SuperSpeed Golf training system

[GolfChannel]

130

[Lincoln_Arcadia]

The only thing about this is the type of 9i and where he puts it in his stance etc. lots of variables.

Really liking this thread though. Looks like we have a ton of success stories with older golfers.

[puresurfr]

Im a older golfer, I still believe in the system but some modifications are helpful especially if you have golfers elbow or some body aches. Im doing my own modified superspeed system after about 6 weeks of intro. Warming up with the green stick in addition to stretches, ill swing with the stick at 60-80% to warm up the joints ( in addition to stretching ). Then I take about 5 swings with the driver increasing from 70-80-90-100-100. Then I do the intro protocol but only the green and blue sticks. I do increase reps to 5 and I take more rest between reps. Although I swing 100%, I still manage some form. It still looks like a golf swing but it is definitely 100%. I probably can reach for a bit more but at that amount of effort, im just as likely to hit my SSR or the ground or detach my elbow tendon. I follow this with 2-4 days of rest depending on how my body feels. In addition, im doing power lifting and exercises with elastic bands and plyometrics and medicine balls and kettle balls and running and stretching and hand/finger exercise and of course Range work.

[dhc1]

You mind sharing some of your workouts to increase hip mobility? Also, did you go to a specific golf trainer or TPI type? Thanks

[ROH1]

Sorry if this has been discussed already. If there is evidence that only one stick is really needed, at about 90% of the weight of a full driver, would it make sense to do the protocols with a women's driver. Are women's drivers about 10% less in weight. If so, all I have to do it go to the garage. No need to order anything.

[Lincoln_Arcadia]

Makes sense. But there is more air resistance with a ladies driver than a stick with a weight.

[puresurfr]

Depending on which driver you own, you can take out all the removable weights and make a lighter driver to speed train with.

Or you can remove your standard grip and put on a Winn Lite grip, this should lighten your club by 28-30g and increase SW by 3 points

[GolfChannel]

As a single stick proponent, I'm not sure it's simply just club weight, but how that weight is actually distributed. I think the club being weighted and having limited head size so it doesn't have to displace as much air on the swing is important in feeling the weight of the end of the stick better almost like an Orange Whip for speed.

Use what you got, but I still think the SuperSpeed sticks are designed well, just I don't think you need all three.

[SirFuego]

The SuperSpeed guys have said in various podcasts I've listened to that there is a mental aspect of swinging a "stick" vs a "club". Their theory is that there is a mental barrier of trying to square the clubface when you are swinging a club (even without a ball), and it goes away when trying to swing a stick. Removing that mental barrier lets you swing faster. This trains your brain/muscles to move faster and shifts your "baseline" speed higher. So even when you do hit real balls with real clubs and need to actually square the face, your baseline speed for a normal swing will still increase.

I suppose one could argue that it's the weight distribution of the club vs the stick as opposed to a mental barrier (maybe it's both?!?), but regardless of the reason the net effect is still the same -- you can swing the stick faster.

[ddetts]

I had an interaction with Brian Manzella on Twitter when he posted a bit of a cryptic post about speed training. While he didn't specicially say SuperSpeed was worthless, he basically implied it. I'll see if I can find my thread on his post.

[bluedot]

I did; I'm working with Chris Finn at Par4Success in Cary, NC. We did a full one-hour assessment to determine where my deficiencies were, but the teaching pro I have been working with had already suspected the hip mobility was a big problem for me. That turns out to be true of LOTS of senior golfers, btw, regardless of general fitness. I'm 67, with really good flexibility and strength, but I just could not get full into my left side on a full swing, even though we could "pose" it and even though I could do it on partial swings in drill work. It was at his recommendation that went to see Chris in the first place; wish I'd gone sooner.

I'm going to have a hard time describing particular parts of the workouts that he's set up for me as purely hip mobility, because that's all part of the weight and especially the medicine ball work. But there is a lot of hip work in the daily myofascial release/soft tissue work that he has me doing, and a lot of hip mobility work without a load; hip openers, hip rotations with a donkey kick, seated hip openers, and so on.

[bluedot]

Bingo.

A company selling sticks makes money if you order a stick, but not as much money as if you order three sticks. If you don't order anything, well...

[ddetts]

Here's what Manzella was arguing for.

[bluedot]

That is possible, though I'd like to see hard testing data from the SS guys to prove that. Whatever is true at the outset of swinging a real driver would seem to me to be a very temporary issue in swinging as hard as you can, just like any other aspect of technique. If I'm putting aside any worries about my technique, and only focusing on teaching my body to go fast by swinging as fast as I can, I don't think that squaring the clubface would be any different than takeaway or swing plane or position at the top or anything else in the long run of trying to swing fast.

But in any case, the key questions are NOT about what's at the end of stick. It's what does the stick weigh, relative to your actual driver, and how many reps are optimal. And there just isn't any testing data that I'm aware of that supports swinging a heavier club as a way to get faster, or supports the need, injuries aside, for 12,000 swings a year. There are benefits to both of those; speed just doesn't happen to be one of them.

[GolfChannel]

I have no idea who Manzella is, but takes like this are probably why...

