US Open on links style courses - booo

[Jasonic]

Having played in Scotland, I have not seen a "links" course in the US. Maybe links "style" here in Long Island there are a few but without the ocean it doesn't really feel the same. Plus no Gorse in the US. That stuff was brutal and on every course over there. Tall grass and "wind" (quotes are because a normal day over there is super windy over here) doesn't make it a links course in my opinion.

[ethanshapiro]

Also I just want to see a good test of golf and an entertaining tournament regardless of links/no links. Personally watching Rory obliterate Congressional was much more interesting than the entire field outside of a couple players go backwards at Merion. Just my $0.02 though

[Argonne69]

I'm in the minority here among everyone who just likes seeing carnage but I would love to see the U.S. Open at Congressional or Southern Hills or Atlanta Athletic Club--courses that players often say that they love playing. I personally feel like these newer courses are very very tricked out. I'm trying to convince myself that Erin Hills isn't gimmicky while someone lands one a yard from the pin on #9 and it goes off the green 30 yards. It just seems like the players hate the courses and the setups more and more each year. I think the USGA at least needs to consider returning to more tried and true or at least conventional golf courses like they will be for the next few years

 

Doesn't that describe Augusta National? Hitting the small target on the green is a critical part of scoring. You give these guys a 20 yard wide target and they'll eat it up. I'm really enjoying the tournament so far. It's rewarding well struck shots, and penalizing errant shots.

[Argonne69]

Having played in Scotland, I have not seen a "links" course in the US. Maybe links "style" here in Long Island there are a few but without the ocean it doesn't really feel the same. Plus no Gorse in the US. That stuff was brutal and on every course over there. Tall grass and "wind" (quotes are because a normal day over there is super windy over here) doesn't make it a links course in my opinion.

 

Bandon Dunes is true links, gorse included. The courses in the Sand Hills area of Nebraska are also true links, albeit with no gorse. Streamsong is very close.

[MMB1500]

Having played in Scotland, I have not seen a "links" course in the US. Maybe links "style" here in Long Island there are a few but without the ocean it doesn't really feel the same. Plus no Gorse in the US. That stuff was brutal and on every course over there. Tall grass and "wind" (quotes are because a normal day over there is super windy over here) doesn't make it a links course in my opinion.

 

Bandon Dunes is true links, gorse included. The courses in the Sand Hills area of Nebraska are also true links, albeit with no gorse. Streamsong is very close.

 

I thought links courses were those built on the land linking the land and the sea - hence the name 'links '.

 

Isn't Nebraska a landlocked state?

[Jasonic]

Having played in Scotland, I have not seen a "links" course in the US. Maybe links "style" here in Long Island there are a few but without the ocean it doesn't really feel the same. Plus no Gorse in the US. That stuff was brutal and on every course over there. Tall grass and "wind" (quotes are because a normal day over there is super windy over here) doesn't make it a links course in my opinion.

 

Bandon Dunes is true links, gorse included. The courses in the Sand Hills area of Nebraska are also true links, albeit with no gorse. Streamsong is very close.

 

Unfortunately I haven't been to Bandon yet but it is very high on the list. Heard amazing things.

[pavlam05]

I was there Wednesday. I've never been overseas, but I've also never watched The Open and seen courses with the amount of undulation or blind shots that this course has. Several greens are severely elevated and I don't see on most holes how you would play any of the "chasing" type shots into a green that roll out 20+ yards like you would see on any of open courses in Scotland, Ireland, etc.

 

Yes, the designers may want you to think of Ireland, but using fescue or putting a shamrock in a logo doesn't make it something it's not.

[Argonne69]

Having played in Scotland, I have not seen a "links" course in the US. Maybe links "style" here in Long Island there are a few but without the ocean it doesn't really feel the same. Plus no Gorse in the US. That stuff was brutal and on every course over there. Tall grass and "wind" (quotes are because a normal day over there is super windy over here) doesn't make it a links course in my opinion.

 

Bandon Dunes is true links, gorse included. The courses in the Sand Hills area of Nebraska are also true links, albeit with no gorse. Streamsong is very close.

 

I thought links courses were those built on the land linking the land and the sea - hence the name 'links '.

 

Isn't Nebraska a landlocked state?

 

Nebraska was once at the bottom of an inland sea. The Sand Hills area in northern Nebraska is basically 200 foot high sand dunes.

 

[danipman]

Well if there are basically 2 types of courses, Parkland and Links, just make sure the PGA is contested at a Parkland and there you have 2 Parklands with Augusta and 2 Links, the US OPEN and British Open for the Majors.

