen that on this side of the pond as they say.  Did it come from Cowen???

[jholz]

1 hour ago, CasualLie said:

 

It has to be tour issue snake oil or it will never fly at golfwrx.

 

I'm curious who was the origin of golf instruction in the UK.  I've met four instructors over the years that love that wind up diagonally from the ground up and unwind the club down like a spiral staircase.  Is weird, never seen that on this side of the pond as they say.  Did it come from Cowen???

 

That is a highly intriguing question that I, unfortunately, couldn't even begin to answer. Perhaps someone else on here can however, and I'd be interested to know it.

[Trippels]

Pete Cowen starting a lesson:

 

[jonsnow]

1 hour ago, jholz said:

 

That is a highly intriguing question that I, unfortunately, couldn't even begin to answer. Perhaps someone else on here can however, and I'd be interested to know it.

I don't know if Pete Cowen originated the idea of the spiral staircase, but he (& those he is working with like Stenson) are the only people I've heard reference it. It is a striking image.

[BMC]

That video was painful to watch.  Cowen has a weird way of communicating.

[jholz]

47 minutes ago, jonsnow said:

I don't know if Pete Cowen originated the idea of the spiral staircase, but he (& those he is working with like Stenson) are the only people I've heard reference it. It is a striking image.

 

Just to be clear here, I make absolutely no claims to knowing more about the golf swing than Pete Cowan or any other competent and experienced teaching pro. No one, beyond beginners, should probably listen to anything I have to say on the subject. I'm simply an enthusiastic middle aged single digit cap with an abiding interest in the golf swing, and particularly my own swing. I've been digging it out of the dirt for the past forty-odd years.

 

I also have over a decade of experience as a college level teacher, and pedagogy is one of my interests.

 

With that in mind, I've got more issues with the marketing in this video than amything.

 

Honestly, I don't see Cowan's theory being that much different than the mainstream right now. There's a lot of emphasis on biomechanics, getting into proper positions before impact, and gaining consistency by using large vs. small muscles. All good stuff that I tend to agree with. But so does everyone else these days. 

 

My issue is with the way all of this is presented and the style of pedagogy that Cowan is using. It's tried and true Socratic method, but the bad kind. Classic "sage on the stage" stuff. He wants it to sound mysterious and complicated. We might as well get into a discussion of Hogan's secret.

 

I'm also suspicious of anyone who says "the golf season is about to begin, time to go get a lesson."

 

Either you've been working on your swing in the off season or you have not. If you've been working with an instructor, wonderful. If not, continue digging it out of the dirt on your own. But, for me, that one time lesson with a swing guru at the start of the season is either going to do no good at all, or completely mess you up for the foreseeable future.

 

You've got to know your swing, and a worthwhile instructor will find a balance between using what you've got and what you should be doing. Not much of that in Cowan's pedagogy, if this video is a representative sample.

 

If only Henrick Stenson had continued listening to Cowan, he'd still be relevant on tour right?

 

[MK7Golf21]

if you look at that guys YouTube you will see that he swings really inside and flat on the backswing and his arms get stuck behind him, he came to him with inconsistent ballstriking which is fairly easy to see why. I think Cowen gave him some good advice, he got him getting his hands higher and more in front to hit some fades which he needed to neutralize him out, was based on ballflight instead of looking at everything on camera and he got results. I mean, there isn't much more you can ask out of a 25 minute lesson really. I thought he ended the lesson pretty fast though, should of kept letting Cowen watch over and end it when he was done. I just think he was nervous.

Edited March 26, 2022 by MK7Golf21

[gsrjc]

Way over my head.