I do have an issue with SuperSpeed not doing better about teaching transference of those gains, for some reason they avoid the question in any social media posting like the plague. I think it's largely that they don't want to revise their training ideas. Do their protocols work, yes, but they are far less than ideal if you want to be efficient and get the largest gains with the lack of injury potential.

Regardless of their failings in this one very important contextual area, my swing speed has gone up since I started the program. Case in point, my max effort 8-iron pre-program in October was 140 yards. This was yesterday and it was a 3/4 smoothie with an 8-iron:

 

[ddetts]

Brian Manzella is a pretty well known golf instructor and has been featured on Golf Channel and in articles in many of the golf publications. I think he was a pretty early adopter of Trackman and using it in instruction as well: http://www.brianmanzellagolf.com/

 

I don't really agree with him, as I picked up a little speed doing the protocol for only about 5 weeks last winter before falling out of my routine. I've started again this winter, and just got into protocol 1 and added kneeling swings. I haven't eclipsed the maxes I had with green stick last year or my max recorded driver on the radar (as of about 2 weeks ago when I accidently demonlished my radar with a careless step swing). But I did regain speed which had fallen off at the end of my season in Oct-Nov. I had recorded a few swings on a FlightScope Range unit that were 108-110mph ( on a day that was only about 40* outside) whereas I was stuck around 105mph for quite awhile.

[bluedot]

There a lots of folks that report gains from the Super Speed protocol; that isn't at issue. But you have to consider the possibility that you could have had equal or better gains another way.

The issue for most TPI-types is what is optimal in terms of the weight you are swinging and the number of reps. I'll say it again; I don't know of ANY exercise protocol in ANY sport that recommends the number of max reps that the SS protocol does. Every other workout routine that I'm aware of has sets of 5-10 reps (occasionally 15 if the load is very light), and three or four sets. The SS protocols have both more reps AND sets; a LOT more, and that alarms the TPI guys immensely.

There is NO question that swinging a weighted club can have benefits in terms of strength, flexibility, and mobility. But there are better and safer ways to improve all of those things without the downside of swinging a weighted club, which is that you are swinging more slowly and training your body to do exactly that. Swinging a weighted club gives the illusion that you are swinging a "normal" weight faster, but the actual speed is slower. Here's a link to a baseball study, but the same applies to the relationship between swinging the red stick and your actual swing speed.https://www.infieldfundamentals.com/should-i-swing-a-weighted-bat-on-deck/

[Shilgy]

Just like in any sport there are always various ways to accomplish the same goal. The Superspeed system works, for me, and I have golf buddies commenting on my newfound distance off the tee. The idea that there are other available methods does not diminish the efficiency of this product imo.

[bluedot]

I don't think there is any question that the SS program increases swing speed for players whose bodies are capable of swinging faster. The questions are whether or not it's the fastest and safest way to achieve the same increases.

[QMany]

 

think Gears shows the opposite, the kinetic sequencing is the same.

[dlygrisse]

Manzella is the guy that preached a swing philosophy as the absolute truth, then took a 180 And taught the total opposite, all the sudden, one day....everything I taught was wrong. Take anything he says with a grain of salt.

[CardsChamps11]

Saw super speed is releasing a new product that is counterbalanced. I wonder how that will train speed

[SirFuego]

Doesn't provide much, but here is a link to the flyer from the PGA Show:https://www.pgashow.com/__novadocuments/661935?v=637146241444870000

[GolfChannel]

I bet I know what it weighs...

[CardsChamps11]

This honestly looks like a red stick with a counterweight. Would be cool to know what the tip and counter weighs. Could potentially replicate with current sticks by putting a specific weight screw in the butt of the club.

[puresurfr]

Looks like they bought out the fire sale of Boccieri Secret Grips.

[GolfChannel]

From the pictures on the website it just looks like a counter-weighted blue speed stick given the dimensions. I will be at the PGA Show on Thursday to confirm.

[bluedot]

It says that it "creates the overall weight of men's driver".

If SS comes out with a product and a protocol using one stick of that weight and fewer swings, they will be in line with what ALL the research from multiple sports shows about the optimal way of increasing swing speed. Not the ONLY way, but the optimal way.

[clevited]

Back to the grip strength thing and how it potentially relates to swing speed, I bought the 1.5 and can close that a couple times even with broken down hands from yesterdays hand strength exercises. I think it is safe to say I was in-between a 1.5 and a 2.0 to start with and swinging mid to high 120s max. Still curious if there is a correlation at all.

 

I expect to be able to close a 2 at least once in a week or two. Last time I tried I was within .25 of an inch from a full close. I will be interested in seeing if my swing speed increases as I progress. I have a 2.5 and a 3 now as well. I think 2.5 is doable for me after much training, not sure a 3 will ever be possible for me.

[puresurfr]

Be careful about doing too many gripper exercises, I was trying to get stronger quickly and most have overdid the training thing. I have mild pain in both elbows now, it does not seem to be joint based but more of the muscle on the forearm by the elbow. I bought the rubber band hand extensors, which are just rubber bands. My grip strength is not bad, but my extensor strength is beyond Pathetic. They come with 5 different levels and some people double up the bands, I can barely handle the easiest rubber band.