 

But if you think about it, Bethpage Black offers BOTH!!!! Front 9 is definitely a Parkland layout, back 9 with the exception of the Par 5 13th and the one tree on 12, is pretty much links style with no trees in play. Now if the greens were a little less flat....................

[Argonne69]

I was there Wednesday. I've never been overseas, but I've also never watched The Open and seen courses with the amount of undulation or blind shots that this course has. Several greens are severely elevated and I don't see on most holes how you would play any of the "chasing" type shots into a green that roll out 20+ yards like you would see on any of open courses in Scotland, Ireland, etc.

 

Yes, the designers may want you to think of Ireland, but using fescue or putting a shamrock in a logo doesn't make it something it's not.

 

The grass appears to be native prairie grass. What would you expect in the Midwest? The Midwest is littered with prairie-style courses that use native grass off the fairway. The town of Erin was settled by Irish immigrants in the mid 1800's. I'd say it's a bit more Irish than Notre Dame University.

[cbole22]

I think the reason the US Open is at Erin Hills is that the USGA is still searching for that superstar course (public preferably) in the Midwest it can take the tournament to every ten years.

 

Oakland Hills, Medinah, Cog Hill, Olympia Fields and Hazeltine just aren't it.

 

 

I'm not sure what the deal is with North Shore Country Club, Skokie Country Club and Chicago Golf Club. Maybe someone on this site is familiar with the "politics" of the membership base. I would like to see the USGA attempt to bring some of the famous old courses back into the loop like they did with Merion. North Shore hosted the 2011 Western Am so maybe it's coming back into the loop.

 

Butler National would be the best choice if not for the membership policies

[Joe85]

I don't like these contrived "made-specifically-for-US Open" courses in general. Last year was Chamber's, this year it's this...place.

 

 

 

How about the probably hundred other courses in America today that are a hundred years old that are worthy of our Nation's Championship? Why do they get jumped over/overlooked for these contrived/fabricated courses , for the greatest Championship in the world and that's it?

[North Butte]

EH is a links in the same way as iBlades are blades.

[Jasonic]

Well if there are basically 2 types of courses, Parkland and Links, just make sure the PGA is contested at a Parkland and there you have 2 Parklands with Augusta and 2 Links, the US OPEN and British Open for the Majors.

 

But if you think about it, Bethpage Black offers BOTH!!!! Front 9 is definitely a Parkland layout, back 9 with the exception of the Par 5 13th and the one tree on 12, is pretty much links style with no trees in play. Now if the greens were a little less flat....................

 

That course is hard enough with benign greens!

[swpgolf]

I find it very difficult to tell one hole from another on television and makes it far less enjoyable to watch. I don't really get the idea that it's a great thing to have at least one blind shot on 14 of the holes at Erin Hills. With no trees to define the course it's almost like watching the pros hit on the range.

[Argonne69]

I don't like these contrived "made-specifically-for-US Open" courses in general. Last year was Chamber's, this year it's this...place.

 

How about the probably hundred other courses in America today that are a hundred years old that are worthy of our Nation's Championship? Why do they get jumped over/overlooked for these contrived/fabricated courses , for the greatest Championship in the world and that's it?

 

I'm fairly certain that Erin Hills was not designed as a "U.S. Open" course. The area was farmland in the Kettle Moraine, a naturally hilly area of the state. As I understand it, very little dirt was moved to create the course.

[Bubb]

I'm really liking Erin Hills. I think courses without trees are are some of the prettiest. Sure, there are a lot of great courses with trees, but all else being equal, I'll take no trees.

[Joe85]

I don't like these contrived "made-specifically-for-US Open" courses in general. Last year was Chamber's, this year it's this...place.

 

How about the probably hundred other courses in America today that are a hundred years old that are worthy of our Nation's Championship? Why do they get jumped over/overlooked for these contrived/fabricated courses , for the greatest Championship in the world and that's it?

 

I'm fairly certain that Erin Hills was not designed as a "U.S. Open" course. The area was farmland in the Kettle Moraine, a naturally hilly area of the state. As I understand it, very little dirt was moved to create the course.

 

 

Was it not designed specifically with it in mind to bring in a Major (if not specifically a US Open)?

 

 

Even if it wasn't, Chamber's was.

[imakaveli]

Having played in Scotland, I have not seen a "links" course in the US. Maybe links "style" here in Long Island there are a few but without the ocean it doesn't really feel the same. Plus no Gorse in the US. That stuff was brutal and on every course over there. Tall grass and "wind" (quotes are because a normal day over there is super windy over here) doesn't make it a links course in my opinion.

 

Bandon Dunes is true links, gorse included. The courses in the Sand Hills area of Nebraska are also true links, albeit with no gorse. Streamsong is very close.

 

I thought links courses were those built on the land linking the land and the sea - hence the name 'links '.

 

Isn't Nebraska a landlocked state?

 

Nebraska was once at the bottom of an inland sea. The Sand Hills area in northern Nebraska is basically 200 foot high sand dunes.

 

 

According to the Links Association Sand Hills is not a true links

[masegolf1978]

I suppose I'm ok with courses without trees. I'm not ok with cutting down a bunch of healthy trees to get them that way.

[Jasonic]

I don't like these contrived "made-specifically-for-US Open" courses in general. Last year was Chamber's, this year it's this...place.

 

How about the probably hundred other courses in America today that are a hundred years old that are worthy of our Nation's Championship? Why do they get jumped over/overlooked for these contrived/fabricated courses , for the greatest Championship in the world and that's it?

 

I'm fairly certain that Erin Hills was not designed as a "U.S. Open" course. The area was farmland in the Kettle Moraine, a naturally hilly area of the state. As I understand it, very little dirt was moved to create the course.

 

Every puff piece running ad nauseum states the goal of the course was to host a US Open. Not built by USGA but safe to say it was created with US Open in mind.

[Argonne69]

Having played in Scotland, I have not seen a "links" course in the US. Maybe links "style" here in Long Island there are a few but without the ocean it doesn't really feel the same. Plus no Gorse in the US. That stuff was brutal and on every course over there. Tall grass and "wind" (quotes are because a normal day over there is super windy over here) doesn't make it a links course in my opinion.

 

Bandon Dunes is true links, gorse included. The courses in the Sand Hills area of Nebraska are also true links, albeit with no gorse. Streamsong is very close.

 

I thought links courses were those built on the land linking the land and the sea - hence the name 'links '.

 

Isn't Nebraska a landlocked state?

 

Nebraska was once at the bottom of an inland sea. The Sand Hills area in northern Nebraska is basically 200 foot high sand dunes.

 

 

According to the Links Association Sand Hills is not a true links

 

That pic is actually Dismal River in the Sand Hills area of Nebraska, not to be confused with Sand Hills GC.

[SilverBullets]

I don't like these contrived "made-specifically-for-US Open" courses in general. Last year was Chamber's, this year it's this...place.

 

How about the probably hundred other courses in America today that are a hundred years old that are worthy of our Nation's Championship? Why do they get jumped over/overlooked for these contrived/fabricated courses , for the greatest Championship in the world and that's it?

 

I'm fairly certain that Erin Hills was not designed as a "U.S. Open" course. The area was farmland in the Kettle Moraine, a naturally hilly area of the state. As I understand it, very little dirt was moved to create the course.

 

 

Was it not designed specifically with it in mind to bring in a Major (if not specifically a US Open)?

 

 

Even if it wasn't, Chamber's was.

 

The original developer embarked on the EH project with the goal of hosting a US Open. He was at the 2000 US Open at Pebble when he determined it was a dream to build and own a course which could host the US Open.

 

So while the land was absolutely perfect for to make a great golf course without moving a ton of dirt, the goal was ultimately to host a US Open when the project started. There is a reason why the course can play over 8000 yards without a major renovation.

[Sixcat]

I don't like these contrived "made-specifically-for-US Open" courses in general. Last year was Chamber's, this year it's this...place.

 

How about the probably hundred other courses in America today that are a hundred years old that are worthy of our Nation's Championship? Why do they get jumped over/overlooked for these contrived/fabricated courses , for the greatest Championship in the world and that's it?

 

I'm fairly certain that Erin Hills was not designed as a "U.S. Open" course. The area was farmland in the Kettle Moraine, a naturally hilly area of the state. As I understand it, very little dirt was moved to create the course.

 

 

Was it not designed specifically with it in mind to bring in a Major (if not specifically a US Open)?

 

 

Even if it wasn't, Chamber's was.

 

FS1 aired a piece yesterday afternoon concerning the initial property investment and development intent. The previous owner met with Mike Davis on sight when they were still bailing hay and hadn't begun to develop a golf course. The piece had photos of the meeting and clearly, no golf course existed at the time. The initial owner ran out of money in the process and sold to the current ownership group, who finished the course and negotiated with the USGA.

 

So, Erin Hills was most assuredly built to host a US Open. I am certain, Fox will re-air the segment several times this weekend.

[lhahn]

I don't like these contrived "made-specifically-for-US Open" courses in general. Last year was Chamber's, this year it's this...place.

 

How about the probably hundred other courses in America today that are a hundred years old that are worthy of our Nation's Championship? Why do they get jumped over/overlooked for these contrived/fabricated courses , for the greatest Championship in the world and that's it?

 

I'm fairly certain that Erin Hills was not designed as a "U.S. Open" course. The area was farmland in the Kettle Moraine, a naturally hilly area of the state. As I understand it, very little dirt was moved to create the course.

 

Every puff piece running ad nauseum states the goal of the course was to host a US Open. Not built by USGA but safe to say it was created with US Open in mind.

 

Might be semantics but yes, it was Mr. Lang's goal with Erin Hills to host a US Open (by the way, there's a great 6 or 7 article write up on the story of EH, great read), but it's not like the course was built specifically for the US Open. The land was there and the architects did their best to make best use of the natural terrain. That Fox story wasn't the complete picture. The land was not originally found by Mr. Lang but some other fellow I forget the name of.

 

Here's the story if anyone's interested - http://www.jsonline....tory/375374001/

[Argonne69]

FS1 aired a piece yesterday afternoon concerning the initial property investment and development intent. The previous owner met with Mike Davis on sight when they were still bailing hay and hadn't begun to develop a golf course. The piece had photos of the meeting and clearly, no golf course existed at the time. The initial owner ran out of money in the process and sold to the current ownership group, who finished the course and negotiated with the USGA.

 

So, Erin Hills was most assuredly built to host a US Open. I am certain, Fox will re-air the segment several times this weekend.

 

Interesting. I stand corrected. Is designing with a major in mind a bad thing? They had the land, so length is not really an issue. 'Not sure how the design would have changed had they decided to forgo a shot at the U.S. Open.

[knock it close]

I don't like these contrived "made-specifically-for-US Open" courses in general. Last year was Chamber's, this year it's this...place.

 

 

 

How about the probably hundred other courses in America today that are a hundred years old that are worthy of our Nation's Championship? Why do they get jumped over/overlooked for these contrived/fabricated courses , for the greatest Championship in the world and that's it?

Find one long enough, with enough space for corporate and tv stuff, close to a urban hub, and with a membership willing to give up their course for an extended period of time. There's not too many 100 year old courses that fit the bill, and the ones that do are in or being added to the rota (Shin, Oakmont, LA CC)

[lhahn]

I don't like these contrived "made-specifically-for-US Open" courses in general. Last year was Chamber's, this year it's this...place.

 

How about the probably hundred other courses in America today that are a hundred years old that are worthy of our Nation's Championship? Why do they get jumped over/overlooked for these contrived/fabricated courses , for the greatest Championship in the world and that's it?

 

I'm fairly certain that Erin Hills was not designed as a "U.S. Open" course. The area was farmland in the Kettle Moraine, a naturally hilly area of the state. As I understand it, very little dirt was moved to create the course.

 

 

Was it not designed specifically with it in mind to bring in a Major (if not specifically a US Open)?

 

 

Even if it wasn't, Chamber's was.

 

FS1 aired a piece yesterday afternoon concerning the initial property investment and development intent. The previous owner met with Mike Davis on sight when they were still bailing hay and hadn't begun to develop a golf course. The piece had photos of the meeting and clearly, no golf course existed at the time. The initial owner ran out of money in the process and sold to the current ownership group, who finished the course and negotiated with the USGA.

 

So, Erin Hills was most assuredly built to host a US Open. I am certain, Fox will re-air the segment several times this weekend.

 

According to the article I read (and linked above), that is not true. Doak had already been on site and had done a routing and when Davis got there, the current architects had done their routing as well.

[gatorz7888]

just a quick vent here... Personally, I'm tired of the trend of having the US Open on a links style courses. Then, we get to watch the British open on a links style course. Let them have the links style and we stick to our parkland and woodlands courses.

 

Agreed, They have manufacture links courses in the states...why? Use the land in the style that it is. I think there are many courses in FL, TX, CA that are much more representative of the majority of US courses.

 

TPC Sugarloaf needs to be brought back not just Champions tour. Glad to FedEx cup at East Lake.

[imakaveli]

 

Bandon Dunes is true links, gorse included. The courses in the Sand Hills area of Nebraska are also true links, albeit with no gorse. Streamsong is very close.

 

I thought links courses were those built on the land linking the land and the sea - hence the name 'links '.

 

Isn't Nebraska a landlocked state?

 

Nebraska was once at the bottom of an inland sea. The Sand Hills area in northern Nebraska is basically 200 foot high sand dunes.

 

 

According to the Links Association Sand Hills is not a true links

 

That pic is actually Dismal River in the Sand Hills area of Nebraska, not to be confused with Sand Hills GC.

 

Which is not a true links as well, only the Bandon Dunes courses are of the ones mentioned above